1. savingblackberry's Avatar
    Watsa said $40 a share a few months back. Now have Heins and BOD screw it up, Heins gets millions, Watsa makes billions.
    Complete scam. Friday bring bad news, delay BBM launch.
    Monday make offer.

    Why not spin BBM, that alone is worth mpore than $9 a share.
    MDM business.
    Global data secure network
    Patents
    BB 10 licensing
    Cash of $5 a share, no debt

    Total fraud, rip-off.
    09-23-13 04:21 PM
  2. KemKev's Avatar
    Crystal ball gazing again, huh?
    09-23-13 04:31 PM
  3. anon1727506's Avatar
    Watsa said $40 a share a few months back. Now have Heins and BOD screw it up, Heins gets millions, Watsa makes billions.
    Complete scam. Friday bring bad news, delay BBM launch.
    Monday make offer.

    Why not spin BBM, that alone is worth mpore than $9 a share.
    MDM business.
    Global data secure network
    Patents
    BB 10 licensing
    Cash of $5 a share, no debt

    Total fraud, rip-off.
    Rich get richer, the poor.....


    While the timing is very circumspect... the fact is that BB isn't worth very much if their Smartphone business has no future... which is pretty much the case at this point.

    The question is how much info do they have to give shareholders before the vote.

    BB10 sales broken out from BBOS devices?
    Subscribers - totals by platform?
    BES Installations without test installations?
    BES licensing numbers by platform - iOS, Android, BB10, BBOS?
    QNX revenues?
    richardat likes this.
    09-23-13 04:37 PM
  4. fadmin's Avatar
    Facts of life. Everything happens for reason, somebody makes money even when things go south. Remember JDS FITEL aka as JDS Uniphase? Couple of days after original owners sold all of their shares in the company, company collapsed. Coincidence? Does Santa really exist?
    09-24-13 09:13 AM
  5. Raestloz's Avatar
    Facts of life. Everything happens for reason, somebody makes money even when things go south. Remember JDS FITEL aka as JDS Uniphase? Couple of days after original owners sold all of their shares in the company, company collapsed. Coincidence? Does Santa really exist?
    There are far too many failures in such a short time, add to that Heins' clause that incentivizes him to sell the company.

    It makes people wonder, really, just how much incompetence do BlackBerry really have? Yes, they're late, but there were lots of opportunities and they botch every single one of them

    Z10 STL100-1/10.1.0.4633
    09-24-13 11:42 AM
  6. amazinglygraceless's Avatar

    Why not spin BBM, that alone is worth mpore than $9 a share.
    Whatever you are drinking, make mine a double. How on Earth do you think BBM is anywhere in the neighborhood of $9 per share?
    richardat likes this.
    09-24-13 10:30 PM
  7. sakin13's Avatar
    Whatever you are drinking, make mine a double. How on Earth do you think BBM is anywhere in the neighborhood of $9 per share?
    Even if $9 for bbm is too far fetched his points are valid and the fact remains that Shareholders have been ripped off big time with this deal.

    the only "hope" is that this whole thing is a charade to lure other bidders in ... regardless though its very hard to get "good will" on intangible assets when the name Blackberry has become a synonym of fail ( under the Heins reign ) So even if $9 is super low for us shareholders the market reacts as $9 is fair or even high...
    09-24-13 10:57 PM
  8. SK122387's Avatar
    That's business.

    Posted via CB10
    09-25-13 04:02 AM
  9. kevinnugent's Avatar
    Elop's deal with Nokia is coming under intense scrutiny. Seems Hein's is a similar clause. Interesting few weeks coming up.
    09-25-13 04:06 AM
  10. cgk's Avatar
    Elop's deal with Nokia is coming under intense scrutiny. Seems Hein's is a similar clause. Interesting few weeks coming up.
    Wonder if it will come up at the Earnings call?
    09-25-13 04:58 AM
  11. greggebhardt's Avatar
    Watsa said $40 a share a few months back. Now have Heins and BOD screw it up, Heins gets millions, Watsa makes billions.
    Complete scam. Friday bring bad news, delay BBM launch.
    Monday make offer.

    Why not spin BBM, that alone is worth mpore than $9 a share.
    MDM business.
    Global data secure network
    Patents
    BB 10 licensing
    Cash of $5 a share, no debt

    Total fraud, rip-off.
    Are you willing to pay $50 to use BBM? That is likely what it would take to help!
    Last edited by greggebhardt; 09-25-13 at 06:34 AM.
    richardat likes this.
    09-25-13 05:43 AM
  12. BB10Funding's Avatar
    The OP does have a point here. At least the user count can be validated. Twitter claims to have millions of clients and has been given billion dollar evaluation. So I guess my dog and cats count as users as they have twitter account. At least BBM can be verified on the BIS system.

    So is 9 dollars a far fetched number ???? Well just yesterday Facebook was worth more then Boeing.... 120 Billion Market cap.

    If the investment market thinks this deal is going for 9 dollars dream on!!!! Someone with half a brain will make a higher bid. Read the original press release. Watsa gets a cool 100 million plus to walk away.

    Sit back and relax I feel an offer coming.
    09-25-13 05:53 AM
  13. MartyMcfly's Avatar
    Watsa said $40 a share a few months back. Now have Heins and BOD screw it up, Heins gets millions, Watsa makes billions.
    Complete scam. Friday bring bad news, delay BBM launch.
    Monday make offer.

    Why not spin BBM, that alone is worth mpore than $9 a share.
    MDM business.
    Global data secure network
    Patents
    BB 10 licensing
    Cash of $5 a share, no debt

    Total fraud, rip-off.
    It's not the easy buddy. Besides BlackBerry didn't rip off shareholders. You made a bad investment (I mean seriously, all of the signs were there), so now you must to deal with the consequences.
    09-25-13 06:06 AM
  14. greggebhardt's Avatar
    All Blackberry stockholders should have know about the risk.

    What I did not like was TH misleading about the sales prior to the last ER. After that if you stayed in, you should have known that there can be no trust. This is common practice these days
    kevinnugent likes this.
    09-25-13 06:37 AM
  15. richardat's Avatar
    Even if $9 for bbm is too far fetched his points are valid and the fact remains that Shareholders have been ripped off big time with this deal.
    .
    Ugh....BBM. The brutal truth is, BBM is worth exactly ZERO dollars at the moment. ZERO. I cannot emphasize that enough.

    BBM will require a TON of work.....it's not even deployable yet, and that's the first version - lacking in most of high end (and no doubt trickier/problematic) features. There is no business model, there is no revenue stream, there is no cross-platform user base. BBM userbase from actual BB users is dropping every day. This is the reality. An enormous amount of work and resources would be needed to develop this into a highly profitable business, and that is assuming they can get people to adopt it broadly (not likely in my opinion). Could it happen for a well-managed company with the resources (not BB as is)? Yes, it's possible, but they will be, once again, behind, and up against entrenched competitors, and big behemoths that may take over. It isn't anywhere near as mature as the smartphone market was, but they are way behind already. As I said back when they first announced this, if they had gotten out a solid working version (even without all the advanced features - that are now mandatory) 2 years ago, they would have had a real shot and quite likely have been a front-runner. The only hope now is that they - or whatever BB becomes if it survives - BB.v2 the software company - can get it out fast, and without major bugs, and that uptake in the developing nations is strong.


    I believe that at 9$, there is room to make money, or at least break-even, on a sell-off of the other assets......but BBM itself is worth next to nothing right now.

    Shareholders weren't ripped off....they were mislead, and misguided, yes.....although for the investors on CB, the biggest source of this delusion was themeselves! Fact is, this was CLEARLY the way the business was headed....I don't believe for a second that Heins and Watsa colluded to create the bad news....they didn't have to.....whether it came out now, two weeks from now, three months ago, three months from now, it would have come out.....it was inevitable, and only a matter of time. That's not to say they couldn't have engineered it, and in fact, I'm sure they compared notes in backroom conversations - no doubt about that, but, all of this was going to happen anyways.

    The business absolutely collapsed...or rather continued it's collapse....and in the grand scheme of things, we were already at the "bitter-end" a year ago.....Heins and Watsa are covering their butts, and the typical investor can't. Nobody should have listened to those two anyways....they aren't your buds! Rough lesson, but there it is.....

    There are interesting things reactions:
    1.some accept it, and are dealing with the reality
    2.some are clinging to a milder form of "BB is the absolute greatest ever" delusion - so they are accepting the failure but cannot believe it could have happened without purposeful sabotage
    3.some are building even more fanciful delusions of BBM domination, and...incredibly future phone domination eg. this the beginning of greatness...they won't have to answer to the stockholders now! Prem Watsa knows cellular, he'll lead us to greatness! They just have to stay quiet for a couple years and THEN unleash their mobile computing revolution!! (yes, I've actually seen posts advocating these :-0 !!! )

    It IS CRAZY. CRazy I tells ya!!! BB....while still retaining some illusion of health, and with the full company working, couldn't sell these phones....now with the workforce eviscerated, sales torn to shreds, the brutal public reveal of how we are at an end, and the best hope being a corporate financier buying them out....NOW they're gonna start selling phones??!!! Businesses and government want to buy in NOW???

    I think the z30 will set new record-lows for sales, by the way.

    #2 is certainly possible, I have long said that Heins is not putting proper all-or-nothing effort into BB, because he too thought it would fail, and wanted to simply conserve and drag out the process as long as possible (rather the opposite of sabotage) to find a buyer. The fact is, he didn't have to sabotage it (whether he did or did not), it was doomed from day 1. Even with all-out, competent "marketing", and a proper launch - the moment it came out without revolutionary, or at least very-eye catching OS hooks....AND without solidifying anywhere near the support needed in software, the conclusion was foregone. The only thing that could have saved it at that point was overwhelming nostalgia from former users who would swarm back.....they didn't.

    Many aspect rant off.
    Last edited by richardat; 09-25-13 at 06:50 AM.
    09-25-13 06:40 AM
  16. Roo Zilla's Avatar
    Even with all-out, competent "marketing", and a proper launch - the moment it came out without revolutionary, or at least very-eye catching OS hooks....AND without solidifying anywhere near the support needed in software, the conclusion was foregone. The only thing that could have saved it at that point was overwhelming nostalgia from former users who would swarm back.....they didn't.
    .
    I've said it before, and I'll say it again. To launch a copycat OS and expect it to succeed is the height of delusion. A marginally better OS isn't going to attract enough attention. I guess nobody learned anything from Palm.

    To the people who are going to mention all the "innovation" in BB10 like "no button".... The big disruptive innovation happened in 2007 when the smartphone paradigm shifted from "phone that do other stuff besides phone calls," to "computer in your pocket that can make phone calls." Everything after that is just little bits of icing on the cake. Unless you come up with something similar in scope, you're not going to change anything.
    09-25-13 02:14 PM
  17. EchoTango's Avatar
    I agree with some of the thoughts here, but I do feel $9 is a fire sale price. Back out the cash on hand, and the offer gets even more rediculous. I can't help but think, this is a stalking horse offer or a complete swindle of the shareholders.

    Fortunately, we have the courts to deal with the later.........
    09-25-13 05:08 PM

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 11
    Last Post: 09-25-13, 10:31 PM
  2. Cha-Ching: Heins will get his $55 million compensation
    By the_sleuth in forum General BlackBerry Discussion
    Replies: 58
    Last Post: 09-25-13, 11:42 AM
  3. Replies: 51
    Last Post: 09-25-13, 11:15 AM
  4. This is a RIP off deal for Shareholders
    By Chicago777Guy in forum BBRY
    Replies: 38
    Last Post: 09-23-13, 09:35 PM
  5. To be fair - This could also be seen as a floor on the stock
    By Chicago777Guy in forum General BlackBerry Discussion
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 09-23-13, 03:39 PM
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD