07-04-13 09:04 AM
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  1. dusdal's Avatar
    Really? I was figuring on the $5 range for book value. I suppose it depends on how one values the patents.
    Nope, it's well above $5 book value without considering the patents.

    You've got $5.92 per share in just cash and equivalents. 3.1 Billion divided by 524 million shares.

    Throw in net 2.2 billion in property, plants and equipment and you get pretty close to where the share price is now.

    Everything else: worldwide NOC, patents, QNX businesses and a growing BB10 handset business (see double digit revenue growth last quarter alone) is all essentially free at this price.

    Edit: plus patents, which are anybody's guess.
    peter9477 likes this.
    06-30-13 12:16 AM
  2. BB10fanatic's Avatar
    Blackberry has taken the best device strategy available to them. Hi end BB10, low end 7. Nokia has better range with asha and $20 phones. And android's fragmentation addresses this in an odd way.

    They can't fight the phone and tablet battle. They don't have the firepower. They are having a lot of mishaps.

    Last thing we need is silence. I hope official communication is persistent.
    06-30-13 12:18 AM
  3. darkehawke's Avatar
    Blackberry has taken the best device strategy available to them. Hi end BB10, low end 7. Nokia has better range with asha and $20 phones. And android's fragmentation addresses this in an odd way.

    They can't fight the phone and tablet battle. They don't have the firepower. They are having a lot of mishaps.

    Last thing we need is silence. I hope official communication is persistent.
    High end? While it is comparable to the high end competition in terms of performance, it is not in reputation. The best strategy BlackBerry could have done is launched as mid range until it had built up a solid user base and reputation then claim to be high end!

    Posted via CB10
    07-01-13 04:30 AM
  4. mrfreetruth's Avatar
    Really? I was figuring on the $5 range for book value. I suppose it depends on how one values the patents.
    They have $6 in cash which doesn't include the value of patents and property. It's obvious you have no idea of what you are talking about. I'm hoping it can drop more to buy a ton of cheap calls.

    Posted via CB10
    07-01-13 10:52 AM
  5. thejules's Avatar
    They have $6 in cash which doesn't include the value of patents and property. It's obvious you have no idea of what you are talking about. I'm hoping it can drop more to buy a ton of cheap calls.

    Posted via CB10
    Its gonna be a long summer for bb. The signs are there for stock to go lower. Support will be at 9.50 and if that breaks down watch out as you may get your wish.
    07-01-13 02:39 PM
  6. swaxolez's Avatar
    Thanks for the reply, but all I'm going to say in response is that a turnaround doesn't happen on a dime.

    The posted loss was expected, as is the upcoming one, but that's called an investment, in my books...the return is going to be in subsequent quarters.

    Just wait...
    I'm sorry loss expected or not - the phones aren't selling because they are not desirable. If you can't sell your product to enough people then you are in deep trouble. They didn't even try and offer any glimmers of hope in the next few quarters. They don't have any large DOD contracts lined up nor are the carriers likely to buy units for very much longer. No one want to buy a product that has lost its mojo. Advising people to buy is inadvisable. The SP will go lower - much lower. A buyout is about the only option to regain some losses at this point. That's the news I'll be looking for before I decide to buy back in.
    07-01-13 02:45 PM
  7. Chicago777Guy's Avatar
    I'm sorry loss expected or not - the phones aren't selling because they are not desirable. If you can't sell your product to enough people then you are in deep trouble. They didn't even try and offer any glimmers of hope in the next few quarters. They don't have any large DOD contracts lined up nor are the carriers likely to buy units for very much longer. No one want to buy a product that has lost its mojo. Advising people to buy is inadvisable. The SP will go lower - much lower. A buyout is about the only option to regain some losses at this point. That's the news I'll be looking for before I decide to buy back in.
    Very smart idea buying after an buyout has been announced..lol

    Posted via CB10
    dusdal and peter9477 like this.
    07-01-13 03:22 PM
  8. thejules's Avatar
    Where's the up side right now? Seriously.

    Posted via CB10
    There's no upside here, summer is going to be tough for bb stock and even tougher in september with new iphone and ios 7 due out then there's the holiday season which is going to be even tougher for bb.
    bekkay likes this.
    07-01-13 03:22 PM
  9. thejules's Avatar
    Here's how I'm thinking...I bought in at 14.90 per share a few months back, and if I buy an equal share amount at 10.46 a share, I average my buy-in price in the middle.

    I am no Wall Street expert, but I DO believe that bbry will rebound in the long term...and will do very well, at that!

    People can quote analysts and experts all they want, but nobody knows what's going to happen 6 months from now, or even 3 months from now...the smartphone market is simply too volatile.

    I think it's unfair that people are blasting bbry at this point, simply because the company has spent so much money on the BB10 launch, that it will take 2 or 3 quarters to recover that investment. Let's not forget how the stock shorts have sabotaged (yes, I say sabotaged, because that's what it is) the company and the stock price because they got it wrong and would lose tons of cash as a result.

    The US carriers and stores have clearly been anti-blackberry, and it shows. As far as I'm concerned, it's Blackberry who needs to start a few lawsuits, not the other way around.

    I'm a user and an investor, and I see great things from this company. I'm convinced now is a time to buy, not sell...things are turning around.

    Just my. 02
    Or loose more money...

    Contrary to what you think the market is valuing BB correctly. When BB was at its all time peak that was also right given their growth. Now there's no growth to speak of. People brag about the 3b in cash as if its their money, thats shareholders money not yours.
    07-01-13 03:35 PM
  10. mrfreetruth's Avatar
    Thejules you pathetic paid troll. For some one who dislikes BlackBerry you posted 33times in under 12 hours. Funny you just joined not even 12 hours.

    Posted via CB10
    dusdal likes this.
    07-01-13 08:23 PM
  11. njblackberry's Avatar
    And once again, anyone who disagrees with your point of view is a troll.
    Never gets old for you, does it!
    07-01-13 08:26 PM
  12. dusdal's Avatar
    But she isn't disagreeing with an opinion necessarily, she is simply not telling the truth.

    "Now there's no growth to speak of"

    They grew both revenues and unit sales in this last quarter, despite it being very much a transition quarter. They did this while building their cash pile.

    Rather impressive.
    07-01-13 08:35 PM
  13. Enyigma's Avatar
    They have $6 in cash which doesn't include the value of patents and property. It's obvious you have no idea of what you are talking about. I'm hoping it can drop more to buy a ton of cheap calls.

    Posted via CB10
    Funny. I am the one who has not lost money on this stock. How about you?

    I don't think this stock has worthwhile value above $5 right now and will revise this figure down with time. As with Nortel, what shows in the financial statement has a strange way of changing in a big way in a very short period of time. The only dfference right now is that RIM is not loaded down with debt. Like Nortel, they still don't have a profitable business and there is no eveidence that the situation is about to change any time soon.
    07-01-13 08:36 PM
  14. dusdal's Avatar
    Funny. I am the one who has not lost money on this stock. How about you?
    The statement you quoted is factual. All of it is fact.

    Your response also has nothing to do with what you are replying to?
    07-01-13 08:39 PM
  15. dusdal's Avatar
    I do think this thread title needs to be changed. I don't believe anyone here is legally able to advise in investments and probably shouldn't be doing so on a public forum.
    07-01-13 08:44 PM
  16. Enyigma's Avatar
    The statement you quoted is factual. All of it is fact.

    Your response also has nothing to do with what you are replying to?
    No. What was quoted was from the released finanncial statements. Unfortunately, financial statements have been proven to be less that factual or perhaps more generously less than useful in evaluating the current state of a business as numerous recent major business and bank scandals and bankruptcies have proven.

    RIM and TH are proving to be less than forthcoming or open about their business which is a very bad sign in a publicly traded corporation. That is why I and probably a lot better qualified people will give a target share price a lot lower value than current market price or even reputed "book value".
    07-01-13 08:50 PM
  17. dusdal's Avatar
    No. What was quoted was from the released finanncial statements. Unfortunately, financial statements have been proven to be less that factual or perhaps more generously less than useful in evaluating the current state of a business as numerous recent major business and bank scandals and bankruptcies have proven.

    RIM and TH are proving to be less than forthcoming or open about their business which is a very bad sign in a publicly traded corporation. That is why I and probably a lot better qualified people will give a target share price a lot lower value than current market price or even reputed "book value".
    .....?

    Yes, what was quoted was fact because it was from the financial statements.... so.... he was right...

    Both revenues and device sales grew. The definition of growth.
    07-01-13 09:32 PM
  18. JonCBK's Avatar
    It is a risky buy right now because it is unclear if folks will buy blackberries in large nunbers. I'm long bbry and not really considering selling my shares for ten dollars. but I know my money is at risk.

    folks should take some comfort that the cash reserves grew thus quarter. and the cash flow from operations would have been nice for a company with twice its market cap. but nothing will make up for lack of sales if consumers don't buy the q10 and q5. those need to sell much more than the z10 has so far.

    Sent from my BlackBerry Runtime for Android Apps using Tapatalk 2
    07-01-13 09:47 PM
  19. Edward in Toronto's Avatar
    The best time to buy a stock is when everyone hates it and nobody what's to touch it and the price has dropped.
    The best time to sell a stock is when everyone is in love with it and falling over themselves to buy it, making the price rise rapidly.

    ...or buy low, sell high. OP is right, now is time to buy, if you want to buy. Now is not the time to sell.
    07-01-13 10:34 PM
  20. costas1966's Avatar
    Or loose more money...

    Contrary to what you think the market is valuing BB correctly. When BB was at its all time peak that was also right given their growth. Now there's no growth to speak of. People brag about the 3b in cash as if its their money, thats shareholders money not yours.
    Not sure if you actually read my post, but....I AM a shareholder...lol!
    07-02-13 04:18 AM
  21. costas1966's Avatar
    I do think this thread title needs to be changed. I don't believe anyone here is legally able to advise in investments and probably shouldn't be doing so on a public forum.
    This is a forum. We have opinions. I stated that I am not a Wall Street expert in my OP.

    You have the choice to either contemplate my opinion, or to argue against it...but, as it all stands...a forum is a place for the exchange of ideas...not financial advice.

    Thanks for playing, but please spin again.
    07-02-13 04:21 AM
  22. costas1966's Avatar
    The best time to buy a stock is when everyone hates it and nobody what's to touch it and the price has dropped.
    The best time to sell a stock is when everyone is in love with it and falling over themselves to buy it, making the price rise rapidly.

    ...or buy low, sell high. OP is right, now is time to buy, if you want to buy. Now is not the time to sell.
    Exactly what I am saying...taking the emotion out of the picture for the love of the platform, leaves the subjective financial evaluation of the company's worth and possible future. I'm posting as a shareholder in the thread, primarily, not a dedicated user.
    07-02-13 04:30 AM
  23. BBThemes's Avatar
    Exactly what I am saying...taking the emotion out of the picture for the love of the platform, leaves the subjective financial evaluation of the company's worth and possible future. I'm posting as a shareholder in the thread, primarily, not a dedicated user.
    Err if you take the emotion out of the picture and look at the raw facts, the biggest fact is. Thorsten has said next quarter will be a LOSS. So the near future is not good and therefore the stock is more likely to drop than to increase in value.

    Posted via CB10
    07-02-13 07:50 AM
  24. peter9477's Avatar
    Err if you take the emotion out of the picture and look at the raw facts, the biggest fact is. Thorsten has said next quarter will be a LOSS. So the near future is not good and therefore the stock is more likely to drop than to increase in value.
    "More likely"? How can one judge that very well? After all the market has already tried to price-in the guidance of a loss, so if they've done a good job of that, wouldn't you say it's just as likely to rise as it is to fall?

    Or isn't it also common for the sort of thing that just happened to result in an overreaction in the market, so that it's actually more likely that it will bounce back slightly in the short term?

    Edit: I see dusdal already mentioned the "priced-in" part of this. I guess if we'd both read the earlier part of the thread I wouldn't have had to answer, and you wouldn't have had to ask. ;-)
    dusdal and BlackistheBerry like this.
    07-02-13 07:57 AM
  25. BBThemes's Avatar

    Edit: I see dusdal already mentioned the "priced-in" part of this. I guess if we'd both read the earlier part of the thread I wouldn't have had to answer, and you wouldn't have had to ask. ;-)
    What? I didn't ask anything lol.


    It's only 'more likely' as that's how the market is viewing it. If sales improve of bb10 devices then yes stock in theory will rise, but I will tell you now if they make a loss and device sales don't pick up then the whole 'priced in' drop is gonna look very shallow.


    Posted via CB10
    07-02-13 09:57 AM
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