08-12-13 01:47 AM
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  1. law2010's Avatar
    You most likely didn't misread. I have one in daycare that is just shy of $1200 a month. My wife is expecting our second in October so soon it will be almost $2400 a month...
    It's nice knowing that you could afford a $500,000.00 home but for your children's daycare bills that make it impossible.
    07-31-13 09:44 AM
  2. Nathan Bael's Avatar
    You most likely didn't misread. I have one in daycare that is just shy of $1200 a month. My wife is expecting our second in October so soon it will be almost $2400 a month...
    At how many children does it make more sense for one of you to be a stay at home parent?
    07-31-13 09:46 AM
  3. law2010's Avatar
    Some people think that successes or changes are won is like in a movie montage: it lasts about the length of a song and only takes 3-5 minutes long to achieve.

    It doesn't.

    BlackBerry knows what's at stake and knows it needs to hustle and refine in order to achieve, but like everything in life, it will take time.

    Just about all the lawyers or people studying law that I have met are so hyper-sensitive about making a decision because words like "liability" are plastered all over their minds that they get stuck when trying to make a decision. Sometimes even simpler ones.

    If you like the phone and it is useful to your needs, then just buy the darn thing.

    BlackBerry is here to stay and isn't shutting down anytime soon. These majority of these so-called "analysts" just want their 15 seconds of notice.

    Best of luck to you.
    You hit the nail on the head of why this is a difficult decision. The question is whether the phone can fulfill my needs. Right now, I believe there are still numerous software additions that need to be made to completely fulfill my needs. However, I applaud Blackberry for pumping out 10.1 so fast, so I know they are working on it.

    The other issue, which I noted in my first post, is the application development for high quality application developers. Right now, Blackberry's app store does not contain many of the basic applications I use. Again, I believe they can be made and work perfectly with Blackberry 10 operating system. The issue is whether the fear of the company's longevity will scare away high quality app developers because they may not receive a significant return on their efforts and resources expended. If I picked up a Q10 now, it would be with the anticipation that the apps I need and OS enhancements would be coming in the relatively near future. I have some degree of reservation that those apps will come to fruition. Also, I am not a giant fan of side loading applications. I think native applications will work best on this amazing OS.
    07-31-13 09:52 AM
  4. Shanerredflag's Avatar
    Well...the stock is up over two percent today on the US Exchange...extrapolate that out to whatever, add the fudge factor then multiply the square root of the "hype" quotient = BUY THE Q

    Posted via CB10
    07-31-13 10:34 AM
  5. heymaggie's Avatar
    One of the sweetest things about being an independent app developer, as some of you know, is that check or wire transfer that you get on a monthly basis for sales of an app that you haven't touched for months or even years because the platform is still popular and people still buy lots of devices. Somehow people still find your app and make purchases on a regular basis. That's why developers care about current market share, current sales, and the long-term viability of the company.
    law2010 likes this.
    07-31-13 11:26 AM
  6. kbz1960's Avatar
    Losses if you own stock.
    07-31-13 11:29 AM
  7. ian8206's Avatar
    Why do people get so paranoid? It's a phone not your life savings. It's not like you have to invest in the company. Dudes, this investment in the phone lasts about 3 years max. If you really want out most plans have a buy out. I love the phone now and am happy with the apps. In a a few years I will buy a new one if BlackBerry survive or not.

    Posted via CB10
    This is what I don't understand as well. I used to own an iphone, never had legacy BB devices so i'm not really attached to the brand and yet this is the best phone I've had. BB going under won't change that. The Z10 won't disappear out of my hand. It's hard to tell what the future will be, but I doubt BB stops supporting their phone by the time my contract ends. Sounds liek the OPs mind was already made up, I don't know what he's looking to hear to be honest.
    07-31-13 11:43 AM
  8. BBBHonest's Avatar
    BlackBerry is dealing with a phenomenon that is quite interesting, but one that makes the stock a huge opportunity to make a lot of money. The negative side - the risk - is that the negative press will bring about what it is predicting by scaring people away for no good reason. That is obviously what a lot of people want, of course, but if BlackBerry handle things sensibly, the shorters are going to get badly burnt, and by this time next year BlackBerry will be out of this problem.

    Everyone is in panic mode, and this is causing some truly awful judgements on the part of analysts and others.

    We are talking about a company with a HUGE brand name, zero debt, and a load of cash in the bank. We are also looking at a company that has done badly for reasons that WE ALL UNDERSTAND. The only unknowns are whether the management will steer through this smartly, pricing the phones correctly, and going for sales numbers over margin in the short term. They've got the hardware and software right, which was the hard part.

    People need to RELAX. Just read the bad press with a clear head. If this were a new company, no one would be talking about market share. Stop comparing BlackBerry to the BlackBerry of 2008, and RELAX.

    There is plenty of room for BlackBerry to steer through this negative press, release BBM cross platform, and get marketing great products. One year from now, if that is done, all the experts will be predicting something else for BlackBerry, and pretending that they saw the success coming all along.

    Posted via CB10
    07-31-13 12:03 PM
  9. saalnaz's Avatar
    If you have android or have access to buying one, why go for a BB phone where you will use android ports.
    Top droid phones offer so much more comparing to a top BB handset.
    Go for HTC one I recommend.

    Sent from my HTC One using CB Forums mobile app
    07-31-13 12:13 PM
  10. arvind1983's Avatar
    He is a new member and looking for advice on buying the Q10. Lets not chase him away.

    I stopped reading after this first sentence..... am I'm the only one that sees this? negative title, very low post count, reference to competing brand yet claims to like or want BB.

    Maybe it's me, call me paranoid, but just doesn't pass the smell test.


    Posted via CB10 from my awesome Z10
    Blacklatino and law2010 like this.
    07-31-13 12:53 PM
  11. BBBHonest's Avatar
    The fact that BlackBerry can access Android apps is not a weakness. Again, the lack of some apps is a problem, but one that has an obvious cause, and solution. The fact is, the Z10 is a superior phone in terms of speed of use...it's OS is the best out. People just don't spend as much time ranting about thw shortcomings of Android and Apple because it isn't in fashion. Their OS are clumsy, and slow. They just are. You can simply do more with a Z10, and do it faster.

    Posted via CB10
    07-31-13 01:04 PM
  12. BBBHonest's Avatar
    By the way, HTC just announced a huge drop in sales. Are we going to start ranting against them now?

    Posted via CB10
    07-31-13 01:05 PM
  13. hootyhoo's Avatar
    By the way, HTC just announced a huge drop in sales. Are we going to start ranting against them now?

    Posted via CB10
    Just because you don't see much about HTC on CB, doesn't mean it isn't discussed.

    http://forums.androidcentral.com/htc...e-14-20-a.html

    Besides, I thought that people were tired of seeing other platforms discussed on here.
    Blacklatino likes this.
    07-31-13 01:33 PM
  14. law2010's Avatar
    If you have android or have access to buying one, why go for a BB phone where you will use android ports.
    Top droid phones offer so much more comparing to a top BB handset.
    Go for HTC one I recommend.

    Sent from my HTC One using CB Forums mobile app
    Actually, I have an HTC Droid DNA, which is pretty much the HTC One without the aluminum body design. I really like the QWERTY keyboards on Blackberries. I type many emails throughout the day, and no matter how awesome SwiftKey's autocorrection is, it cannot predict the truly unusual spellings of my clients' names. Having a traditional QWERTY keyboard will result in much more accurate typing for me where autocorrect could not fathom how I need to spell some of the very strange names I need to spell.

    So, I hear you, but I already have the functional equivalent of the HTC One sitting next to me as I type this, and I still have the Blackberry Q10 bug.
    07-31-13 02:11 PM
  15. sbx9900's Avatar
    If you are a BlackBerry shareholder, the stock price is definitely your concern....But if you're just a BlackBerry phone user, the stock price should not concern you as long as you chose a phone that meets your needs in the next couple of months or years.

    I have 2 9900's and one Z10 in the family. And today, I might pull the trigger for the Q10 (I went to my favorite Tmo store last night but it was past 8pm and the sales people won't let me in). It does not matter whether the price per share is down to a few cents as long as the phones meet my needs.
    KemKev likes this.
    08-01-13 08:51 AM
  16. Kersus's Avatar
    When it's as low as possible, I want to buy buy buy!
    08-01-13 09:19 AM
  17. gitchies's Avatar
    Did you notice the other article posted on CB this week discussing an analyst claiming the stock will slowly rebound and double by the end of next year? There are a few positive stories.

    And I have been saying this forever. They don't have to overtake Samsung or Apple to be a successful company. But I realize they need to be solid and not lose ground. I wish they were a private firm lol.

    Posted via CB10
    They been saying that for how long now....so everyone should rush out and buy it!! Maybe every die hard can save the company?
    08-01-13 09:53 AM
  18. lorax1284's Avatar
    They been saying that for how long now....so everyone should rush out and buy it!! Maybe every die hard can save the company?
    The stock price going up doesn't make BB richer. It doesn't give them more resources to execute their plans. I may appease the institutional investors that pressure the board to go this way or that way, but the stock price going up also isn't going to stop the executive from doing stupid things like kicking their most loyal customers in the crotch and ignoring their current 70 million user install base by ignoring the issues BBOS users are having in migrating to BB10. I am kind of surprised that the board isn't being properly pressured by the institutional investors to do something QUICK and GREAT to get the BBOS users onto BB10, to increase the BB10 install base QUICKLY so that it becomes a very compelling target platform for big app developers.

    I believe in the BB10 technology: I believe the current executive team at BB10 is making a lot of terrible decisions. I believe they might wake up and come out of their daze and start doing things right if they're properly terrified that what they're doing isn't working... I still have some BB stock that I was going to hold, but the best piece of stock market advice I ever got was: "don't hold something you think isn't going to go up soon, just because it's already in your portfolio: sell it and find something that IS going up and buy THAT instead." I bought the stock because I believe in the technology and I still do (I'm developing apps exclusively for BB10 because I love the BB10 UX) but holding shares in a company being obviously mismanaged is just watching my money shrivel to nothing.
    MPF94025 and Kersus like this.
    08-01-13 11:31 AM
  19. undone's Avatar
    At $1200 a month in daycare, either both parents should be making bank or it is more profitable for one to stay at home and raise the child.

    A childhood friend of mine worked two jobs while his wife went to college. After she finished they had a baby and she went to work. Because of daycare costs and his limited skillset, he became a stay at home dad.
    You'd probably fall over if you knew my daycare costs. The other side of it is earning power (if it exists). Stay at home parent's earning power decreases the more they stay at home. You have to take a long view on it, not only is it cash in your pocket, its retirement, medical, and later saving for there college.
    08-01-13 11:41 AM
  20. MPF94025's Avatar
    The stock price going up doesn't make BB richer. It doesn't give them more resources to execute their plans. I may appease the institutional investors that pressure the board to go this way or that way, but the stock price going up also isn't going to stop the executive from doing stupid things like kicking their most loyal customers in the crotch and ignoring their current 70 million user install base by ignoring the issues BBOS users are having in migrating to BB10. I am kind of surprised that the board isn't being properly pressured by the institutional investors to do something QUICK and GREAT to get the BBOS users onto BB10, to increase the BB10 install base QUICKLY so that it becomes a very compelling target platform for big app developers.

    I believe in the BB10 technology: I believe the current executive team at BB10 is making a lot of terrible decisions. I believe they might wake up and come out of their daze and start doing things right if they're properly terrified that what they're doing isn't working... I still have some BB stock that I was going to hold, but the best piece of stock market advice I ever got was: "don't hold something you think isn't going to go up soon, just because it's already in your portfolio: sell it and find something that IS going up and buy THAT instead." I bought the stock because I believe in the technology and I still do (I'm developing apps exclusively for BB10 because I love the BB10 UX) but holding shares in a company being obviously mismanaged is just watching my money shrivel to nothing.

    BOD and CEO, though some may/will argue otherwise, have needed a kick in the pants to get their act together. That they needed one is inarguable, whether one looks at issues with device migration, contact/calendar/sync migration (I'm not speaking to all of you who were lucky and things worked perfectly, but for all those, even seasoned tech people, who have had problems well documented in BB user support forums), hyperbolic statements about device sales KNOWING that the emerging BB 10 OS wasn't where it needed to be to compete directly with iOS or Android, or irresponsible corporate actions such as a press release the day before QE in June announcing 18,000 BES installations (whatever that means) or "Ooops" Venezuela owes us $90M and we decided to wait until QE to announce it so BBRY diehard investors could get knifed in the back by hedge funds who shorted the stock and were already likely aware of what was going on. Gross missteps and oversights.

    About a month ago I wrote an email to BBRY investor relations asking for some response to these issues as a shareholder. No response. A couple of weeks ago, sent another note with "SEC" in the subject line, got a response. Somehow, BOD and CEO haven't gotten the message that fans, users, and shareholders are p******* off at their actions, time to wake up, keep up the progress, and stop doing stupid, irresponsible things as outlined above. Time to keep the pressure on the company's leadership who are collectively responsible for these decisions. Time for TH to move on, credit for what he's done but users and shareholders are paying for his education as CEO. And that is ridiculous for a company that has many challenges ahead. (Today I saw a press release that an medical device manufacturer had committed to BES 10, no information whether there are 10 or 10,000 employed by the company: is this the best they can do?)

    Lots of people want BBRY to go way. As a Z10 user, there is serious potential here (until we get the apps in place like banks, travel, etc; full features in; bugs out, don't even argue that market will take this seriously NOW as a iPhone or Android killer...). But it can be.

    BBRY CEO and BOD. Time to use an iPhone, S4, read BBRY user forums, Crackberry forums (and yes, in response to a previous comment from someone asking whether BBRY should be reading these forum comments the answer is YES) see what's really going on out here. And fix it. If you keep making same stupid errors like flying carpet ads, or "corporate/biz user/social user" phones that can't even migrate contacts/calendar items PERFECTLY from legacy RIM devices then perhaps shareholder actions will be necessary.

    "There is a war outside sill raging they say it isn't ours anymore to win". BS. "No retreat, no surrender" Bruce Springsteen.

    The ball is in the court of BBRY leadership, time for them to get their act together, not issue lame-*** excuses for a major corporation that clearly appears out of touch with its own products, with where its products fit in the market, and lacks a coherent plan for addressing specific ads for enterprise, biz users, and social media users. And stop leaving your end users in the hands of wireless providers for tech support: Apple, Lenovo can talk to its customers who are having tech problems, so can you. The wireless providers more often than not can't fix and end user just goes into store, where, guess what, they leave with iOS or Android device.

    People on fire and flying carpets. Buggy contact/calendar management. OMG. Cross-platform BBM had better be beta-tested thoroughly (as if there aren't enough iOS or Android users....) AND full-featured (text and video) and PERFECT on release. If not, should be final straw for CEO.
    Last edited by MPF94025; 08-01-13 at 01:16 PM.
    08-01-13 12:50 PM
  21. Emaderton3's Avatar
    BOD and CEO, though some may/will argue otherwise, have needed a kick in the pants to get their act together. That they needed one is inarguable, whether one looks at issues with device migration, contact/calendar/sync migration (I'm not speaking to all of you who were lucky and things worked perfectly, but for all those, even seasoned tech people, who have had problems well documented in BB user support forums), hyperbolic statements about device sales KNOWING that the emerging BB 10 OS wasn't where it needed to be to compete directly with iOS or Android, or irresponsible corporate actions such as a press release the day before QE in June announcing 18,000 BES installations (whatever that means) or "Ooops" Venezuela owes us $90M and we decided to wait until QE to announce it so BBRY diehard investors could get knifed in the back by hedge funds who shorted the stock and were already likely aware of what was going on. Gross missteps and oversights.

    About a month ago I wrote an email to BBRY investor relations asking for some response to these issues as a shareholder. No response. A couple of weeks ago, sent another note with "SEC" in the subject line, got a response. Somehow, BOD and CEO haven't gotten the message that fans, users, and shareholders are p******* off at their actions, time to wake up, keep up the progress, and stop doing stupid, irresponsible things as outlined above. Time to keep the pressure on the company's leadership who are collectively responsible for these decisions. Time for TH to move on, credit for what he's done but users and shareholders are paying for his education as CEO. And that is ridiculous for a company that has many challenges ahead. (Today I saw a press release that an medical device manufacturer had committed to BES 10, no information whether there are 10 or 10,000 employed by the company: is this the best they can do?)

    Lots of people want BBRY to go way. As a Z10 user, there is serious potential here (until we get the apps in place like banks, travel, etc; full features in; bugs out, don't even argue that market will take this seriously NOW as a iPhone or Android killer...). But it can be.

    BBRY CEO and BOD. Time to use an iPhone, S4, read BBRY user forums, Crackberry forums (and yes, in response to a previous comment from someone asking whether BBRY should be reading these forum comments the answer is YES) see what's really going on out here. And fix it. If you keep making same stupid errors like flying carpet ads, or "corporate/biz user/social user" phones that can't even migrate contacts/calendar items PERFECTLY from legacy RIM devices then perhaps shareholder actions will be necessary.

    "There is a war outside sill raging they say it isn't ours anymore to win". BS. "No retreat, no surrender" Bruce Springsteen.

    The ball is in the court of BBRY leadership, time for them to get their act together, not issue lame-*** excuses for a major corporation that clearly appears out of touch with its own products, with where its products fit in the market, and lacks a coherent plan for addressing specific ads for enterprise, biz users, and social media users. And stop leaving your end users in the hands of wireless providers for tech support: Apple, Lenovo can talk to its customers who are having tech problems, so can you. The wireless providers more often than not can't fix and end user just goes into store, where, guess what, they leave with iOS or Android device.

    People on fire and flying carpets. Buggy contact/calendar management. OMG. Cross-platform BBM had better be beta-tested thoroughly (as if there aren't enough iOS or Android users....) AND full-featured (text and video) and PERFECT on release. If not, should be final straw for CEO.
    This will probably support your stance further, but I thought I read a while back that the initial release of BBM for other platforms will not have video yet?

    Posted via CB10
    08-01-13 01:56 PM
  22. Haslarn's Avatar
    You worry to much.
    In the beginning when I started working structural engineering in the mid-80's, Microsoft (via DOS or Windows later) was the core operating system for most of the computers on planet earth including ours. Yes, Apple or MacIntosh if you will, had a presence but only as a arty sort of persons computer. All engineering/CAD programs as well as retail and commercial systems in the early days were designed with the Microsoft operating system and no other. As time moved on, the Apple computer started to find its way into offices but it still did not support the paramount software giants like Microsoft did. As time moved on again, things changed and now they (Apple) have a place in most of the previous mentioned industry....this is called evolution. That does not mean they (Apple) are the best!
    I am biased. I do not like Apple products at all because you could never take them serious when they appeared in the industry except for arty people. What I am saying is, you could not do your career (unlike today) with a MacIntosh....they just did not fit in.

    Blackberry (RIM), was like Microsoft, they were the pioneer of what we call the 'Smartphone' with the secure email, etc. They are the springboard that all others jumped from to start all other smartphone systems and they rocked the world until Apple, Google, Palm and Windows 8 came around. Just like Microsoft, Blackberry is being looked at as old and non-trendy, so the masses want to roll with the trendy. If social networking never evolved more than email, Blackberry would still rule the world and we all know that. Blackberry needed to start from a clean sheet and move forward and its not easy. But don't worry. Now that Apple has been out for a while, it is looking old and useless vs. BB10. Google system reminds me of the Atari game system of the 80's or Intelevision. Windows 8 I think is pretty good, but Ive always been a BB man and plan on staying that way.

    Apple and Google, well they caress consumers with pixy dust and lifestyle more than anything and BB needs to do the same. Yes, the US is giving up BB for a rotten Apple and Google crazy web surfers or W8. It may take a few years to lure back those people if BB can caress them.
    08-01-13 02:37 PM
  23. Blacklatino's Avatar
    I stopped reading after this first sentence..... am I'm the only one that sees this? negative title, very low post count, reference to competing brand yet claims to like or want BB.

    Maybe it's me, call me paranoid, but just doesn't pass the smell test.


    Posted via CB10 from my awesome Z10
    Get a pole if you're going fishing. Stop trying to instigate others to flame him. Next time read all of it.
    Last edited by Blacklatino; 08-01-13 at 04:33 PM.
    MPF94025 and lorax1284 like this.
    08-01-13 03:00 PM
  24. MPF94025's Avatar
    This will probably support your stance further, but I thought I read a while back that the initial release of BBM for other platforms will not have video yet?

    Posted via CB10
    Yes, precisely correct. And just how is BBM text only going to make iOS and Android owners drool? A recent CB survey suggested that, despite claims to the contrary, most current BBM users don't even have that many friends/colleagues with whom to use the service any longer. So a text only BBM release will just be another sign tat BBRY is releasing many software applications that are technologically 4 years behind the times and will just damage the company's reputation (as in the fiasco with contact/calendar management that many still have problems with, per user support forums...).

    I'm happy to be corrected if there is something I'm missing here, but the last BBM informal article on BBM use did not suggest that this is a feature that users will be crying out for on Android or iOS. I understand there is a report that 100,000 android users downloaded a fake BBM in a day or two, but there has been so much misinformation released over the last few months, hard to know what to believe. Even BBRY's press release that BES10 installations (whatever that means) went from 12,000 to 18,000 from June to July was followed a day later by a 30% drop in stock price.

    It's time to stop releasing imperfect software that only diehard BBRY fans want. It's not even convincing legacy RIM users to upgrade, as we all see more legacy RIM devices on the street than BB 10 devices.

    Cross platform BBM better have some pop to it or it will BBRY just shooting itself in the foot again.
    08-01-13 03:49 PM
  25. Simon Sage's Avatar
    I think it's a little weird that you're considering stock prices when shopping for a new phone. Investors aren't technology experts, they're experts in the perceived value of companies.

    Now, app selection and long-term support are certainly things to think about. As others have pointed out, I wouldn't worry about long-term support. It took Palm circling the drain for years in worse conditions than this to fully die out. If BlackBerry had been in really rough shape for a year already and had been recently acquired, then I might start worrying about whether my phone would get another OS update. Things aren't that bad right now.

    As for app selection, it really depends on what you see as mission-critical. I've got everything I could want. Sure, you'll be taking a hit in comparison to Google Play, but how many apps do you rely on? Are you averse to sideloading?

    As for market share, I think it's actually kind of fun to be packing something nobody else is. Lent my Palm Pre Plus to a cousin awhile back, and she loved that nobody had any freakin' clue what it was. Sticking out can be fun.
    cjcampbell likes this.
    08-01-13 06:00 PM
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