11-13-13 08:25 PM
73 123
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  1. Franz Israel's Avatar
    Thanks for replying to me like an adult. You need to learn some manners. Go on a financial forum and talk to people then.
    You teach me nanners ole boy? I want to see your manners when someone breaks into your house and wipes you out clean and on the way out, **** on you as well and say its raining. Thats what Watsa said.. oh provide piquidity to shareholders.
    People like you are the reason financial crimes are committeed because you are so gullible. Dont you see: Basically this management team and board has said: the value of our business is below zero, its negative since they are selling below tangible book value.
    And by the weay this forum is for BBRY, the stock.
    10-26-13 02:16 AM
  2. bobauckland's Avatar
    I dont think these guys here understand. They, unlike me, have no skin in the game. I saved my retirement by working on my two feet day and night and that has been stolen by this management and board.

    I will say this again and again that this management led by Heins and Board led by Stymiest colluded to steal my money, my retirerment savings. I have proof.
    And here we have the problem, you put more into this stock than you were willing to lose.
    I'm sorry it's happened and I genuinely feel bad for you. It sucks.
    But insulting people who understand the stock market will not make anything better.
    Sadly this is built to help people cheat the system, they pay lawyers way too much money to leave themselves open.
    Again, the lesson is never ever invest with your heart, and don't put more in stocks than you're willing to lose.

    The numbers and arguments you put forward don't make any sense. No one cares how much money they have in the bank. If they're burning through it and losing money, that's factored in.
    If the infrastructure and patents are depreciating, then that's not worth tomorrow what it's worth today either. All of this matters, and you haven't figured it in.

    I'm sorry you're getting shafted, I really am. But if no one else feels it's worth more, then the shafting is pretty unavoidable.

    Posted via CB10
    10-26-13 07:14 AM
  3. zee3p0's Avatar
    I wouldn't build myself a house because i don't know anything about house building.

    I wouldn't go into space because im not an astronaut.

    I don't go to war because im not a soldier.

    But if i did and my house fell down i wouldn't call the person that sold me the materials a criminal.

    If i suffocated in space when i took off my helmet i wouldn't blame nasa.

    And if i got shot in the head in war.... well i guess that would be my own fault.



    Posted via CB10
    10-26-13 09:24 AM
  4. eddy_berry's Avatar
    You teach me nanners ole boy? I want to see your manners when someone breaks into your house and wipes you out clean and on the way out, **** on you as well and say its raining. Thats what Watsa said.. oh provide piquidity to shareholders.
    People like you are the reason financial crimes are committeed because you are so gullible. Dont you see: Basically this management team and board has said: the value of our business is below zero, its negative since they are selling below tangible book value.
    And by the weay this forum is for BBRY, the stock.
    I think you need to lay off me son. Maybe manners wasn't the right word. How about professionalism? My question to you is, if you feel as if you were robbed, why did you let them in and let them stay for so long? You say I'm the gullible one. Your analogy does not make sense. You let them stay and take more. I share the same sentiment as BobAuckland. Your heart was too far in this. This is not the biggest corporate crime ever and you only feel that way because, as a shareholder who stayed to the bitter end, you're getting shafted. You played the game that way. You can't control what the company does but you had control over your investment the whole time. You could have kicked the thieves out before they took too much. Get me? I really hope you get a better deal but this should be taken as a lesson for the next investment. BTW, I meant a stock forum other than BBRY forums on Crackberry.
    khehl and Etios like this.
    10-26-13 09:25 AM
  5. eddy_berry's Avatar
    If you think they got offered market value for the company you're way too naieve in the way the world works to even have this discussion.

    Posted via CB10
    Not what I meant but I see everyone thought that. Refer to BobAuckland last post. He said it better. Let's see what other offers come in.
    10-26-13 09:32 AM
  6. anon3700711's Avatar
    10-26-13 09:33 AM
  7. khehl's Avatar
    You obviously know nothing about business..

    Posted via CB10
    10-26-13 09:33 AM
  8. chtang's Avatar
    You said it yourself.
    A smart management would have taken action 3 years ago
    So why didn't you sell your shares back then? It should have been obvious that management wasn't taking the actions they needed to. You would have gotten $55-60 a share.

    I'm sorry you lost money, but a decreasing stock price is not a crime.
    10-26-13 01:07 PM
  9. m1a1mg's Avatar
    Are you delusional or what? You know when geeks like you start talking about finance, things go to crazy-land. Now stick to your toys and gizmos, and leave serious arguments to people with brains who understand finance and investments.
    Please do not comment on stuff you have no idea about.
    I think there is someone delusional, but it isn't eddy_berry.

    Obviously, there are many finance experts who don't think the BBRY is worth the effort. But only time will tell.
    khehl, Etios and eddy_berry like this.
    10-26-13 02:19 PM
  10. theHip's Avatar
    Dont you think BBerry would have received an offer fpor more than $9 a few years back?
    Of course I do. But they were in a much better position a few years back, and we are talking about their value today, not yesterday.

    I know everyone is feeling like they got ripped off, but that's life. That's the downfalls of being traded publicly. The people have spoken, and the people say BlackBerry is worth $8.23 per share (at the time of writing this).

    No one seems interested in bringing that price up by buying shares.

    Posted via CB10
    10-26-13 05:12 PM
  11. Eldon Wilk's Avatar
    140 million shares shorted and rising looks like an attempt to hold share price down. As well checking Interactive Charts. Yes Bbry has been a speculative play. But 1.5 B in properties patents worth at least 3B approx 2.4B software service fees 2.6B cash 1B in written off hardware 500m tax rebate and now almost 100m BBM users. (2.6B in cash after the 1B write off) QNX and Certicom worth conservatively 1B. All in all Bbry is certainly worth way more than present bid.
    10-26-13 05:47 PM
  12. bobauckland's Avatar
    140 million shares shorted and rising looks like an attempt to hold share price down. As well checking Interactive Charts. Yes Bbry has been a speculative play. But 1.5 B in properties patents worth at least 3B approx 2.4B software service fees 2.6B cash 1B in written off hardware 500m tax rebate and now almost 100m BBM users. (2.6B in cash after the 1B write off) QNX and Certicom worth conservatively 1B. All in all Bbry is certainly worth way more than present bid.
    5 posts in, and this is almost completely made up. Sounds like someone else misunderstood the stock and got burned.
    So much sadness, and it's so terrible how the market works in these situations.
    richardat and Etios like this.
    10-26-13 06:27 PM
  13. Franz Israel's Avatar
    The stock is currently trading below $9, so if the Fairfax deal goes through you will be getting more than "market value", by definition.
    So the board decides to sell when the price is low? Sell below tangible book value? so board is putting a value of negative $2 billion on its business, yes the business is a liability of $2 billion.
    10-26-13 10:17 PM
  14. Franz Israel's Avatar
    Of course I do. But they were in a much better position a few years back, and we are talking about their value today, not yesterday.

    I know everyone is feeling like they got ripped off, but that's life. That's the downfalls of being traded publicly. The people have spoken, and the people say BlackBerry is worth $8.23 per share (at the time of writing this).

    No one seems interested in bringing that price up by buying shares.

    Posted via CB10
    So why sell now? whats the hurry? so Fairfax and Heins etc can get rich instantly?
    10-26-13 10:18 PM
  15. Franz Israel's Avatar
    You said it yourself.

    So why didn't you sell your shares back then? It should have been obvious that management wasn't taking the actions they needed to. You would have gotten $55-60 a share.

    I'm sorry you lost money, but a decreasing stock price is not a crime.
    No declining stock price is not a crime, but selling the company at the height of negativity is a crime.. selling to people who are related and who paid you money to sell them cheap is a crime.
    10-26-13 10:19 PM
  16. Franz Israel's Avatar
    I think you need to lay off me son. Maybe manners wasn't the right word. How about professionalism? My question to you is, if you feel as if you were robbed, why did you let them in and let them stay for so long? You say I'm the gullible one. Your analogy does not make sense. You let them stay and take more. I share the same sentiment as BobAuckland. Your heart was too far in this. This is not the biggest corporate crime ever and you only feel that way because, as a shareholder who stayed to the bitter end, you're getting shafted. You played the game that way. You can't control what the company does but you had control over your investment the whole time. You could have kicked the thieves out before they took too much. Get me? I really hope you get a better deal but this should be taken as a lesson for the next investment. BTW, I meant a stock forum other than BBRY forums on Crackberry.
    I dont wish you are robbed or really bad things to happen to you but if it does, would you blame yourself? Life is full of risks, but when there is fraudalent behavior, that should be fought. According to you, boards and management can do whatever they want, there is no accountability, eh?
    So why have any rules, any governanace, just kill and loot.
    10-26-13 10:22 PM
  17. Franz Israel's Avatar
    So according to you gangrape is bad, but rape is okay/
    10-26-13 10:23 PM
  18. Franz Israel's Avatar
    You obviously know nothing about business..

    Posted via CB10
    Yes, I do know about business son. And I know a thing or two about greed and fraud as well.
    10-26-13 10:23 PM
  19. richardat's Avatar
    No declining stock price is not a crime, but selling the company at the height of negativity is a crime.. selling to people who are related and who paid you money to sell them cheap is a crime.
    You are correct that Heins and Watsa are both very concerned, probably wholly concerned with cashing themselves out. That is what happens at the end. It's unfortunate, but many of "you" won't be able to. I don't know that they have done anything illegal however.

    My question though to you is: what is it you wish to see happen?? What course of action do you want the board to take?

    The fact is, regardlesss of whether Prem or Heins get their reward (they will, and no, they don't deserve it), you, and the other joe blow investors are toast anyways.
    bobauckland and m1a1mg like this.
    10-27-13 02:07 AM
  20. bobauckland's Avatar
    Yes, I do know about business son. And I know a thing or two about greed and fraud as well.
    Why do you call everyone son?
    Whatever sympathy people have for you erodes with every immature insulting ignorant post you make.

    Why don't you mail prem and heins directly and ask them if they're your children too, I'm sure that will go down well.

    Posted via CB10
    khehl, Etios and OMGitworks like this.
    10-27-13 03:48 AM
  21. qwerty4ever's Avatar
    Do you see anyone yet willing to pay more? BlackBerry didn't ask for the pricing, which by the way is not $0, but instead was offered to them based on market price. It would be nicer if people were willing to invest in stocks but that isn't working anymore. Would you rather see the company kick the bucket then or do what is necessary to stay alive? Your post is inaccurate. Nobody wants to pay more for something based on how much it could maybe possibly be worth. BLackBerry is worth what it is now for obvious reasons.
    The price of USD8.00 per share might as well be USD0.00 considering the mismanagement executed by the BlackBerry Senior Management Team under the command of Thorsten Heins. Fairfax and BlackBerry tacitly agreed to manipulate the share price hoping to draw other bidders to the auction. Thus far no serious bidders have stepped forward despite rumours Mike Lazardis and John Scully have expressed an interest in the company. The only people walking away with bags of cash will be the BlackBerry Senior Management Team, BlackBerry Board of Directors, and most notorious of them all BlackBerry Chief Executive Officer Thorsten Heins when he is handed his walking papers. By the way, where is that weasel?
    10-27-13 07:29 AM
  22. qwerty4ever's Avatar
    Why do you call everyone son?
    Whatever sympathy people have for you erodes with every immature insulting ignorant post you make.
    Posted via CB10
    It is a Southern US expression and possibly used in other countries as well.
    10-27-13 07:31 AM
  23. m1a1mg's Avatar
    It is a Southern US expression and possibly used in other countries as well.
    I grew up in the South. I live here now. If I called someone "Son", I'd expect the need to physically defend myself.

    It is meant to demean the person you are talking to as not being worthy.
    bobauckland, khehl, trwrt and 2 others like this.
    10-27-13 08:52 AM
  24. sergei9's Avatar
    New letter from Darryl McKinnon "open letter to the Canadian

    BlackBerry an Alternative Reality, An Alternative Future | pfcsystems


    A Letter To Members of The Canadian Parliament


    This was sent out by one of our BBM Channel subscribers:

    Dearest Member of Parliament,

    My name is Darryl McKinnon. Im a Canadian and a strong supporter of Canada.

    Im contacting you today to express my deep concern over the current circumstances surrounding Canadas titan of innovation: BlackBerry.

    My biggest concern right now is the lack of support from Canadians and the government of Canada for BlackBerry, as well as the strange circumstances surrounding the current sale of the company.

    The American financial News makers Bloomberg & CNBC among others, have sold Canada a story of no value in BlackBerry and we as a nation are believing it!

    Americans support their Tech Cos through the Financial Markets! Tech companies in the USA trade at 100′s of times their earnings, years before they ever make money! These valuations protect the said companies and empower them to go out and buy real value, by acquiring other companies.

    Linkedin trades at 650 times their earnings.
    Netflix trades at 376 times their earnings.
    FaceBook trades at 180 times their earnings.
    Tesla is over 1000 times their earnings

    Canadian BlackBerry is being sold at .5 times their book value!

    Prem Watsa Buying BlackBerry at Half of Book Value - NASDAQ.com

    The sale of BlackBerry looks to be rigged, like it was planned out, well in advance of the situation being as critical as it now appears. The CEO and BOD installed incentives to sell the company. It seems as though current products are purposefully being scuttled to ensure a low bar is set for the current bidder.
    I believe the BlackBerry CEO has neglected his duty to shareholders, when he first set himself up to benefit from a sale of the company. He then signed a deal to sell the company, with financial obstacles for others to enter.
    BlackBerry traded at a higher price than the existing Fairfax offer, the day before the offer came. There was not enough time for anyone to do the due dilidiligence. This deal was cooked up prior to being announced, to benefit only those in positions of power, neglecting long term shareholders like myself.
    I believe the current BlackBerry CEO should be removed before a sale is completed to ensure its not a fraud!
    The government of Canada could request/recommend, Jim Balsillie to return as CEO to ensure this situation is handled legally and in a fashion that meets the needs of Canada!

    It would be helpful if the Government of Canada could show more support!
    The Canadian government could buy a stability stake in the company which it could hold for 2 to 3 years! This would send a strong signal to the enterprise market that they can continue to count on BlackBerry.
    Canada has a strong history as a fair arbitrator and protector of personal privacy! The message would resonate in the market.

    Saving BlackBerry would be as easy as spinning out BBM and Channels into a new company, distributing shares to current holders, while BlackBerry retains a controlling stake. Do the same with Mobile Device Management, and BES10 if need be.
    This would create value and erase the myopic view of the company by the market.
    Offering up BB10 to other mobile manufacturers in China & India would increasing BB10 distribution.
    From there BlackBerry can remain public, right size, and move forward with BB10, Mobile Device Management, Software, Services, Social & Security for the mobile world, and so much more!

    The technology inside BlackBerry will guide Canadas future in the mobile world!
    They have a proven business model, they only need to complete their transition and right size the company.
    BlackBerry is not late to the market with their offerings, theyre early!

    BlackBerrys announcement of the special committee was beyond poor timing. Interest in the platform from developers was and still is strong and sales were coming. Any new platform needs more then 6 months for users to asses its value. BB10 has true, differentiated value. I can assure you of this.
    I believe this is Canadas moment to show our resolve. To ensure our Tech sector remains strong. We can do this. Success is assured. We just need to provide some time, in the form of support.

    Please support my effort to see BlackBerry remain public and Canadian!

    My attempts to communicate via email, with BlackBerry Investor relations have gone ignored since August 16. First they responded saying we could set up a call after the coming earnings report. But since the ER they have not responded to my email requests for information.
    Ive been an investor in BlackBerry for 5 years! I feel the pain of the current situation. But I believe in this technology 110% I have no desire to sell my shares! Certainly not in a forced sale, where it appears the CEO and BOD, have scuttled the Stock Price to help facilitate the deal.
    If Canada cant find a way to facilitate the completion of the BlackBerry turn around. Or looses BlackBerry to a foreign bidder. I fear we will always be seen as a second class market, unable to compete, let alone support our innovative companies.

    Your support is greatly appreciated.

    Kindest Regards
    Darryl McKinnon.

    Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone.

    Read more at BlackBerry ( T.BB ) stock message board and forum - Bullboard Discussion - Stockhouse Community
    khehl likes this.
    10-27-13 12:17 PM
  25. khehl's Avatar
    New letter from Darryl McKinnon "open letter to the Canadian

    BlackBerry an Alternative Reality, An Alternative Future | pfcsystems


    A Letter To Members of The Canadian Parliament


    This was sent out by one of our BBM Channel subscribers:

    Dearest Member of Parliament,

    My name is Darryl McKinnon. Im a Canadian and a strong supporter of Canada.

    Im contacting you today to express my deep concern over the current circumstances surrounding Canadas titan of innovation: BlackBerry.

    My biggest concern right now is the lack of support from Canadians and the government of Canada for BlackBerry, as well as the strange circumstances surrounding the current sale of the company.

    The American financial News makers Bloomberg & CNBC among others, have sold Canada a story of no value in BlackBerry and we as a nation are believing it!

    Americans support their Tech Cos through the Financial Markets! Tech companies in the USA trade at 100′s of times their earnings, years before they ever make money! These valuations protect the said companies and empower them to go out and buy real value, by acquiring other companies.

    Linkedin trades at 650 times their earnings.
    Netflix trades at 376 times their earnings.
    FaceBook trades at 180 times their earnings.
    Tesla is over 1000 times their earnings

    Canadian BlackBerry is being sold at .5 times their book value!

    Prem Watsa Buying BlackBerry at Half of Book Value - NASDAQ.com

    The sale of BlackBerry looks to be rigged, like it was planned out, well in advance of the situation being as critical as it now appears. The CEO and BOD installed incentives to sell the company. It seems as though current products are purposefully being scuttled to ensure a low bar is set for the current bidder.
    I believe the BlackBerry CEO has neglected his duty to shareholders, when he first set himself up to benefit from a sale of the company. He then signed a deal to sell the company, with financial obstacles for others to enter.
    BlackBerry traded at a higher price than the existing Fairfax offer, the day before the offer came. There was not enough time for anyone to do the due dilidiligence. This deal was cooked up prior to being announced, to benefit only those in positions of power, neglecting long term shareholders like myself.
    I believe the current BlackBerry CEO should be removed before a sale is completed to ensure its not a fraud!
    The government of Canada could request/recommend, Jim Balsillie to return as CEO to ensure this situation is handled legally and in a fashion that meets the needs of Canada!

    It would be helpful if the Government of Canada could show more support!
    The Canadian government could buy a stability stake in the company which it could hold for 2 to 3 years! This would send a strong signal to the enterprise market that they can continue to count on BlackBerry.
    Canada has a strong history as a fair arbitrator and protector of personal privacy! The message would resonate in the market.

    Saving BlackBerry would be as easy as spinning out BBM and Channels into a new company, distributing shares to current holders, while BlackBerry retains a controlling stake. Do the same with Mobile Device Management, and BES10 if need be.
    This would create value and erase the myopic view of the company by the market.
    Offering up BB10 to other mobile manufacturers in China & India would increasing BB10 distribution.
    From there BlackBerry can remain public, right size, and move forward with BB10, Mobile Device Management, Software, Services, Social & Security for the mobile world, and so much more!

    The technology inside BlackBerry will guide Canadas future in the mobile world!
    They have a proven business model, they only need to complete their transition and right size the company.
    BlackBerry is not late to the market with their offerings, theyre early!

    BlackBerrys announcement of the special committee was beyond poor timing. Interest in the platform from developers was and still is strong and sales were coming. Any new platform needs more then 6 months for users to asses its value. BB10 has true, differentiated value. I can assure you of this.
    I believe this is Canadas moment to show our resolve. To ensure our Tech sector remains strong. We can do this. Success is assured. We just need to provide some time, in the form of support.

    Please support my effort to see BlackBerry remain public and Canadian!

    My attempts to communicate via email, with BlackBerry Investor relations have gone ignored since August 16. First they responded saying we could set up a call after the coming earnings report. But since the ER they have not responded to my email requests for information.
    Ive been an investor in BlackBerry for 5 years! I feel the pain of the current situation. But I believe in this technology 110% I have no desire to sell my shares! Certainly not in a forced sale, where it appears the CEO and BOD, have scuttled the Stock Price to help facilitate the deal.
    If Canada cant find a way to facilitate the completion of the BlackBerry turn around. Or looses BlackBerry to a foreign bidder. I fear we will always be seen as a second class market, unable to compete, let alone support our innovative companies.

    Your support is greatly appreciated.

    Kindest Regards
    Darryl McKinnon.

    Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone.

    Read more at BlackBerry ( T.BB ) stock message board and forum - Bullboard Discussion - Stockhouse Community
    You should definitely make your own thread on that..

    Posted via CB10
    Eldon Wilk likes this.
    10-27-13 02:57 PM
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