11-13-13 07:25 PM
73 123
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  1. Franz Israel's Avatar
    Blackberry has $5 in cash
    Blackberry has minimum $4 in PP&E
    Fairfax bid $9 a share and gets $157 million breakup fee, Heins gets $55 million for selling the company.

    So all thse hundreds pof millions of dollars are given away to people who are valuing:
    All 9,000 Patents
    BB 10
    BBM
    BES 10 and Enterprise business/MDM
    Legacy business
    70 million customers
    ... all of that at a grand total of $0 ZERO, NADA, ZILCH,

    And Crackberry wont say a word about this crime being crommitted; one of the biggest financial/corporate crimes in the history of mankind. Those Z10 and Z30s. those Q10s and those BBMs, are all worth zero.

    So much for Canadian business ethics.

    Resrtructuring costs of $400 millin cancelled by $400 in tax refunds
    europolska00, gg22 and pbfan like this.
    10-24-13 02:05 PM
  2. mkwb's Avatar
    There are just so many things wrong with this post that I'm not going to comment further.
    richardat likes this.
    10-24-13 02:07 PM
  3. Franz Israel's Avatar
    You seem to be from Blackberry PR department because thats what the PR people at Blackberry always say: "No Comment" while the company gets slaughtered in the media. Instead of trolling here, why dont you do some good for this company with amazing technology that is getting trashed.
    There are just so many things wrong with this post that I'm not going to comment further.
    fedakd and kfh227 like this.
    10-24-13 10:37 PM
  4. eddy_berry's Avatar
    Do you see anyone yet willing to pay more? BlackBerry didn't ask for the pricing, which by the way is not $0, but instead was offered to them based on market price. It would be nicer if people were willing to invest in stocks but that isn't working anymore. Would you rather see the company kick the bucket then or do what is necessary to stay alive? Your post is inaccurate. Nobody wants to pay more for something based on how much it could maybe possibly be worth. BLackBerry is worth what it is now for obvious reasons.
    10-24-13 10:52 PM
  5. fedakd's Avatar
    I disagree. It's difficult to say who is and who isn't interested due to the non-disclosure agreements. Furthermore, we are more likely to hear about companies that are not interested in BlackBerry than those that are. For instance, Silver Lake noted that they were not interested in pursuing a bid for BlackBerry. If a company is interested in BlackBerry, they are more likely to simply not comment, which if you've been paying attention, is exactly what's been happening. Soon we will see how the poker game ends.

    Do you see anyone yet willing to pay more? BlackBerry didn't ask for the pricing, which by the way is not $0, but instead was offered to them based on market price. It would be nicer if people were willing to invest in stocks but that isn't working anymore. Would you rather see the company kick the bucket then or do what is necessary to stay alive? Your post is inaccurate. Nobody wants to pay more for something based on how much it could maybe possibly be worth. BLackBerry is worth what it is now for obvious reasons.
    BlackistheBerry likes this.
    10-25-13 02:02 AM
  6. theHip's Avatar
    Look, it's simple. If someone thought BlackBerry was worth more than $9 per share, then a better offer would be on the table. But there isn't. If the public thought the company was worth more than $9 per share, then the stock price would reflect that. But it doesn't.

    Posted via CB10
    10-25-13 02:14 AM
  7. trwrt's Avatar
    Fairfax? More like unFair-fax, amirite?
    richardat and europolska00 like this.
    10-25-13 02:36 AM
  8. bobauckland's Avatar
    Everytime I read some of these threads, I'm reminded of how important it is to invest using brains and not heart.
    So many people seem to have lost money because they don't understand how the stock market works.
    It's scary.
    10-25-13 05:48 AM
  9. zee3p0's Avatar
    There will be another offer, i think that is kind of obvious by now. If fairfax firms up and the company sells then complain about it. We don't know what is going to happen here. The fairfax / BlackBerry offer just accelerated the process to keep buyers from holding off from bidding. The company desprately needs to be removed from the public market/view to prevent further harm to the brand. Should have done this last year, but it would be doubtful shareholders would be into that with the upcoming bb10 launch.

    Posted via CB10
    silversun10 and fedakd like this.
    10-25-13 08:40 AM
  10. Franz Israel's Avatar
    My question is why sell now... Heins LIED to us when he said he has a 3 year plan. But if you need to do something, why not break up the company? For instance, let BBM part of business be a separate business.
    This whole thing is one big rip-off, a crime being committed in Waterloo by the board and the top management.

    I disagree. It's difficult to say who is and who isn't interested due to the non-disclosure agreements. Furthermore, we are more likely to hear about companies that are not interested in BlackBerry than those that are. For instance, Silver Lake noted that they were not interested in pursuing a bid for BlackBerry. If a company is interested in BlackBerry, they are more likely to simply not comment, which if you've been paying attention, is exactly what's been happening. Soon we will see how the poker game ends.
    fedakd and europolska00 like this.
    10-25-13 09:19 AM
  11. Franz Israel's Avatar
    So tell me how the stock market works?
    This is not about stock market, its about sheer incompetency, fraud and criminal behavior by the stewards of a company that has tremendous assets.

    Everytime I read some of these threads, I'm reminded of how important it is to invest using brains and not heart.
    So many people seem to have lost money because they don't understand how the stock market works.
    It's scary.
    10-25-13 09:21 AM
  12. hrim5493's Avatar
    Stop your rediculous nonsense. BB still has a chance for a buyout/bid offer from another bidder so relax. In addition, you're ignorant if you think this is the biggest financial crime being committed. Have you heard of enron or madoff?
    Blackberry has $5 in cash
    Blackberry has minimum $4 in PP&E
    Fairfax bid $9 a share and gets $157 million breakup fee, Heins gets $55 million for selling the company.

    So all thse hundreds pof millions of dollars are given away to people who are valuing:
    All 9,000 Patents
    BB 10
    BBM
    BES 10 and Enterprise business/MDM
    Legacy business
    70 million customers
    ... all of that at a grand total of $0 ZERO, NADA, ZILCH,

    And Crackberry wont say a word about this crime being crommitted; one of the biggest financial/corporate crimes in the history of mankind. Those Z10 and Z30s. those Q10s and those BBMs, are all worth zero.

    So much for Canadian business ethics.

    Resrtructuring costs of $400 millin cancelled by $400 in tax refunds
    silversun10 likes this.
    10-25-13 09:21 AM
  13. Franz Israel's Avatar
    A smart management would have taken action 3 years ago but "We are Blackberry" arrogance has resulted in so much destruction but all of those low-life criminals at Blackberry are quick to take money when it comes to personal enrichment. I lost my retirement, I can show proof, will these thugs pay me?

    There will be another offer, i think that is kind of obvious by now. If fairfax firms up and the company sells then complain about it. We don't know what is going to happen here. The fairfax / BlackBerry offer just accelerated the process to keep buyers from holding off from bidding. The company desprately needs to be removed from the public market/view to prevent further harm to the brand. Should have done this last year, but it would be doubtful shareholders would be into that with the upcoming bb10 launch.

    Posted via CB10
    10-25-13 09:23 AM
  14. Franz Israel's Avatar
    Yes, i have heard of Msdoff and Enron, and the Fairfax/Blackberry deal is in that category, so sorry, I amend my title.. one of the biggest financial crimes committed.


    Stop your rediculous nonsense. BB still has a chance for a buyout/bid offer from another bidder so relax. In addition, you're ignorant if you think this is the biggest financial crime being committed. Have you heard of enron or madoff?
    10-25-13 09:25 AM
  15. Dave79's Avatar
    It's a legalized crime, even Chris Umi voiced his unhappiness to how things turned out but quickly voiced down, for probably obvoius reasons?

    Anyway it's not the first time things like this happen and it's not the last one. Every privatization/delisting is a legalized crime and think about it if you were going to bid for a company and you were sitting in its board would you do anything to drive the price up prior the bid and lower it? I'd rather pay the lowest price on the market when I purchase something...

    Unfortunately small investors has little defences in these circumstances. Any savy investors would have dumped long time ago. The lastest to dump BBRY was about when this guy wrote this article:
    The Young And Restless Portfolio Update: Dumping BlackBerry And Sitting Tight - Seeking Alpha
    10-25-13 09:35 AM
  16. zee3p0's Avatar
    Yes, i have heard of Msdoff and Enron, and the Fairfax/Blackberry deal is in that category, so sorry, I amend my title.. one of the biggest financial crimes committed.
    There is no crimes here, and you obviously know nothing about enron and madoff to put them in the same category.



    Posted via CB10
    10-25-13 09:36 AM
  17. s7khan's Avatar
    one of the biggest financial/corporate crimes in the history of mankind.
    Oh really???

    Bernie Maddoff
    Libor
    30-1 Leverage
    Misleading credit ratings by agencies on obviously junk funds
    Enron

    And that's just a tiny list of the last 13 years. I'm not sure if your post is meant to be serious, or a joke that flew right over my head.
    silversun10 likes this.
    10-25-13 10:05 AM
  18. eddy_berry's Avatar
    Are you delusional or what? You know when geeks like you start talking about finance, things go to crazy-land. Now stick to your toys and gizmos, and leave serious arguments to people with brains who understand finance and investments.
    Please do not comment on stuff you have no idea about.
    Thanks for replying to me like an adult. You need to learn some manners. Go on a financial forum and talk to people then.
    10-25-13 05:59 PM
  19. europolska00's Avatar
    Blackberry has $5 in cash
    Blackberry has minimum $4 in PP&E
    Fairfax bid $9 a share and gets $157 million breakup fee, Heins gets $55 million for selling the company.

    So all thse hundreds pof millions of dollars are given away to people who are valuing:
    All 9,000 Patents
    BB 10
    BBM
    BES 10 and Enterprise business/MDM
    Legacy business
    70 million customers
    ... all of that at a grand total of $0 ZERO, NADA, ZILCH,

    And Crackberry wont say a word about this crime being crommitted; one of the biggest financial/corporate crimes in the history of mankind. Those Z10 and Z30s. those Q10s and those BBMs, are all worth zero.

    So much for Canadian business ethics.

    Resrtructuring costs of $400 millin cancelled by $400 in tax refunds
    Here here! Why do people get so upset when someone has the stones to just flat out call it as it is. Good for you original poster!

    Posted via CB10
    10-25-13 10:59 PM
  20. europolska00's Avatar
    Do you see anyone yet willing to pay more? BlackBerry didn't ask for the pricing, which by the way is not $0, but instead was offered to them based on market price. It would be nicer if people were willing to invest in stocks but that isn't working anymore. Would you rather see the company kick the bucket then or do what is necessary to stay alive? Your post is inaccurate. Nobody wants to pay more for something based on how much it could maybe possibly be worth. BLackBerry is worth what it is now for obvious reasons.
    No sorry, OP has it right. You have it backwards. He is pointing out what everything is worth if you just liquidated assets. The $9 offer is what you are saying, perceived worth. Only difference is you are accusing the OP of too high of a perceived value, and he is pointing out the perceived value is too low.

    BlackBerry announces their earnings early and their sp drops to just pennies over $9. The next business day, Prem Watsa's company happens to agree to pay a ridiculously low $9, and BlackBerry is allowed to shop around. But if someone else happens to make an offer, better than a ridiculously low set price, and get an amazing bargain buying BlackBerry, which they know it will, Watsa gets a nice pay out and so does Thorsten Heins. The CEO, and an until recently, a board member happen to get this payout nicely set up. And then Watsa leaves the board and makes the bid.

    If you think they got offered market value for the company you're way too naieve in the way the world works to even have this discussion.

    Posted via CB10
    10-25-13 11:28 PM
  21. Franz Israel's Avatar
    All of that will come out in lawsuits. Dont you think BBerry would have received an offer fpor more than $9 a few years back? What was the hurry to sign the deal with Fairfax? Isnt this like:
    Watsa to Heins: here is $55 milliopn of shareholders' money that you can have
    Heins to Watsa: here is $157 million of shareholders money you can have
    Heins and Watsa to others: Hey here is a million for you 2 million for you etc.
    Oh, and to Mike and Jim: Here is $7 million for you two.
    Thats what has come to pass in one of the best tech companies ever.
    Look, it's simple. If someone thought BlackBerry was worth more than $9 per share, then a better offer would be on the table. But there isn't. If the public thought the company was worth more than $9 per share, then the stock price would reflect that. But it doesn't.

    Posted via CB10
    10-26-13 01:08 AM
  22. Franz Israel's Avatar
    Here here! Why do people get so upset when someone has the stones to just flat out call it as it is. Good for you original poster!

    Posted via CB10
    Thats because most people here on Crackberry have no independent thinking. If BBerry management told them to jump off the cliff, they will. Most of these crackberry users are basically a cult, pure and simple.. sheep.
    10-26-13 01:09 AM
  23. Franz Israel's Avatar
    Oh really???

    Bernie Maddoff
    Libor
    30-1 Leverage
    Misleading credit ratings by agencies on obviously junk funds
    Enron

    And that's just a tiny list of the last 13 years. I'm not sure if your post is meant to be serious, or a joke that flew right over my head.
    Oh yeah! Then why Watsa who said $40 or more gets paid $157 million for bidding $9?
    What was the hurry?
    Why $157 million breakup fee for a bid that is below book value. That means all yoiur hype about BB10, BBM, security is one BIG FRAUD because you are valuing them at less than ZERO.

    Stop kissing BBerry management behind and think!
    10-26-13 01:12 AM
  24. trwrt's Avatar
    The stock is currently trading below $9, so if the Fairfax deal goes through you will be getting more than "market value", by definition.
    10-26-13 01:13 AM
  25. Franz Israel's Avatar
    No sorry, OP has it right. You have it backwards. He is pointing out what everything is worth if you just liquidated assets. The $9 offer is what you are saying, perceived worth. Only difference is you are accusing the OP of too high of a perceived value, and he is pointing out the perceived value is too low.

    BlackBerry announces their earnings early and their sp drops to just pennies over $9. The next business day, Prem Watsa's company happens to agree to pay a ridiculously low $9, and BlackBerry is allowed to shop around. But if someone else happens to make an offer, better than a ridiculously low set price, and get an amazing bargain buying BlackBerry, which they know it will, Watsa gets a nice pay out and so does Thorsten Heins. The CEO, and an until recently, a board member happen to get this payout nicely set up. And then Watsa leaves the board and makes the bid.

    If you think they got offered market value for the company you're way too naieve in the way the world works to even have this discussion.

    Posted via CB10
    I dont think these guys here understand. They, unlike me, have no skin in the game. I saved my retirement by working on my two feet day and night and that has been stolen by this management and board.

    I will say this again and again that this management led by Heins and Board led by Stymiest colluded to steal my money, my retirerment savings. I have proof.
    10-26-13 01:14 AM
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