[cjcampbell]

Everywhere im reading the media and big funds would like to see BBRY as a software run company only, reason the stock keeps dropping is because BBRY said they are still committed to handsets and we still don't have a strategic plan on turning this around from Chen yet. I don't expect anything because of the "quiet period" but what im trying to do is think in Chen shoes, he should know that ditching the production of the hardware division would immediately lift the SP and that would get rid of the continued losses. So when Chen says he is still committed to handsets did he specify that BBRY would be producing it or find a company to outsource and license too? this part I could not find in any readings but technically if the hardware is outsourced BBRY can still provide end to end service right?

They can't ditch the handsets. That's an integral part of the top to bottom security that many of the service subscribers rely on. The German gov wouldn't have bought a, lets just say, Samsung made BB10 device since it probably (and no, I can't confirm this) wouldn't have reacted the same with the added Secusmart security card. I'm of the feeling that they should either close the Waterloo production or the Mexico plant. For local business reasons and simple test production, I'd say keep the Waterloo but for cost of labour, it's keep Mexico. One or the other but not both. They absolutely need to continue in the handset area.

[morlock_man]

Because they may be impressed, but there is nothing obvious enough to get them to change. And that's a huge problem. Although the Z30 is a wonderful device, what differentiates from the others?

The best phone-to-phone sound quality in the world?

Security that's harder to crack into than a physical bank vault?

Personally, I want them to release an IDE and a desktop when they bring full landscape mode in a future update. Software features are a lot easier to add to an older device than hardware features.

[slipstream89]

ahh ok thats the part I was trying to understand, so it doesn't even work if someone else produces the hardware but we still manage all the security and software

They can't ditch the handsets. That's an integral part of the top to bottom security that many of the service subscribers rely on. The German gov wouldn't have bought a, lets just say, Samsung made BB10 device since it probably (and no, I can't confirm this) wouldn't have reacted the same with the added Secusmart security card. I'm of the feeling that they should either close the Waterloo production or the Mexico plant. For local business reasons and simple test production, I'd say keep the Waterloo but for cost of labour, it's keep Mexico. One or the other but not both. They absolutely need to continue in the handset area.

[cjcampbell]

ahh ok thats the part I was trying to understand, so it doesn't even work if someone else produces the hardware but we still manage all the security and software

Yes... A lot of the security is the hardware itself. It takes a lot of hard work, and many many hours/days/weeks, to break the physical security let alone the software. You simply can't root the hardware and take a back door (gigidy). Now, of course, in theory, they could get a handset manufacturer to make them just as secure, but that would be more work on the OEM's part to supply parts and add production for something that doesn't sell as well as their other lines of which they don't need to, nor care to, have the secure hardware. Look at how many ways there are to "break into" an iPhone or Android device. There's even the freezer method if you can't get through the other layers of security. Any know ways to break a BlackBerry? Now some would bring up the whole "why bother with such a small market share" and I have one answer. The final nail in the coffin. Why wouldn't companies like Apple or Google invest in breaking the security premise of BlackBerry? That's the one thing they have going for them at the moment and the one thing that keeps them in use by a large number of corporations and governments. To show how a BlackBerry could be cracked would open the door wide open. It just makes sense. Funny, though, that nothing has come out of it.

[michaelshawn]

Here's my support to BlackBerry! I got this beautiful beast on the weekend. It definitely wasn't easy to get though. is there a z30 club?? LOL


Posted via CB10

[kfh227]

Because they may be impressed, but there is nothing obvious enough to get them to change. And that's a huge problem. Although the Z30 is a wonderful device, what differentiates from the others?

Hub.

The reason I will never get any android device.

Keyboard

The reason I will never get any iOS device.



Posted via CB10

[Andrew4life]

Tax loss selling.
So I know there is a 30 day time frame after tax loss selling that you can't buy back the shares, but what if I buy more and then sell.

E.g. If my average price right now is $20 and I had 100 shares. If I buy another 100 shares at $10, wouldn't my average share price be $15, so then I immediately sell 100 shares at $10, which would mean I loss $5 ($15 - $10), so I would get capital loss of $5 x 100 shares = $500 in capital loss?

[danprown]

Keep in mind the revenue breakdown for the last quarter was approximately 49% for hardware, 46% for service and 5% for software and other revenue. It be difficult to cut the hardware.

Everywhere im reading the media and big funds would like to see BBRY as a software run company only, reason the stock keeps dropping is because BBRY said they are still committed to handsets and we still don't have a strategic plan on turning this around from Chen yet. I don't expect anything because of the "quiet period" but what im trying to do is think in Chen shoes, he should know that ditching the production of the hardware division would immediately lift the SP and that would get rid of the continued losses. So when Chen says he is still committed to handsets did he specify that BBRY would be producing it or find a company to outsource and license too? this part I could not find in any readings but technically if the hardware is outsourced BBRY can still provide end to end service right?

[Joao Oliveira]

The best phone-to-phone sound quality in the world?

Security that's harder to crack into than a physical bank vault?

Personally, I want them to release an IDE and a desktop when they bring full landscape mode in a future update. Software features are a lot easier to add to an older device than hardware features.

WE know that, WE, Blackberry users know that!... but those features are hidden, and the common consumer doesn't know much about that... They have to advertise, let people know the advantages, because the Z30 is seen as another competitor with similar features.

[fedakd]

I hear you morgan, me as well. Stock hit a fresh 10-year low today. It's evident that whatever BlackBerry is doing, they should be doing something else. Shareholders are not happy, and we are kept in the dark. The last 4-5 days have been tough to watch - could it be tax loss selling? Seems like its more. Could earnings have been leaked? Will we get another warning like last quarter? I'm starting to get worried here.

I couldn't agree with you more JLagoon,

We need a change of management, they sit behind closed doors and let the media trample all over us. There is no support for the stock either. Pathetic management. They could retire 100,000,000 shares and wipe out the effect of the bond issue. You have to wonder why Mike L isn't buying super cheap shares down here. Pathetic. I'm tired of seeing this company continue as the spineless creature that they have become.

I have been trying to buy a Z30 this weekend and it is so hard to come by. My frickin' carrier doesn't carry it so I have to find another one that has one in stock. All I get is promises that they will have them one day. What kind of company refuses to make their product available? Man, I'm ticked at them!

[cjcampbell]

I hear your morgan, me as well. Stock hit a fresh 10-year low today. It's evident that whatever BlackBerry is doing, they should be doing something else. Shareholders are not happy, and we are kept in the dark. The last 4-5 days have been tough to watch - could it be tax loss selling? Seems like its more. Could earnings have been leaked? Will we get another warning like last quarter? I'm starting to get worried here.

I'd say it's a lot of tax loss and none willing to get in just yet. Tax loss is a good time to dump a dog and this is one that you're not going to have turn around by end of the year. I'm looking to get back in at some point but haven't seen any confirmation of the bottom yet. I'm sure there are many in the same boat as me. I don't expect to see any price correction until after the ER. And no... I don't expect the ER to be all that bad.... definitely not good but no worse than the last one, if not a tad better.

[JonCBK]

Everything. The only commonality between smart phones is the apps. Android is far different than iOS and BB10 is different too. So will Sailfish and Ubuntu be. The main reasons, I think anyway, that it hasn't caught on are for two main factors.... the jones effect, whereas people want what others have, and the fact that people, for some reason, are very reluctant to try and learn something new. If they can hang on for the long haul and garner enough revenues from services and other areas, then they should be able to catch on and grow. As much as I don't personally care for WP8 it seems to have finally been gaining some interest. How long did it take? A lot longer than BB10 has been on the market. Give it time.... Just because it hasn't been an instant hit doesn't mean that it can't become one.

I think WP8 mainly had cheap phones that looked nice. Then they followed that with nitch targeted advertising all over the place. Mainly they focused on the camera.

Posted via CB10

[sentimentGX4]

Everything. The only commonality between smart phones is the apps. Android is far different than iOS and BB10 is different too. So will Sailfish and Ubuntu be.

No, all mobile OSes are nearly exactly the same. If you claim that every OS is different, you think too inside the box. The only mobile OS that is even a little different is WP8 and its not distinguished by a unique feature set but its aesthetics.

Different is like iOS to BB OS. As of right now, the most central feature of every mobile OS is merely a grid app launcher. Then everybody has some multitask view and everybody has some notification center. How you navigate to the features may be tweaked here and there; but, if an OS was truly different, it should have features it shares with no other OS and this feature needs to be frequently used. "Frequently" as defined as the feature is used at least 20% of the OS's running time.

As much as I don't personally care for WP8 it seems to have finally been gaining some interest. How long did it take? A lot longer than BB10 has been on the market.

In its current state, BB10 may have underperformed Windows Phone 7. Yes, Windows Phone 7. Blackberry has a very tall mountain to climb to catch up with Windows Phone and even after that we don't even know if Windows Phone is actually financially viable. The only reason we don't discuss Windows Phones viability is because it is backed by Microsoft and the money is of no concern to Redmond. Windows Phone is no "success story" BB10 can ride.

[sidhuk]

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/b...w/27152231.cms

10 millions equal to one crore.
60 rupees equal to 1 us dollar.

Posted using Z30. Best phone in the world.

[JonCBK]

What I mean is the WP8 is just eeking out a small percentage based on looks, cheap prices and lots of advertising. I don't see long term success here.

Posted via CB10

[leafs123]

I think WP8 mainly had cheap phones that looked nice. Then they followed that with nitch targeted advertising all over the place. Mainly they focused on the camera.

Posted via CB10

I would say that was mostly Nokia than Microsoft itself. Hence, why Microsoft had to buy Nokia.

[leafs123]

What I mean is the WP8 is just eeking out a small percentage based on looks, cheap prices and lots of advertising. I don't see long term success here.

Posted via CB10

I disagree...whether cheap or expensive, you're building marketshare. Coupled with Microsoft's deep pockets to attract big apps, it's not a bad thing.

Cheap is the trend. Nokia did it with low cost Lumias and Google/Motorola did it with the Moto G. On their price points, you can't compete with those.

[cjcampbell]

No, all mobile OSes are nearly exactly the same. If you claim that every OS is different, you think too inside the box. The only mobile OS that is even a little different is WP8 and its not distinguished by a unique feature set but its aesthetics.

Different is like iOS to BB OS. As of right now, the most central feature of every mobile OS is merely a grid app launcher. Then everybody has some multitask view and everybody has some notification center. How you navigate to the features may be tweaked here and there; but, if an OS was truly different, it should have features it shares with no other OS and this feature needs to be frequently used. "Frequently" as defined as the feature is used at least 20% of the OS's running time.


In its current state, BB10 may have underperformed Windows Phone 7. Yes, Windows Phone 7. Blackberry has a very tall mountain to climb to catch up with Windows Phone and even after that we don't even know if Windows Phone is actually financially viable. The only reason we don't discuss Windows Phones viability is because it is backed by Microsoft and the money is of no concern to Redmond. Windows Phone is no "success story" BB10 can ride.

I'll both agree and disagree with what you are saying. They are the same as in the basic function and the app grid. Outside of that, they all operate differently. I'll go very simplistic and use, for example, 3 different ways of shifting gears in a car. There's automatic, manual, and tiptronic. All achieve the same function but all do it in a very different way. Those who learned how to drive using automatic have an unwillingness to learn standard even though it may be of more benefit in many situations, and those who use standard may not wish to learn or use tiptronic due to "bastardization" or "ruining" the driving experience. It's all personal preference but all very different user experience. So yes, all doing essentially the same thing, they are all very different.

Now, as for your comparison to WP7, I have no comment as I've never seen one nor used one, nor even seen an add or video. I'll reserve judgement until I see at least something.

[JLagoon]

Nothing to see here, carry on, BlackBerry Upgraded by MKM Partners to Neutral (BB) | North Fork Vue

[michaelshawn]

Nothing to see here, carry on, BlackBerry Upgraded by MKM Partners to Neutral (BB) | North Fork Vue

Is that good?

Posted via CB10

[kadakn01]

A reminder as tomorrow after market close we will get the short interest as of Nov 29th

[Superfly_FR]

On days when the stock is down, on-topic discussion of BBRY stock is hard to find around here. Off-topic posts about alcohol and HALO are the norm on red days.
Now comes the "troll" accusations, which is still off-topic.
In BBRY-related news, I think I may get back in this mofo after the new year. I expect the stock price to be further depressed by then and maybe BBRY will have a more transparent business model by then.

Off topic is gently monitored and almost 100% granted from Friday afternoon to Monday morning
Seems that the beer-thirsty can last up to two days for some of ... us lol

[Superfly_FR]

After the T-mobile BES in the Cloud news of yesterday, it became obvious to me that when Chen was referring to handsets, he was talking about future devices. Not "pushing commercially" actual devices.
As I wrote earlier, the next 5 months will be the continuity of Heins' job. That's strategy latency and unless they want to commit suicide, like it or not, our wishes, rants, hopes cannot change that.

Thus this strategy seems to take a form I do like and IMHO is coherent and have a real chance to succeed.
They want to pocket the ball by the band; sometimes you read random sentences and suddenly you see the light.
Yesterday, this was one of them :

Blackberry has to stay the course and innovate.
They need to create small victories and collect them into a cohesive set of opportunities.

In other words : as they cannot compete right now on the hardware front, they rally prospects and former users around BlackBerry DNA : Messaging (BBM) and security/privacy (BES).
Who needs BIS when there's BES ? <= think 'return of revenues', virtually expanded to 90% of the consumers market where BIS had a low added value ($ side) and was constrained to BB users ...

Out of time right now, but working on something more academic and detailed; I have to make extra research and itw b4, takes a while.

[_dimi_]

Can't wait to read it Superfly_Fr!

Posted via CB10

[OMGitworks]

Tax loss selling.
So I know there is a 30 day time frame after tax loss selling that you can't buy back the shares, but what if I buy more and then sell.

E.g. If my average price right now is $20 and I had 100 shares. If I buy another 100 shares at $10, wouldn't my average share price be $15, so then I immediately sell 100 shares at $10, which would mean I loss $5 ($15 - $10), so I would get capital loss of $5 x 100 shares = $500 in capital loss?

Check with your accountant but I am 99.99 sure it is first in first out accounting allocated to specific shares, no averaging allowed and you can't treat it the way you propose to defeat the wash sale rules. YMMV but check it out.

See no editorial comments from me.....