[Sqoon]

That's a pretty narrow viewpoint, but you are entitled to it. The notion that if it's not a Mac, you can't do much with a PC is faulty. I can enough things fine on a PC, and I choose to use one myself as opposed to being forced to do so. Can run all Adobe Creative products fine without any hiccups on my $500 Samsung laptop.

You can do a lot on PC, but you have to admit that Windows 8 is a hodge podge OS that only interrupts workflow and constantly tries to show me their ads like Xbox.
I only use PC, I would switch to Linux if it actually had good gaming support. I'm not an Apple fan, so I don't see myself spending $2000 on a computer.
My point being that people don't really describe themselves as Microsoft fan and brag when they get a new product the same way they do with other companies.
If a new OS comes out that can run legacy windows apps, I think a lot more people would be willing to switch than MS would expect.


Posted via CB10

[morganplus8]

M+8 and crew, Are you worried about sector rotation and people moving money from AAPL, NOK AND BBRY? I am thinking about what happened to PC makers and the like? I think clearly we are holding up much better, but I wonder if the "phones have become a commodity" argument is about to emerge? They are all starting to look and act alike. As good as the z10 is, and I really like mine, I don't think its leaps and bounds ahead of the ithings or upper end Andriod devices and it does seem like major innovation has become a stumbling block for all the companies, getting thinner, lighter and/or bigger aren't market changing "innovations" in my book.

I don't think we are anywhere near the commodity phase for smartphones. The growth in the sector is huge, Apple has taken the high road and it might not be wise for them to do so against Samsung. Listen to Dan Niles talk about Apple this morning on CNBC, he made some great points and really doesn't see any value or price point to buy the stock based solely upon their business model. So as long as they pursue this business model of "a single phone for everyone", don't buy the stock.

As for NOK, I wouldn't buy the stock simply because they went Microsoft and I hate all things MS. Its a personal thing for me. As for the company, they need to differentiate themselves from the competition and they dropped the ball there. So again, I can't buy their stock. BlackBerry is different, they have the Q10 and BB 10.1 coming out very soon and that is like being the only company in the world to sell an iPad. The market is completely theirs now, you can't bash the key board, you can't bash BB 10.1 because no one has seen it yet. You have a product that millions dream of owning again and zero competition for it. If you want a leading key board, you buy BlackBerry. Wait until the media and business not to mention entertainers get their hands on the new Q10, BlackBerry will begin a whole new push up from here.

To answer your question, there is too much that is different about the operating systems to reduce the sector to a commodity. I would bet we are at least 2 years way from settling on a phone size and OS to reduce price points to a commodity level.

[OMGitworks]

Maybe i'm misunderstanding what you are saying... But isn't this what BB has been preaching all along (for the last year or 2)? They are moving away from just the cellphone and tablet arena and diving into m2m and the "internet of things". This is what BB10 is about, it's just that the "short" sighted are incapable of seeing this, or someone believe there is no value in it.

Personally, i'm not investing in the phone side of things bit rather in the bigger system and potential.

No, I think we are headed in the same direction. Look at IBM, they grew and grew and then realized the PC business, after many years, was a losing proposition. The set off in a different direction. They went into services, consulting and software and other stuff and reemerged as a power house.

BBRY has to figure out how to do this and to make money off it. Nobody cares who handles the back end, they just want to use the devices to do what they want. I think QNX certainly helps, BBRY just needs to figure out how to capitalize on that type of connectivity. Hopefully they are headed there quickly. Apple is stumbling here, they need to pounce.

[OMGitworks]

Niles was really negative on BBRY a while back. Did he mention them at all?

[m0de25]

Can someone explain this 10:30 dip phenomenon? Why does this always happen like clockwork? Lol. Is it just BBRY or across the board?

[plasmid_boy]

M+8 and crew, Are you worried about sector rotation and people moving money from AAPL, NOK AND BBRY? I am thinking about what happened to PC makers and the like? I think clearly we are holding up much better, but I wonder if the "phones have become a commodity" argument is about to emerge? They are all starting to look and act alike. As good as the z10 is, and I really like mine, I don't think its leaps and bounds ahead of the ithings or upper end Andriod devices and it does seem like major innovation has become a stumbling block for all the companies, getting thinner, lighter and/or bigger aren't market changing "innovations" in my book.

Maybe. But some have suggested that mobile computing is the way of the future and the phone is in the center of it. Phone talking to google glasses, cars, desktop computers, tvs, microwave ovens, clocks, door locks, etc. If this is true, then this sector is where I would want to bank my money.

[morganplus8]

Niles was really negative on BBRY a while back. Did he mention them at all?

Niles mentioned BlackBerry and others as direct competition against Apple in their space. He implied that Apple is really in a difficult place right now as their business model is flawed to the point that until they make some big changes, you simply can't value the stock at any level. Therefore, i.e., they should not be purchased at any level. The fact that he included BlackBerry as direct competition speaks to his belief that BB has some positive strategies out there now. I think he really has a handle on where Apple is today much to the surprise of the interviewer who asked how he could mention "Apple and BlackBerry/Nokia in the same competitive sentence." CNBC is clearly behind Apple all the way to the point of being brainwashed it seems.

[_dimi_]

Can someone explain this 10:30 dip phenomenon? Why does this always happen like clockwork? Lol. Is it just BBRY or across the board?

Market makers earning their lunch money?

[morganplus8]

Can someone explain this 10:30 dip phenomenon? Why does this always happen like clockwork? Lol. Is it just BBRY or across the board?

Its nothing special, happens to all stocks with slight variations. The BBRY share price is bullish on the outset, buyers come in and buy the stock in the first hour to set the high for the day, its a TA thing, the stock then has to trade between a high/low until it is driven to move outside those boundaries. As the day goes on, we look for volume on drops and the same on rallies, if there is a trade that leans in one direction, we start the process of moving in that direction. And so the high set in the morning is challenged again later in the day. TA tells you where the high and low is, we are circling the 5-dma today in a negative market with the phone sector getting creamed. We trade just below support which is the 5-dma, test it for awhile and then rally back to the high again. Remember, we have to fill in a long trading day here, all of this could be done in the first hour but we have to drag it out for a full day. Again, it doesn't mean anything other than the stock trading on TA while we wait for news. By the end of the day, you will see that BBRY hasn't accomplished much for buy/hold investors yet it has been a nice trade for TA minded traders. I watch hundreds of different companies and they all do the same thing.

[mrfreetruth]

There was what, 400K sold in the US? That's really crap. I live in Canada and I have personally NEVER seen a new Windows 8 phone out in the wild...and no one ever talks about them either. I've seen 4 Z10's so far - two from students, one from a Faculty member, and one from a Staff member (I work at a University). Never seen a Windows 8 phone from Nokia.

Also, most of the students here that are forced to have Windows 8 (because they bought a new PC laptop) don't like Windows 8, they even apologize when they come into our help desk for support saying "Sorry, I have Windows 8 on this laptop...", and some have asked if they can "downgrade" to Windows 7...

That's what I have been saying for months now. The microsoft employees have been on CB talking about WP is everywhere and they have seen it all over the wild. I too have NEVER SEEN ONE SINGLE WP. NOT EVEN ONE. Now the ER came out and validated what I have been saying. I hate microsoft and I think the the masses also hate microsoft and their windows. People have been FORCED for the most part when they bought their PC in the past. Now with a phone there is choice and people remember how much they HATE WINDOWS. Who would buy a windows phone? Maybe it's just me since I hate microsoft and windows anything.

[tygros]

Also, keep in mind those Windows 8 #'s are shipments - people question BB sell-through, etc - 400k is so miserable, I wonder if they're able to sell-through half of those at the carrier level.

[plasmid_boy]

That's what I have been saying for months now. The microsoft employees have been on CB talking about WP is everywhere and they have seen it all over the wild. I too have NEVER SEEN ONE SINGLE WP. NOT EVEN ONE. Now the ER came out and validated what I have been saying. I hate microsoft and I think the the masses also hate microsoft and their windows. People have ben FORCED for the most part when they bought their PC in the past. Not with a phone there is choice and people remember how much they HATE WONDOWS. and who would buy a windows phone? Maybe it's just me since I hate microsoft and wondows anything.

I am genuinely curious why people hate microsoft. When RedHat packaged the consumer Linux systems, I thought that would mark the end of windows, but it didn't happen. I love Unix and Linux, I use Mac OS now because of the Linux component. But I built my first computer with MS-DOS 5.0, so microsoft is like an old flame. I don't have hatred for any of these systems, so I am just curious how it occurred to those that do.

[BRG3450]

BB's positioning on a new, fresh mobile OS with QNX gives them competitive advantage for approx. 10 years for the OS lifespan, new advanced application functionality (again because of the OS functionality), and M2M capabilities. Developers are already discovering this in working with BB10. This will become clearer over time. Apple has to reinvent iOS for mobility, MSFT has it's issues, Android is a fragmented market to manage an OS in.

The public may perceive the 'cell phone' as a commodity but that is because they have not made the leap to consider changing paradigms in mobile computing. Its so much bigger than just handsets and telephone/texting. Our PC centric world is changing to a new bread of devices that will center around the rocket in your pocket. Tablet/laptops will evolve into hybrid devices over the next 3 years, fundamentally changing how we think about local computing. A combination of cloud based SaaS (Software as a Service) and storage needs to evolve to solve both corporate and consumer needs. Thinner, jighter, bigger... makes no difference here. Look for real inovation underlying the technology and assess the trends.

[Tinomane]

That's what I have been saying for months now. The microsoft employees have been on CB talking about WP is everywhere and they have seen it all over the wild. I too have NEVER SEEN ONE SINGLE WP. NOT EVEN ONE. Now the ER came out and validated what I have been saying. I hate microsoft and I think the the masses also hate microsoft and their windows. People have ben FORCED for the most part when they bought their PC in the past. Not with a phone there is choice and people remember how much they HATE WONDOWS. and who would buy a windows phone? Maybe it's just me since I hate microsoft and wondows anything.

For real. It looks like they got every single lumia user to vote in that march madness poll lol. Ppl were saying they've never seen a lumnia in person and they were getting ripped up in the comments. I guess that was true.

Smartphone Madness 2013 Finals: Nokia Lumia 920 vs. BlackBerry Z10

[Bbnivende]

I don't think we are anywhere near the commodity phase for smartphones. The growth in the sector is huge, Apple has taken the high road and it might not be wise for them to do so against Samsung. Listen to Dan Niles talk about Apple this morning on CNBC, he made some great points and really doesn't see any value or price point to buy the stock based solely upon their business model. So as long as they pursue this business model of "a single phone for everyone", don't buy the stock.

As for NOK, I wouldn't buy the stock simply because they went Microsoft and I hate all things MS. Its a personal thing for me. As for the company, they need to differentiate themselves from the competition and they dropped the ball there. So again, I can't buy their stock. BlackBerry is different, they have the Q10 and BB 10.1 coming out very soon and that is like being the only company in the world to sell an iPad. The market is completely theirs now, you can't bash the key board, you can't bash BB 10.1 because no one has seen it yet. You have a product that millions dream of owning again and zero competition for it. If you want a leading key board, you buy BlackBerry. Wait until the media and business not to mention entertainers get their hands on the new Q10, BlackBerry will begin a whole new push up from here.

To answer your question, there is too much that is different about the operating systems to reduce the sector to a commodity. I would bet we are at least 2 years way from settling on a phone size and OS to reduce price points to a commodity level.

I think in China and soon in other major markets like India and Brazil the cheap commodity android touch screen devices are a commodity or soon will be. They will be made by local manufacturers that we have not heard of. Too often we look at smartphones through a Canadian or American looking glass.

[Charles Martin1]

Research In Motion Ltd (NASDAQ:BBRY) Q10 Rumored To Make An Early Release In The US | US Market Buzz

Any word yet on when we may expect to hear something factual about the Q10 preorders?

[DarrenHD]

That's what I have been saying for months now. The microsoft employees have been on CB talking about WP is everywhere and they have seen it all over the wild. I too have NEVER SEEN ONE SINGLE WP. NOT EVEN ONE. Now the ER came out and validated what I have been saying. I hate microsoft and I think the the masses also hate microsoft and their windows. People have ben FORCED for the most part when they bought their PC in the past. Not with a phone there is choice and people remember how much they HATE WONDOWS. and who would buy a windows phone? Maybe it's just me since I hate microsoft and wondows anything.

I don't hate Microsoft or Windows - in fact I think Windows 7 is probably the best Windows version they have produced. I just think they are going in the wrong direction with Windows 8. The Windows 8 phone OS itself, at least to me, doesn't bring much if anything materially different than iOS or Android, and in short, there would be no reason I could really think of to justify it. With Windows 8 desktop OS, adding that metro crap on top is just annoying. You keep getting pushed back to that metro interface and you aren't sure when you need to touch or what gesture you need to perform and without a touch screen it is really silly. Even with a touch screen you are back and forth from the trackpad to touching the screen, and it's even worse if you have an external mouse. It's clunky and unnecessary. Full screen apps are totally stupid. The entire premise around the original "Windows" was the capability to run programs in "Windows" - so you can arrange things, see multiple things at once, etc. Full screen apps destroys that paradigm. Start Skype, or try to veiw photos - they are full screen apps and you can't see whatever else you may have going on with no way to "re-size" the windows. Stupid stupid...

Blackberry is a bit different. First, it's not Microsoft - a PC OS and server/office software company trying to make a cell phone. Blackberry started out with mobile and that is their bread and butter. Blackberry is known for great security, great typing, messaging, battery life, low data usage, and now with BB10 true multitasking, again a great keyboard, the hub, messaging, etc.

I also think Blackberry is going in the right direction with the BB10 OS design with QNX as the underpinnings. To me it is a better experience than MS's offering.

[OMGitworks]

Maybe. But some have suggested that mobile computing is the way of the future and the phone is in the center of it. Phone talking to google glasses, cars, desktop computers, tvs, microwave ovens, clocks, door locks, etc. If this is true, then this sector is where I would want to bank my money.

There is a really good car commercial (at least to me) that I have seen recently. It is a car ad (not sure which brand - BUICK? - maybe its not so effective anyway ). Anyway this guy is on a plane that is landing. It is snowing out, and they are returning from somewhere warm. He whips out his phone, hits an app and fires up his SUV and the heat. Next scene is the family emerging from the airport shuttle in a snowy lot and right into a started, warm car. Apologies to all the Mad Men fans out there.

Now imagine if that is a QNX powered car, a BB10 phone he is using and you run that commercial and then go 1 more step showing him turning some lights on and heat at their house as they leave the airport. Now that is something I know is technologically possible, I just don't know how much QNX and BB10 is integrated, but I would love a commercial like that much more than the ones BB is running these days. Sell the whole package. What if it starts with them booking their vacation on a BB phone, BB Travel.... Make it easy and simple for the lazy Consumers. It may sound a little apple-ish, but I think it would work.

[pooger]

Posted via CB10

[m0de25]

Posted via CB10

Are you scouting locations for the $100 party?

[Shanerredflag]

Maybe i'm misunderstanding what you are saying... But isn't this what BB has been preaching all along (for the last year or 2)? They are moving away from just the cellphone and tablet arena and diving into m2m and the "internet of things". This is what BB10+QNX is about, it's just that the "short" sighted are incapable of seeing this, or simply believe there is no value in it.

Personally, i'm not investing in the phone business only but rather in the bigger system and potential that BB has presented. They aren't too concerned with flex screen or finger_hover_above_glass gimmicky phones, but rather how a doctor can receive real time communication with hospital machinery hooked up to patients.

You sir..."get It". I'm in for the same reason.

Posted via CB10

[Tinomane]

There is a really good car commercial (at least to me) that I have seen recently. It is a car ad (not sure which brand - BUICK? - maybe its not so effective anyway ). Anyway this guy is on a plane that is landing. It is snowing out, and they are returning from somewhere warm. He whips out his phone, hits an app and fires up his SUV and the heat. Next scene is the family emerging from the airport shuttle in a snowy lot and right into a started, warm car. Apologies to all the Mad Men fans out there.

Now imagine if that is a QNX powered car, a BB10 phone he is using and you run that commercial and then go 1 more step showing him turning some lights on and heat at their house as they leave the airport. Now that is something I know is technologically possible, I just don't know how much QNX and BB10 is integrated, but I would love a commercial like that much more than the ones BB is running these days. Sell the whole package. What if it starts with them booking their vacation on a BB phone, BB Travel.... Make it easy and simple for the lazy Consumers. It may sound a little apple-ish, but I think it would work.

Yup it was a buick enclave



I like this buick commercial better lol

[gohan_bcc]

You'll be all glad to know my company just finished approving the Z10. All upgrades going forward are now Z10's and all new employee phones (approx 25 in the office) are Z10's. I ordered mine in white . Nothing better then a free work issued Z10!

This should be headlined so I can make a quick buck LOL jk

[erodenero]

Posted via CB10

Getting that $100 party prepared early I see

[erodenero]

Hey all,
I just wanted to say good morning from Toronto. This forum is wonderful and informative, but I wanted to express my distaste for the amount of spelling and grammatical errors posted. Let's do better!

Best,
Steve

Good morning, Spelling and gramatical errors are unavoidable on the internet. Probably best to just ignore them all together.
Not to mention a large portion of the member base of CB does not speak English as their first language.