[Klipspringers Shoes]

With the SE (not Passport, but iPhone) Apple has accepted the iPhone is nothing more but a commodity nowadays. Let's see how long it takes for iPhone prices to reflect their 'new' strategy, which is imho deteriorating to their brand.

Might be of interest :
Apple had a services revenue of 5.5 billion in their latest quarter. (iTunes, Apple Music, App Store. Licensing, Service Parts, iCloud, Apple Pay) That's approx. 7% of their total revenue.

Posted via CB10

Is it not possible that Apple simply decided to toss out a device they know will sell whilst people await the proper iPhone 7? I wouldn't read too much into it. Apple aren't even thinking about us or BlackBerry. Apple are doing just fine, and, personally, I couldn't care less about them. I'd rather see BlackBerry focus on their own lane and start accelerating in their own right. Start selling devices, increasing the OS and BBM user base slowly but surely, and expanding in enterprise and IoT as well. Let's hope our own team and chalk up some wins, and stop worrying about or hoping for the collapse of the Other Fruit. Just a thought.

Posted via CB10

[Superfly_FR]

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I wonder if we should be asking the following question: What do enterprise care about?
Posted via CB10

As per the answers Corbu posted earlier, you may find your answer.
This is mandatory for highly regulated / gov type of customers. And that's a big pile of the (recurring) revenues.
As per J. Chen statements, it also has a large similitude with other hardware they have/are about to launch(ed).
Finally, as of date, they've not succeed to make Android as much secure than BB10 so that they need to be able to fulfill the remaining demand for BB10 compatible devices. IMHO - this is not an option without the addition of Android/IoT devices in order to take advantage of economies of scale to better cover their fixed costs and average up the margins.

[bspence87]

Let's please not engage in ad hominem attacks. You are welcome - indeed, invited - to disagree with my statements, and to put forth your own opposing arguments, hopefully including rational argument and evidence. In doing so, we both help each other to become more thoughtful and informed investors. Whether or not I am a bear or a squirrel or a wildebeest is an irrelevance. Let's be grown-ups.

Posted via CB10

With all due respect, we've all heard your opinion. For six days straight now. Please leave it alone, and let's go on to something else.

Bear, bull or nuetral, the negativity isn't good for anything or anybody. This group is for BBRY supporters, not critics.

[Klipspringers Shoes]

As per the answers Corbu got earlier, you may get your answer.
This is mandatory for highly regulated / gov type of customers. And that's a big pile of the (recurring) revenues.
As per J. Chen statements, it also has a large similitude with other hardware they have/are about to launch(ed).
Finally, as of date, they've not succeed to make Android AS secure than BB10 so that they need to be able to fulfill the remaining demand for BB10 compatible devices and - IMHO - this is not an option without the addition of Android/IoT devices in order to take advantage of economies of scale to better cover their fixed costs and average up the ASP.

I see where you are coming from, but it can't be 'mandatory' for BlackBerry to exist. BlackBerry aren't 'required' to provide services for governments and aren't guaranteed of their business. Yes, at the present time, BlackBerry 10 does seem to be the best solution for a lot of governments but BlackBerry ALREADY have those governments. That's not new business; it's business that is already there, and the company are still struggling to sell.

Please don't get me wrong: to be completely honest, if I think selfishly, I don't care who owns a BlackBerry 10 phone provided I can have one ( a PP II by Christmas would be lovely, thanks), but I know that that becomes more and more of a pipe dream if BlackBerry cannot make themselves HW relevant in a broader context.

I love the idea of BlackBerry selling Android devices in addition to BlackBerry 10 devices...but the evidence is clear: not advertising them does NOT work. I know we have a lot of people saying advertising wouldn't make any difference, but there is really very little evidence for that hypothesis. What we do have is a mountain of evidence showing that the hardly-advertise-at-all strategy has been a colossal failure. We're not talking about BlackBerry doing some wild, exotic thing no one has ever heard of; we're talking about them doing what is simply common and essential practice universally in the business/sales world: advertise your products effectively.

In my view, profit per device is the wrong datum to be looking at or aiming for. It may look 'good' over the short term (and even that is questionable), but the datum that matters is the number of devices sold. Now, I cannot prove this, but I strongly suspect that if BlackBerry were to announce an increase in device sales coupled with almost zero profit or even a mild loss, the markets would actually respond positively. The products are, and have been, very good products (the Q5 being the exception to this).

It seems to me that even at this late stage, BlackBerry need to focus on the following:

1) increasing unit sales
2) re-entering retail locations (phone shops)
3) increase BlackBerry 10 software advantages.
a) This means continuing to improve BBM, especially for iOS, but for
BlackBerry 10 as well.
b) It also means...apps. It means attracting apps, but in time it could also
mean BlackBerry developing an app department developing apps for
BlackBerry 10 as well as iOS and Android - why not? Why not buy a
talented app company or two and see how it goes? We're supposed to
be a software company, aren't we?

Now, of the above, the most vital is #1. Without success with #1, #s 2 and 3 become difficult, shading towards impossible. In this game, size matters. BlackBerry have got to SELL, and if they do, the market will see progress as opposed to stagnation, and in the medium-term, #s 2 and 3 will keep feeding into the ease and success of the #1 objective. They all work together, but it all rests of device sales. We can't blame stores for not stocking phones that don't sell, and we can't blame app devs for not building for a platform with a falling as opposed to rising user base.

Let's see some focus and creativity from BlackBerry. They can dig themselves out if they get going asap instead of sitting with a sandcastle up their bottom, watching the tide rising all around them. Start selling the damn phones, profit-per-device be damned, and light a fire under BBM: let's get some users.

Wow, that was a long one: sorry, I just want to see my team winning again. LET'S GO, BLACKBERRY. GET AFTER 'EM...

Posted via CB10

[Klipspringers Shoes]

With all due respect, we've all heard your opinion. For six days straight now. Please leave it alone, and let's go on to something else.

Bear, bull or nuetral, the negativity isn't good for anything or anybody. This group is for BBRY supporters, not critics.

I was merely responding to someone calling me silly names. But yes, I do think I've said my piece and I look forward to benefitting from the various views, opinions, and insights of others. Feel free to offer something up, and I'll certainly be reading with interest. Have a good one.

Posted via CB10

[early2bed]

I love the idea of BlackBerry selling Android devices in addition to BlackBerry 10 devices...but the evidence is clear: not advertising them does NOT work. I know we have a lot of people saying advertising wouldn't make any difference, but there is really very little evidence for that hypothesis. What we do have is a mountain of evidence showing that the hardly-advertise-at-all strategy has been a colossal failure. We're not talking about BlackBerry doing some wild, exotic thing no one has ever heard of; we're talking about them doing what is simply common and essential practice universally in the business/sales world: advertise your products effectively.

Not advertising does save money, though. If we run some rough numbers, let's say JC decides to spend a modest $25 million on handset advertising next quarter. If he can squeeze a big fat $100 margin from each new phone - and I don't even know if that's possible given a lower price with mid-tier handset, then he's got to build and sell 250,000 more devices to pay for the campaign - probably a 50% increase in sales from what's coming. I don't see how it adds up even with these generous figures.

I don't see why you would bet the company on this if you're a software company with a hardware business on the side.

[bbjdog]

With all due respect, we've all heard your opinion. For six days straight now. Please leave it alone, and let's go on to something else.

Bear, bull or nuetral, the negativity isn't good for anything or anybody. This group is for BBRY supporters, not critics.

Well put Bspence87!

Posted via my BlackBerry Passport

[bungaboy]

With all due respect, we've all heard your opinion. For six days straight now. Please leave it alone, and let's go on to something else.

Bear, bull or nuetral, the negativity isn't good for anything or anybody. This group is for BBRY supporters, not critics.

Respect . . . has to be earned I was taught.

[DeRedder]

But you have to wait for actual sales to account for revenue? Or are we just going to assume they can continue to ask 480 euros for this in a few weeks/months time?

Posted via CB10

everyone knows that iPhones get discounted after a few weeks. After a few months the price is only 50 or even 40% of the original price.

[bbjdog]

Last couple of days has left me feeling like this, and not because of BlackBerry!

[bbjdog]

From the great CEO!


http://blogs.blackberry.com/2016/04/...ity-and-email/

Posted via my BlackBerry Passport

[DeRedder]

for today I predict a drop below 7.

I am set to buy 1500 shares automatically once the price hits 6.75

[Im Mo Green]

Not advertising does save money, though. If we run some rough numbers, let's say JC decides to spend a modest $25 million on handset advertising next quarter. If he can squeeze a big fat $100 margin from each new phone - and I don't even know if that's possible given a lower price with mid-tier handset, then he's got to build and sell 250,000 more devices to pay for the campaign - probably a 50% increase in sales from what's coming. I don't see how it adds up even with these generous figures.

I don't see why you would bet the company on this if you're a software company with a hardware business on the side.

Don't bother early, numbers, costs, margins, facts don't matter in his fantasyland world. He just babbles on, and does not learn a thing along the way. I guess her/ his "enthusiasm/ delusion" should be applauded in some way, but that is the same enthusiasm that produced his underground bbm marketing campaign featuring the batman/robin avatars, so I say not. So Please stay as far away from blackberry as possible.

[bungaboy]

My "List" seems to grow of late at a rapid rate!

[rytwjyx]

I see where you are coming from, but it can't be 'mandatory' for BlackBerry to exist. BlackBerry aren't 'required' to provide services for governments and aren't guaranteed of their business. Yes, at the present time, BlackBerry 10 does seem to be the best solution for a lot of governments but BlackBerry ALREADY have those governments. That's not new business; it's business that is already there, and the company are still struggling to sell.

Please don't get me wrong: to be completely honest, if I think selfishly, I don't care who owns a BlackBerry 10 phone provided I can have one ( a PP II by Christmas would be lovely, thanks), but I know that that becomes more and more of a pipe dream if BlackBerry cannot make themselves HW relevant in a broader context.

I love the idea of BlackBerry selling Android devices in addition to BlackBerry 10 devices...but the evidence is clear: not advertising them does NOT work. I know we have a lot of people saying advertising wouldn't make any difference, but there is really very little evidence for that hypothesis. What we do have is a mountain of evidence showing that the hardly-advertise-at-all strategy has been a colossal failure. We're not talking about BlackBerry doing some wild, exotic thing no one has ever heard of; we're talking about them doing what is simply common and essential practice universally in the business/sales world: advertise your products effectively.

In my view, profit per device is the wrong datum to be looking at or aiming for. It may look 'good' over the short term (and even that is questionable), but the datum that matters is the number of devices sold. Now, I cannot prove this, but I strongly suspect that if BlackBerry were to announce an increase in device sales coupled with almost zero profit or even a mild loss, the markets would actually respond positively. The products are, and have been, very good products (the Q5 being the exception to this).

It seems to me that even at this late stage, BlackBerry need to focus on the following:

1) increasing unit sales
2) re-entering retail locations (phone shops)
3) increase BlackBerry 10 software advantages.
a) This means continuing to improve BBM, especially for iOS, but for
BlackBerry 10 as well.
b) It also means...apps. It means attracting apps, but in time it could also
mean BlackBerry developing an app department developing apps for
BlackBerry 10 as well as iOS and Android - why not? Why not buy a
talented app company or two and see how it goes? We're supposed to
be a software company, aren't we?

Now, of the above, the most vital is #1. Without success with #1, #s 2 and 3 become difficult, shading towards impossible. In this game, size matters. BlackBerry have got to SELL, and if they do, the market will see progress as opposed to stagnation, and in the medium-term, #s 2 and 3 will keep feeding into the ease and success of the #1 objective. They all work together, but it all rests of device sales. We can't blame stores for not stocking phones that don't sell, and we can't blame app devs for not building for a platform with a falling as opposed to rising user base.

Let's see some focus and creativity from BlackBerry. They can dig themselves out if they get going asap instead of sitting with a sandcastle up their bottom, watching the tide rising all around them. Start selling the damn phones, profit-per-device be damned, and light a fire under BBM: let's get some users.

Wow, that was a long one: sorry, I just want to see my team winning again. LET'S GO, BLACKBERRY. GET AFTER 'EM...

Posted via CB10

I think the company is way past the point where it can afford to push unit sales. Given the disappointment on Priv sales I think JC is less and less inclined to spend on marketing. Heck to be honest I can tell you that there aren't really that many in house device developers left anymore - not even those Android devs converted from BB10 (converted from BBOS). At this point either you are waiting to be let go or you're doing tons of interviews in town. Enterprise on the other hand is a different story where it hasn't been affected by the layoffs much and morale is still 'alright'. So you should really face the fact that unless there's some crazy miracle, devices (esp BB10) probably won't be relevant in BB's future.

As hard as John Chen has tried to keep devices he has done a great job with the turnaround. He realized that enterprise is BB's bread and butter and refocused on that; He did the best he could do with HW given the mess left by Thorsten. The really hard problem he needs to address is employee morale/attrition because the company has become so frugal it's not fun anymore.

[Klipspringers Shoes]

I think the company is way past the point where it can afford to push unit sales. Given the disappointment on Priv sales I think JC is less and less inclined to spend on marketing. Heck to be honest I can tell you that there aren't really that many in house device developers left anymore - not even those Android devs converted from BB10 (converted from BBOS). At this point either you are waiting to be let go or you're doing tons of interviews in town. Enterprise on the other hand is a different story where it hasn't been affected by the layoffs much and morale is still 'alright'. So you should really face the fact that unless there's some crazy miracle, devices (esp BB10) probably won't be relevant in BB's future.

As hard as John Chen has tried to keep devices he has done a great job with the turnaround. He realized that enterprise is BB's bread and butter and refocused on that; He did the best he could do with HW given the mess left by Thorstein. The really hard problem he needs to address is employee morale/attrition because the company has become so frugal it's not fun anymore.

Well, we'll see. A number of us have shared our views sensibly, which is good, and we will have to sit back and observe the evidence/results. What the consequences will be of a total collapse of the HW division is a subject for later conversation, but I hope it doesn't come to that. The future is always a difficult thing to predict, and I have a feeling Chen may not even be a part of that future. Whatever happens, I wish everyone the best with their investments and sincerely hope people don't lose too much of their hard-earned money.

Posted via CB10

[bungaboy]

Advertizing . . . photo taken yesterday

[bbjdog]

Reading material

http://blogs.blackberry.com/2016/04/...-own-disaster/

Posted via my BlackBerry Passport

[Superfly_FR]

I see where you are coming from, but it can't be 'mandatory' for BlackBerry to exist. BlackBerry aren't 'required' to provide services for governments and aren't guaranteed of their business (1). Yes, at the present time, BlackBerry 10 does seem to be the best solution for a lot of governments but BlackBerry ALREADY have those governments (2). That's not new business; it's business that is already there (3), and the company are still struggling to sell.

(1) yes they are. They have contracts for 1 to (est.) 5 years running up. We don't know the terms but I won't be surprised a fraction of these contracts are based on progressive adoption, so that the first year(s) won't make a lot of profit, either due to low volume and/or financial arrangements.

(2) They have those customers because the end to end. They don't own the whole segment even with this competitive advantage. Rip it off and you'll ear "ok, let's ride another horse; they didn't fulfill the contract promise". Guaranteed.

(3) Yup, loyal customers. Roughly one estimates that the marketing cost to keep a customer loyal is (base) 1. Acquiring new customers from the competition is 10X higher. Maybe someone would like to do the maths and see if the hardware loss balances the "loyalty marketing cost" ?

It seems to me that even at this late stage, BlackBerry need to focus on the following:
1) increasing unit sales
2) re-entering retail locations (phone shops)
3) increase BlackBerry 10 software advantages.
a) This means continuing to improve BBM, especially for iOS, but for
BlackBerry 10 as well.
b) It also means...apps. It means attracting apps, but in time it could also
mean BlackBerry developing an app department developing apps for
BlackBerry 10 as well as iOS and Android - why not? Why not buy a
talented app company or two and see how it goes? We're supposed to
be a software company, aren't we?

1) increasing profitable unit sales
2) Besides popups, I can't find where the money is for that.
3) They are right here under your eyes : battery life, security, security, security (enterprise context).
a) they do and even make it free for previously paying options
b) It's not in their hands nowadays. If you want to access a service, you have to be given access to the API. FB/Whatsapp said "no" and there's nothing you can oppose to that. As for software company, yes, absolutely but IMHO more likely on a SaAS / back-end basis.

P.S / edit :
Thanks bbjdog. And you, John, stop reading my lips ! lol

From the great CEO!
BlackBerry Security and Email | Inside BlackBerry

We are the global gold standard in security because we have always engineered our platform based on the fundamental principle that security is not about making a single component as strong as possible; security is about making all the components strong. No single device, server or network can create a secure system; they all have to work together to protect user privacy and security. This simple yet immutable fact is what makes security so difficult to get right – and so easy to get wrong. One small hole or crack in the fa�ade can quickly lead to a complete breakdown in the security chain.

BlackBerry devices support numerous security features, including hardware root of trust, local data encryption and built-in malware protection. When connected to a BlackBerry Enterprise Server, the device creates an end-to-end secure connection using the strongest, most reliable certified encryption technology available. For over 15 years, BlackBerry has been tested and trusted by the world’s most security-conscious governments and corporations, receiving well over 80 independent security approvals and certifications, the most of any mobile platform.

When properly deployed in a secure environment, BlackBerry is the most secure end-to-end mobile platform in the world.

Hey men

[world traveler and former ceo]

From the great CEO!


http://blogs.blackberry.com/2016/04/...ity-and-email/

Posted via my BlackBerry Passport

This reply says it all..
−

"wussel
2 hours ago
So please stop the Hardware bleeding and concentrate on security, software and IP. Just license the Hardware to HTC or Samsung and stop trying to compete in the Android market field. If you want to give Hardware really another honest try release two midrange phones (one with and the other one without a PKB) for a reasonable price and competetiv specs immediately. With Samsung S7 launched and iphone 7 around the corner Blackberry does not have the luxury to wait with the release until the fourth quarter.

If you think that Blackberry will not be able to compete in the smartphone business cut the ties sooner than later because the Hardware division dominates the headlines and drags down the whole company."



Posted via CB10

[Klipspringers Shoes]

(1) yes they are. They have contracts for 1 to (est.) 5 years running up. We don't know the terms but I won't be surprised a fraction of these contracts are based on progressive adoption, so that the first year(s) won't make a lot of profit, either due to low volume and/or financial arrangements.

(2) They have those customers because the end to end. They don't own the whole segment even with this competitive advantage. Rip it off and you'll ear "ok, let's ride another horse; they didn't fulfill the contract promise". Guaranteed.

(3) Yup, loyal customers. Roughly one estimates that the marketing cost to keep a customer loyal customer is base 1. Acquiring new customers from the competition is 10X higher. Maybe someone would like to make the maths and see if the hardware loss balances the "loyalty marketing cost" ?

It seems to me that even at this late stage, BlackBerry need to focus on the following:


1) increasing profitable unit sales
2) Besides popups, I can't find where the money is for that.
3) They are right here under your eyes : battery life, security, security, security (enterprise context).
a) they do and even make it free for previously paying options
b) It's not in their hands nowadays. If you want to access a service, you have to be given access to the API. FB/Whatsapp said "no" and there's nothing you can oppose to that. As for software company, yes, absolutely but IMHO more likely on a SaAS / back-end basis.

Superfly, thanks for the detailed and thoughtful comments.

1) Regarding unit sales, I'd settle for break-even as a goal in the cause for increased user base.
2) Regarding stores, you're absolutely correct on that one. I had shop presence as a medium-term goals once unit sales were upped, making the idea more palatable to retail stores - yes, you are absolutely right: BlackBerry can't do much about that in the short-term.
3) You're absolutely right again in highlighting the battery life and security as strengths, although don't we already have the high-security enterprise/govt market? In a wider, public context, of course, most people don't care (yet), and those that do see Apple 'standing up' to the FBI and WhatsApp announcing end-to-end encryption while Chen says plainly he will let the authorities in. (I'm speaking of public perception here.)
Apps) yes, you're right again in stating that it's out of BB's control. The only thing that will change the minds of the big name app companies is unit sales. Still, it would be nice to see BlackBerry keeping an eye out for up-and-coming popular apps, and creating their own. What if - a HUGE what if - BlackBerry could develop or buy the next big thing in popular social media for example?

Anyway, thanks again for the comments. We don't all agree on everything, but we are certainly all on the same side in here.

Posted via CB10

[Superfly_FR]

In a wider, public context,

That's step n .
Step 1 (current) is professionals/enterprises/gov.
Public sales are cherry on the cake and only there to sustain a minimal level of production. Furthermore, besides "us CrackBerrians", I'd bet most customers right now are what they used to name "prosumers" [And I strongly miss this marketing hook, me armchair CEO says : bring it back full force"]

I believe our point of view differ because of this step chronology.
They simply can't address the mass market right now.
Priv could have met wide/public success ? Yes.
By accident ? Probably. [IMHO, personal, etc.]

[bbjdog]

This reply says it all..
−

"wussel
2 hours ago
So please stop the Hardware bleeding and concentrate on security, software and IP. Just license the Hardware to HTC or Samsung and stop trying to compete in the Android market field. If you want to give Hardware really another honest try release two midrange phones (one with and the other one without a PKB) for a reasonable price and competetiv specs immediately. With Samsung S7 launched and iphone 7 around the corner Blackberry does not have the luxury to wait with the release until the fourth quarter.

If you think that Blackberry will not be able to compete in the smartphone business cut the ties sooner than later because the Hardware division dominates the headlines and drags down the whole company."



Posted via CB10

That's his/her opinion and I do not share it.

Posted via my BlackBerry Passport

[world traveler and former ceo]

That's his/her opinion and I do not share it.

Posted via my BlackBerry Passport

Sadly.. the market thinks otherwise....

Posted via CB10

[OnTheFence001]

This reply says it all..
−

"wussel
2 hours ago
So please stop the Hardware bleeding and concentrate on security, software and IP. Just license the Hardware to HTC or Samsung and stop trying to compete in the Android market field. If you want to give Hardware really another honest try release two midrange phones (one with and the other one without a PKB) for a reasonable price and competetiv specs immediately. With Samsung S7 launched and iphone 7 around the corner Blackberry does not have the luxury to wait with the release until the fourth quarter.

If you think that Blackberry will not be able to compete in the smartphone business cut the ties sooner than later because the Hardware division dominates the headlines and drags down the whole company."



Posted via CB10

I agree. They should go for the break even point, continue with BB10 in a One+One kinda way- demand/ orders/ preorders drive production. The only fly in this ointment is whether they can continue to support BB10 at all...I am okay with the slower cycle, I just want a commitment to the BB OS. 2 form factors, $299/ $349. Keep the passport as a standalone- the priv could go by the wayside. It did not sell as expected. You could keep it around at the right inventory level though, bc it still offers something unique in the market. Choice of OS. Keep expectations/ production low to start....The market shifted on BB- their competitor is not google android, it's Blackphone, Jolla, One+. Of those BB is way ahead, imo- own independent app store, apps, no need to sideload (per se). BB just needs to reassess "it's" market. A more realistic view of its handset market + increasing sales on other fronts mean the handset biz could stay alive and perhaps be profitable and perhaps grow. It's just never gonna be Samsung/ iPhone level of sales, 10 mill/ qtr. Of course they need to get to the break even point soon. I do not think Chen is being na�ve. I support him- many tough calls, I just would appreciate more of a verbal commitment- he said more recently, but based on this forum, the Osbourne effect, in some manner, is creeping in...