12-25-09 09:44 AM
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  1. Volcom's Avatar
    FYI cpugeek4u:


    "It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool, than to open it and remove all doubt."
    12-10-09 08:23 PM
  2. adambigge's Avatar
    A good paraphrase of an excellent quote by Abe Lincoln.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    12-10-09 08:54 PM
  3. kriptikchicken's Avatar
    "cpugeek4u" - you live in a fantasy land.

    In reality, you don't know sh*t.

    12-10-09 08:59 PM
  4. cpugeek4u's Avatar
    While your right about having a bad alternator, you're wrong saying that the car runs off the alternator.

    If you disconnect your battery while the car is running, it will stay running, that is true.

    BUT, lets say you have a big off-road truck with a big music system in it. While your battery is disconnected and running, turn all your bright lights (even your light bar), crank up the music with those big subwoofers while you winch yourself out of that big mud hole. See how long that alternator keeps that truck running.
    Your right.. Sorry. The Alternator continulesy charges the battery as needed..
    12-12-09 10:56 PM
  5. tech_head's Avatar
    Right, I've done more than enough work on my car to know that if you yank the negative terminal, you essentially disconnect the battery. I think you're misunderstanding.

    The alternator is connected to the positive pole in the car. It's usually bolted to the terminal that connects to the pole. Because of this, when you pull it off of the battery when the car is running the regulator will open the flow of juice to the positive terminal. Because there's still flow to the positive terminal, there's still somewhere for the electrons from the negative pole to go, so the car will stay running.
    No. No. No.
    Without a competed circuit there are no electrons flowing into a battery.
    You cannot charge or even consider a battery as a load in a circuit unless both +/- are connected. The Voltage regulator sees an open and continues to supply current to the cars circuitry. With no load from a battery you stand to fry the regulator for the alternator.

    But with one terminal disconnected from the battery, and it doesn't matter which one, the battery is out of the circuit.

    Do you think all switches for circuits are DPST (double pole single throw)?
    Most switches for typical circuits are SPST.
    12-12-09 11:18 PM
  6. HellKatzX's Avatar
    I'm sure glad I didn't start this thread, dude's getting slammed!
    12-13-09 01:25 AM
  7. Branta's Avatar
    i wish this forum had a feature that u can filter out certain user's posts like other vBulliten boards.
    The feature is here. Pull up the target user's profile and just below the user name you should see "User Lists" as a dropdown. Select "Add to Ignore List"
    12-13-09 10:04 AM
  8. Branta's Avatar
    As another of the many technical readers this thread makes me cringe.

    PacketRat points out the official RIM statement which the unknowing are advised to study and learn.

    The bottom line is that any (mini/micro) USB charger should be compatible. If the connector is wrong change the plugin USB cable or use an adaptor) The standard is that they produce nominal 5v DC, and at least 500mA. As others have pointed out, the voltage rating is critical and must be correct, but the current rating on a charger is the <maximum output of the charger> and the phone will limit the current drawn to the value it needs. For practical purposes any BB will charge safely on any supply with 5v regulated output and current rating 500mA or higher.

    Computer USB ports are almost always suitable, although a few very old notebooks are fitted with low power ports and have difficulty reaching the 500mA required. Voltage rating on a computer USB port is always 5v DC.

    Possible problems...
    Cheap or broken AC chargers may have bad regulation or power smoothing (removing AC ripple). Nobody can predict broken, but in good condition any USB 5v charger from a reputable phone or accessory manufacturer should be fine. Avoid the no-name junk found on market stalls and unregulated street vendors and you should be OK.

    No-name car adaptors are an unknown risk. They have to reduce 12v nominal car supply to a *regulated* 5v and not all are well designed. Most branded devices will be fine provided the correct mini/micro USB connector is available.
    12-13-09 10:41 AM
  9. gtstang462002's Avatar
    No. No. No.
    Without a competed circuit there are no electrons flowing into a battery.
    You cannot charge or even consider a battery as a load in a circuit unless both +/- are connected. The Voltage regulator sees an open and continues to supply current to the cars circuitry. With no load from a battery you stand to fry the regulator for the alternator.

    But with one terminal disconnected from the battery, and it doesn't matter which one, the battery is out of the circuit.

    Do you think all switches for circuits are DPST (double pole single throw)?
    Most switches for typical circuits are SPST.
    Everything stated here is correct enough that I am not going to get anymore in-depth with it. Though I will point out that the battery is like a big capacitor in the system when the alternator is running to prevent voltage spikes. When you turn your headlights on the voltage will dip slightly and then the regulator will adjust the required input to bring the system voltage back to the predefined point. Now without the battery in line and you turn your headlights on the voltage will drop 2-3 times as much and them the regulator will try to recover and can jump 1-3 volts higher than it should. Older vehicles this normally isn't a problem but some on the newer vehicles are sensitive to rapid voltage changes(power spikes) and can burn up computers. Most computers that are in todays cars can handle from 9.5-17volts on average. Too low just shuts them down, too high burns transistors.

    BTW I am Master ASE certified, Ford Diesel certified, and have a few certificates that haven't expired from GM corporation. I have been a technician for 14 years now and own my own shop. (I am also a computer system administrator in the Maryland Army National Guard)
    12-13-09 11:02 AM
  10. cpugeek4u's Avatar
    as another of the many technical readers this thread makes me cringe.

    Packetrat points out the official rim statement which the unknowing are advised to study and learn.

    The bottom line is that any (mini/micro) usb charger should be compatible. If the connector is wrong change the plugin usb cable or use an adaptor) the standard is that they produce nominal 5v dc, and at least 500ma. As others have pointed out, the voltage rating is critical and must be correct, but the current rating on a charger is the <maximum output of the charger> and the phone will limit the current drawn to the value it needs. For practical purposes any bb will charge safely on any supply with 5v regulated output and current rating 500ma or higher.

    Computer usb ports are almost always suitable, although a few very old notebooks are fitted with low power ports and have difficulty reaching the 500ma required. Voltage rating on a computer usb port is always 5v dc.

    Possible problems...
    Cheap or broken ac chargers may have bad regulation or power smoothing (removing ac ripple). Nobody can predict broken, but in good condition any usb 5v charger from a reputable phone or accessory manufacturer should be fine. Avoid the no-name junk found on market stalls and unregulated street vendors and you should be ok.

    No-name car adaptors are an unknown risk. They have to reduce 12v nominal car supply to a *regulated* 5v and not all are well designed. Most branded devices will be fine provided the correct mini/micro usb connector is available.
    told you all so. Suprised everybody is quiet now once the truth came out. See im right sometimes!
    12-13-09 10:53 PM
  11. howarmat's Avatar
    As another of the many technical readers this thread makes me cringe.

    PacketRat points out the official RIM statement which the unknowing are advised to study and learn.

    The bottom line is that any (mini/micro) USB charger should be compatible. If the connector is wrong change the plugin USB cable or use an adaptor) The standard is that they produce nominal 5v DC, and at least 500mA. As others have pointed out, the voltage rating is critical and must be correct, but the current rating on a charger is the <maximum output of the charger> and the phone will limit the current drawn to the value it needs. For practical purposes any BB will charge safely on any supply with 5v regulated output and current rating 500mA or higher.

    Computer USB ports are almost always suitable, although a few very old notebooks are fitted with low power ports and have difficulty reaching the 500mA required. Voltage rating on a computer USB port is always 5v DC.

    Possible problems...
    Cheap or broken AC chargers may have bad regulation or power smoothing (removing AC ripple). Nobody can predict broken, but in good condition any USB 5v charger from a reputable phone or accessory manufacturer should be fine. Avoid the no-name junk found on market stalls and unregulated street vendors and you should be OK.

    No-name car adaptors are an unknown risk. They have to reduce 12v nominal car supply to a *regulated* 5v and not all are well designed. Most branded devices will be fine provided the correct mini/micro USB connector is available.
    told you all so. Suprised everybody is quiet now once the truth came out. See im right sometimes!
    where are you right?

    Right there in bold "any (mini/micro) USB charger".....that means the motorola ones, lg ones and all the other branded ones work fine which is direct opposite to what you stated

    you fail again....
    12-13-09 11:03 PM
  12. cpugeek4u's Avatar
    ^^ its pretty obvious that you dont know how to read and comprehnd sentences
    12-14-09 12:07 AM
  13. Jerry Hildenbrand's Avatar
    1. Cpugeek you're either a moron or a liar. Or both.

    2. Dude who claims to be EE and 'converted' his imaginary PS3 from AC to DC is a liar.

    3. As long as your mini/micro USB charger is UL or CE listed, it will not damage a device which uses mini/micro USB to charge it. If it's not UL or CE listed, stop buying chargers at the swap meet or 5 Below and get something decent you cheap SOB.

    Someone earlier mentioned about it's now 2010 and standards are in place. That is where this thread should have stopped.

    Now let the idiocy continue.
    12-14-09 12:30 AM
  14. usmcrob's Avatar
    Environment

    * BlackBerry smartphones

    Overview

    Charging conditions:

    * When the BlackBerry smartphone is powered on and plugged into a charging source you will see a lightning bolt over the battery indicator. If the battery has already been charged to 100% this indicator will be removed.
    * When the BlackBerry smartphone is powered off and plugged into a charging source the light-emitting diode (LED) will slowly flash yellow when charging.
    * When it has completed charging the LED will show solid green until unplugged or powered on.

    Charge Times:

    Over all charge times will depend on the BlackBerry smartphone being charged and what power source is charging it.

    * When the BlackBerry smartphone is plugged into a computer without the USB drivers installed it will charge at one fifth the rate of when the drivers are installed.
    * When plugged into an approved BlackBerry AC wall charger or car charger you can receive the same or higher charge rate then when using a computer with the USB drivers installed.

    Discharge conditions:

    * As the battery discharges the BlackBerry smartphone will issue an audible beep and a yellow LED will begin flashing when a low battery condition is reached. Further battery discharge will cause an audible beep and an informational message to be displayed indicating that there is not enough battery capacity to operate the radios and the radios will automatically turn off. Still further battery discharge will cause another informational message to be displayed indicating that the BlackBerry smartphone will turn off due to insufficient battery capacity and the BlackBerry smartphone will turn itself off automatically.
    * If the BlackBerry smartphone has turned itself off due to insufficient battery capacity connecting a charger will cause a yellow LED to slowly flash. This is normal HANDHELD OFF charging behavior. The BlackBerry smartphone will go back to the ON state if it is manually turned on by pressing the ON button.
    * If the BlackBerry smartphone has turned itself off due to insufficient battery capacity and remains in this state without being charged for a long time it will enter a deep sleep condition. Connecting a charger to the BlackBerry smartphone at this point will cause the red LED to turn on for up to 2 minutes, after which the red LED will turn off and the Battery Charging icon will be displayed.
    * If a dead battery is inserted in the BlackBerry smartphone the red LED may turn on for up to 2 minutes. Connecting a charger to the BlackBerry smartphone at this point will cause the red LED to turn on for up to 2 minutes, after which the red LED will turn off and a Battery Charging icon will be displayed.
    * If a deeply discharged battery is inserted into the BlackBerry smartphone there will be no visual indicators of functionality. Connecting a charger to the BlackBerry smartphone at this point will cause the red LED to turn on for up to 2 minutes, after which the red LED will turn off and a Battery Charging icon will be displayed.
    * Make sure the charger is a BlackBerry wall charger or a computer. Using a bus-powered USB hub may cause the red LED to remain on indefinitely and the computer operating system may show a pop-up window with the following message: USB Hub Power Exceeded. In this case, the BlackBerry smartphone will not charge.
    How do you know if you have the drivers?
    12-14-09 01:53 AM
  15. 10SE's Avatar
    The feature is here. Pull up the target user's profile and just below the user name you should see "User Lists" as a dropdown. Select "Add to Ignore List"
    Best piece of advice in this thread.

    DONE! Bye-bye cpugeek4u.
    12-14-09 03:57 AM
  16. cpugeek4u's Avatar
    whatever..............
    12-14-09 04:30 AM
  17. Jerry Hildenbrand's Avatar
    How do you know if you have the drivers?
    If DM works then you have the drivers

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    12-14-09 05:44 AM
  18. Mr. Orange 645's Avatar
    told you all so. Suprised everybody is quiet now once the truth came out. See im right sometimes!
    Ok, OK...Now I'm confused. See I read this whole thread, and in the OP, cpugeek says (paraphrasing here): Don't charge your Storm with any charger not specifically manufactured for the Storm, otherwise you will damage the battery and/or device, because the voltage is different.

    Here's a link to that post for the lazy: http://forums.crackberry.com/f145/do...1/#post4268900

    Then for the next seven pages, amongst the talk of car batteries and alternators, various electrical engineers and other experts here refute cpugeek's statement, which is then further proven wrong by an official statement from RIM stating any micro/mini USB Charger is safe to use on a BlackBerry (providing its not defective, of course).

    So after all of that, cpugeek says, "See I'm right"? CPUGEEK, are you totally and completely delusional? If you said the sky was green, and I took you outside and showed you it was blue, you would say, "See, I was right."

    Wow....
    12-14-09 05:57 AM
  19. adambigge's Avatar
    1. Cpugeek you're either a moron or a liar. Or both.

    2. Dude who claims to be EE and 'converted' his imaginary PS3 from AC to DC is a liar.

    3. As long as your mini/micro USB charger is UL or CE listed, it will not damage a device which uses mini/micro USB to charge it. If it's not UL or CE listed, stop buying chargers at the swap meet or 5 Below and get something decent you cheap SOB.

    Someone earlier mentioned about it's now 2010 and standards are in place. That is where this thread should have stopped.

    Now let the idiocy continue.
    1. It's both
    2. I believe I already covered this. All electronic items run on DC. They simply concert AC to the DC voltage they require via a rectifier. It's just a matter of bypassing the rectifier bridge in the devices power supply. Entirely possible so I would be inclined to believe him.
    3. Agree

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    12-14-09 07:03 AM
  20. ctgilles's Avatar
    I charge my BBs with just about any charger I own, even my LG/Nokia/Motorola chargers
    12-14-09 07:10 AM
  21. Jerry Hildenbrand's Avatar
    2. I believe I already covered this. All electronic items run on DC. They simply concert AC to the DC voltage they require via a rectifier. It's just a matter of bypassing the rectifier bridge in the devices power supply. Entirely possible so I would be inclined to believe him.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Agreed. But come on...read it again. He's no EE nor did he convert his PS3 and Xbox. I call intertube warrior bigshot syndrome

    It's easy to see you know what you're talking about. And either of us can see that running a game console off of a DC power source is a very silly idea, unless you have a substantial DC power supply already in place. He makes it sound like he's running it from a deep cycle boat battery or a 9 volt
    12-14-09 06:20 PM
  22. Branta's Avatar
    where are you right?

    Right there in bold "any (mini/micro) USB charger".....that means the motorola ones, lg ones and all the other branded ones work fine which is direct opposite to what you stated

    you fail again....
    I think he's trying (and failing) to rescue his credibility by taking my last paragraph warning out of context. Everyone with more than one brain cell knows counterfeit and 2 oriental sourced no-name bogus adaptors from street vendors don't comply with the standard, don't have UL or CE approval, can't be sold legally in most western countries, and may fry any electronics to which they are connected. They are correspondingly rare and unlikely to be found in any bricks and mortar store.
    12-14-09 06:49 PM
  23. adambigge's Avatar
    At this point I think trying to rescue his credibility would be like trying to resuscitate a week old corpse..........
    12-14-09 07:08 PM
  24. wampart's Avatar
    I am amazed at the amount of misinformation in this thread. For anybody curious, cpugeek is way off base. Listen to the electrical engineers and electronic engineers (which I happen to be ) that are refuting his claims. He does not know what he is talking about. Voltage in car chargers is regulated with zener diodes as has been stated earlier. Think of it as a diode that is designed to only allow a certain level of voltage. They operate just outside of their thermal breakdown range. Too much current and they simply burn up. There is no conversion of DC to AC. USB protocols are set at certain voltage and current ranges. As long as you are using a properly made usb charger it will not produce enough current to damage your phone. All electronic devices run on DC. Even the ones you plug into the wall. The AC is just converted via an internal rectifier bridge and then regulated to the proper voltage for the device. The only reason we have AC current in our homes is because it is more efficient to transmit electricity as AC rather than DC. Geek might mean well but he just doesn't understand what he is talking about.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    Adambigge - not true about all electronics running off DC. Incandescent light bulbs, christmas lights, stoves, many motors (ceiling fans, many vacuum cleaners, etc) among other products run off AC. It all depends on the specific application.

    AC is actually an excellent choice for reliability in environments which could be humid or experience high levels of board contaminants. AC is often centered around 0 V (not always, once again it depends on the application), yielding an average voltage of 0 V (though RMS is not 0V). This can reduce the possibility of dendrite growth, which can cause performance degradation or catastrophic failure of an electronic device. I have first hand experience with this design strategy for products which are intended to function in environments > 80% RH.

    Otherwise Adambigge, you're spot on.

    Also, cpugeek is way off base. Why doesn't a moderator just delete this ridiculous thread?
    12-24-09 06:39 PM
  25. gtstang462002's Avatar
    Adambigge - not true about all electronics running off DC. Incandescent light bulbs, christmas lights, stoves, many motors (ceiling fans, many vacuum cleaners, etc) among other products run off AC. It all depends on the specific application.

    AC is actually an excellent choice for reliability in environments which could be humid or experience high levels of board contaminants. AC is often centered around 0 V (not always, once again it depends on the application), yielding an average voltage of 0 V (though RMS is not 0V). This can reduce the possibility of dendrite growth, which can cause performance degradation or catastrophic failure of an electronic device. I have first hand experience with this design strategy for products which are intended to function in environments > 80% RH.

    Otherwise Adambigge, you're spot on.

    Also, cpugeek is way off base. Why doesn't a moderator just delete this ridiculous thread?
    I think that Adambigge was referring to your entertainment electronics like you PS3, TV, DVD player and those types of electronics. Very few if any of them actually run on AC power directly. Most of them have power supplies in them that convert AC to DC power, typically 5VDC or 12VDC is the norm for internal voltages.

    BTW thanks for digging this thread up from the grave.
    12-24-09 07:16 PM
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