12-08-14 05:40 AM
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  1. SnoozerBold's Avatar
    Flash is being dropped because it sucks up resources, is continually having to be updated, and presents a security vulnerability since it requires code to be run on the device and not the server.
    No, that probably not the reason. I'd read through this thread to get a better understanding as to why they dropped it.
    If it was the right reason to drop it or not? I'm not getting into that a few people here have BOTH sides of the issue well covered. ...And actually might have swayed my opinion. Either way, this whole thread is a very interesting read.

    Posted via CB10
    12-05-14 04:33 AM
  2. anon(5818411)'s Avatar
    Here is something to chew on boys

    This is BES12 47min infrastructure webcast URL https://cgs.adobeconnect.com/system/...=/p8cmt1um7n9/


    Flash Usefulness-img_20141206_021232.png


    This has to be the biggest fail ever

    Posted via CB10
    12-06-14 01:12 AM
  3. SnoozerBold's Avatar
    Here is something to chew on boys

    This is BES12 47min infrastructure webcast URL https://cgs.adobeconnect.com/system/...=/p8cmt1um7n9/


    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	IMG_20141206_021232.png 
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ID:	318965


    This has to be the biggest fail ever

    Posted via CB10
    I don't have time to watch a 47 min webcast today but I'm assuming it confirms once and for all that they're dropping flash?


    Posted via CB10

    EDIT: oh lol. I didn't see the image until I replied with a quote to your post. Now I get it.
    12-06-14 05:26 AM
  4. dejanh's Avatar
    I don't have time to watch a 47 min webcast today but I'm assuming it confirms once and for all that they're dropping flash?


    Posted via CB10

    EDIT: oh lol. I didn't see the image until I replied with a quote to your post. Now I get it.
    Yeah, it doesn't freaking work because it's broadcast using Flash.

    Posted via CB10
    12-06-14 06:39 AM
  5. Furell's Avatar
    Hey khehl you forgot one, or maybe this is for geeks mostly lol.

    This is the TWiT Network http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/TWiT.tv It's a netcast network that I watch pretty much religiously, now the irony is this entire network centers around the latest technology, and guess what their using on their live stream site. http://live.twit.tv/


    Flash Usefulness-img_20141206_042732.png

    Now I do know they are in the process of a site update and I believe they will move to HTML5 but in the meantime I lost the ability to watch live streaming in my browser. I can still watch all the polished fully-edited shows from their main site http://twit.tv/ (apparently those are HTML5) but I really enjoy watching live when I can. I didn't even know the livestream was encoded in flash until my flash was taken away.

    Sidenote: I could not be without TWiT not even one day so I found a app(TWIT pro) In snap that plays the livestream fairly well...... but still not quite as good as my native experience in my browser.

    Ruling the air with my '30, 10.3.1, and big red! Accept no substitute.
    Last edited by Furell; 12-06-14 at 07:27 AM.
    12-06-14 07:02 AM
  6. moosbb's Avatar
    I'm very sad to see flash dropped on our browser too!

    Yeah HTLM5 is the future, but plenty of flash use here too, with live streaming...

    Sticking to OS 10.3 because of this. (I'm not that excited neither about an Android browser!)
    12-06-14 07:47 AM
  7. anon(5818411)'s Avatar
    Hey khehl you forgot one, or maybe this is for geeks mostly lol.

    This is the TWiT Network TWiT.tv - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia It's a netcast network that I watch pretty much religiously, now the irony is this entire network centers around the latest technology, and guess what their using on their live stream site. TWiT Live: Netcasts you love, from people you trust
    I was mainly going after BlackBerry's target market

    But noted and your link got sent to BlackBerry, thank you. Please list more when you find them
    Furell likes this.
    12-06-14 10:28 AM
  8. D3C0D3R's Avatar
    I was mainly going after BlackBerry's target market

    But noted and your link got sent to BlackBerry, thank you. Please list more when you find them
    You listed the BES12 webcast link, right?

    Praise be unto our Lord Squircle | Passport SQW100-1/10.3.0.1418
    12-06-14 11:36 AM
  9. anon(5818411)'s Avatar
    You listed the BES12 webcast link, right?

    Praise be unto our Lord Squircle | Passport SQW100-1/10.3.0.1418
    yes
    12-06-14 12:11 PM
  10. joeragan's Avatar
    I am wondering how much is the license cost for Adobe Flash. Isn't it a one time payment only?


    Posted via CB10 - Z30 - 10.3.1.1154
    12-06-14 12:28 PM
  11. app_Developer's Avatar
    Hey khehl you forgot one, or maybe this is for geeks mostly lol.

    This is the TWiT Network http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/TWiT.tv It's a netcast network that I watch pretty much religiously, now the irony is this entire network centers around the latest technology, and guess what their using on their live stream site. http://live.twit.tv/


    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	IMG_20141206_042732.png 
Views:	514 
Size:	57.7 KB 
ID:	318984

    Now I do know they are in the process of a site update and I believe they will move to HTML5 but in the meantime I lost the ability to watch live streaming in my browser. ...
    This is an example of a site that works perfectly fine on Safari without Flash.

    I also tried a couple of khehl's sites on iPhone and some work, some do not.

    So some sites don't actually need Flash. They already offer alternatives, they just need to recognize the BB10 browser the way they recognize Safari and provide the correct content type.

    I would suggest when you guys provide these sites to BB that you clearly differentiate between the two issues. BB and BB fans can help fix the user agent issue without actually needing Flash at all.


    Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk
    12-06-14 01:30 PM
  12. dejanh's Avatar
    We're not all owners of iPhones in addition to our BlackBerry devices. A lot of us don't have any second device. I have an LG G2, but I don't have the time to be checking sites on one browser and than the other. Besides, desktop mode is what I'm always after, and is part of the reason why I bought the Passport in the first place.

    Posted via CB10
    12-06-14 03:29 PM
  13. boilerkim's Avatar
    But you can't use the play on feature with hdmi in kalem. People with the q10 have to watch the movies on a 1:1 even if they used hdmi without play on.

    Posted via CB10
    12-06-14 05:44 PM
  14. Furell's Avatar
    I am wondering how much is the license cost for Adobe Flash. Isn't it a one time payment only?


    Posted via CB10 - Z30 - 10.3.1.1154
    I highly doubt it. Licensing agreements almost always come with an expiration date.
    12-06-14 06:19 PM
  15. app_Developer's Avatar
    We're not all owners of iPhones in addition to our BlackBerry devices. A lot of us don't have any second device. I have an LG G2, but I don't have the time to be checking sites on one browser and than the other. Besides, desktop mode is what I'm always after, and is part of the reason why I bought the Passport in the first place.
    Fair enough, but we still can't count those sites as requiring Flash. They don't all require Flash.

    BB could, for example, just allow people to change their user agent header if that would help with enough of these sites.



    Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk
    Kris Simundson likes this.
    12-06-14 06:38 PM
  16. dejanh's Avatar
    I see that more as a stopgap. Which user agent do you change to? How is the end user supposed to know? Here is what happens on Android 4.4, using latest Chrome.

    Flash Usefulness-screenshot_2014-12-06-17-35-34.jpg

    Posted via CB10
    Last edited by dejanh; 12-06-14 at 07:45 PM.
    Furell likes this.
    12-06-14 07:34 PM
  17. app_Developer's Avatar
    I see that more as a stopgap. Which user agent do you change to? How is the end user supposed to know? Here is what happens on Android 4.4, using latest Chrome.
    Change it to mobile safari. That's a safe bet. Most web sites want iPhone users. Over time they work harder and harder to give iPhone users a good experience. That's good business.

    BB can even track the most popular sites and automatically change the user agent for you. They can also track analytics to crowd source those decisions. Both would be easier than trying to support and secure mobile Flash all by themselves.

    Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk
    12-06-14 07:50 PM
  18. Furell's Avatar
    Change it to mobile safari. That's a safe bet. Most web sites want iPhone users. Over time they work harder and harder to give iPhone users a good experience. That's good business.

    BB can even track the most popular sites and automatically change the user agent for you. They can also track analytics to crowd source those decisions. Both would be easier than trying to support and secure mobile Flash all by themselves.

    Sent from my iPhone 6 using Tapatalk
    Yes this would be nice. I would really like to control the user agent or have it on "auto mode" and let BB change it. That being said, I would still miss the native browser experience w/flash, it just felt so natural and worked really well. I do understand JC has to turn the ship around and start profiting so he needs to cut the fat any where he can. I'm just so conflicted as to whether this is "fat" or not. I can see both sides to this issue and can debate on either side. This could be a game changing decision for the company "make or break". I just wish I knew what JC thinks about all this. Only time will tell, when the official 10.3.1 drops we will see how they handle this issue, until then we are poking in the dark here. Safe to say this decision will have a huge impact on BlackBerry's end-users.
    12-06-14 08:46 PM
  19. aha's Avatar
    Nice thread!

    Ok here is one that flash doesn't work.

    https://d2l.cbe.ab.ca/index.asp?sess...fhome%2f315986

    This is site used by students and teachers in Canada, it called design to learn, or D2L. The login page requires no flash of course, but the resources linked in the site requires flash to be loaded. Now I get this:


    Flash Usefulness-img_20141207_063541.png

    Posted via CB10 with PassportSQW100-1/10.3.1.1151
    12-07-14 07:37 AM
  20. D3C0D3R's Avatar
    Nice thread!

    Ok here is one that flash doesn't work.

    https://d2l.cbe.ab.ca/index.asp?sess...fhome%2f315986

    This is site used by students and teachers in Canada, it called design to learn, or D2L. The login page requires no flash of course, but the resources linked in the site requires flash to be loaded. Now I get this:


    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	IMG_20141207_063541.png 
Views:	432 
Size:	177.2 KB 
ID:	319166

    Posted via CB10 with PassportSQW100-1/10.3.1.1151
    Man I timed being in school well, i used the D2L for a couple of my courses on my Z10 all the time, lucky me that it was before BlackBerry potentially dropped Flash!

    Praise be unto our Lord Squircle | Passport SQW100-1/10.3.0.1418
    12-07-14 11:27 AM
  21. James Blight's Avatar
    Wow - some of you folks are ridiculous. I don't give a flying rat's heiny if anyone doesn't need or use Flash. I do. I use it for work and play. It's not a choice. I don;t care what the entire world wide web will look like in 10 years. Right now - right this second there are ten's of thousands of sites that I use - that use flash. And if one more individual tells me that flash is a security risk I'm going to get really nasty. Flash is a security risk? Really? It's been in BB10 since day 1. Day 1. How many flash infections have been reported, how much patching has BB had to do? Oh that's right NONE! SMH.

    2 points are unassailable - BB can not afford to lose any users. Any users. The removal of flash not attract users, it will lose users. And to the "individual" who claimed that having flash hasn't helped BB sales - By that logic - BB should remove the camera and music player. I mean let's be honest, prior to OS5, BB;s did not have these things and had a much larger market share.

    Finally to those who claim flash doesn't work well, I don't know what phone you are using. My Z10 and Z30 utilize flash great. Three examples from this week: I missed 2 games on Sunday I wanted to see. I used NFL rewind on Monday morning to watch the compressed games flawlessly from the train. On Tuesday afternoon, I was in a partner's office for a meeting and phone conference, client asked about an assignment provision in a mortgage, I used ACRIS to locate and view the mortgage on the fly - (PS this impressed the crap out of both the associate and partner who decided they should give BB another look). Finally, out shopping yesterday - I needed to check a worksite to see if new docs had been posted. And yes, many worksites require both adobe reader and flash plugins. Like I said previously, the legal industry ( a huge BB purchasing niche) is slow to change. Removal of flash adds another hurdle to my job and removes one of the last few differentiators BB had over competing OSes.

    But yeah - let's turn this around on all those sites that utilize flash - don't they know that BB is stopping flash support? How dare they not update their technology to HTML5? Or at least develop a BB app like everyone else...oh yeah.... nevermind.
    Great points. Totally agree. The only comment I would make us that, like it or not, no other platform supports it either. I think BlackBerry should leave it in. They already have it working, they should just leave it in the OS until flash isn't on the Internet anymore.

    Posted via CB 10 on my Z30 (STA100-5) w 10.3.1.1151
    12-07-14 11:44 AM
  22. aha's Avatar
    Wow - some of you folks are ridiculous. I don't give a flying rat's heiny if anyone doesn't need or use Flash. I do. I use it for work and play. It's not a choice. I don;t care what the entire world wide web will look like in 10 years. Right now - right this second there are ten's of thousands of sites that I use - that use flash. And if one more individual tells me that flash is a security risk I'm going to get really nasty. Flash is a security risk? Really? It's been in BB10 since day 1. Day 1. How many flash infections have been reported, how much patching has BB had to do? Oh that's right NONE! SMH.

    2 points are unassailable - BB can not afford to lose any users. Any users. The removal of flash not attract users, it will lose users. And to the "individual" who claimed that having flash hasn't helped BB sales - By that logic - BB should remove the camera and music player. I mean let's be honest, prior to OS5, BB;s did not have these things and had a much larger market share.

    Finally to those who claim flash doesn't work well, I don't know what phone you are using. My Z10 and Z30 utilize flash great. Three examples from this week: I missed 2 games on Sunday I wanted to see. I used NFL rewind on Monday morning to watch the compressed games flawlessly from the train. On Tuesday afternoon, I was in a partner's office for a meeting and phone conference, client asked about an assignment provision in a mortgage, I used ACRIS to locate and view the mortgage on the fly - (PS this impressed the crap out of both the associate and partner who decided they should give BB another look). Finally, out shopping yesterday - I needed to check a worksite to see if new docs had been posted. And yes, many worksites require both adobe reader and flash plugins. Like I said previously, the legal industry ( a huge BB purchasing niche) is slow to change. Removal of flash adds another hurdle to my job and removes one of the last few differentiators BB had over competing OSes.

    But yeah - let's turn this around on all those sites that utilize flash - don't they know that BB is stopping flash support? How dare they not update their technology to HTML5? Or at least develop a BB app like everyone else...oh yeah.... nevermind.
    This needs to be sent to Mr. Chen!

    Yeah HTML5 is the future, but flash is NOW.




    Posted via CB10 with PassportSQW100-1/10.3.1.1151
    12-07-14 11:57 AM
  23. dejanh's Avatar
    Here is one more site. Just trying to book a vacation with Sunwing and want to see the seat selection. Sorry, but no way.

    Flash Usefulness-img_20141207_102741.png

    Posted via CB10
    12-07-14 12:31 PM
  24. CarbonKevin's Avatar
    Nice thread!

    https://d2l.cbe.ab.ca/index.asp?sess...fhome%2f315986

    This is site used by students and teachers in Canada, it called design to learn, or D2L. The login page requires no flash of course, but the resources linked in the site requires flash to be loaded. Now I get this:

    Posted via CB10 with PassportSQW100-1/10.3.1.1151
    It isn't even remotely surprising that DesireNot2Learn uses flash.

    Two simple facts:
    1. Most mobile devices are iSomethings, which don't have flash.
    2. Every user of D2L would absolutely want to be able to access it via their mobile device when needed.

    Yet...they code it in flash, making it inaccessible to most users at some point or other. The lousy interface and poor coding, along with need for regular maintenance, (and the unplanned outages, of course) makes this software an all-round hairy piece of shirt. So much the better, the worse it is, the more likely the company gets dropped in favor of better software. Fork D2L. Fork every last one of 'em.
    12-07-14 01:11 PM
  25. CarbonKevin's Avatar
    If this discussion deserves a thread, I think we should also have on debating the merits of Steve Jobs vs Tim Cook. Personally, I think Jobs is a far superior CEO and capable of bringing his company to far greener pastures than Cook. They definitely should bring Steve Jobs back as CEO.

    See what I did there? Flash had it's time. That time is passing. Unfortunately, whenever a technological shift occurs, there are transition issues - early adopters being compatible with nothing, late adopters being compatible with nothing, everyone else being caught in the middle, and of course the time, energy, money, and frustration that goes into the awkward period of moving from one way of doing things to the other.

    Leaded gas was great for engines, but caused that annoying cancer thing. You bet your *** the transition was tough.

    Asbestos is a wonderful insulator with some great fireproofing qualities. But...cancer.

    Rotary dialing giving way to touch tone phones? Some people STILL have rotary phones - I don't have a clue how they survive being unable to navigate phone menu systems, but somehow they do...

    How 'bout going from English units to the Metric system? That's a really sore one, because the transition was never completed, because of too damn much whining, and the Metric commission unable to finish what they started - so now we have two ways of measuring things and will likely be stuck that way for all eternity, wasting billions of dollars with the inefficiencies and failures caused by this dual system. That's the danger of failing to transition fully, for those of you saying bring back Flash.

    If you think this is a painful transition, just wait 'til electric cars really start to gain market traction! Power grids won't be able to cope, gas stations will be harder and harder to find, gasoline supply will be scaled back to try and maintain profitability, so prices will skyrocket...

    Like every other successful transition, we must all learn to adapt and cope, and for better or worse suffer through the difficult time, because on the other side things will (hopefully? usually? ideally? maybe?) be better.
    James Blight likes this.
    12-07-14 01:26 PM
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