12-08-14 05:40 AM
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  1. conite's Avatar
    Yep, after the current flash support regression, it's easy to conclude that Cheapskate Chen will do or has done the same with other key software like the AC3 Codec. It's almost like this guy was brought in to BlackBerry to fire talent, to dump useful software, and to make our phone experience a little less competitive every step of the way.

    Z-30 / STA100-5 / 10.3.0.1418 / T-Mobile USA
    Ya, and that little annoying thing like keeping the company alive.

    Z30STA100-5/10.3.1.1154
    SnoozerBold likes this.
    11-27-14 08:41 AM
  2. BrooklynBerryAddict's Avatar
    Ya, and that little annoying thing like keeping the company alive.
    This.

    We may not like everything Chen or BlackBerry is doing right now but overall I do not see how you cannot like where they are now compared to 12 months ago.

    Posted via CB10
    11-27-14 08:47 AM
  3. conite's Avatar
    This.

    We may not like everything Chen or BlackBerry is doing right now but overall I do not see how you cannot like where they are now compared to 12 months ago.

    Posted via CB10
    In addition to the financial improvements, I would also argue that with 10.3.1, Blend, and the Amazon appstore (even with its shortcomings) , the overall consumer experience has never been better.

    Z30STA100-5/10.3.1.1154
    11-27-14 08:53 AM
  4. eyesopen1111's Avatar
    Ya, and that little annoying thing like keeping the company alive.

    Z30STA100-5/10.3.1.1154
    You seem to agree that Chen is degrading BB10, but argue that he is doing so in order to "keep[] the company alive. "

    Don't be fooled. If BlackBerry were so close to death that saving on flash license fees and Codec fees were the only things "keeping the company alive" then Cheapskate Chen wouldn't be talking about making a profit next year.

    There is money to support these things, Chen just wants to adopt a short term strategy to make the books look good so that he can sell as quickly as possible.

    As a customer whose BlackBerry experience is being degraded by his strategy, I object.

    Z-30 / STA100-5 / 10.3.0.1418 / T-Mobile USA
    11-27-14 08:58 AM
  5. dejanh's Avatar
    Then what's the excuse for BB not including the AC3 codec? It was on 10.0

    AC3 is one of the most common codecs for watching movies.
    You know what's the irony about AC3? It's still in the OS. It just cannot be used because a config flag is set to "false". I'm not ****ting you. You can even open the file and edit it, but without root access you can't save it.

    Posted via CB10
    11-27-14 09:14 AM
  6. conite's Avatar
    You seem to agree that Chen is degrading BB10, but argue that he is doing so in order to "keep[] the company alive. "

    Don't be fooled. If BlackBerry were so close to death that saving on flash license fees and Codec fees were the only things "keeping the company alive" then Cheapskate Chen wouldn't be talking about making a profit next year.

    There is money to support these things, Chen just wants to adopt a short term strategy to make the books look good so that he can sell as quickly as possible.

    As a customer whose BlackBerry experience is being degraded by his strategy, I object.

    Z-30 / STA100-5 / 10.3.0.1418 / T-Mobile USA
    See my previous post. Consumer experience has never been better in my opinion.

    I understand that you are laser focused on this one issue. But BlackBerry is hardly alone in its handling of mobile Flash. That sucks for you, I know - and that's too bad. But if you're going to throw BlackBerry under the bus, then you have to do the same for every other mobile platform.

    Z30STA100-5/10.3.1.1154
    Last edited by conite; 11-27-14 at 09:33 AM.
    11-27-14 09:19 AM
  7. conite's Avatar
    You know what's the irony about AC3? It's still in the OS. It just cannot be used because a config flag is set to "false". I'm not ****ting you. You can even open the file and edit it, but without root access you can't save it.

    Posted via CB10
    A lot of native players can handle ac3 though. Kalemsoft is one. Great program. Can stream from DLNA sources too.

    Z30STA100-5/10.3.1.1154
    11-27-14 09:22 AM
  8. eyesopen1111's Avatar
    This.

    We may not like everything Chen or BlackBerry is doing right now but overall I do not see how you cannot like where they are now compared to 12 months ago.

    Posted via CB10
    I hate what Chen is doing right now. Investors may like it, but I'm not an investor in BlackBerry. I'm a customer.

    But are we better off than a year ago? Last year we had flash and more Codec software support. Plus, I didn't like the Amazon store deal because we could always (since 10.2.1) download the Amazon store apk for free, so I thought that the betrayal of native BlackBerry development was a terrible idea (sacking developer relations, deferring consumer apps to Amazon, etc). I thought that removal of features like the movie store in BlackBerry World was a negative (I loved the $1 movie purchases). I also liked the idea of the balanced Z10 + Q10 + Z30 product mix a year ago much more than the launch of the Classic and Passport this year because I think BB10 has and will continue to sell more all-touch phones, and that even temporary monomania for keyboard phones is foolish. I could go on.


    See my previous post. Consumer experience has never been better in my opinion.

    I understand that you are laser focused on this one issue. But BlackBerry is hardly alone in its handling of mobile Flash. That sucks for you, I know - and that's too bad. But if you're going to throw BlackBerry under the bus, then you have to do the same for every other mobile platform.

    Z30STA100-5/10.3.1.1154
    I'm not laser focused on flash as a single issue, though flash is the topic of this thread so I focus on that here. No harm done, I see why you'd think that.

    I'd say I'm much more focused on Chen's pattern of degrading the BB10 experience, especially when I think it's being done for reasons I disagree with. Flash's loss is just a symptom of the Chen short term approach.

    From my point of view, 10.3.1 is a degrade with respect to 10.3.0--not by a lot, but by enough. As for Blend, I'd rather have a lot of other things prioritized over Blend, like cross-platform video chat, better Android support, or a suite of software services to rival the iOS/Android competition.

    I've already discussed why I think the Amazon app store deal is no good.

    Z-30 / STA100-5 / 10.3.0.1418 / T-Mobile USA
    Last edited by eyesopen1111; 11-27-14 at 10:04 AM.
    11-27-14 09:36 AM
  9. -Puck-'s Avatar
    You seem to agree that Chen is degrading BB10, but argue that he is doing so in order to "keep[] the company alive. "

    Don't be fooled. If BlackBerry were so close to death that saving on flash license fees and Codec fees were the only things "keeping the company alive" then Cheapskate Chen wouldn't be talking about making a profit next year.

    There is money to support these things, Chen just wants to adopt a short term strategy to make the books look good so that he can sell as quickly as possible.

    As a customer whose BlackBerry experience is being degraded by his strategy, I object.

    Z-30 / STA100-5 / 10.3.0.1418 / T-Mobile USA
    As a shareholder who sees the stock value has doubled since this time last year, I do not object.
    11-27-14 03:30 PM
  10. bhrgvr's Avatar
    Flash is very useful. Especially on BB. MLB's website, NFL's website (especially NFL Rewind), NBA etc... they all use flash. Not all have apps that will work on BB, and some the website is 100X better than the app. Also Vidbull and Vodlocker and dozens of other streaming video sites. Same with many municipal search engines like NY ACRIS, one can not view documents without flash (and there is no app for this).

    In short, the loss of flash is a big step backwards. BB10 has had flash from the start and has had no security issues as a result. Security is not the reason it was pulled (if it has been). If it was pulled it was part of the misguided understanding that a focus on enterprise mobility is the best course of action, and flash, being a consumer element can fall to the wayside, along with full touch screen devices. A poor decision.
    Legacy BlackBerry devices did not have flash... we still streamed videos without it... on most of the sites

    Posted via CB10
    11-27-14 03:34 PM
  11. eyesopen1111's Avatar
    As a shareholder who sees the stock value has doubled since this time last year, I do not object.
    Brilliant confession and very much my point. The BB10 experience is definitely being degraded in supposed service to the investor. In this case, that means that investors get an extra $5 per share to the princely sum of $10.45 as of today's current value. I completely get this picture.

    The motivation of shareholders is obvious. I get why they apologize for every shortcoming of BlackBerry. I get why they cheer as the costs get cut, promising better financial results. Yep, I get it. The financially motivated fan is the least puzzling person on the site.

    But customers care about product value. And BlackBerry's flash, codec, and native development strategies run counter to building product value; and instead, they seem built around short-term thinking that's focused on building BlackBerry's financial curbside appeal for sale.

    So, IMHO, BlackBerry still looks like it's getting ready to leave the phone market to me, divesting before exiting. Here's hoping I'm wrong...

    Z-30 / STA100-5 / 10.3.0.1418 / T-Mobile USA
    11-27-14 05:22 PM
  12. tushargkwd's Avatar
    See guys... we're again at the point in history where we're witnessing intense format wars in terms of HTML5 and Flash....

    While people argue that HTML5 is the future... I agree with all of you and majority will... but still there's this Internet where bot everyone on the same page... some are laggards...

    BlackBerry with its native browser with Flash have people the freedom to browse to any site and get the content... be it flash or no flash.. In short BlackBerry did a superb job with the browser....

    At this point in time when the web continues to transition to HTML5, many still use Flash..... and this outrage that I notice in this thread would be of a lesser extent if BlackBerry would have thought to drop Flash support next year or so... since by then most of the web would have become 'flash-free'.

    I agree with Conite and Kris that BlackBerry needs to save money... but also like that my BlackBerry browser gives me freedom to go to any site, be it flash or no-flash and consume content...

    I hope that they continue to develop flash for sometime until we have almost everything in HTML5..... and yes.. Adobe Flash always have had security related issues and hence BlackBerry might be tired of maintaining the codebase to mitigate the security flaws!

    My 2 cents... I'm neutral.. but I think they should support Flash for a year..!

    Posted via CB10 and my awesome Z30STA100-2/10.2.1.3442
    m3mb3rsh1p and dejanh like this.
    11-27-14 06:27 PM
  13. D3C0D3R's Avatar
    Have YOU tried it? Like I said, I find Photon Browser quite nice for those times I trip across Flash sites. Nice too in that it removes the crutch from our native browser. This solution will be perfectly fine for all but the power Flash users.

    Z30STA100-5/10.3.1.1154
    Can you stop telling us to use a 3rd party browser? Yeah? Thanks.

    We're on BlackBerry because it's an efficient phone and OS, and the Browser being a literal beast, handling all content and challenges that are thrown at it.

    We don't want to revert to a 3rd party browser every time we catch a wiff of 'Flash', nor do we want to always have to rely on Android apps.

    I for one love the current one and will definitely be a part of the group the rebuilds official 10.3.1 with a proper Flash support (there's work around, just not something we'd like to do).

    Praise be unto our Lord Squircle | Passport SQW100-1/10.3.0.1418
    DickDorf likes this.
    11-27-14 07:54 PM
  14. conite's Avatar
    Can you stop telling us to use a 3rd party browser? Yeah? Thanks.

    We're on BlackBerry because it's an efficient phone and OS, and the Browser being a literal beast, handling all content and challenges that are thrown at it.

    We don't want to revert to a 3rd party browser every time we catch a wiff of 'Flash', nor do we want to always have to rely on Android apps.

    I for one love the current one and will definitely be a part of the group the rebuilds official 10.3.1 with a proper Flash support (there's work around, just not something we'd like to do).

    Praise be unto our Lord Squircle | Passport SQW100-1/10.3.0.1418
    What's done is done. I can whine about it, or I can try and offer a practical solution that will more than satisfy over 95% of BlackBerry Flash users out there. I am fully aware that you will never be happy about it. It seems odd telling me to stop making suggestions to the hundreds of other people that read this thread and may not be aware of the alternatives. I'm fairly certain you do not speak for every last one of them.

    Z30STA100-5/10.3.1.1154
    app_Developer likes this.
    11-27-14 08:58 PM
  15. dejanh's Avatar
    What's done is done. I can whine about it, or I can try and offer a practical solution that will more than satisfy over 95% of BlackBerry Flash users out there. I am fully aware that you will never be happy about it. It seems odd telling me to stop making suggestions to the hundreds of other people that read this thread and may not be aware of the alternatives. I'm fairly certain you do not speak for every last one of them.

    Z30STA100-5/10.3.1.1154
    This is the first time I have to agree with you. Since we're already in a hole, a bad solution is better than no solution. It doesn't make me any more pleased at the situation.

    Posted via CB10
    11-27-14 09:00 PM
  16. D3C0D3R's Avatar
    What's done is done. I can whine about it, or I can try and offer a practical solution that will more than satisfy over 95% of BlackBerry Flash users out there. I am fully aware that you will never be happy about it. It seems odd telling me to stop making suggestions to the hundreds of other people that read this thread and may not be aware of the alternatives. I'm fairly certain you do not speak for every last one of them.

    Z30STA100-5/10.3.1.1154
    Definitely not 95% of the BlackBerry Flash users will be using an android browser as opposed to a native solution such as Evolution Browser..

    I'm just saying that they're going to want an actual solution that has good quality and not an android app that crashes/stutters/lags/formats incorrectly/battery drainer.

    Sooo I'm not saying don't make suggestions, just make good ones where possible :P


    Praise be unto our Lord Squircle | Passport SQW100-1/10.3.0.1418
    Last edited by D3C0D3R; 11-27-14 at 11:12 PM.
    11-27-14 09:43 PM
  17. tushargkwd's Avatar
    Yes... now I believe that there is a market for a native BlackBerry browser with Flash... and if its good.. its going to be a hit...

    Devs... notice this and start work on a flash browser and drop it in this thread... people will happily buy a native one....!

    I believe devs like nemOry /xsacha or others can help here... and they can help all guys who need native flash!

    Posted via CB10 and my awesome Z30STA100-2/10.2.1.3442
    11-28-14 03:51 AM
  18. dejanh's Avatar
    Yes... now I believe that there is a market for a native BlackBerry browser with Flash... and if its good.. its going to be a hit...

    Devs... notice this and start work on a flash browser and drop it in this thread... people will happily buy a native one....!

    I believe devs like nemOry /xsacha or others can help here... and they can help all guys who need native flash!

    Posted via CB10 and my awesome Z30STA100-2/10.2.1.3442
    Yeah, I think you're dreaming. Unlike on Android where Flash was a downloadable APK, on BlackBerry it's embedded into the OS. There won't be anyone substituting for native Flash with 3rd party native Flash.

    Posted via CB10
    11-28-14 09:10 AM
  19. BetaZoneEmployee's Avatar
    As you know, Flash support has been removed from the Browser. We are looking to gather a list of your top websites that you are unable to access content on because of the Flash removal

    1. Please list websites below where you cannot access content because of Flash removal, please list the exact URL

    2. Do you know if any of the sites you listed work on Android/iPhone native browsers? If so, please list them below

    3. Do you know if any of the sites you listed have an app available for Android/iPhone? If so, please list them below.
    m3mb3rsh1p likes this.
    11-28-14 10:58 AM
  20. delboyca's Avatar
    Hi Mr fake beta zone employee!

    I'm rather upset with this as this is my work phone and my employer has a number of intranet services which are built on flash and likely not going to get rewritten any time soon, including the hot desking app I use almost on a daily basis to reserve my seat at work.

    It has been great over the last almost 2 years to be able to do this on the train or at night from my phone without having to fire up the laptop and engage the VPN.

    I use them in the Work partition as well so Android browsers are not a possibility.

    Posted via CB10
    11-28-14 02:13 PM
  21. D3C0D3R's Avatar
    As you know, Flash support has been removed from the Browser. We are looking to gather a list of your top websites that you are unable to access content on because of the Flash removal

    1. Please list websites below where you cannot access content because of Flash removal, please list the exact URL

    2. Do you know if any of the sites you listed work on Android/iPhone native browsers? If so, please list them below

    3. Do you know if any of the sites you listed have an app available for Android/iPhone? If so, please list them below.
    Can't tell whether to treat this as a fake account from 'BlackBerry' yet again, if it's an actual account..

    We need CB to find a way to authorize and show authorized accounts..

    Praise be unto our Lord Squircle | Passport SQW100-1/10.3.0.1418
    11-28-14 03:29 PM
  22. eyesopen1111's Avatar
    As you know, Flash support has been removed from the Browser. We are looking to gather a list of your top websites that you are unable to access content on because of the Flash removal

    1. Please list websites below where you cannot access content because of Flash removal, please list the exact URL

    2. Do you know if any of the sites you listed work on Android/iPhone native browsers? If so, please list them below

    3. Do you know if any of the sites you listed have an app available for Android/iPhone? If so, please list them below.
    This account was created today and has a single post. Looks bogus to me.

    Z-30 / STA100-5 / 10.3.0.1418 / T-Mobile USA
    11-29-14 12:09 AM
  23. Norg's Avatar
    Have YOU tried it? Like I said, I find Photon Browser quite nice for those times I trip across Flash sites. Nice too in that it removes the crutch from our native browser. This solution will be perfectly fine for all but the power Flash users.

    Z30STA100-5/10.3.1.1154
    Kinda makes you wonder why they put Flash in OS10 in the first place !! For the most part, I'm not really feeling that inconvenienced as I thought I would be.

    Posted via my Kick@ss Q10.
    11-29-14 12:10 AM
  24. eyesopen1111's Avatar
    Kinda makes you wonder why they put Flash in OS10 in the first place !! For the most part, I'm not really feeling that inconvenienced as I thought I would be.

    Posted via my Kick@ss Q10.
    I hope you're joking, but I'll take your why-question seriously. BlackBerry built flash into BB10 because it wanted to provide customers with a native browsing solution that could access flash content. There was, and still is, much flash content on the Web and many users would like BlackBerry to continue providing flash support in the native browser.

    Z-30 / STA100-5 / 10.3.0.1418 / T-Mobile USA
    11-29-14 12:21 AM
  25. allbetsareoff29's Avatar
    Like I said in my previous posts:
    Why take it out of the core file?
    It doesn't cost BlackBerry anything to keep it in. If anything, it costs them developer time to take it out and making sure that all other stuff still runs as expected

    Posted via CB10
    11-29-14 12:27 AM
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