04-21-14 10:05 AM
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  1. ravipiero's Avatar
    It's all about personal opinion buddy..!! It's perfectly alright if you feel android runtime is useless.. but for majority of BlackBerry 10 users it's amazing.. including me..!! Just saying..!!

    Posted via Dual OS Z10..!! B-)
    I first tried android launcher when there was Instagram keyboard fix using launcher. The runtime is amazing, BB 10 is also amazing. But the ability to run android launcher and tell people that I can dual boot android is useless for me, because first it's technically not dual boot, it's function is limited, and I can't really find anything useful to do with it. Same like my nokia-windows 3.1 experience.

    But again it's just me. I'm glad you and several other people loved it so much

    Posted via CB10
    12-07-13 06:30 AM
  2. Akshay Borkar's Avatar
    I first tried android launcher when there was Instagram keyboard fix using launcher. The runtime is amazing, BB 10 is also amazing. But the ability to run android launcher and tell people that I can dual boot android is useless for me, because first it's technically not dual boot, it's function is limited, and I can't really find anything useful to do with it. Same like my nokia-windows 3.1 experience.

    But again it's just me. I'm glad you and several other people loved it so much

    Posted via CB10
    I think you didn't read the entire post friend..!! Before ending the post their is *P.S.* message.. go through it..!! I have mentioned there something..!!

    Posted via Dual OS Z10..!! B-)
    12-07-13 07:55 AM
  3. ravipiero's Avatar
    I think you didn't read the entire post friend..!! Before ending the post their is *P.S.* message.. go through it..!! I have mentioned there something..!!

    Posted via Dual OS Z10..!! B-)
    Read the PS already, and even if I read it 10 more times the opinion stays the same.

    Posted via CB10
    Akshay Borkar likes this.
    12-07-13 09:22 AM
  4. ToddJack's Avatar
    Good posts Akshay, the reason BlackBerry had to negotiate an agreement with Google was become they finally realized they could not survive on BB10 alone. I wish they had come to this conclusion a few years ago and not push a number of us out the door due to BlackBerry not being able to keep its products market competitive.

    Sent from my Samsung S3 using CB Forums mobile app
    Akshay Borkar likes this.
    12-07-13 09:25 AM
  5. mnc76's Avatar
    Why would android users need to run the the very few blackberry apps that exist ? Just shows how much of a failure BB10 is that it needs to rely on a poor emulator.
    Every Android handset uses an "emulator". All Android applications run on a modified Java virtual machine called Dalvik. This means that even the Galaxy S4 'emulates' apps on virtual machine. Even the HTC One 'emulates' apps on a virtual machine. Even the LG G2 'emulates' apps on a virtual machine.

    So saying that 'emulation' sucks, is exactly the same thing as saying "every Android phone ever made sucks". Is that what you're saying?

    Posted via CB10
    Akshay Borkar and DStLouis like this.
    12-07-13 03:39 PM
  6. Akshay Borkar's Avatar
    Good posts Akshay, the reason BlackBerry had to negotiate an agreement with Google was become they finally realized they could not survive on BB10 alone. I wish they had come to this conclusion a few years ago and not push a number of us out the door due to BlackBerry not being able to keep its products market competitive.

    Sent from my Samsung S3 using CB Forums mobile app
    It's never too late..!! Hope for the best..!!

    Posted via Dual OS Z10..!! B-)
    12-07-13 03:57 PM
  7. Akshay Borkar's Avatar
    Every Android handset uses an "emulator". All Android applications run on a modified Java virtual machine called Dalvik. This means that even the Galaxy S4 'emulates' apps on virtual machine. Even the HTC One 'emulates' apps on a virtual machine. Even the LG G2 'emulates' apps on a virtual machine.

    So saying that 'emulation' sucks, is exactly the same thing as saying "every Android phone ever made sucks". Is that what you're saying?

    Posted via CB10
    Excellent point..!! Superb..!!

    Posted via Dual OS Z10..!! B-)
    12-07-13 03:58 PM
  8. DStLouis's Avatar
    Every Android handset uses an "emulator". All Android applications run on a modified Java virtual machine called Dalvik. This means that even the Galaxy S4 'emulates' apps on virtual machine. Even the HTC One 'emulates' apps on a virtual machine. Even the LG G2 'emulates' apps on a virtual machine.

    So saying that 'emulation' sucks, is exactly the same thing as saying "every Android phone ever made sucks". Is that what you're saying?

    Posted via CB10
    So I'm wondering about BlackBerry vs Android phone side by side performances.

    It's known that Android devices typically require more CPU relative to BB10 OS. Which CPU power may not be found high in BlackBerry devices.

    Apart of the initial load time, I know that running Android apps on my Z10 performs as much as on an Android device

    What about the emulation ?


    Posted via CB10
    Akshay Borkar likes this.
    12-07-13 09:40 PM
  9. Michael Bornstein's Avatar
    I Have to disagree with you on performance and the characterization of this runtime as something akin to a dual boot operating system. I just got a z10 during the 200 sale and the first thing I did was install 1055. I also installed SNAP,1mobile,and Amazon stores. First, for those people who think this is a seemless integration of Android onto BB10 forget about it. Of all the android apps I have purchased and installed over time (you can see this information on the real google play store) I could get about 20% to work and install properly on the Z10. THis is true regardless of which market or method I downloaded the APK from. The majority simply doen't load or initialize. If you are dependent on google services forget about it. If the program you are trying to load requires google's login services, the existing runtime is unable to deal with that and the program won't load. Im not sure why other programs also failed. Im also not sure why sometimes a program doesn't work but if you load a different version of that program it sometimes does. Also, interestingly, even with 1055 I had better luck loading APKs converted to BARS then APKs. Teamviewer computer remote control is the perfect example. I tried to load the APK. Wouldn't work. I converted the APK to a BAR and boom it worked. Not sure why.

    Performance wise there is a noticeable difference between the apps running on Z10 an a native android phone. Comparing it to for example a G2 the performance gap is very noticeable. Load times are about 1/10 of what they are on the z10 and there really is no comparison in terms of smoothness scrolling and frame rates. I would compare performance to something you would see in a Galaxy s2 or Atrix.
    Akshay Borkar likes this.
    12-08-13 10:41 AM
  10. Akshay Borkar's Avatar
    I Have to disagree with you on performance and the characterization of this runtime as something akin to a dual boot operating system. I just got a z10 during the 200 sale and the first thing I did was install 1055. I also installed SNAP,1mobile,and Amazon stores. First, for those people who think this is a seemless integration of Android onto BB10 forget about it. Of all the android apps I have purchased and installed over time (you can see this information on the real google play store) I could get about 20% to work and install properly on the Z10. THis is true regardless of which market or method I downloaded the APK from. The majority simply doen't load or initialize. If you are dependent on google services forget about it. If the program you are trying to load requires google's login services, the existing runtime is unable to deal with that and the program won't load. Im not sure why other programs also failed. Im also not sure why sometimes a program doesn't work but if you load a different version of that program it sometimes does. Also, interestingly, even with 1055 I had better luck loading APKs converted to BARS then APKs. Teamviewer computer remote control is the perfect example. I tried to load the APK. Wouldn't work. I converted the APK to a BAR and boom it worked. Not sure why.

    Performance wise there is a noticeable difference between the apps running on Z10 an a native android phone. Comparing it to for example a G2 the performance gap is very noticeable. Load times are about 1/10 of what they are on the z10 and there really is no comparison in terms of smoothness scrolling and frame rates. I would compare performance to something you would see in a Galaxy s2 or Atrix.
    That's really a very good point you mentioned here..!! Hopefully they will improve over it in next leak or the official one.. let's see..!!

    Posted via Dual OS Z10..!! B-)
    12-08-13 01:25 PM
  11. DStLouis's Avatar
    That's really a very good point you mentioned here..!! Hopefully they will improve over it in next leak or the official one.. let's see..!!

    Posted via Dual OS Z10..!! B-)
    Well it may not just need software improve then.
    BlackBerry haven't put the fasted possible CPU in the existing devices, which is not a must have to run smoothly BB OS10. But for Android...sound it is more on the must have side.
    We have something like 1.5, 1.7Ghz dual core in Z10, Z30. They've boost CPU power up to 1.9Ghz quad core in the S4 (Android 4.2.2). S3 was set with 1.5Ghz but running Android 4.0.

    Posted via CB10
    Akshay Borkar likes this.
    12-08-13 02:28 PM
  12. DStLouis's Avatar
    I Have to disagree with you on performance and the characterization of this runtime as something akin to a dual boot operating system. I just got a z10 during the 200 sale and the first thing I did was install 1055. I also installed SNAP,1mobile,and Amazon stores. First, for those people who think this is a seemless integration of Android onto BB10 forget about it. Of all the android apps I have purchased and installed over time (you can see this information on the real google play store) I could get about 20% to work and install properly on the Z10. THis is true regardless of which market or method I downloaded the APK from. The majority simply doen't load or initialize. If you are dependent on google services forget about it. If the program you are trying to load requires google's login services, the existing runtime is unable to deal with that and the program won't load. Im not sure why other programs also failed. Im also not sure why sometimes a program doesn't work but if you load a different version of that program it sometimes does. Also, interestingly, even with 1055 I had better luck loading APKs converted to BARS then APKs. Teamviewer computer remote control is the perfect example. I tried to load the APK. Wouldn't work. I converted the APK to a BAR and boom it worked. Not sure why.

    Performance wise there is a noticeable difference between the apps running on Z10 an a native android phone. Comparing it to for example a G2 the performance gap is very noticeable. Load times are about 1/10 of what they are on the z10 and there really is no comparison in terms of smoothness scrolling and frame rates. I would compare performance to something you would see in a Galaxy s2 or Atrix.
    If Google Play Store became accessible, would you still say that it's not much a seamless integration?

    Posted via CB10
    12-08-13 02:37 PM
  13. Akshay Borkar's Avatar
    Well it may not just need software improve then.
    BlackBerry haven't put the fasted possible CPU in the existing devices, which is not a must have to run smoothly BB OS10. But for Android...sound it is more on the must have side.
    We have something like 1.5, 1.7Ghz dual core in Z10, Z30. They've boost CPU power up to 1.9Ghz quad core in the S4 (Android 4.2.2). S3 was set with 1.5Ghz but running Android 4.0.

    Posted via CB10
    Imagine a quad-core cpu with Google login services integrated.. along with bb10 10.3 and android 4.4.. that would be like a perfect phone..!! * fingers crossed *

    Posted via Dual OS Z10..!! B-)
    12-08-13 03:42 PM
  14. Michael Bornstein's Avatar
    Couple of points. I think the processor is fine. I believe it's comparable to what is in the galaxy s3. So certainly on a native android phone it would run most things fine. As I use my z10 more I am getting more programs to run. Some run and load comparable to their counterparts on my android phone. Others much slower. I was stunned for example to use Snap to load Tango and boom it worked. Took a while to load but after it did I made a video call and it worked better than my android phone then I tried to load a simple game like strike force which has no Google integration but it wouldn't load. I'm not a software person so I have no reason or explanation for these inconsistencies.

    Finally I just have to say this. The keyboard on the z10 is absolutely KILLER. It is light years better than anything on android including Swift key. I may keep the phone for that reason alone
    Akshay Borkar likes this.
    12-08-13 07:37 PM
  15. heyjohnnybravo's Avatar
    I kinda agree with this.
    Its just like an OS with a virtual machine inside.
    But this one is different. This android runtime is meant to handle android apps only, (I think).

    Its pretty cool though

    Posted via CB10
    It's true. Phone calls and texts are not supported from launchers.

    It is quite nice though..i have my Nova Launcher on at all times and all my sideloads/APKs hanging out there

    I can't wait until BB10 develops visually as Android has over the years. Such potential but so many wrinkles to iron and glitter to glue on.
    Akshay Borkar likes this.
    12-08-13 11:36 PM
  16. mnc76's Avatar
    So I'm wondering about BlackBerry vs Android phone side by side performances.

    It's known that Android devices typically require more CPU relative to BB10 OS. Which CPU power may not be found high in BlackBerry devices.

    Apart of the initial load time, I know that running Android apps on my Z10 performs as much as on an Android device

    What about the emulation ?

    Posted via CB10
    Not sure I follow your question fully, specifically when you ask "What about the emulation ?". What is it about the 'emulation' you'd like to know.

    However, I'll note that BB10 does not actually 'emulate' Android any more than a dedicated Android phone 'emulates' Android.
    12-09-13 01:56 AM
  17. mnc76's Avatar
    I Have to disagree with you on performance and the characterization of this runtime as something akin to a dual boot operating system. I just got a z10 during the 200 sale and the first thing I did was install 1055. I also installed SNAP,1mobile,and Amazon stores. First, for those people who think this is a seemless integration of Android onto BB10 forget about it. Of all the android apps I have purchased and installed over time (you can see this information on the real google play store) I could get about 20% to work and install properly on the Z10. THis is true regardless of which market or method I downloaded the APK from. The majority simply doen't load or initialize. If you are dependent on google services forget about it. If the program you are trying to load requires google's login services, the existing runtime is unable to deal with that and the program won't load. Im not sure why other programs also failed. Im also not sure why sometimes a program doesn't work but if you load a different version of that program it sometimes does. Also, interestingly, even with 1055 I had better luck loading APKs converted to BARS then APKs. Teamviewer computer remote control is the perfect example. I tried to load the APK. Wouldn't work. I converted the APK to a BAR and boom it worked. Not sure why.

    Performance wise there is a noticeable difference between the apps running on Z10 an a native android phone. Comparing it to for example a G2 the performance gap is very noticeable. Load times are about 1/10 of what they are on the z10 and there really is no comparison in terms of smoothness scrolling and frame rates. I would compare performance to something you would see in a Galaxy s2 or Atrix.
    APK Failures
    People have found that almost no apps downloaded from Amazon seem to work, even though (very often) the same app downloaded from 1Mobile DOES work. So I'd try to re-download any apps that failed, but make sure you download them all from 1Mobile (or directly from Google Play using Evozi APK Downloader). I have no idea why baring one of your APKs made it work though! Also, for the failed apps: sometimes an app won't run until after the first initialization fails.

    BB10 Android Experience
    Long story short: it's clear that the Android experience on BB10 is not perfect. However, .1055 is a leak, and the Android runtime can only improve in future releases. But even if it does, we still won't have Play Services.

    BB10 Android Performance
    Comparing a Z10 to a G2 is not really a fair comparison. The hardware in the G2 is much more powerful than the Z10. A fair comparison would be the Galaxy S3 versus the Z10, since they both use the Qualcomm S4 Plus SOC with 2 GBs of RAM.

    Some Android apps seem to run slower on the Z10 than the S3, but there is no technical reason that prevents BlackBerry from improving their Android virtual machine to perform on par with the S3's Android virtual machine (again note, both phones use an Android virtual machine to run Android apps).

    However, some Android apps run FASTER on BB10 than on pure Android phones. CrackBerry's B1aize and others gave some examples:

    • Astro Boy Dash - Runs slow and sluggish on HTC One but runs fine on Z30 with 10.2.1 (However on Note II it runs fine)
    • GifBoom - Runs dreadfully on HTC One, runs fine on Z30 with 10.2.1.
    • Gunman Clive - Has weird lag on Note II, runs fine on Z30 with 10.2.1
    • Fitbit and Myfitnesspal - Lags on Galaxy S3 and Note 10.1 tab, runs smooth on Z10
    • fitocracy, RD client, shazam, kijiji - Runs better on Q10 then on Nexus 7

    I can add another: Google Maps - very very choppy on HTC One mini, runs better on Z10.
    Last edited by mnc76; 12-09-13 at 09:10 AM.
    DStLouis likes this.
    12-09-13 02:18 AM
  18. Akshay Borkar's Avatar
    Couple of points. I think the processor is fine. I believe it's comparable to what is in the galaxy s3. So certainly on a native android phone it would run most things fine. As I use my z10 more I am getting more programs to run. Some run and load comparable to their counterparts on my android phone. Others much slower. I was stunned for example to use Snap to load Tango and boom it worked. Took a while to load but after it did I made a video call and it worked better than my android phone then I tried to load a simple game like strike force which has no Google integration but it wouldn't load. I'm not a software person so I have no reason or explanation for these inconsistencies.

    Finally I just have to say this. The keyboard on the z10 is absolutely KILLER. It is light years better than anything on android including Swift key. I may keep the phone for that reason alone
    if any android app you loading.. be it in apk format or bar format. If the signatures of the app promote any particular android device.. or so.. BB10 won't accept it as BlackBerry is against promoting any devices other than their own..!! This is one of the major reason why few apps won't even install in apk.. and if you convert it in bar and install.. then either it will crash or just hang..!! And yes the keyboard is just amazing and with 1055 it has my local language too.. so typing on it was never this awesome..!!

    Posted via Dual OS Z10..!! B-)
    12-09-13 02:21 AM
  19. Akshay Borkar's Avatar
    It's true. Phone calls and texts are not supported from launchers.

    It is quite nice though..i have my Nova Launcher on at all times and all my sideloads/APKs hanging out there

    I can't wait until BB10 develops visually as Android has over the years. Such potential but so many wrinkles to iron and glitter to glue on.
    Patience... slow and steady wins the race..!!

    Posted via Dual OS Z10..!! B-)
    12-09-13 02:22 AM
  20. Akshay Borkar's Avatar
    APK Failures
    People have found that almost no apps downloaded from Amazon seem to work, even though (very often) the same app downloaded from 1Mobile DOES work. So I'd try to re-download any apps that failed, but make sure you download them all from 1Mobile (or directly from Google Play using Evozi APK Downloader). I have no idea why baring an APK made it work though! Also, for the failed apps: sometimes an app won't run until after the first initialization fails.

    BB10 Android Experience
    However, long story short: it's clear that the Android experience on BB10 is not perfect. However, .1055 is a leak, and the Android runtime can only improve in future releases. But even if it does, we still won't have Play Services.

    BB10 Android Performance
    Comparing a Z10 to a G2 is not really a fair comparison. The hardware in the G2 is much more powerful than the Z10. A fair comparison would be the Galaxy S3 versus the Z10, since they both use the Qualcomm S4 Plus SOC with 2 GBs of RAM.

    Some Android apps seem to run slower on the Z10 than the S3, but there is no technical reason that prevents BlackBerry from improving their Android virtual machine to perform on par with the S3's Android virtual machine (again note, both phones use an Android virtual machine to run Android apps).

    However, some Android apps run FASTER on BB10 than on pure Android phones. CrackBerry's B1aize and others gave some examples:

    • Astro Boy Dash - Runs slow and sluggish on HTC One but runs fine on Z30 with 10.2.1 (However on Note II it runs fine)
    • GifBoom - Runs dreadfully on HTC One, runs fine on Z30 with 10.2.1.
    • Gunman Clive - Has weird lag on Note II, runs fine on Z30 with 10.2.1
    • Fitbit and Myfitnesspal - Lags on Galaxy S3 and Note 10.1 tab, runs smooth on Z10
    • fitocracy, RD client, shazam, kijiji - Runs better on Q10 then on Nexus 7
    That's some research you did man.. hatsoff.. all we can do is just wait for the next leak or official release..!! Let's see how developers surprise us..!!


    Posted via Dual OS Z10..!! B-)
    12-09-13 02:32 AM
  21. Michael Bornstein's Avatar
    good points all. I finally got GMaps to work and it runs fine. Still can't log in but can certainly use it for navigation and search. Im finding more apps that are running fine. Still no as fast as Native but acceptable.
    Akshay Borkar likes this.
    12-09-13 09:24 AM
  22. Akshay Borkar's Avatar
    good points all. I finally got GMaps to work and it runs fine. Still can't log in but can certainly use it for navigation and search. Im finding more apps that are running fine. Still no as fast as Native but acceptable.
    glad we all could help..!! spread the word..!! BB needs our support..!!
    12-09-13 09:43 AM
  23. austriker's Avatar
    That is sick!! Nice work OP! If I ever get a second bb10 I'm going to go all out.

    Posted via CB10
    Akshay Borkar likes this.
    12-09-13 07:38 PM
  24. mnc76's Avatar
    good points all. I finally got GMaps to work and it runs fine. Still can't log in but can certainly use it for navigation and search. Im finding more apps that are running fine. Still no as fast as Native but acceptable.
    What version of GMaps? 6.14.4 runs extremely fast (native fast), but the 7.x versions run slower (but have more functionality and a better GUI than 6.14.4). Note that 6.14.4 is Gingerbread compatible (and hence runs on 10.1), but 7.x requires Android 4.0+ (and hence requires 10.2). I'm running 7.3 myself and am tempted to downgrade back to 6.14.4 for its speed. However, 7.3 is enough of an improvement over 6.14.4, that I will probably stick with it.

    Also, Google releases many many versions of GMaps 7.x. Each version is customized for specific phone specs. For example, some versions are optimized for phablets. Google Play automatically selects the most appropriate APK for your Android phone. However, since the Z10 and other BB10 phones are not officially supported by Google, it's possible for us to get APKs that are not tuned to our phone's unique specs (and may therefore not run as well as they could).
    Akshay Borkar likes this.
    12-10-13 05:57 AM
  25. Akshay Borkar's Avatar
    What version of GMaps? 6.14.4 runs extremely fast (native fast), but the 7.x versions run slower (but have more functionality and a better GUI than 6.14.4). Note that 6.14.4 is Gingerbread compatible (and hence runs on 10.1), but 7.x requires Android 4.0+ (and hence requires 10.2). I'm running 7.3 myself and am tempted to downgrade back to 6.14.4 for its speed. However, 7.3 is enough of an improvement over 6.14.4, that I will probably stick with it.

    Also, Google releases many many versions of GMaps 7.x. Each version is customized for specific phone specs. For example, some versions are optimized for phablets. Google Play automatically selects the most appropriate APK for your Android phone. However, since the Z10 and other BB10 phones are not officially supported by Google, it's possible for us to get APKs that are not tuned to our phone's unique specs (and may therefore not run as well as they could).
    I'm having 7.4 and it's working absolutely fine.. I installed it directly from snap.. I had created my GSF id from Nexus 4 with android 4.2.2 and had entered it in snap.. but new version of snap uses gsf id from z10 runtime itself.. so maybe this version of gmaps 7.4 is suitable for z10..just saying idk..coz I haven't logged in my Google account from maps.. you can give it a try if you want..!! Correct me if I'm wrong please..

    Posted via Dual OS Z10..!! B-)
    12-10-13 12:03 PM
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