[jhkluger]

This is a rant, rather than a question, about my KEYones. First, let me say that I really LOVE the phone from a design and software perspective. My only complaint is that I am now on my 6th phone with fatal hardware problems: 3 have had screen lifts; 1 had a defective PKB; 1 had a faulty speaker and today the Sim card is not being recognized (which is not the fault of the card, which works fine on my backup phone). I understand that there is a percentage of complicated technology devices that have hardware problems. A 100% failure rate on six phones is not a fluke, but a failure of build quality processes. What is the probability that TCL fixes this with the KEYtwo?

[the_boon]

Did you keep record of the build dates of each unit?

Apart from screen lift, it seems that May and June built models were prone to a few other hardware problems, namely loose keys, bad antennas, etc...

I'm only saying this because I feel like I see less threads complaining about the K1's hardware these days compared to last June/July.

As far as screen lifts go, July 10th and earlier is a no-go. Unless the screen was properly fixed.

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

I've seen some with 2nd or 3rd returned devices (reception,keyboard and of screen lift), and many still on their launch phone with no issues.... I don't own one so can't really comment on the "quality" of a device. And I realize that more folks are going to come here to complain than the praise a device.

But I doubt you'll see any "changes" in how TCL build phones... they are a struggling company that isn't in the premium smartphone business. Pretty sure they'll not make another screen lift mistake, but failure rate will be higher for lower cost components built on tighter budgets. Apple and Samsung have their issues too, even with all the care they take to make "premium" products.

If a PKB is a must for you, for now just hope of the best... an consider long term insurance.

[the_boon]

I've seen some with 2nd or 3rd returned devices (reception,keyboard and of screen lift), and many still on their launch phone with no issues.... I don't own one so can't really comment on the "quality" of a device. And I realize that more folks are going to come here to complain than the praise a device.

But I doubt you'll see any "changes" in how TCL build phones... they are a struggling company that isn't in the premium smartphone business. Pretty sure they'll not make another screen lift mistake, but failure rate will be higher for lower cost components built on tighter budgets. Apple and Samsung have their issues too, even with all the care they take to make "premium" products.

If a PKB is a must for you, for now just hope of the best... an consider long term insurance.

Also, buying at launch usually brings a higher risk. But then if no one wants to take the plunge, the phone can't succeed commercially.

To me, keyboard keys falling off is the worst hardware issue that can happen with a PKB. Those parts are easy to lose, and it makes the owner seem silly having paid such a price just to have that kind of thing happen. That's why I really really hope TCL goes for unibody one piece PKB for all their upcoming devices, just like the Priv and some older legacy BB7 devices

[anon(10268214)]

...they are a struggling company that isn't in the premium smartphone business.

You really should not conflate your theoretical projections regarding their financial situation with quality control issues. Don't forget, it was TCL's first run at what probably began as a half-baked BlackBerry design to begin with...

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

I don't know how done the design was.... people had seen it almost a year before, with those same specs. And we know it had been sitting on Chen desk for a good long time. What we don't know is how closely TCL copied their plans......

TCL Communications finical information, up until they went private (due to their business was in trouble) are public record. The sale of 49% of their business for a fraction of what it had been worth when they went private is pretty well documented. T And they still post product shipments, currently down 39% YoY - which last year it was down 30% YoY for the same period. TCL has had a rough two years from their high back in 2015. At one time they were a major vendor in China, but now they don't even rank.

It is true that they are partly owned by TCL Corporation that has been very successful in appliances and other electronics, and is worth billions. How that would help TCL Communications.... is unknown, as so far they haven't stepped in to help them much.

[brookie229]

This is a rant, rather than a question, about my KEYones. First, let me say that I really LOVE the phone from a design and software perspective. My only complaint is that I am now on my 6th phone with fatal hardware problems: 3 have had screen lifts; 1 had a defective PKB; 1 had a faulty speaker and today the Sim card is not being recognized (which is not the fault of the card, which works fine on my backup phone). I understand that there is a percentage of complicated technology devices that have hardware problems. A 100% failure rate on six phones is not a fluke, but a failure of build quality processes. What is the probability that TCL fixes this with the KEYtwo?

Let me just say this: I am in awe of your patience! I would have been long gone after #2.

[anon(10268214)]

I don't know how done the design was.... people had seen it almost a year before, with those same specs. And we know it had been sitting on Chen desk for a good long time. What we don't know is how closely TCL copied their plans......

TCL Communications finical information, up until they went private (due to their business was in trouble) are public record. The sale of 49% of their business for a fraction of what it had been worth when they went private is pretty well documented. T And they still post product shipments, currently down 39% YoY - which last year it was down 30% YoY for the same period. TCL has had a rough two years from their high back in 2015. At one time they were a major vendor in China, but now they don't even rank.

It is true that they are partly owned by TCL Corporation that has been very successful in appliances and other electronics, and is worth billions. How that would help TCL Communications.... is unknown, as so far they haven't stepped in to help them much.

Still, I'm not sure what you're trying to prove by conflating KEYone build quality and your investigative reporting on BBMo's financials. Both Google and Apple are facing class action lawsuits over their devices, Samsung had its Note 7 dumpster fire, etc. Obviously, even being a successful multi-billion dollar company at the highest level does not make a company immune.

I did own a KEYone...two in fact, and I thought the build quality was quite good. Certainly on par with any top notch OEM. I just wished they had used better quality components.

As for Chen, I don't believe anything he ever said about devices can be trusted...including the BS about the KEYone prototype. He spent at least the first few years of his tenure pretending BlackBerry was still in the phone business, while behind closed doors ripping it to pieces and firing thousands of people. Does anyone honestly believe during that time period he funded the development of a working prototype for a device that had no chance of getting built and sold by BlackBerry? PRIV was the last, and even then it was a botched rush job to get it out the door before the entire division was asked to pack their bags.

[the_boon]

Still, I'm not sure what you're trying to prove by conflating KEYone build quality and your investigative reporting on BBMo's financials. Both Google and Apple are facing class action lawsuits over their devices, Samsung had its Note 7 dumpster fire, etc. Obviously, even being a successful multi-billion dollar company at the highest level does not make a company immune.

I did own a KEYone...two in fact, and I thought the build quality was quite good. Certainly on par with any top notch OEM. I just wished they had used better quality components.

As for Chen, I don't believe anything he ever said about devices can be trusted...including the BS about the KEYone prototype. He spent at least the first few years of his tenure pretending BlackBerry was still in the phone business, while behind closed doors ripping it to pieces and firing thousands of people. Does anyone honestly believe during that time period he funded the development of a working prototype for a device that had no chance of getting built and sold by BlackBerry? PRIV was the last, and even then it was a botched rush job to get it out the door before the entire division was asked to pack their bags.

So why even go through the trouble of making the Priv? Why didn't he just cancel the project the day he was hired?

[anon(10268214)]

So why even go through the trouble of making the Priv? Why didn't he just cancel the project the day he was hired?

The PRIV was already well into development by the time he took over and it was also used as a pivot to Android. As we know, he obviously saw some value in trying to license the BlackBerry namesake. In order to do that he needed a vehicle to get him there. I don't doubt the KEYone had reached a certain level of development as a concept. Clearly the design has some BlackBerry lineage in its DNA. But did BlackBerry fund and produce a full-blown working prototype? I highly doubt it. By that time BlackBerry already had TCL busy boxing up DTEKs and the rest of the division had been sent packing. If such a prototype truly did exist, it is far more likely it was an early TCL built prototype, such as to prove they were worthy of the task. Lol.

[Chuck Finley69]

The PRIV was already well into development by the time he took over and it was also used as a pivot to Android. As we know, he obviously saw some value in trying to license the BlackBerry namesake. In order to do that he needed a vehicle to get him there. I don't doubt the KEYone had reached a certain level of development as a concept. Clearly the design has some BlackBerry lineage in its DNA. But did BlackBerry fund and produce a full-blown working prototype? I highly doubt it. By that time BlackBerry already had TCL busy boxing up DTEKs and the rest of the division had been sent packing. If such a prototype truly did exist, perhaps it was an early TCL prototype, such as to prove they were worthy of the task. Lol.

I believe the PRIV only began development after Chen joined BB. Perhaps someone else here remembers otherwise....

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

I believe the PRIV only began development after Chen joined BB. Perhaps someone else here remembers otherwise....

Pretty sure there was some plans for a Slider already.... I seem to remember someone posting some plans or something, along with info on moving to 64Bits. I was thinking that both the Z50 and a Slider would show up in 2014. But don't think they had advanced to making prototypes. Maybe it was designed around BB10, but i'd bet on it being an Android project from the beginning. BB10 development pretty much ended with the Passport. We were running 10.3 early summer of 2014.

[anon(10268214)]

I believe the PRIV only began development after Chen joined BB. Perhaps someone else here remembers otherwise....

Given what he did to the hardware division I highly doubt he personally authorized PRIV's development from scratch. Or the KEYone's development for that matter. There were no truly new devices under Chen...just rehashed versions of BB10 devices, the 'non-release' of the Z30, bringing an almost complete Passport to market, and finally allowing the PRIV to continue as a bridge to the licensing strategy / Android and onward to TCL and the DTEKs etc.

[Chuck Finley69]

Pretty sure there was some plans for a Slider already.... I seem to remember someone posting some plans or something, along with info on moving to 64Bits. I was thinking that both the Z50 and a Slider would show up in 2014. But don't think they had advanced to making prototypes. Maybe it was designed around BB10, but i'd bet on it being an Android project from the beginning. BB10 development pretty much ended with the Passport. We were running 10.3 early summer of 2014.

I'm referring to Android device. Chen joined end of 2013. There was no Android device in development when Chen joined.

[Carjackd]

I'm referring to Android device. Chen joined end of 2013. There was no Android device in development when Chen joined.

This is correct. It was still only bb10

[anon(10268214)]

This is correct. It was still only bb10

Yes but they changed their mind to full Android midway. PRIV was going to be BB10 initially. And if you want to talk BB10 only...even the ART / Amazon Appstore brought to BB10 during Chen's tenure could be seen as a bridge to Android and also part of that overall transition.