QNX 7 powers TWO SnapDragon SoCs in Land Rover 2020 Defender.
- I wonder if the need to be *nix like constrained what could be done with microkernels. So much hasn't been done due to entrenched tech (incl. knowledge) which makes the cost of replacement prohibitive.. IoT could be an excuse to rethink things more fundamental than the transition from the combustion engine to electric -- more like steam engine to electric engine.
We really are entrenched.
Most of the real product and engineering work (not research projects) in the world happens layers up from the kernel.03-19-20 11:13 PMLike 0 - I wonder if the need to be *nix like constrained what could be done with microkernels. So much hasn't been done due to entrenched tech (incl. knowledge) which makes the cost of replacement prohibitive.. IoT could be an excuse to rethink things more fundamental than the transition from the combustion engine to electric -- more like steam engine to electric engine.
We really are entrenched.03-19-20 11:21 PMLike 0 -
Bottom line is QNX is a proprietary OS that BlackBerry tightly controls.... but BlackBerry hasn't got the resources to take it beyond what they are doing in Automotive and maybe a little IoT. Tiny company struggling to gain any traction in ESS. A few years from now if they hit it big, maybe they'll have some extra cash to throw at QNX.
If you want the whole software world to change... you need to back a more open solution.co4nd likes this.03-20-20 10:06 AMLike 1 -
And if you or I want to introduce something new to QNX and collaborate with others on our new work, how do we do that?03-20-20 10:32 AMLike 0 - How about replacing persistent storage with DRM which will provide much more granular control of IP. It should be generalized to work for business IP as well as personal IP. If I want to send pictures from my mirrorless camera (or handset) I can be assured that only my family can see it. I would only need to send it to one family member who would forward it to others. I shouldn't have to provide any more authentication than watching Netflix. The OS would embed into the file the DRM requirements. In a sense it would be a distributed networked ACL. Now, consider how the granular control of DRM can be extended to work with a DBMS. Much harder than extending this abstraction to streaming media. Think how much persistent storage needs to be rethought for this to work.
You will say this functionality should be implemented in an app with an API. If this were done in the OS how much simpler would app implementations be? Some apps may not need to be modified at all. Of course some OSes like Windows allow for installable file systems. So, adding support to third party platforms may be in the form of replacements or extensions even on Linux. I am not sure how restricted the APIes are for extensible file systems on these OSes. QNX seems to make adding APIs easier than those.03-21-20 06:12 PMLike 0 - Every single operating system in the past 50 years has had a pluggable filesystem. All modern OSes support multiple filesystems concurrently. All of them. And they all support encrypted filestores.
In fact what you just described is how iMessage works, and the crypto you describe that drives that is implemented in iOS (and in the hardware of Apple products)
In your scheme, How will your family members authenticate and authorize access?03-21-20 08:27 PMLike 0 - Actually, the question should be how are people authorized to gain access? This should work with IoT and for businesses. Imagine a scenario which applies to a Hollywood production from the time a script is acquired, through production (and script rewrites), delivery to theaters and finally streaming. This would require rethinking how the stack works, if you are interested in keeping complexity down. Of course doing it at the app layer would provide you the opportunity to proliferate proprietary APIs of all kinds.
Just to bring this back to handsets. If you consider handsets being an amalgamation of IoT features (e.g. sensors like GPS, compass, etc.) and the company wants to be in IoT how would a handset's software stack be designed so the pieces are applicable to less feature rich IoT devices. You would want a system which can easily be pulled apart and recombined and provide a well integrated whole.Last edited by DonHB; 03-23-20 at 04:27 PM.
03-23-20 04:15 PMLike 0 - Yeah, that's exactly what I asked. When families share data in your scenario, how do you authorize access? You restated the question but I didn't see your answer. How specifically would you do this? And how would it be different from how we *already* do this on PC's and phones. [Hint: I do this in iMessage every time I share a picture]03-23-20 05:52 PMLike 0
- Yeah, that's exactly what I asked. When families share data in your scenario, how do you authorize access? You restated the question but I didn't see your answer. How specifically would you do this? And how would it be different from how we *already* do this on PC's and phones. [Hint: I do this in iMessage every time I share a picture]03-23-20 08:57 PMLike 0
- Yeah, that's exactly what I asked. When families share data in your scenario, how do you authorize access? You restated the question but I didn't see your answer. How specifically would you do this? And how would it be different from how we *already* do this on PC's and phones. [Hint: I do this in iMessage every time I share a picture]03-25-20 04:56 PMLike 0
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- It should be harder to send something to someone by mistake than to someone I wish to receive the content. If I somehow manage to get it delivered it should be destroyed upon attempts to copy it (or open it). I should also be able to leave it to a legitimate recipient to decide if someone should also receive it and this be authorized without this intermediary having to ask me (but certain criteria need to be met) for approval. This criteria should be applicable across apps. It should be less complicated than MS Windows permissions yet have more granular control and work across unaffiliated networks: nothing like Active Directory or a VPN should be required.03-25-20 05:37 PMLike 0
- It should be harder to send something to someone by mistake than to someone I wish to receive the content. If I somehow manage to get it delivered it should be destroyed upon attempts to copy it (or open it). I should also be able to leave it to a legitimate recipient to decide if someone should also receive it and this be authorized without this intermediary having to ask me (but certain criteria need to be met) for approval. This criteria should be applicable across apps. It should be less complicated than MS Windows permissions yet have more granular control and work across unaffiliated networks: nothing like Active Directory or a VPN should be required.
- For the control to be complete, the app has to be aware of the control. Does that make sense? Otherwise the app can't enforce the control. if the OS hides this, then the app ends up with a normal picture and is then free to share it normally, which totally breaks the control. So the app has to be aware of protected content and then have the APIs it needs to display or share or edit or even create that content with the controls in place.
- There are several other projects/systems that address this type of DRM. Since people share content across multiple operating systems already, any DRM system has to be supported in all the OSes that people actually use. Would you agree?03-25-20 05:54 PMLike 0 - If this is done at the OS level it will be far easier to use for all customers including developers. Some classes of apps my not need to be aware of the control, but the control needs to be maintained nonetheless. If done at the level of the OS it could be a distributed instead of a centralized solution that supports the apps on alternative OSes. These differences can be a selling point of the OS. This suggests that other OSes should be supported and this difference in "flow" could be exploited in marketing. It is also possible for certain features (or sensitive content) to be withheld because privacy concerns on certain platforms.03-25-20 09:09 PMLike 0
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- If this is done at the OS level it will be far easier to use for all customers including developers. Some classes of apps my not need to be aware of the control, but the control needs to be maintained nonetheless. If done at the level of the OS it could be a distributed instead of a centralized solution that supports the apps on alternative OSes. These differences can be a selling point of the OS. This suggests that other OSes should be supported and this difference in "flow" could be exploited in marketing. It is also possible for certain features (or sensitive content) to be withheld because privacy concerns on certain platforms.
Let’s take a picture for example. If an app that is unaware of the control opens a picture, then it has the picture and can display the picture to the user. If it can display the picture to the user then it also has the ability to transmit same picture (without controls) over the net, and to any other non-secure means. Remember you’re talking about apps that are totally unaware of the controls and so will blissfully do anything with the actual bits of the content.
If you think that apps that are unaware of the control should simply not have access to display the sensitive content, then all you’ve invented is a cryptography library, which has existed on almost all operating systems for the past 80 years.
And you also totally glossed over the identity management piece of this. When you realize you have to manage the identity of the users and roles who have access to the content, then you will realize you have to have a bag of keys somewhere, with a different key for each authorized user or group of users and you have to be able to distribute said keys as needed to multiple users on multiple systems.
And if you now turn this into some argument about distributed work at the *kernel* level, I’m going to roll my eyes pretty hard.
The idea you have is interesting, but remember it’s been worked on for many decades now. Snap, for example, originally built a business around a very similar idea if you think about it.eshropshire likes this.03-25-20 11:27 PMLike 1 -
- No, the idea is to make the IP available only to whom the IP owner decides. It should scale from protecting a family photograph to a Hollywood film or software. It should also be able to manage change in ownership. It could have at least as much impact as a widely adopted OS (and its API). What is interesting is that some have claimed that blockchain is not suitable for implementing DRM.03-26-20 12:18 PMLike 0
- No, the idea is to make the IP available only to whom the IP owner decides. It should scale from protecting a family photograph to a Hollywood film or software. It should also be able to manage change in ownership. It could have at least as much impact as a widely adopted OS (and its API). What is interesting is that some have claimed that blockchain is not suitable for implementing DRM.Eumaeus likes this.03-26-20 12:31 PMLike 1
- No, the idea is to make the IP available only to whom the IP owner decides. It should scale from protecting a family photograph to a Hollywood film or software. It should also be able to manage change in ownership. It could have at least as much impact as a widely adopted OS (and its API). What is interesting is that some have claimed that blockchain is not suitable for implementing DRM.
QNX and BB10 bring nothing more to this problem than any other OS. OTOH, the other OSes bring a lot more users, which means a lot more users with whom you can share content. A system like this is pointless without users.03-26-20 12:37 PMLike 0 - No, the idea is to make the IP available only to whom the IP owner decides. It should scale from protecting a family photograph to a Hollywood film or software. It should also be able to manage change in ownership. It could have at least as much impact as a widely adopted OS (and its API). What is interesting is that some have claimed that blockchain is not suitable for implementing DRM.
Has nothing to do with BlackBerry....03-26-20 03:45 PMLike 0 - yes, it's an interesting idea and one that the world probably needs and one that many people have worked on. You should go work on that. Find an existing project and contribute to it.
QNX and BB10 bring nothing more to this problem than any other OS. OTOH, the other OSes bring a lot more users, which means a lot more users with whom you can share content. A system like this is pointless without users.
The big challenge is striking a balance in a company between people who need access to data to get their work done and IT needs/legal requirements to secure the data for proper protection. If IT makes accessing and using data too hard for people to get their work accomplished then 'shadow IT' appears in companies. Workers need to be able to access the right data, at the right time, in the right places using the right methods/controls. With Covid-19 and many working from home this is more critical today. At the same time IT must protect a companies most valuable data assets. Today failure to do so can result in massive fines.
I could write for hours about this topic. My statement above is a very overly simplified explanation of the challenges. I see absolutely no usage of QNX of BB10 in solving this problem. They bring nothing to the table.03-26-20 05:27 PMLike 0 -
That BlackBerry owns QNX combined with its other IP is the reason the company should invest in using QNX tech. By judiciously choosing a handset's SoC it could impact, in partnership with Qualcomm and Samsung, the direction of chipsets in both IoT and automotive. Would it make sense for a SoC to migrate from handsets to automotive and finally to IoT? When would it make sense for 5G to migrate to IoT? It may make more sense than 4G. Samsung has 5G modems.
Finally, the question you don't answer and no-one arguing against my proposition does is whether QNX-7 architecturally makes these things more difficult to implement than Linux (the migration of the underlying SoC to automotive and then to IoT should mitigate the driver availability difficulties). Remember, part of what QNX touts is its POSIX compatibility. What I am suggesting isn't compatible with Linux either. From a business perspective, should a solution it created, that brings DRM to the Gig economy, be OSS?Last edited by DonHB; 03-27-20 at 05:23 PM.
03-27-20 05:06 PMLike 0
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QNX 7 powers TWO SnapDragon SoCs in Land Rover 2020 Defender.
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