[Jason Page]

im just gonna play the waiting game. what else can one do? If I win the lottery id start the phone wing of Page Telegram. first phone will do everything a NeXTCube be designed to do having just the 16mb of RAM, hell yay! im sick of this crazy bloat market place where the next big attraction is whether phone has 4 cameras packed with pixel peeping garbage data through interpolation, great at pictures but functions less as a phone. what the heck?

[markmall]

im just gonna play the waiting game. what else can one do? If I win the lottery id start the phone wing of Page Telegram. first phone will do everything a NeXTCube be designed to do having just the 16mb of RAM, hell yay! im sick of this crazy bloat market place where the next big attraction is whether phone has 4 cameras packed with pixel peeping garbage data through interpolation, great at pictures but functions less as a phone. what the heck?

How about a phone with multiple antennas that never dropped a call instead of multiple cameras?

Posted via CB10

[Hazo]

"BB's hardened version of Android" is a hoax. It's just a launcher and app suite (that they barely update).

Posted via CB10

Well, you certainly are entitled to your OPINION, so I'm curious what facts you have to back it up.

[Jason Page]

How about a phone with multiple antennas that never dropped a call instead of multiple cameras?

Posted via CB10

And 90% battery per volume!

I'm ok with a THICK phone, hell they easier to grab and hold anyhow.

Phone markets these days exhibit serious mental illness of anorexia where you have to install those rear phone stands for any kind of "love handles."

[Jason Page]

The Bold/Curve form factor and function of phones were the perfect balance between function and smarts that is ultimately missing with smart phones today.

I remember the BB OS7 had a black and white option which was way cool, because too much saturation over-sensation hurts the visual cortex and is cause for distractability and loss of mental function. BBOS was a beautiful design for being simple yet having been stocked with extensive functions that not even Android phones come OEM.

When it comes to phone smarts, I'm thinking the development should be married to the idea of "keep it as simple as possible, but no simpler"

[conite]

The Bold/Curve form factor and function of phones were the perfect balance between function and smarts that is ultimately missing with smart phones today.

I remember the BB OS7 had a black and white option which was way cool, because too much saturation over-sensation hurts the visual cortex and is cause for distractability and loss of mental function. BBOS was a beautiful design for being simple yet having been stocked with extensive functions that not even Android phones come OEM.

When it comes to phone smarts, I'm thinking the development should be married to the idea of "keep it as simple as possible, but no simpler"

There is no point trying to redevelop (from scratch) some archaic java code to work on modern hardware.

There is nothing BBOS can do that a current, in-development OS can't.

[Chuck Finley69]

This would take someone with much more marketing acumen than current top management. Many have postulated this but are not well received in these forums, IMO.

Posted via CB10

The reality is that nobody has the economic resources to displace the Android/IOS with something earth shattering like free devices. If BB10 had anything really worthwhile then Microsoft surely would have purchased or could still purchase. It would be as I’ve repeated before, loose change in the old Gates family couch. Not the main couch in the family room. The old couch now in the man cave.

[bb10adopter111]

No one needs a new OS. I just want Android to support a better UX. I've given up on Apple completely. If they cared about an efficient UI they would have built it already. iOS is best for use by people who really don't need desktop business functionality from their phone. It's gotten incrementally better, but it's still a terrible device for switching quickly between 3 or more tasks, and data interoperability across apps is almost non-existent.

Once you're inside an app, of course, all platforms are the same. And Apple hardware is very good, so I see why people like them, and, used correctly, they support privacy and security better than Android for the average user.

But the inability to escape Apple's lock-ins and optimize the UI is a deal-breaker for me.



Posted with my trusty Z10

[Jason Page]

There is no point trying to redevelop (from scratch) some archaic java code to work on modern hardware.

There is nothing BBOS can do that a current, in-development OS can't.

You are forgetting the bloat factor involved, with seemingly Moore's law type gains in available resources/speeds often the market looses sight in cumbersome bloated software. Efficiency with modern platforms is only given the grace of faster hardware....it does not make things better in the long run.

[conite]

You are forgetting the bloat factor involved, with seemingly Moore's law type gains in available resources/speeds often the market looses sight in cumbersome bloated software. Efficiency with modern platforms is only given the grace of faster hardware....it does not make things better in the long run.

But that's just nonsense.

You can develop a working OS implementation from an existing code base. Look at Android in the Punkt. There is no bloat, and it runs on very minimal hardware.

Why start with something that has no drivers for any current hardware available in the world? You'd be starting tens of millions of dollars in the hole.

[Jason Page]

If there is an Android base that addresses the bloat concern, something with a minimal foot print of about 40mb, I'd consider thinking about finding a team willing to build on that.

And of course, something that doesn't "dial home" 4,000 times a day would be ideal. I have to install a firewall to stop that from happening (more bloat.) I feel like this kin to layering thick and heavy band-aids everywhere there is some leakage with the current Android options I'm aware of, adding to the overhead.

[Jason Page]

But that's just nonsense.

You can develop a working OS implementation from an existing code base. Look at Android in the Punkt. There is no bloat, and it runs on very minimal hardware.

Why start with something that has no drivers for any current hardware available in the world? You'd be starting tens of millions of dollars in the hole.

I do not know what is possible with Android base as far as my concerns being addressed.

[conite]

If there is an Android base that addresses the bloat concern, something with a minimal foot print of about 40mb, I'd consider thinking about finding a team willing to build on that.

And of course, something that doesn't "dial home" 4,000 times a day would be ideal. I have to install a firewall to stop that from happening (more bloat.) I feel like this kin to layering thick and heavy band-aids everywhere there is some leakage with the current Android options I'm aware of, adding to the overhead.

You're confusing Android with Google Services.

And why would you care about the footprint, as long as it performs well. Memory is cheap.

[bb10adopter111]

But that's just nonsense.

You can develop a working OS implementation from an existing code base. Look at Android in the Punkt. There is no bloat, and it runs on very minimal hardware.

Why start with something that has no drivers for any current hardware available in the world? You'd be starting tens of millions of dollars in the hole.

^^This

The core Android OS is the best platform out there for building systems on today's mobile hardware. There's no reason to reinvent the wheel when it comes to drivers as the costs and complexity would skyrocket.

Posted with my trusty Z10

[Jason Page]

You're confusing Android with Google Services.

And why would you care about the footprint, as long as it performs well. Memory is cheap.

Memory being cheap is no excuse. Being as it may, Android OS maybe the only viability than to reinvent the wheel so to speak.

I appreciate your input. I have not looked at the M02 yet as far as footprint and capabilities with hardware. I'll ask an engineer friend some questions as he's working on related stuff, from this once I get back in Chicago (Dec 5th: been taking care of my mother last 7 months.)

[conite]

Memory being cheap is no excuse.

And a low footprint strictly for the sake of a low footprint is pointless.

[Jason Page]

Not pointless from perspective of art. Otherwise it's a dog-pile!

Eventually the dog-pile will catch up to us effecting user-ability and getting in the way of function as well as uncertainty of all sorts of security concerns.

The point has been made clear so far that the onset of the mainstream phones interfere with work. I know folks in the corporate and banking environments that used Bold 9900 exclusively and some still do with the BES setup; so many concerns come up with suggestion of iOS or Android phones in replacing the old BBOS phones in the business environment.

For me, feels like a pill of spaghetti, not being able to keep tabs on what's doing what with these modern Android phones.

The other issue is all this battery drain. I loved the BBOS Facebook app when it worked. It was a very small program under 2mb and was nowhere near the battery and data drain that the Android Facebook App is today. There are HTML wrappers out there as apps however nothing compared to the BBOS FB app by RIM.

[conite]

Not pointless from perspective of art. Otherwise it's a dog-pile!

Eventually the dog-pile will catch up to us effecting user-ability and getting in the way of function as well as uncertainty of all sorts of security concerns.

The point has been made clear so far that the onset of the mainstream phones interfere with work. I know folks in the corporate and banking environments that used Bold 9900 exclusively and some still do with the BES setup; so many concerns come up with suggestion of iOS or Android phones in replacing the old BBOS phones in the business environment.

For me, feels like a pill of spaghetti, not being able to keep tabs on what's doing what with these modern Android phones.

The other issue is all this battery drain. I loved the BBOS Facebook app when it worked. It was a very small program under 2mb and was nowhere near the battery and data drain that the Android Facebook App is today. There are HTML wrappers out there as apps however nothing compared to the BBOS FB app by RIM.

Now you're conflating code base and implementation.

The Punkt MP02 is an Android device that can only make calls, text, and run a few custom productivity tools. And it does so on extremely low-end hardware.

[Jason Page]

I'd be interested to know if you can aggregate playstore apps to those that work on a concept device, without having to start a separate store (ie Amazon App Store) or is there a device category restriction you can add to Play Store to only list the apps deemed working on such concept device.

I do not want to device to have to fit all the apps. Rather have the apps fit the device.

[conite]

I'd be interested to know if you can aggregate playstore apps to those that work on a concept device, without having to start a separate store (ie Amazon App Store) or is there a device category restriction you can add to Play Store to only list the apps deemed working on such concept device.

I do not want to device to have to fit all the apps. Rather have the apps fit the device.

Just incorporate an app whitelist feature in the OS.

[Chuck Finley69]

Not pointless from perspective of art. Otherwise it's a dog-pile!

Eventually the dog-pile will catch up to us effecting user-ability and getting in the way of function as well as uncertainty of all sorts of security concerns.

The point has been made clear so far that the onset of the mainstream phones interfere with work. I know folks in the corporate and banking environments that used Bold 9900 exclusively and some still do with the BES setup; so many concerns come up with suggestion of iOS or Android phones in replacing the old BBOS phones in the business environment.

For me, feels like a pill of spaghetti, not being able to keep tabs on what's doing what with these modern Android phones.

The other issue is all this battery drain. I loved the BBOS Facebook app when it worked. It was a very small program under 2mb and was nowhere near the battery and data drain that the Android Facebook App is today. There are HTML wrappers out there as apps however nothing compared to the BBOS FB app by RIM.

I’m a a regulated finance guy that you speak of. The regulators have required that institutions move away from BBOS and BB10 through private and security regulations. Secure and private six years ago is not today. The FDIC, SIPC, FINRA, SEC and DOL are constantly forcing upgrades through requirements like REG SP and similar regs.

[Jason Page]

I’m a a regulated finance guy that you speak of. The regulators have required that institutions move away from BBOS and BB10 through private and security regulations. Secure and private six years ago is not today. The FDIC, SIPC, FINRA, SEC and DOL are constantly forcing upgrades through requirements like REG SP and similar regs.

Upgrades to what? One person I know worked for a major bank institution and he can only use the BB 9900 for phone calls, was restricted from even receiving text. And it was the only phone he could use. Last I met with him was a little over a year ago, he was still using the 9900 then.

[Chuck Finley69]

Upgrades to what? One person I know worked for a major bank institution and he can only use the BB 9900 for phone calls, was restricted from even receiving text. And it was the only phone he could use. Last I met with him was a little over a year ago, he was still using the 9900 then.

That’s an employer restriction on corporate device by an employer that obviously is still living in 2007-2012 through ignorance and ineptitude.

By regulation, any phone call is to be made from company or personal hardware that if observed through caller ID must display actual company name, actual personal name or marked private so as not to mislead person on the other end as to identity.

Text messages and emails are treated as written communication and must be archived according to published regulations by SEC and mirrored by FINRA including 24/7 regulator access through system portals.

All internal and external apps have to meet regulatory guidelines which is why institutions are typically minimum 4.4 ART or certain features aren’t offered resulting in a 2013 customer experience in a 2018 environment.

[bb10adopter111]

That’s an employer restriction on corporate device by an employer that obviously is still living in 2007-2012 through ignorance and ineptitude.

By regulation, any phone call is to be made from company or personal hardware that if observed through caller ID must display actual company name, actual personal name or marked private so as not to mislead person on the other end as to identity.

Text messages and emails are treated as written communication and must be archived according to published regulations by SEC and mirrored by FINRA including 24/7 regulator access through system portals.

All internal and external apps have to meet regulatory guidelines which is why institutions are typically minimum 4.4 ART or certain features aren’t offered resulting in a 2013 customer experience in a 2018 environment.

None of those requirements would prohibit someone using email on a BBOS device, and the called ID function can be managed through the carrier on a corporate account.

But there are many other functions that a BBOS phone would likely not support.

Posted with my trusty Z10

[Chuck Finley69]

None of those requirements would prohibit someone using email on a BBOS device, and the called ID function can be managed through the carrier on a corporate account.

But there are many other functions that a BBOS phone would likely not support.

Posted with my trusty Z10

No, that’s correct. I’m merely stating that solutions long ago moved past BBOS and it’s limitations.