1. Blackberry_Boss's Avatar
    Why isn't BlackBerry reaching out to Tesla. I'm sure they need qnx or some security inside those Tesla cars. Those bad boys are nice by the way, I got to test drive 1 a week ago.

    Posted By My BeastBerry
    04-24-15 02:34 PM
  2. Ment's Avatar
    Tesla uses a Linux based system and Musk is good friends with Google peeps so they'll probably go Android Auto if they use anyone outside.
    04-24-15 02:51 PM
  3. Blackberry_Boss's Avatar
    Ahhh didn't know he was in good with Google.

    Posted By My BeastBerry
    04-24-15 06:45 PM
  4. Ment's Avatar
    Ahhh didn't know he was in good with Google.

    Posted By My BeastBerry
    Google almost bought them 2 years ago, but then Tesla took off and Musk didn't need Google's deep pockets anymore.
    04-24-15 06:50 PM
  5. prplhze2000's Avatar
    Tesla is a house of cards. Without government help, it doesn't exist

    Posted via CB10
    04-24-15 10:43 PM
  6. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    Tesla is a house of cards. Without government help, it doesn't exist.
    Nice try, but Tesla paid back its government loans 10 years early.

    Tesla Pays Off Its $465 Million 'Loser' Loan - Businessweek
    Last edited by Troy Tiscareno; 04-25-15 at 01:40 AM.
    jmr1015, mmcfly23, bp2k7 and 2 others like this.
    04-24-15 11:22 PM
  7. dguy123's Avatar
    Tesla uses a Linux based system and Musk is good friends with Google peeps so they'll probably go Android Auto if they use anyone outside.
    'cept android auto isn't android in the car. It's the android phone projecting onto the car's hmi. No android phone, no android auto in your car. It's Google's analog of Apple's car play.

    I won't be surprised if Google goes native in cars at some point (no phone required) but I haven't seen any indications of this yet.

    Posted via CB10
    04-24-15 11:36 PM
  8. Ment's Avatar
    'cept android auto isn't android in the car. It's the android phone projecting onto the car's hmi. No android phone, no android auto in your car. It's Google's analog of Apple's car play.

    I won't be surprised if Google goes native in cars at some point (no phone required) but I haven't seen any indications of this yet.

    Posted via CB10
    Thats exactly where Google is going. Of course the first gens will be based on the phone just like Carplay is, but the Open Automotive Alliance will eventually have some version of Android inside the car. I assume given the friendly relations that Musk has that if Tesla wanted they'd be the first in line to co-develop such a venture.
    04-25-15 12:26 AM
  9. prplhze2000's Avatar
    They paid back Nevada?

    Posted via CB10
    04-25-15 07:07 AM
  10. byex's Avatar
    Nice try, but Tesla paid back its government loans 10 years early.

    Tesla Pays Off Its $465 Million 'Loser' Loan - Businessweek
    Don't know how accurate this is

    Teslas announcement that it had paid back its government loan made it sound like at least one of Obamas crony capitalist Green Energy boondoggles was working the way it was supposed to.



    Finally at least one green energy company wasnt drinking the blood of taxpayers in its corporate offices and was actually making money selling things. It was the dawn of a new age.

    Except it wasnt.

    The latest round of Tesla wonderment came when it reported its first quarterly profit earlier this month. TSLA stock darned near doubled in a week.* Musk then borrowed $150 million from Goldman Sachs (shocking!) and floated a cool billion in new stock and long-term debt.* Thats how wethe taxpayerswere repaid.

    Tesla didnt generate a profit by selling sexy cars, but rather by selling sleazy emissions credits, mandated by the state of Californias electric vehicle requirements.* The competition, like Honda,* doesnt have a mass market plug-in to meet the mandate and therefore must buy the credits from Tesla, the only company that does. The bill for last quarter was $68 million.

    Absent this shakedown of potential car buyers, Tesla would have lost $57 million, or $11,400 per car. As the company sold 5,000 cars in the quarter, though, $13,600 per car was paid by other manufacturers, who are going to pass at least some of that cost on to buyers of their products. Folks in the new car market are likely paying a bit more than simply the direct tax subsidy.

    Tesla isnt actually making money selling cars. Its making money from crony capitalist taxes of people who buy cars from other companies. And even the customers who buy its cars get paid with taxpayer money.

    First, theres the $7500 taxback bonus that every buyer gets and every taxpayer pays.* Then there are generous state subsidies ($2500 in California, $4000 in Illinoisthe bluer the state, the more the taxpayers get gouged), all paid to people forking out $63K (plus taxes) for the base version, to roughly $100K for the really quick one.

    Tesla is still turning a profit, not from customers, but from money being seized from taxpayers to compensate its customers for buying Tesla.

    http://www.frontpagemag.com/2013/dgr...rom-taxpayers/


    Posted via CB10
    SlcCorrado likes this.
    04-25-15 10:16 AM
  11. prplhze2000's Avatar
    They got a real sweet package from Nevada. See WSJ editorial on it did a good job of pointing out the goodies.


    Look up editorial Nevada gets Mucked or something like that. Around $1 billion package

    Posted via CB10
    04-25-15 11:22 AM
  12. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    No doubt all that is true... and I don't like many of those subsidies and bogus "carbon credit" crap anymore than you do, but the fact is that the various states have passed those laws, and they apply to all car companies. Musk is no ***** - he's going to take advantage of every way he can to sell more cars, just like ANY business owner would. He didn't create those rules, so if they make you upset (and they probably should), blame your legislators, not the entrepreneurs who utilize them. It's no different than Apple or Google or Microsoft or Exxon or Chevron keeping foreign-generated profits outside the US to avoid paying taxes on them - those tax rules were around before the tech companies in question even existed, so you can't blame them for legally manipulating their own money to avoid as many taxes as possible.

    The money Tesla made here aren't "government loans", which is what was originally stated. They are legal tax credits. Big difference - you can't default on paying back a tax credit - like Solyndra or Fisker.

    The solar industry in California is booming too, and in large part due to the 30% state subsidy. Where are the complaints that the solar companies "wouldn't exist" without that government money? It's nothing new, and the fact is that Musk did in fact pay back his loans - 10 years early. He's also expanding his model line-up and could have sold many more cars than he did if he only had them to sell. It isn't easy building a whole new car company from scratch, much less one that uses a ton of brand-new technology. Musk is amazing, and history will back that up.
    Superdupont 2_0 and bp2k7 like this.
    04-25-15 11:24 AM
  13. jhanks64's Avatar
    There are also a lot of states that are lobbied by the Auto Dealers Association to prevent Tesla from selling cars there. They don't like the Direct to Consumer model and some states have passed anti-consumer laws that prevent Tesla from selling there. What a load of BS, it's the buyers decision to purchase whatever car they wish.

    New Jersey and Texas are two that I have heard of and they supposedly are pro-capitalism.
    bp2k7 likes this.
    04-25-15 04:47 PM
  14. TheBirdDog's Avatar
    I'm not going to pretend to be nearly educated enough on any of this, though I should be, I know.

    But from the sounds of things' Tesla is probably plenty busy enough and so is BlackBerry. As awesome as it would be for BlackBerry to get in there, it's not going to generate a ton more revenue for them. They have other areas to focus their efforts.

    And Tesla, well, it doesn't sound like they are doing anything wrong with subsidies and tax credits. Any way that they can get the government to sway people away from crude oil in any capacity is a good one.

    Green energy tax credits are what we need to see more and more of. And, if you're worried about where the money is coming from, it should come from increased tax to anything that isn't as 'green'. If someone who buys an electric car gets a tax credit of 7500 dollars, someone who buys a Hummer should be charged a premium of that same amount. I don't think that it should be coming directly from taxpayers.

    Posted via my BlackBerry Passport
    04-25-15 04:59 PM
  15. NamelessStar's Avatar
    which the best part is still qnx under so they are in no matter what

    Edit: quote was not picked up

    Tesla uses a Linux based system and Musk is good friends with Google peeps so they'll probably go Android Auto if they use anyone outside.
    Last edited by NamelessStar; 04-26-15 at 04:01 AM.
    04-25-15 05:18 PM
  16. prplhze2000's Avatar
    I'm just saying tesla is making it because of government help. Period. I know what tax credits are, historic, new market, etc.

    Posted via CB10
    04-25-15 05:48 PM
  17. jmr1015's Avatar
    I'd rather tax money be put towards companies like Tesla instead of given away to countries that hate us through foreign aid packages and overspending on defense and given to illegal immigrants through welfare and free health care and education and housing and giving tax breaks to big oil when they're making record profits.
    bp2k7 likes this.
    04-25-15 06:46 PM
  18. sentimentGX4's Avatar
    I'd rather tax money be put towards companies like Tesla
    The problem is that there aren't many companies "like Tesla". After spending hundreds of billions of dollars, we have one Tesla and many, many flops... no doubt many of which existed merely to funnel money into the lawmakers' own pockets.
    04-25-15 07:08 PM
  19. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    which the best part is still qnx under so they are in no matter what

    Edit: quote was not picked up

    Tesla uses a Linux based system and Musk is good friends with Google peeps so they'll probably go Android Auto if they use anyone outside.
    That's not true at all. Android Audio (and Apple's Car Play) can run on QNX, Windows, Linux, and probably other OSs as well. Both could certainly be installed on Tesla's current Linux-derived OS, with no need for QNX at all. Just because it can run on QNX doesn't mean it needs QNX to run.
    04-26-15 09:59 PM
  20. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    I'm just saying tesla is making it because of government help. Period. I know what tax credits are, historic, new market, etc.
    The government made the same "help" available to Fisker and others - why didn't they make it? They made lots of help (read: $$$) available to a number of "green energy" companies that crashed, including Solyndra - why didn't they make it?

    Tesla is making it because they're making a product that people want and will pay for. Sure, they are taking advantage of everything they can to make them lower cost, because they'd be dumb not to, but they didn't sell only 5,000 cars because only 5,000 people wanted and could afford one, they only sold that many because it's all they could manufacture - they're still in the long process of expanding production lines and creating new models. But you completely dismiss many of the innovative and consumer-friendly things that Tesla has done to make their product desirable by saying that "they are only successful because of government help."

    Do you have any idea how many industries you can say that about? Big Oil? The existing auto industry? The Internet and all of the Tech sector?

    Again, I don't love government subsidies, but that's something you need to complain to government about, not to Tesla.
    04-26-15 10:05 PM
  21. BoldPreza's Avatar
    Tesla is a house of cards. Without government help, it doesn't exist

    Posted via CB10
    That's a foolish statement. It's a startup so yes it's in a somewhat precarious position but the cars are definitely selling and they are fantastic. Can't wait to see what their new car looks like. I may be in the market by then and paying 1.20 a litre sucks.

    Posted via CB10
    05-15-15 12:58 PM
  22. THBW's Avatar
    Don't know how accurate this is

    Teslas announcement that it had paid back its government loan made it sound like at least one of Obamas crony capitalist Green Energy boondoggles was working the way it was supposed to.



    Finally at least one green energy company wasnt drinking the blood of taxpayers in its corporate offices and was actually making money selling things. It was the dawn of a new age.

    Except it wasnt.

    The latest round of Tesla wonderment came when it reported its first quarterly profit earlier this month. TSLA stock darned near doubled in a week.* Musk then borrowed $150 million from Goldman Sachs (shocking!) and floated a cool billion in new stock and long-term debt.* Thats how wethe taxpayerswere repaid.

    Tesla didnt generate a profit by selling sexy cars, but rather by selling sleazy emissions credits, mandated by the state of Californias electric vehicle requirements.* The competition, like Honda,* doesnt have a mass market plug-in to meet the mandate and therefore must buy the credits from Tesla, the only company that does. The bill for last quarter was $68 million.

    Absent this shakedown of potential car buyers, Tesla would have lost $57 million, or $11,400 per car. As the company sold 5,000 cars in the quarter, though, $13,600 per car was paid by other manufacturers, who are going to pass at least some of that cost on to buyers of their products. Folks in the new car market are likely paying a bit more than simply the direct tax subsidy.

    Tesla isnt actually making money selling cars. Its making money from crony capitalist taxes of people who buy cars from other companies. And even the customers who buy its cars get paid with taxpayer money.

    First, theres the $7500 taxback bonus that every buyer gets and every taxpayer pays.* Then there are generous state subsidies ($2500 in California, $4000 in Illinoisthe bluer the state, the more the taxpayers get gouged), all paid to people forking out $63K (plus taxes) for the base version, to roughly $100K for the really quick one.

    Tesla is still turning a profit, not from customers, but from money being seized from taxpayers to compensate its customers for buying Tesla.

    http://www.frontpagemag.com/2013/dgr...rom-taxpayers/


    Posted via CB10
    Bingo, you hit the nail on the head. Musk is a modern day flim flam artist. Despite all the press and hyperventilating about new age, energy efficienct products, he has failed to hit any measurable target of success. Car sales are dismal, rate of growth is poor and the cars have several performance problems. He has been papering over these issues with accounting tricks and tax credits. And when investors start asking him hard questions, he pulls a new product out his arse that will magically transform energy storage/usage. But remember, it's super duper secret so he can't tell you how it works. Cue the fawning media and the masses stupid enough to invest in Tesla. It's a scam folks. Even Google wasnt stupid enough to invest in this guy.

    Posted via CB10
    05-17-15 10:22 AM
  23. rthonpm's Avatar
    Tesla is a house of cards. Without government help, it doesn't exist

    Posted via CB10
    Replace Tesla with sugar, wheat, corn, or any other product the government artificially inflates or pulls subsidies for.

    The government made an investment in Tesla and got the money back. Just like any other kind of investment, a better technology won out over other similar makers. The government wastes more money on other frivolous things, and anything that can potentially get an entire industry into gear isn't a waste so much as it's a crapshoot: some investments pay off, others don't.

    Posted via CB10
    05-25-15 06:58 AM

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