[Daniel Ratcliffe]

Ok kid well you keep going and telling people they have to believe the exact words Steve Jobs says and not read in between the lines. Then call them thick from not believing a rumor that started on BGR because you do. To each their own I guess

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

Exactly, when I hear from a high-up guy at RIM at a Press Conference of theirs that a 10" PlayBook is definitely on the way, then I'll believe it, because I've seen (or rather heard) it from a RIM official.

[xandermac]

Damn right, common sense can be hard, I get it.

Ok kid well you keep going and telling people they have to believe the exact words Steve Jobs says and not read in between the lines. Then call them thick from not believing a rumor that started on BGR because you do. To each their own I guess

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

[mjs416]

That's what she said?

Sorry, everyone else was being sooo mature, I had to.

Dunder Mifflin Scranton is going to miss Michael Scott - as will I.

[mjs416]

Believe what you want, everyone else knows a 10" is on the way.

Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com

And thus negating the portability factor of the device which doesnt seem to be one of the gripes people have with the device. Common sense does not dictate a corporate oriented device jump to a 10 inch screen simply because every other manufacturer chose to do so.

[xandermac]

I agree, but common sense also tells us that RIM is not a company to limit themselves to a single formfactor, never have been, never will be. They try to appeal to all segments of the market, not just the corporate sector. Its a PLAYbook for a reason.

And thus negating the portability factor of the device which doesnt seem to be one of the gripes people have with the device. Common sense does not dictate a corporate oriented device jump to a 10 inch screen simply because every other manufacturer chose to do so.

[chiefbroski]

Apple will announce its iCloud service next week.

Should we care?

Amazon, Google, Microsoft and RIM need to get serious and provide some coordinated competition. Each has strengths that beat Apple in particular areas. Individually, they lack the breadth of solutions to match Apple in the consumer oriented application space. They need to seriously consider a more unified response - or at least - a less proprietary approach.

The iPad will be less about hardware and more about the underlying services. Just like the iPod was never really about MP3. It was always the vehicle for weaning users onto iTunes. iPads will now wean users onto the iCloud. It's D�j� vu all over again.

Here is a link to my complete blog entry:

PlayBook Geek: The Apple iCloud

Comments???

Why wasn't this thread moved or posted on an apple site? This has nothing to do with the playbook. The only reason you posted this here is because you knew you would get more views because the playbook isthe most popular forum section at the moment. You know this forum should have sections for this kind of stuff called "RIM" or "Apple", because you know "Apple" would be one of the most popular forums on a blackberry site, go figure.

[xandermac]

Apple is the chief competition, It's inevitable that the comparison is going to be made. RIM have had their heads in the sand for a long time ignoring the competition, if the same holds true on these boards there's no hope for blackberry fans as were just accepting the status quo. If people would just engage in a conversation without all the over sensitivity there might actually be some good come out of it, but instantly dismissing the largest competitor is inane. Good ideas come from all sides.

Why wasn't this thread moved or posted on an apple site? This has nothing to do with the playbook. The only reason you posted this here is because you knew you would get more views because the playbook isthe most popular forum section at the moment. You know this forum should have sections for this kind of stuff called "RIM" or "Apple", because you know "Apple" would be one of the most popular forums on a blackberry site, go figure.

[cis4life]

All of this back and forth is pointless.

The bottom line is all about preception, if your customer preceive something is better over another item, then in their mind who cares about hardware.

I've always said hardware don't make a platform or system, software and the preception the market feels for it does.

Case in point:
The Nintendo WII was a run away success, NOT BECAUSE of it's hardware, but because of what it brought to the market and the software titles that followed. It allowed families to have game night together and to do it interactively. Graphic wise, it was basic, NOTHING like the hardware that the XBOX 360 push, but NINTENDO SOLD MILLIONS of them and not a single person cared much about it's graphics.

Same is true of APPLE products. I for one like Apple and use and buy their producst. I also like what Blackberry is doing for the playbook. BUT, the average customer is not a techie and that is where we need to look at this from, a consumer stand point. OK, granted, the playbook is pretty and has a SUPERB display and great processors and so on. IT KILLS THE IPAD, hardware wise. BUT AGAIN, can it facebook, twitter, play games, do business functions, remote desktop, and so on. I KNOW it can, but when the consumer goes to the market to look for apps to do these functions, they are presented with a ghost town of apps. It is from this point you have lost the customer. We can say all day we can just go to the website for these things, but ALL these devices can do web browsing. I don't hear customers saying that they can't browse properly. People want to offset their laptops with these devices not JUST browse the web.

This is where I think blackberry went wrong. They put ALOT in their browser (WHICH IS EXCELLENT), but no one is complaining about their browser on their ipads and droid devices / tablets. So blackberry addressed an issue that wasn't really an issue to the AVERAGE consumer. And we can say, the playbook is for business people, but again, business users need apps as well. THey can browse fine on any of the devices that is in the market today. Like it or not, APPS WILL RULE this market. It's nice these apps can sync to the cloud, but cloud base solutions aren't gonna cut it this maket.

Simply put, if the developers aren't on board your platform will die. At that point who cares about how fast or what size a device is cause in the AVERAGE consumer eye, it doesn't do what I want it to do.

[mbrouill]

Well spotted! Here's what I meant:

Apple is primarily a hardware company. Yet iTunes is more important to them than hardware. Here's why I say that:

To continue selling hardware, Apple needs barriers that stop others from offering alternative hardware that just costs less. iTunes is that barrier.

Now they are doing the same with the iPad. You can buy cheaper hardware (200x Androids available + to come later this year). You can buy better hardware (the PlayBook). But you cannot get Apple services any other way.

iPads are no longer about hardware. Competitors need to take note.

I use to work for Digital Equipment and the philosophy of the company was give the hardware away at a reasonable price, we will make our money on services and add-on software the client will need to buy.

It is still the same today. Apple makes all these amazing devices but where they are making a ton of their money is on the periphery stuff...

[xandermac]

And thats the name of the game. Everyone has learned from Apple. Android has its market place, RIM has its AppWorld, they're all designed to keep people locked in from an investment standpoint. RIM are well behind in this regard though, Cloud syncing is a joke at the moment, just look at their Gmail sync support, its pathetic, and while everyone else is releasing an ebook store and music store/streaming service RIM is nowhere to be seen!. It might be hard for RIM to comprehend but these services sell devices and keep customers coming back!.

I use to work for Digital Equipment and the philosophy of the company was give the hardware away at a reasonable price, we will make our money on services and add-on software the client will need to buy.

It is still the same today. Apple makes all these amazing devices but where they are making a ton of their money is on the periphery stuff...

[blackranger3d]

.......Gmail sync support, its pathetic, ......

Oh man google sync was one of the things I HATED about my BB. Could snyc one way but not the other ugh.

RIM does a lot right, but the wrong they do it very annoying.

[cis4life]

I agree,
Once a standard has been set NO COMPANY can come to the party behind it. If you do, you will only be greeted by blank looks. Point is, tablet wise, the ipad made a standard. Android followed and widen the standard (flash broswer and so on). IT IS at this point you CAN NOT come to the party either behind or just meeting those standard. If you do, YOU WILL get the WTF and REALLY? look. AGAIN, I'm not slamming BB. I for one like it FOR WHAT i know it is capable of. But the promise of updates isn't gonna cut it, especally when you have already had a product that was promised to get better and then was just dropped (the storm).

[pkcable]

I added the full text of the blog so our members don't have to go anywhere to read it. Also I am moving the thread to the iphone/ipad section

[s219]

t is still the same today. Apple makes all these amazing devices but where they are making a ton of their money is on the periphery stuff...

That's actually not the case at all. Look through their financial reports and you'll see the vast majority of Apple revenue comes from hardware sales. Everything Apple does outside of hardware is meant to drive hardware sales, whether it's apps, iTunes, etc. They know where the big money is.

[cis4life]

Actually,
Though alot of their revenue comes from hardware as you said, there is still a cost assoicated with them to build the device, thus their profit for those items are probably lower than say profit from the app store and itunes. They make more money all around, but I say that it's the software and service is probably more "Profitable" than just their hardware.

Example:
In their app store, they make 30% of the purchase price of an app. Thats money in the bank. True, they have to pay support and all, but I'm sure what they are makeing pure app sale and what they put out for support, profit wise, it's a cash cow for them.

Game companies do the same, some companies will take a lost on the console itself knowing that their money is going to come from the license it will take for a company to push out a game on their platform.

Software Drives Platforms, Hardware Doesn't.

[Tre Lawrence]

Revolving door of profits, maybe?

Hardware sale locks one into iTunes, which drives the sales of more hardware.

I read somewhere that iPhone users are some of the biggest group of people who purchase Touches and iPods. That is telling, I think, and great for Apple's bottom line.

[PlayBookGeek]

Why wasn't this thread moved or posted on an apple site? This has nothing to do with the playbook. The only reason you posted this here is because you knew you would get more views because the playbook isthe most popular forum section at the moment. You know this forum should have sections for this kind of stuff called "RIM" or "Apple", because you know "Apple" would be one of the most popular forums on a blackberry site, go figure.

Not true. I have a PlayBook and think it has great potential. I have a blog dedicated to the making the PlayBook better: PlayBook For Geeks. Analyzing the competition is something I do. Sorry that offends you.

Adding services behind a device is a key differentiator. RIM owned the mobile market years ago with the BES. They need to invest to stay in the game.

[anon(19759)]

You want some music? It's on amazon cloud player. But music is not the only part. Want to rent a movie? Blockbuster, netflix. Want to start watching that video on TV and finish watching on your tablet? Netflix Update your software? Automatic. Want to share the pictures you are looking at in iPhoto? Picasa, flickr. Want to make a video call to Grandma? Qik. Want to make a free phone (a.k.a. Skype) call to another part of the world? Uh, Skype.

[PlayBookGeek]

You want some music? It's on amazon cloud player. But music is not the only part. Want to rent a movie? Blockbuster, netflix. Want to start watching that video on TV and finish watching on your tablet? Netflix Update your software? Automatic. Want to share the pictures you are looking at in iPhoto? Picasa, flickr. Want to make a video call to Grandma? Qik. Want to make a free phone (a.k.a. Skype) call to another part of the world? Uh, Skype.

There is no question these services are available elsewhere . For example: Don't forget DropBox - It will also be consumed by the Apple iCloud. Apple rarely invents anything that is completely new. The point is: Apple will package these services and say to consumers: "You must have these features and we make it easy".

The result: Anyone selling a 'premium' tablet will need bundled services. There will be a separate market for $200 commodity tablets that only browse the web. I don't think RIM wants to be in that group.

[anon(19759)]

Yes, Apple will package all of their cloud stuff well and those that just want everything set up nice and tidy will go for it. I prefer choice and Apple doesn't give you that.

[PlayBookGeek]

Yes, Apple will package all of their cloud stuff well and those that just want everything set up nice and tidy will go for it. I prefer choice and Apple doesn't give you that.

I couldn't agree more.

[ugahairydawgs]

Yes, Apple will package all of their cloud stuff well and those that just want everything set up nice and tidy will go for it. I prefer choice and Apple doesn't give you that.

I'm just curious, what choice are you looking for that you feel Apple is keeping you from experiencing?

[anon(19759)]

I'm just curious, what choice are you looking for that you feel Apple is keeping you from experiencing?

Isn't that what this discussion is about? I want to allow companies to compete service-by-service. File storage, cloud media services, video calling..... I don t want to be told what services I can use.

Sent from my DROID Pro using Tapatalk

[anon(153966)]

I have nothing against paying for a service\feature. I pay for quite a few as is. But, I seriously don't want to pay Apple for this iCloud service.

And, if I ever did, just to test it, and it was slow, or messed up ONCE, I'd be demanding a refund.

I just have a feeling that it may be slow, a bit like Mobile ME's web interface, s l o w. Unless AT&T's service makes it slow; just saying...

[PlayBookGeek]

I'm just curious, what choice are you looking for that you feel Apple is keeping you from experiencing?

The Apple App store outlaws competitive products (examples: Aperture and Quicktime competitors) and technologies that Steve Jobs simply doesn't like (examples: Flash, any tablet smaller than 10", SSD slots, tethering iPad to iPhone). Apple is free to make these decisions. Alternatives are good for everyone including Apple Fanboyz.