02-27-12 03:49 AM
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  1. teeuwen's Avatar
    Hmm and here I thought that 10 inch tablets are THE only acceptable screen size and that anything smaller is doomed to fail. Is Apple actually backtracking on a statement?!
    i was waiting for someone to post this ^

    But who knows, now that steve jobs has passed away it could be even easier for them to deny ever saying that.
    02-14-12 02:16 PM
  2. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    i was waiting for someone to post this ^

    But who knows, now that steve jobs has passed away it could be even easier for them to deny ever saying that.
    I find it hilarious that y'all are hanging your hats on that. They own the tablet market; they can backtrack, sidestep, boogie and parry ALL they want.

    Good companies do not let pride stand in the way of potential profits.
    Last edited by trelawrence; 02-14-12 at 02:24 PM.
    02-14-12 02:21 PM
  3. conix67's Avatar
    i was waiting for someone to post this ^

    But who knows, now that steve jobs has passed away it could be even easier for them to deny ever saying that.
    I'll say it again - PRICE CHANGES EVERYTHING.

    Both Amazon and RIM demonstrated smaller tablet at unachievable prices will sell. Steve was quite correct.

    On another count, RIM is preparing 10" tablets. Steve gets credit again.

    Now, it's RIM's turn to prove Steve was not quite correct, if RIM can sell PBs at original prices with release of OS 2.0.
    02-14-12 02:23 PM
  4. CairnsRock's Avatar
    My next tablet WILL have Skype and be 7 or 8 inches.
    02-14-12 02:33 PM
  5. teeuwen's Avatar
    I'll say it again - PRICE CHANGES EVERYTHING.

    Both Amazon and RIM demonstrated smaller tablet at unachievable prices will sell. Steve was quite correct.

    On another count, RIM is preparing 10" tablets. Steve gets credit again.

    Now, it's RIM's turn to prove Steve was not quite correct, if RIM can sell PBs at original prices with release of OS 2.0.
    i don't quite following you hear... you seem to interpret this in the wrong way.

    you said both amazon and rim demonstrated smaller tablets at unachievable prices will sell?

    what about the other 10" tablets that are currently at unachievable prices? like the zoom and larger tabs.

    Apple won because of its branding and because of its early release, and follow threw from previous products, aswell as some other reasons. which i think have nothing to do with the 10" form factor.

    Dont forget rim has actually a fairly large segment in the tablet market comparison to the other tablets (not including the ipads large percentage)

    its all in perception, and yours seems to be controlled....

    Hardware wise they have always been on track, but this battle has not only been about hardware and releastate size.. its about many other things.

    my post was specifically talking about this last statement

    "Now, it's RIM's turn to prove Steve was not quite correct, if RIM can sell PBs at original prices with release of OS 2.0"
    Last edited by teeuwen; 02-14-12 at 02:41 PM.
    02-14-12 02:35 PM
  6. teeuwen's Avatar
    I find it hilarious that y'all are hanging your hats on that. They own the tablet market; they can backtrack, sidestep, boogie and parry ALL they want.

    Good companies do not let pride stand in the way of potential profits.
    Im not hanging my hat on it, i just find it hilarious because the apple camp usually like to use statements by the late steve jobs as prophetic truth.

    They can backtrack and side step and boogie all they want....

    because after all! your holding your phone wrong, its not their fault.
    jamesbondOO7 likes this.
    02-14-12 02:46 PM
  7. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    Im not hanging my hat on it, i just find it hilarious because the apple camp usually like to use statements by the late steve jobs as prophetic truth.

    They can backtrack and side step and boogie all they want....

    because after all! your holding your phone wrong, its not their fault.
    Okay, I'm with you there. The most arrogant statement ever made.
    teeuwen likes this.
    02-14-12 02:50 PM
  8. conix67's Avatar
    i don't quite following you hear... you seem to interpret this in the wrong way.

    you said both amazon and rim demonstrated smaller tablets at unachievable prices will sell?

    what about the other 10" tablets that are currently at unachievable prices? like the zoom and larger tabs.
    Both RIM and Amazon are selling hardware at below PARTS cost, let alone manufacturing. In other words, the hardware sales does not generate profit for them, in fact at current pricing every PB sold is cost to RIM. Amazon has a strategy around their content base, and trying to lure customers with low hardware price, so they do have more viable business model.

    Apple won because of its branding and because of its early release, and follow threw from previous products, aswell as some other reasons. which i think have nothing to do with the 10" form factor.

    Dont forget rim has actually a fairly large segment in the tablet market comparison to the other tablets (not including the ipads large percentage)
    Apple's brand perception is their weapon. Their execution has been far above all competitors.

    As for 10", look at Samsung. Their first tablet was 7". It didn't sell. Their follow up which is 10" is selling a lot better.

    RIM reportedly also is building 10" tablet along with 7".

    RIM's PB market share in tablet market is respectable, thanks to the recent sales that drove PB sales. They could not have achieved this without price drop. PRICE CHANGES EVERYTHING.

    its all in perception, and yours seems to be controlled....

    Hardware wise they have always been on track, but this battle has not only been about hardware and releastate size.. its about many other things.

    my post was specifically talking about this last statement

    "Now, it's RIM's turn to prove Steve was not quite correct, if RIM can sell PBs at original prices with release of OS 2.0"
    None of what I said is perception, they are hard facts you can see everywhere. Hardware alone does not complete a product, especially a tablet with proprietary OS.

    What about my last statement?

    By the way, I'm not controlled by anything. I've been following high tech industry very closely since 1984. There's a trend, lots of things appeared and disappeared, lots of companies succeeded and failed. I know for certain Apple has learned a lot from the past, and doing well because they know what competitors don't, and well ahead of game, very well prepared.

    There's a reason their net worth became larger than Microsoft and Google combined. It's not just marketing like some people claim.
    02-14-12 03:06 PM
  9. apengue1's Avatar
    Think about it.. we're screwed. As much as I like my Playbook, if Apple comes out with an 8" iPad in the $2-300 range we are royally screwed. I cannot imagine how any 'average consumer' who does not know much about technology would take ANYTHING else other than an iPad, whichever model they may choose. Its the standard in mobile. That consumer market is huge and they win by default. It kills me to think this, its so sad.. but I think its true. I don't think its possible to compete with Apple and win right now. 2012 will be another huge year for them.(Cross my fingers I hope its not true.)
    02-14-12 03:08 PM
  10. shn'g's Avatar
    A smart business does not care about backtracking on statements made in the past, unless the backtracking is about promising things like an OS and then not delivering for a year. Apple's only genuine competition at the moment comes from the Kindle Fire and (possibly) the Nook. Why would they not reevaluate the viability of a smaller iPad, especially since it has been a recurring suggestion of iPad users.
    You nailed it.. Good business coming from a ******** company! I love how people actually defend a company that makes you feel like crap for buying a smaller tablet and says you are an , then a year later oh wait you should have a smaller tablet but it should only be ours because... And they will list another bunch of reasons why theirs is better.

    I have lost interest in apple because of the way they do business.. I'll wait for the playbook 2 or window's tablet hoping they come out with a 7-8" tab
    02-14-12 03:38 PM
  11. teeuwen's Avatar
    Both RIM and Amazon are selling hardware at below PARTS cost, let alone manufacturing. In other words, the hardware sales does not generate profit for them, in fact at current pricing every PB sold is cost to RIM. Amazon has a strategy around their content base, and trying to lure customers with low hardware price, so they do have more viable business model.



    Apple's brand perception is their weapon. Their execution has been far above all competitors.

    As for 10", look at Samsung. Their first tablet was 7". It didn't sell. Their follow up which is 10" is selling a lot better.

    RIM reportedly also is building 10" tablet along with 7".

    RIM's PB market share in tablet market is respectable, thanks to the recent sales that drove PB sales. They could not have achieved this without price drop. PRICE CHANGES EVERYTHING.



    None of what I said is perception, they are hard facts you can see everywhere. Hardware alone does not complete a product, especially a tablet with proprietary OS.

    What about my last statement?

    By the way, I'm not controlled by anything. I've been following high tech industry very closely since 1984. There's a trend, lots of things appeared and disappeared, lots of companies succeeded and failed. I know for certain Apple has learned a lot from the past, and doing well because they know what competitors don't, and well ahead of game, very well prepared.

    There's a reason their net worth became larger than Microsoft and Google combined. It's not just marketing like some people claim.

    your still missing my point, this isn't about pricing, this is about brand recognition.

    the saturation of the tablet market at a lower price point then manufactured cost isn't so they can buy a stake in the tablet market at the 7" size, its so they get a stake in the market and have a name there, for that i would grant the price has some importance, but the battle is not being fought on the same plain.
    02-14-12 03:53 PM
  12. conix67's Avatar
    your still missing my point, this isn't about pricing, this is about brand recognition.

    the saturation of the tablet market at a lower price point then manufactured cost isn't so they can buy a stake in the tablet market at the 7" size, its so they get a stake in the market and have a name there, for that i would grant the price has some importance, but the battle is not being fought on the same plain.
    I'll say it again - PRICE CHANGES EVERYTHING.

    Where were RIM and PB before price reduction?

    Who says tablet market (if there are any) reached saturation point? I don't think you understand the reasoning behind RIM's recent price drop (or inconsistency) of PBs.

    Of course, they reduced price of PBs so they can gain some market share, attract developers, start the good cycle going. Was this part of their ORIGINAL plan? Are they succeeding with this new plan? It remains to be seen.
    02-14-12 04:40 PM
  13. alnamvet68's Avatar
    I rest my case.
    pmccartney and AlienSlacker like this.
    02-14-12 04:43 PM
  14. LisaOnline's Avatar
    What is an acceptable price for a tablet?

    I dont really care what size screen apple bring the ipad out in, i wouldnt buy one for just two reasons.

    Overhyped and overpriced.
    kennyliu likes this.
    02-14-12 10:03 PM
  15. Peritaxis's Avatar
    Yeah they do crash and lock up, as well as the iTune crashes. Both of ours have locked up and had to be rebooted on several occasions and the email issues are driving my wife up the wall. Last night she was doing some school emails on the iPad because she had left her PB at school. Every other time she started to delete a line, whoose!, it would jump to the home page and the two page email was gone. Happened three times and has done it sporadically on both iPads since we've had them. Go read the iPad forums. Take a bite and you'll see there are some worms in that apple. They all have issues.
    TRUE! My dad hates his iPad2 for this reason. He was writing a paper he was hoping to publish... and whoosh! Weeks of work disappeared because it accidentally highlighted everything and he typed another letter. And there was no undo.

    Once it got stuck in landscape mode, despite not being locked in it. He asked me how to fix it... how would I know, I don't have that problem with the PlayBook. He had to reboot it.

    It annoys me when people say how the iPad2 is flawless/better/godly compared to the PlayBook... they're probably lying about it just to justify the obscene price they paid for it.
    02-14-12 10:03 PM
  16. howarmat's Avatar
    ^^ remember people paid just as much of a "obscene price" for the PB too
    speedypear and brucep1 like this.
    02-14-12 10:06 PM
  17. conix67's Avatar
    TRUE! My dad hates his iPad2 for this reason. He was writing a paper he was hoping to publish... and whoosh! Weeks of work disappeared because it accidentally highlighted everything and he typed another letter. And there was no undo.

    Once it got stuck in landscape mode, despite not being locked in it. He asked me how to fix it... how would I know, I don't have that problem with the PlayBook. He had to reboot it.

    It annoys me when people say how the iPad2 is flawless/better/godly compared to the PlayBook... they're probably lying about it just to justify the obscene price they paid for it.
    You shake it to undo edits. Which app was your dad using?

    We have not rebooted ours for few months. I reboot my PB few times almost every day but I guess it's not fair since I'm running Android apps on OS 2.0 beta, I would like to put an end to it though.

    There's nothing that is claimed "godly", what people want is something that just works.
    02-14-12 11:05 PM
  18. ridemaster's Avatar
    ipad anything = no thanks

    go RIM go
    scott.slater likes this.
    02-14-12 11:15 PM
  19. kennyliu's Avatar
    Guys, we all need to grow up and choose based on how a certain product meets our needs. Not based on what letters or words are stamped on the product. We are talking about pieces of electronics. It looks very immature when someone says "I hate this and that, because it's company X that makes it". It is even more worrisome to see people saying "you suck, you are dumb, you are ...... (fill in the blank), because you buy a brand X product".
    02-15-12 12:11 AM
  20. FSeverino's Avatar
    this shows one thing...

    Apple knows that the smaller sizes are what people want.

    The main thing to look at will be the price and what is contained in it.
    If it is $100 less and 2 inches smaller with a weak battery it WILL NOT be worth it...
    unless you are a fanboy
    02-15-12 12:53 AM
  21. AlienSlacker's Avatar
    ^^ remember people paid just as much of a "obscene price" for the PB too
    Maybe so. But then again Apple is the company that smugly prides itself on how their products work flawlessly and when there is a problem they just arrogantly claim it must be you the consumer using their product wrong. Here's a little video regarding Apple smugness. It's older but quite accurate.



    02-15-12 12:53 AM
  22. Mr.Willie's Avatar
    A few comments:
    1) Apple got a tiny niche market share out of years of Apple vs PC ads. They almost went bankrupt with that market share and probably would have without cash (and other things) from Microsoft.
    2) The iPad does not crash and lock up - that is an Android issue.
    3) OS 2 looks solid but is still not out.
    4) The whole business first issue got tossed out the window when RIM released a mass market product without email. The only genuine business tablets run Windows 7.
    1) Those ads came after Apple almost went bankrupt and MS bought 'new' Apple stock and promised to continue Office for the Mac.
    2) Sometimes an app will crash and if you install some apps and try to run them without rebooting you can get an iPad lockup.
    4) Tell the Windows part of your statement to the millions of business users.

    Think about it.. we're screwed. As much as I like my Playbook, if Apple comes out with an 8" iPad in the $2-300 range we are royally screwed. I cannot imagine how any 'average consumer' who does not know much about technology would take ANYTHING else other than an iPad, whichever model they may choose. Its the standard in mobile. That consumer market is huge and they win by default. It kills me to think this, its so sad.. but I think its true. I don't think its possible to compete with Apple and win right now. 2012 will be another huge year for them.(Cross my fingers I hope its not true.)
    What I get from your your post is that you think you're a tech geek, but you're not. Do you know that with a $10 app and a $50 dongle you can use your iPad to manage enterprise networking equipment to include Sun Netra servers ? Apple is also taking over the business market. It's a superior product. (I am talking about the iPad only. I am a dedicated BB phone user.) Instead of being sad, why not buy an iPad and several shares of Apple stock ? Try out iTunes U and the new interactive text books. Oh, and for Apple to win, RIM does not have to lose, there is plenty of business for both companies to succeed.

    this shows one thing...
    Apple knows that the smaller sizes are what people want.
    The main thing to look at will be the price and what is contained in it.
    If it is $100 less and 2 inches smaller with a weak battery it WILL NOT be worth it...
    unless you are a fanboy
    Are what some people want. It's only a rumor, but I guarantee that if it's true, it won't have a weak battery.

    Now let me get back to Netflix.
    Last edited by Mr.Willie; 02-15-12 at 02:47 AM.
    02-15-12 02:39 AM
  23. arundmt's Avatar
    I see how people have over hypeing os2.0 ... You know its still a playbook ...
    And people should really stop comparing playbook to ipads ... I own both and they do what they are ment too ...

    Just cuz i got hold of a $200 playbook i am not gona say that its better than my ipad 2 ...

    And people saying when os2.0 comes its gona change the tablet market ...NO .. It wont change nothing ....
    02-15-12 06:59 AM
  24. wet_coast's Avatar
    does an extra inch even make a difference? Many ads in my Maxim magazines say so.
    howarmat likes this.
    02-15-12 07:53 AM
  25. alnamvet68's Avatar
    does an extra inch even make a difference? Many ads in my Maxim magazines say so.
    A little comic relief is what's needed in this thread; speaking fo comic, where's......oh never mind.
    omniusovermind likes this.
    02-15-12 08:24 AM
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