[larryjb1120]

The one thing I love about the Classic is the ability to answer calls by pressing a button, and hang up using a button. I don't have that feature on my Q10 and sometimes have issues trying to hang up because the virtual keys don't respond to my fingers.

Now to the Titan. Can you answer calls by pressing a physical key? Also, I'm used to a large space bar. How difficult was it to convert to having a small space bar in the 3rd row?

Posted via CB10

[idssteve]

The one thing I love about the Classic is the ability to answer calls by pressing a button, and hang up using a button. I don't have that feature on my Q10 and sometimes have issues trying to hang up because the virtual keys don't respond to my fingers.

Now to the Titan. Can you answer calls by pressing a physical key? Also, I'm used to a large space bar. How difficult was it to convert to having a small space bar in the 3rd row?


Posted via CB10

Physical "answer/end" keys are greatly valued by my company, also. We quit using Q after some painful experiences resulting from failure to end some calls... Client listened in to shop talk about their competitor's bid prep, as one example. My brother's soon to be X listened in on a conversation with his attorney. As another example. My brother was using an iPhone. Lol. Fortunately that was an amicable situation but pretty easy to imagine how nasty that might could get... Can cite a few other examples. An issue that really hasn't been adequately considered, imo.

Real PHONES have dedicated phone controls. Imo. Phablets with phone functions patched in really shouldn't be called "phones", imo. Apple's genius was including the word "phone" in the name of their iPad with phone capabilities patched in. Lol.

I'd like to know how Titan utilizes the control keys in the fingerprint row... ??

[the_boon]

Real PHONES have dedicated phone controls. Imo. Phablets with phone functions patched in really shouldn't be called "phones", imo.

That's why I call them slabs

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

Physical "answer/end" keys are greatly valued by my company, also. We quit using Q after some painful experiences resulting from failure to end some calls... Client listened in to shop talk about their competitor's bid prep, as one example. My brother's soon to be X listened in on a conversation with his attorney. As another example. My brother was using an iPhone. Lol. Fortunately that was an amicable situation but pretty easy to imagine how nasty that might could get... Can cite a few other examples. An issue that really hasn't been adequately considered, imo.

Real PHONES have dedicated phone controls. Imo. Phablets with phone functions patched in really shouldn't be called "phones", imo. Apple's genius was including the word "phone" in the name of their iPad with phone capabilities patched in. Lol.

I'd like to know how Titan utilizes the control keys in the fingerprint row... ??

But in the end it's what people seem to want.... an internet appliance that at times can be used as a phone.

Less interest in a email machine that was also a phone.

Bottom line is all the power users and companies that some here say can't live without the right tool.... just didn't demand the right tool. I do wonder if PKB users might have been better off if in 2014 BlackBerry had gone bankrupt. Would there have been enough of a market then for a major player to step in? Would they have offered a great product or just something so-so?

But we can play the what if game all day, bottom line is there are too few PKB lovers and they aren't united in what they view as the perfect tool. I don't think Android is every going to match up well enough, no matter the PKB format for you. Sure don't think a cheap Unihertz phone will meet your demanding needs. Hopefully the OM device will be more refined and higher quality... might be better than nothing.

[idssteve]

But in the end it's what people seem to want.... an internet appliance that at times can be used as a phone.

Less interest in a email machine that was also a phone.

Bottom line is all the power users and companies that some here say can't live without the right tool.... just didn't demand the right tool. I do wonder if PKB users might have been better off if in 2014 BlackBerry had gone bankrupt. Would there have been enough of a market then for a major player to step in? Would they have offered a great product or just something so-so?

But we can play the what if game all day, bottom line is there are too few PKB lovers and they aren't united in what they view as the perfect tool. I don't think Android is every going to match up well enough, no matter the PKB format for you. Sure don't think a cheap Unihertz phone will meet your demanding needs. Hopefully the OM device will be more refined and higher quality... might be better than nothing.

You are probably right. But then are my requirements really so demanding? ?? It's not like I'm seeking something that's never been done before... Lol. In fact, my "needs" are well satiated on this grossly crippled ten year old Bold! Research and design were paid for a decade ago. No need to reinvent the wheel. Really nothing "new" to invent. Other than "inventing" willingness to cease chasing Apple's userbase and remember everything RIM forgot. Forgotten by Mike's qnx sequestration... Lol.

MY demands start with the mission of the device. A mobile communications device should, first and foremost, communicate. While mobile! That frequently means while in motion. (Research In Motion? Lol) Most frequently while walking? Or while living an active business life??

How comfortable are you that you've ended a voice communications session with a "soft end"? While walking? With the other hand occupied with living a mobile life in motion? ?? For most "consumers", most of the time, failure to end a call is cause for a good laugh. Worst case might be someone's wife over hearing conversations with girls in bars... ? Lol.

For business operators, and particularly for regulated professions, I simply don't believe "soft end" is an issue that's been adequately debated. Imo. Fwiw.

Much like "slabbers" who talk like they'd like more compact slabs but actually buy huge, I really don't believe PKB phreeks who talk like they'd like bigger PKB handsets really represent significant sales potential among legacy enthusiasts. Imo. Simply because most who still seek PKB do so for what it can DO rather than what it is. And handset chassis grasp proves an inescapably significant variable for what PKB can DO. FAR more significant than demanded of slab chassis grasp.

If hugeness enjoyed chance of success amongst PKB market, wouldn't each step larger since 2013 have improved sales? Pretty hard to look at sales trends and conclude that larger PKB screens sell BETTER... ?? Screen size vs sales volumes plot pretty inversely, since 2013. Pretty basic. Pretty obvious. For some of us still willing to risk thinking outside of SamApple's box. Lol. The single form factor that has NOT been seriously revisited since Bold is Bold's. And Bold represents BB et al's final success story.

It also enjoys relatively favorable reputation even around here. Despite pervasive attempts to "cancel" everything about it, 2012-2015. Imo.
Looking thru "favorite" and "poll" threads, Bolds still receive disproportionate mentions. Even write-in votes in polls where Bold isn't a listed option. NOT because of what it IS. Because of favorable memories of what it DID. Memories tarnished by exposure to oversized & crippled "sorta Bold" attempts at compromise with SamApple userbase. A userbase who has little use for PKB of any size. Imo.

It's poorly kept secret that I contend that RIM achieved mobile communications in motion "perfection" with 9900. That's NOT an arbitrary contention. That contention was derived, and still supported, thru quantitative evaluations. Problem with achieving "perfection" is that subsequent attempts to improve on "perfection" too typically result in less "perfection". Lol.

Pocket is still no revisit of Bold form. It's arguably a revisit of Classic form which was, itself, an oversized "sorta Bold" experiment. An experiment that still failed to migrate significant Bold userbase. Now that this old Bold is facing demise as ATT shuts down 3G, "lesser of evils" become contenders. ??

Still hopefull for OM's offering, also. Just too little data on expected form factor, so far. ??

[Chuck Finley69]

You are probably right. But then are my requirements really so demanding? ?? It's not like I'm seeking something that's never been done before... Lol. In fact, my "needs" are well satiated on this grossly crippled ten year old Bold! Research and design were paid for a decade ago. No need to reinvent the wheel. Really nothing "new" to invent. Other than "inventing" willingness to cease chasing Apple's userbase and remember everything RIM forgot. Forgotten by Mike's qnx sequestration... Lol.

MY demands start with the mission of the device. A mobile communications device should, first and foremost, communicate. While mobile! That frequently means while in motion. (Research In Motion? Lol) Most frequently while walking? Or while living an active business life??

How comfortable are you that you've ended a voice communications session with a "soft end"? While walking? With the other hand occupied with living a mobile life in motion? ?? For most "consumers", most of the time, failure to end a call is cause for a good laugh. Worst case might be someone's wife over hearing conversations with girls in bars... ? Lol.

For business operators, and particularly for regulated professions, I simply don't believe "soft end" is an issue that's been adequately debated. Imo. Fwiw.

Much like "slabbers" who talk like they'd like more compact slabs but actually buy huge, I really don't believe PKB phreeks who talk like they'd like bigger PKB handsets really represent significant sales potential among legacy enthusiasts. Imo. Simply because most who still seek PKB do so for what it can DO rather than what it is. And handset chassis grasp proves an inescapably significant variable for what PKB can DO. FAR more significant than demanded of slab chassis grasp.

If hugeness enjoyed chance of success amongst PKB market, wouldn't each step larger since 2013 have improved sales? Pretty hard to look at sales trends and conclude that larger PKB screens sell BETTER... ?? Screen size vs sales volumes plot pretty inversely, since 2013. Pretty basic. Pretty obvious. For some of us still willing to risk thinking outside of SamApple's box. Lol. The single form factor that has NOT been seriously revisited since Bold is Bold's. And Bold represents BB et al's final success story.

It also enjoys relatively favorable reputation even around here. Despite pervasive attempts to "cancel" everything about it, 2012-2015. Imo.
Looking thru "favorite" and "poll" threads, Bolds still receive disproportionate mentions. Even write-in votes in polls where Bold isn't a listed option. NOT because of what it IS. Because of favorable memories of what it DID. Memories tarnished by exposure to oversized & crippled "sorta Bold" attempts at compromise with SamApple userbase. A userbase who has little use for PKB of any size. Imo.

It's poorly kept secret that I contend that RIM achieved mobile communications in motion "perfection" with 9900. That's NOT an arbitrary contention. That contention was derived, and still supported, thru quantitative evaluations. Problem with achieving "perfection" is that subsequent attempts to improve on "perfection" too typically result in less "perfection". Lol.

Pocket is still no revisit of Bold form. It's arguably a revisit of Classic form which was, itself, an oversized "sorta Bold" experiment. An experiment that still failed to migrate significant Bold userbase. Now that this old Bold is facing demise as ATT shuts down 3G, "lesser of evils" become contenders. ??

Still hopefull for OM's offering, also. Just too little data on expected form factor, so far. ??

Even my adult kids tell me communication has evolved. Talking on phone is like messaging using fire and smoke. Telegraph is cutting edge and my talking and texting with email for the important stuff is so 2010 nowadays. Something about dinosaurs, extinction and laughing at me......

[idssteve]

Even my adult kids tell me communication has evolved. Talking on phone is like messaging using fire and smoke. Telegraph is cutting edge and my talking and texting with email for the important stuff is so 2010 nowadays. Something about dinosaurs, extinction and laughing at me......

Maybe it depends on what is being communicated? If troubleshooting misbehaving equipment on a noisy production line, background noise makes voice pretty useless. Ability to communicate in "real time" thru keyboard under offhand while right hand adjusts a pot screw becomes as "modern" as this very day. lol

Of course as production lines offshore elsewhere, maybe "modern youngsters" will never need such skillsets...? lol

[gdugic]

On Titan you can answer/hang up a call with double press on space bar. It works without problems and I use it often. It is expecially usefull when I wear gloves.

Posted via CB10

[idssteve]

On Titan you can answer/hang up a call with double press on space bar. It works without problems and I use it often. It is expecially usefull when I wear gloves.

Posted via CB10

Good to know. K's do similar also.

[larryjb1120]

On Titan you can answer/hang up a call with double press on space bar. It works without problems and I use it often. It is expecially usefull when I wear gloves.

Posted via CB10

Thank you!!!!!

I do think that the slab craze is also partly the industry telling us what we want, the tease us with "cool" tech we don't really need. They have to, or else we'd all still be using flip phones or brick phones.

Honestly, the smartphone is not very useful for Internet. The smallest I can go is a 10" tablet, and the ol' desktop with a real keyboard is so much nicer to work with. The smartphone is too small, I can't tap links properly, and in general, I can't wait to get to a desktop or laptop.

But I guess that is me. I gave our kids old flip phones this year. No Internet. They have laptops if they need.

Posted via CB10

[anon(5597702)]

I do think that the slab craze is also partly the industry telling us what we want, the tease us with "cool" tech we don't really need.

Posted via CB10

So agree. They say "jump" , we say "how high?" To think this industry offers products designed around what customers actually want is naive. Most of us are just conditioned to buy into what they offer and the offer is all but homogenous.

The old startup cliche applies, even to bigger business: "we need to disrupt ourselves " . With mass exodus of key players in the slab space to basically the point of a duopoly, how healthy can that market be? I don't expect pkb to overtake (I'm not that naive!) But I'm encouraged that there are some fringe options via kickstarter/niche channels, and foldables are an intriguing wrinkle in the mobile tech space too.

[idssteve]

SOooo... I'm understanding that the buttons on either side of Titan's fingerprint sensor don't include phone "Answer/End"? ??

If not, are there provisions to assign functions to those buttons?

Space bar sounds better than virtual, for sure. Did someone suggest that to them? Or did they derive that internally?

UH seems responsive to suggestions?

[spARTacus]

So agree. They say "jump" , we say "how high?"...

Agree. More of Idiocracy

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

Agree. More of Idiocracy

Idiocracy is thinking the tail wags the dog....

Market is providing what consumers want, it's pretty simple economic 101. Might be true that Steve Jobs introduced people to what they wanted - slab phones. But fourteen years later the format isn't still going strong because of some mass conspiracy among manufactures - some of which are being forced out of the market. If LG knew people really wanted PKB phones... they'd have made them.

Reality is outliers don't want to believe they are outliers and it's easer to think there is something wrong with the "system".

[anon(5597702)]

Idiocracy is thinking the tail wags the dog....

Market is providing what consumers want, it's pretty simple economic 101. Might be true that Steve Jobs introduced people to what they wanted - slab phones. But fourteen years later the format isn't still going strong because of some mass conspiracy among manufactures - some of which are being forced out of the market. If LG knew people really wanted PKB phones... they'd have made them.

Reality is outliers don't want to believe they are outliers and it's easer to think there is something wrong with the "system".

So a counterperception to the above point isn't real and must be rooted in conspiracy theory. Got it. Companies are benevolent and listen to their users. Got it. Sounds a bit like gaslighting 101 to me.

[chain13]

LOL.. In internet everybody could easily make up a story about failing to hang up a call only because it uses a slab, and still there will be some who believe ������

[conite]

So a counterperception to the above point isn't real and must be rooted in conspiracy theory. Got it. Companies are benevolent and listen to their users. Got it. Sounds a bit like gaslighting 101 to me.

If a company thought they could bring something to the market that people wanted and that would give them a competitive advantage, they'd do it in a heartbeat.

Samsung spends more money on consumer research than some countries' entire GDP.

[the_boon]

If a company thought they could bring something to the market that people wanted and that would give them a competitive advantage, they'd do it in a heartbeat.

Samsung spends more money on consumer research than some countries' entire GDP.

Yes but sometimes, something sticks because you threw it at a wall.

In 2006 before the first iPhone came out, no one screamed at Apple "we want slabs", yet they still made one for 2007.

No one's mentioning in Samsung surveys that they desperately want a PKB phone, but if one came out (would be slider or add-on with them) and they liked what it can offer, they could possibly end up buying it.

[conite]

Yes but sometimes, something sticks because you threw it at a wall.

In 2006 before the first iPhone came out, no one screamed at Apple "we want slabs", yet they still made one for 2007.

No one's mentioning in Samsung surveys that they desperately want a PKB phone, but if one came out (would be slider or add-on with them) and they liked what it can offer, they could possibly end up buying it.

After 15 years of mobile device evolution, we've reached an organic sweet spot.

There probably will be another one in 5 to 10 years from now which will involve flexible screens.

Samsung has plenty of money to try out various things if they thought there was even the faintest hope. The fate of physical keyboards is signed and sealed.

[idssteve]

Every company is subject to certain minimum volumes. For various reasons. No two the same. Applying one rule to fit all proves inevitably short sighted.

UniHertz has found innovative ways to serve small volume niches. Niches Samsung and Apple prefer not to serve. The "system" is working. Finally.

The surprise, to me, is where and under what "system" niches are getting served from... Lol. Not sure WHAT that says but...? Lol.

[the_boon]

The fate of physical keyboards is signed and sealed.

I don't believe in that.

Maybe fixed keyboards that "eat up screen space" is sealed to only appear on kickstarter phones, but that doesn't mean they won't make sliders/swivelers/add-ons somewhere down the line.

[conite]

I don't believe in that.

Maybe fixed keyboards that "eat up screen space" is sealed to only appear on kickstarter phones, but that doesn't mean they won't make sliders/swivelers/add-ons somewhere down the line.

Thankfully all that junk is gone the way of the dodo.

[Dunt Dunt Dunt]

So a counterperception to the above point isn't real and must be rooted in conspiracy theory. Got it. Companies are benevolent and listen to their users. Got it. Sounds a bit like gaslighting 101 to me.

No companies are not benevolent... but neither are they going to put other companies goals ahead of their own profits.

Sure Steve Jobs thought PKB devices didn't offer what he wanted to provide his users. One company might decide they won't support a format - be it a PBK, a Beta Max or HD-DVD...

But if LG could have stayed in the phone business by offering PKB phone or Tringale phones or something other than a slab... they would have. Because unlike with Beta Max or HD-DVD... there is nothing stopping them from doing a PKB other then customer demand.

[spARTacus]

...Reality is outliers don't want to believe they are outliers and it's easer to think there is something wrong with the "system".

I think I am somewhat indifferent to being worried about if my views are outliers or not, and if the system is wrong or right for if aligned or not with my views. However, I guess I feel a need to voice when/where I think things are taking the system in silly directions. I assume it is related to becoming more cynical with age.

[the_boon]

Thankfully all that junk is gone the way of the dodo.

Thankfully is not the word to use, as practically all that we're left with are slabs. Better to have the above than not, even if you're not personally a fan of say the Priv for example.

Any form factor dying isn't a good thing.