1. Master of Surgery's Avatar
    Am I the only one in here who thinks releasing 2 physical keyboard "next gen" BlackBerry 10 devices in succession with NO sight or sound of any "next gen" full touch device is absolutely stupid? Don't get me wrong I'm sure the Passport and Classic are excellent devices but come on.... let's be real here... the physical keyboard group is truly just 1% ..... why cater their first 2 "next gen" devices to them? Where's the full touch screen love? I hope BlackBerry doesn't think the Z30 is enough to hold everyone over until their next full touch device (in BlackBerry terms, how long is that? Like 2 more years?) listen, I know the Z30 is a fantastic device (I have multiple) but if this is what they're thinking..... I think it's an extremely dangerous line to walk. At the least they should have released the Passport alongside their new full touch.

    What are your thoughts?

    Posted Securely Via BlackBerry 10.
    06-26-14 10:09 AM
  2. akabbani's Avatar
    Ummm, there's a Z3 LTE/Manitoba/JET which is going to be released later this year. That + the original Z3 which is making its way across several countries.

    So 2 Qwerty's and 2 full touch this year. You call that "NO sight or sound of a full touch"???

    Yes the Z3 will be duplicated to offer LTE but different people will have different reasons to buy each of them.

    Posted via My Beast Q10
    redsaph and eduzojordan like this.
    06-26-14 10:14 AM
  3. webber27's Avatar
    They released the Z30 about 7 months ago - a truly excellent phone - and no one except the most hard-core BB lovers bought one. Hardly any carriers even stocked them (just 1 in the US and online only) and BB surely lost a lot of money on the design and manufacturing. What has changed since then? Why would they want to repeat that story?

    A full touch will come again one day. But first the perception of BB needs to change. The Classic fills the needs of the niche market that has been asking for it, and the Passport is something that will turn heads and hopefully impress. The Z3-LTE should get BB10 in the hands of more people, and the Amazon deal will also help. Once all those things happen, things should change for the better and it'll be time for a new all-touch flagship for the masses. For now, it would make no sense to repeat the business failure that was the Z30. And don't get me wrong, I'm eagerly awaiting the next all-touch BB too.
    06-26-14 10:42 AM
  4. Master of Surgery's Avatar
    Ummm, there's a Z3 LTE/Manitoba/JET which is going to be released later this year. That + the original Z3 which is making its way across several countries.

    So 2 Qwerty's and 2 full touch this year. You call that "NO sight or sound of a full touch"???

    Yes the Z3 will be duplicated to offer LTE but different people will have different reasons to buy each of them.

    Posted via My Beast Q10
    Completely disagree with you. The Z3 is sorely outdated like the Z30 it's also a current generation device with lower specs than the Z30. Remember my friend, I'm referring to "next generation" devices. This rumored "Manitoba" is just that... STILL just a rumor. No leaked images or anything remotely close to confirmation that it will actually be produced.... and you stating that it (Manitoba) WILL be released "later this year" is absolutely laughable. Think about it, 2 devices that have been "rumored" and "leaked" over the past 12 months and just now been announced by BlackBerry are being released in September / October for the Passport and November / December for the Classic ....... yeah.... this "Manitoba" will NOT even come close to "later this year". This time next year is a little more believable. So these 2 devices you mentioned are completely irrelevant.

    Posted Securely Via BlackBerry 10.
    06-26-14 10:47 AM
  5. Master of Surgery's Avatar
    They released the Z30 about 7 months ago - a truly excellent phone - and no one except the most hard-core BB lovers bought one. Hardly any carriers even stocked them (just 1 in the US and online only) and BB surely lost a lot of money on the design and manufacturing. What has changed since then? Why would they want to repeat that story?

    A full touch will come again one day. But first the perception of BB needs to change. The Classic fills the needs of the niche market that has been asking for it, and the Passport is something that will turn heads and hopefully impress. The Z3-LTE should get BB10 in the hands of more people, and the Amazon deal will also help. Once all those things happen, things should change for the better and it'll be time for a new all-touch flagship for the masses. For now, it would make no sense to repeat the business failure that was the Z30. And don't get me wrong, I'm eagerly awaiting the next all-touch BB too.
    Interesting. This "niche" is 1%. Why cater to what this tiny ever shrinking group wants? "Turning heads"? Don't get me wrong, I would love nothing more than that to happen. Although every single BlackBerry 10 device to date had that same feeling and hope... sorry... we've been burned before. The Z3 better be absolutely dirt cheap in the LTE version to ever land in more consumers hands. My main concern here is... you talk about the Z3 and Amazon helping BlackBerry get into more hands..... thus getting more traction and exposure.... I get that.... my issue... why on earth would you take that gamble on a 2 devices that are the 1% and not the majority? Makes little sense.

    Posted Securely Via BlackBerry 10.
    06-26-14 10:57 AM
  6. webber27's Avatar
    Interesting. This "niche" is 1%. Why cater to what this tiny ever shrinking group wants? "Turning heads"? Don't get me wrong, I would love nothing more than that to happen. Although every single BlackBerry 10 device to date had that same feeling and hope... sorry... we've been burned before. The Z3 better be absolutely dirt cheap in the LTE version to ever land in more consumers hands. My main concern here is... you talk about the Z3 and Amazon helping BlackBerry get into more hands..... thus getting more traction and exposure.... I get that.... my issue... why on earth would you take that gamble on a 2 devices that are the 1% and not the majority? Makes little sense.

    Posted Securely Via BlackBerry 10.
    The niche I was talking about is enterprise users who wanted the trackpad back, not keyboard lovers. Although you could throw them in as well.

    The Z3 makes sense for emerging markets and since they already did the R&D for it, might as well add LTE and release it in North America.

    Anyway my main point is that the Z30 despite being an awesome, highly rated phone was a total commercial failure, and until things change it makes no sense to repeat that failure just to give us few BlackBerry enthusiasts a new device to play with. We want it, but almost no one else in the world does...

    Posted via CB10
    TgeekB likes this.
    06-26-14 01:05 PM
  7. itsyaboy's Avatar
    I think you are forgetting where the focus of BlackBerry primarily lies. The focus is to sell BES10 (and thus BES12) installations + productivity smartphones. With the hardware keyboard phones, I believe that they hope to cater to existing business users and maybe even sway some previous BlackBerry owners back.

    I do agree with your statement that BlackBerry will need a full touch phone eventually (and I have good hope that it is coming in 2015) but a full touch phone is primarily used in the consumer market. And 'regular' consumers are currently not the primary focus.

    So, be patient and enjoy your Z30. And what's up with everybody wanting a new phone each year? Do you really need that?
    eduzojordan and southlander like this.
    06-26-14 01:28 PM
  8. 21stNow's Avatar

    And what's up with everybody wanting a new phone each year? Do you really need that?
    No. I need a new phone each season. I'm going through withdrawals now because I didn't get a new phone this spring. ; )
    vvvhhh8 likes this.
    06-26-14 01:36 PM
  9. Powdah's Avatar
    Every enterprise user I know, and that includes me, wants screen size. I do not know one person who wants a physical keyboard. I know 45 person law firms who went from BB with keyboards to fruit to android to get larger screens.

    I want a high spec phablet. Android apps, BT keyboards, mice, and with tv screen monitors, connected to the office server all take resources past the OS needs.

    I want power with a 5.5" min of screen.
    06-26-14 01:44 PM
  10. itsyaboy's Avatar
    Every enterprise user I know, and that includes me, wants screen size. I do not know one person who wants a physical keyboard. I know 45 person law firms who went from BB with keyboards to fruit to android to get larger screens.

    I want a high spec phablet. Android apps, BT keyboards, mice, and with tv screen monitors, connected to the office server all take resources past the OS needs.

    I want power with a 5.5" min of screen.
    Sure, there are many different type of enterprise users. I can imagine that there is a substantial group that requires a full touch phone, but I believe the group which desires a hardware keyboard is substantial as well. And perhaps news form factors can be more rewarding to work on?

    I don't understand your last sentence... what is your point there? "Take resources past the OS needs"?
    06-26-14 01:50 PM
  11. bakron1's Avatar
    I agree that they should have updated the z30 with a quad core processor, 3 gigs of ram, 1080p and a HD display. Square it up like the passport and now you have a device that folks will look at.

    The main issue is you would have to bring it in below what the competition has or folks are going to jump over to Blackberry. I think $499.99 US would be perfect, with the iPhone and Galaxy S5 at or around 650 US. Now you have have folks looking at Blackberry, just my two cents.
    RH1Pearl likes this.
    06-26-14 01:57 PM
  12. anon(6038817)'s Avatar
    Let's be honest, here. They may have been great devices in their own right, but the Z10 and Z30 were both commercial failures. To try to right the ship, BlackBerry needs to focus on their strengths, one of which is physical keyboards.

    At this point, they can't focus too much on all touch without alienating their physical keyboard faithful. They need to keep their loyal base happy and try to stop the bleeding a bit. Releasing the Classic and Passport may seem counter intuitive, but it was the only sensible move BlackBerry could have made.

    That said, I think they are going to remain a niche player in the smartphone market for some time to come. They could release the most amazing all touch smartphone in terms of hardware and it would not help them grow market share at this point. The brand image itself has been too damaged. They've lost my generation (30s and younger) to Apple and Google and it will take a long time to undo that damage.

    Posted from my BlackBerry Z30 via Tapatalk
    gregsoledad likes this.
    06-26-14 02:20 PM
  13. amjass12's Avatar
    Your not the only one op!

    I am eagerly awaiting the super touch ( if it ever comes to existence) !

    Don't care much for the windermere as I an not into the physical key part anymore but.. the technology in the windermere is incredible.. screen shots of the so are amazing also and is only making me look forward to the full touch version of this!

    Posted via CB10
    06-26-14 02:29 PM
  14. TgeekB's Avatar
    As others have said, and BlackBerry themselves have said, they are focusing on their roots and enterprise. To them that means kb phones. They have lost the consumer war. This is their only chance to survive. A niche market yes, but one they may thrive in.

    Posted via my Nexus 10.
    06-26-14 02:48 PM
  15. Parrillas NY's Avatar
    I want a full touchscreen Z10i with 3gb Ram and 32 or 64gb of storage!! or Z30i the new generation of Blackberrys Z's
    06-26-14 02:51 PM
  16. Master of Surgery's Avatar
    No. I need a new phone each season. I'm going through withdrawals now because I didn't get a new phone this spring. ; )
    Ha Ha. Good one.

    Posted Securely Via BlackBerry 10.
    06-26-14 05:27 PM
  17. Master of Surgery's Avatar
    Let's be honest, here. They may have been great devices in their own right, but the Z10 and Z30 were both commercial failures. To try to right the ship, BlackBerry needs to focus on their strengths, one of which is physical keyboards.

    At this point, they can't focus too much on all touch without alienating their physical keyboard faithful. They need to keep their loyal base happy and try to stop the bleeding a bit. Releasing the Classic and Passport may seem counter intuitive, but it was the only sensible move BlackBerry could have made.

    That said, I think they are going to remain a niche player in the smartphone market for some time to come. They could release the most amazing all touch smartphone in terms of hardware and it would not help them grow market share at this point. The brand image itself has been too damaged. They've lost my generation (30s and younger) to Apple and Google and it will take a long time to undo that damage.

    Posted from my BlackBerry Z30 via Tapatalk
    Commercial failure? That was entirely BlackBerry's fault. Absolutely zero advertising.... come on... seemed liked BlackBerry themselves didn't even believe in the Z10 and especially the Z30 ... it wasn't the consumer.... it was the damn advertising.... or absolutely pathetic lack of it from BlackBerry. Their "loyal base" which by your comments means Trackpad and Keyboard users are nearly nonexistent and make up only 1%.

    Posted Securely Via BlackBerry 10.
    axe50 likes this.
    06-26-14 05:34 PM
  18. sianto's Avatar
    Am I the only one in here who thinks releasing 2 physical keyboard "next gen" BlackBerry 10 devices in succession with NO sight or sound of any "next gen" full touch device is absolutely stupid? Don't get me wrong I'm sure the Passport and Classic are excellent devices but come on.... let's be real here... the physical keyboard group is truly just 1% ..... why cater their first 2 "next gen" devices to them? Where's the full touch screen love? I hope BlackBerry doesn't think the Z30 is enough to hold everyone over until their next full touch device (in BlackBerry terms, how long is that? Like 2 more years?) listen, I know the Z30 is a fantastic device (I have multiple) but if this is what they're thinking..... I think it's an extremely dangerous line to walk. At the least they should have released the Passport alongside their new full touch.

    What are your thoughts?

    Posted Securely Via BlackBerry 10.
    Didn't Chen talk about (or hinting) a phablet?

    Posted via CB10
    06-26-14 05:43 PM
  19. Master of Surgery's Avatar
    Didn't Chen talk about (or hinting) a phablet?

    Posted via CB10
    Just little hunting at it. Nothing even close to substantial.

    Posted Securely Via BlackBerry 10.
    06-26-14 05:55 PM
  20. aha's Avatar
    I absolutely love my Z30 and have been longing for Z50 for a while now. BUT, if Chen's strategy gets BlackBerry back to profit, I don't mind waiting until next year for BlackBerry 's next generation touch device.

    Summer next year, that's how long I can wait while I keep asking "where is my Z50?" in all sorts of threads. lol.
    bb_fever likes this.
    06-26-14 06:07 PM
  21. sfcramsey's Avatar
    I too am begging for a new power house all touch. My wife's company (a tech company) left BB for Androids bigger screens and what not. Very few of them want a keyboard as they have all adapted to the world of touch. My wife's email is absurd as in over two hundred messages a day. The screen size allows her to be more efficient in reviewing emails and she like her colleges can pound out emails on the touch screens. It is amazing to watch them type, she is fast, but the young guns are stupid fast. The passport will have little to no impact meaning the OP is spot on; as usable viewing space is more important to both business and everyday consumers. All of us touch screen fans understand the position of the die hard keyboard lovers, and not all of us hate the keyboard phones. I love BB10 and want it to be successful, and have to be honest with myself even if they offered a true high end all touch would it sale. The short answer is probably not, but boy do I want one. Just like all the keyboard lovers want one, I sincerely hope it answers the mail for the hold outs (Classic) in addition I hope the passport fills the high end request for the key board lovers. And next year if we all touch guys get a new powerhouse be happy for us and let's hope BlackBerry can regain some respect........
    06-26-14 07:07 PM
  22. Master of Surgery's Avatar
    I too am begging for a new power house all touch. My wife's company (a tech company) left BB for Androids bigger screens and what not. Very few of them want a keyboard as they have all adapted to the world of touch. My wife's email is absurd as in over two hundred messages a day. The screen size allows her to be more efficient in reviewing emails and she like her colleges can pound out emails on the touch screens. It is amazing to watch them type, she is fast, but the young guns are stupid fast. The passport will have little to no impact meaning the OP is spot on; as usable viewing space is more important to both business and everyday consumers. All of us touch screen fans understand the position of the die hard keyboard lovers, and not all of us hate the keyboard phones. I love BB10 and want it to be successful, and have to be honest with myself even if they offered a true high end all touch would it sale. The short answer is probably not, but boy do I want one. Just like all the keyboard lovers want one, I sincerely hope it answers the mail for the hold outs (Classic) in addition I hope the passport fills the high end request for the key board lovers. And next year if we all touch guys get a new powerhouse be happy for us and let's hope BlackBerry can regain some respect........
    Nicely said. I know of at least one business and own one myself that have absolutely NO interest in a physical keyboard. We just want the already bulletproof and unmatched security that BlackBerry offers. We would gladly upgrade to a "next gen" full touch device. I think everyone here including BlackBerry themselves are sorely mistaken thinking that ALL enterprise and business users require or want ONLY a physical keyboard. It's a dying niche for a reason.

    Posted Securely Via BlackBerry 10.
    pystha likes this.
    06-26-14 07:21 PM
  23. lift's Avatar
    Nicely said. I know of at least one business and own one myself that have absolutely NO interest in a physical keyboard. We just want the already bulletproof and unmatched security that BlackBerry offers. We would gladly upgrade to a "next gen" full touch device. I think everyone here including BlackBerry themselves are sorely mistaken thinking that ALL enterprise and business users require or want ONLY a physical keyboard. It's a dying niche for a reason.

    Posted Securely Via BlackBerry 10.
    Very nicely said. I agree 100% with everything you have said in this thread. I love my Z30. I also have many of them along with my Z10's. I am a BlackBerry fan. I love the devices and the company and I support them with my money. But I have to also say I think they are making a huge mistake. Most people laugh at keyboard phones. Sorry BlackBerry but it's the truth. So many people have become accustomed to all touch devices that when they see a keyboard device they think old tech. That's why I have had a lot of people say to me "what kind of phone is that, it's nice" and when I tell them it's a BlackBerry Z30 they are shocked. They think of BlackBerry's as old keyboard phones. BlackBerry should have put out ONE high end keyboard phone to please that very small segment, and at least one high end all touch, large screen (at least 5") device and advertise it. This would keep the diehard physical keyboard people satisfied and will hopefully attract some new BlackBerry users with a state of the art all touch device.
    06-26-14 09:48 PM
  24. Master of Surgery's Avatar
    Very nicely said. I agree 100% with everything you have said in this thread. I love my Z30. I also have many of them along with my Z10's. I am a BlackBerry fan. I love the devices and the company and I support them with my money. But I have to also say I think they are making a huge mistake. Most people laugh at keyboard phones. Sorry BlackBerry but it's the truth. So many people have become accustomed to all touch devices that when they see a keyboard device they think old tech. That's why I have had a lot of people say to me "what kind of phone is that, it's nice" and when I tell them it's a BlackBerry Z30 they are shocked. They think of BlackBerry's as old keyboard phones. BlackBerry should have put out ONE high end keyboard phone to please that very small segment, and at least one high end all touch, large screen (at least 5") device and advertise it. This would keep the diehard physical keyboard people satisfied and will hopefully attract some new BlackBerry users with a state of the art all touch device.

    Absolutely agree.

    Posted Securely Via BlackBerry 10.
    lift likes this.
    06-26-14 10:43 PM
  25. targnik's Avatar
    Specs get the masses rollin in + access to apps...

    BlackBerry Ph's compared to other top end devices (spec wise) just don't cut it... although I've always been content to wait a few cycles for the ph I want - so the price reduces.

    RIM (are they taking it back?) are not (according to the hype) in a strong enough position to invest in top-of-the-line gear... they're hitting less developed markets and putting out mid-range gear to get some bling in the old coffers.

    Once they've regrouped and gathered their strength they can then take on the big boys.

    Z10STL100-2/10.2.1.3175
    06-26-14 11:22 PM
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