[codiak]

The way I see it, in some ways RIM are their own worst enemy, BB10 is being talked about and shown to the public GREAT!

However the average user will be looking at it this way.... Well if I get an in market BB7 device, in most cases I will have to sign up for a 2 year contract!!!! After that most apps they buy WONT get to run on the new platform, unless the devs make new versions.

If RIM truly want to turn some of that inventory into cash - they need to be all over the operators getting attractive 12 MONTH deals out there.

This obviously wont apply for people out there where money is no object, that concludes my input for today..... discuss.

[belfastdispatcher]

It's catch 22, how can you get customers excited about the new BB10 without putting them off BB7.

[Superfly_FR]

The way I see it, in some ways RIM are their own worst enemy, BB10 is being talked about and shown to the public GREAT!

However the average user will be looking at it this way.... Well if I get an in market BB7 device, in most cases I will have to sign up for a 2 year contract!!!! After that most apps they buy WONT get to run on the new platform, unless the devs make new versions.

If RIM truly want to turn some of that inventory into cash - they need to be all over the operators getting attractive 12 MONTH deals out there.

This obviously wont apply for people out there where money is no object, that concludes my input for today..... discuss.

[Speculations]
RIM will probably make an incentive action like "free upgrade to BB7/99xx for fleets" . This will both demonstrate the device as being "better than any previous BB device" by spreading it to the street and sustain corporate subscriptions for cash.

We don't know yet T. Heins' plans for loyal (non enterprise) customers, but he clearly stated that it's a major concern for RIM. So maybe there will be an "upgrade discount" for BB7 devices holders ... but I think it'll be more easy to setup as a discounted device price than a specific contract. In other words, IMHO, it may come, but after BB10 devices release.

[codiak]

Im just thinking about those out there who are sitting right now with BB6 devices, most of who took out two year deals for bold and torch devices. They know they want a high-end device over say the curve, but have no incentive to drop their BB6 device for BB7 knowing that BB10 is coming.

So for RIM and to a lesser extent retailers with existing stock, there needs to be an incentive to do so.

[madman0141]

They will probably offer a rebate to upgrade from 7 to 10. It is what it is.

[brucep1]

They will probably offer a rebate to upgrade from 7 to 10. It is what it is.

Highly doubtful. At least there's been no indication that this was happening.

And we've stumbled upon RIM's biggest blunder after the PlayBook launch. Making the OS7 devices incapable of running any OS other than 7 was a HUGE mistake. Why would I go get locked into a 2 year contract on an OS7 device?

I get it, the devices were a stopgap. They don't have the hardware to run BB10. But it's undeniable that its limited OS life is hurting its sales. RIM may have gotten away with doing stuff like this before, but it's a different market now than it was 3 years ago.

[EdwardC]

I totally agree that RIM is between a rock and a hard place at the moment. My Torch 9800 broke a few weeks ago so I'm back on my old iPhone 3gs until I can renew my contract which is in December. The good news is I will have had time to decide which route I want to go with BB10 or iOS6, even if AT&T offered me a 9900 for free I wouldnt commit to signing up for another 2 years at this point with a new O.S. just months away.

[Spencerdl]

Highly doubtful. At least there's been no indication that this was happening.

And we've stumbled upon RIM's biggest blunder after the PlayBook launch. Making the OS7 devices incapable of running any OS other than 7 was a HUGE mistake. Why would I go get locked into a 2 year contract on an OS7 device?

I get it, the devices were a stopgap. They don't have the hardware to run BB10. But it's undeniable that its limited OS life is hurting its sales. RIM may have gotten away with doing stuff like this before, but it's a different market now than it was 3 years ago.

I disagree, contrary to "Crackberry" belief, most consumers don't by phones every six months (slight exaggeration), and don't need or want the latest, greatest next best thing, every twelve months. Most "adults" keep their phones for the term of their contract and beyond (other bills). RIM has offered incentives before for upgrades and it will happen again. BB10 hopefully will increase RIM's north American market, but it's not the only market on the planet, other countries are growing in the cell phone market and they will need those outdated north American OS7 devices. Of course all of our OPINIONS are pure speculation and I hope RIM is able to bounce back because I like their products

[Italianemperor]

How about selling some of the devices directly? I would buy a torch 9850 or bold 9930 without contract.

[James Nieves]

RIM needs to give away all the excess inventory pimp BB10.
I'm sorry but trying to sell 100$ BB7 devices just wont fly with anyone. Consumers will buy a 100$ Iphone 4 before they consider BB. RIM should seed the phones to enterprise and then when BB10 comes out give them a real offering

[harshalbid271]

I think offering upgrades from OS7 to BB10 would be much better than selling the OS7 devices for cheap. Not only would it help them sell the current devices but also boost the BB10 user base when it launches.

[brucep1]

I disagree, contrary to "Crackberry" belief, most consumers don't by phones every six months (slight exaggeration), and don't need or want the latest, greatest next best thing, every twelve months. Most "adults" keep their phones for the term of their contract and beyond (other bills). RIM has offered incentives before for upgrades and it will happen again. BB10 hopefully will increase RIM's north American market, but it's not the only market on the planet, other countries are growing in the cell phone market and they will need those outdated north American OS7 devices. Of course all of our OPINIONS are pure speculation and I hope RIM is able to bounce back because I like their products

I think you're agreeing with my post. Since users usually ride out the term of their contract, having a device that will be obsolete in 6 months will hurt sales. Obsolete meaning stuck on an OS.

[Superfly_FR]

I think you're agreeing with my post. Since users usually ride out the term of their contract, having a device that will be obsolete in 6 months will hurt sales. Obsolete meaning stuck on an OS.

Several markets in several places with each specific needs.
I don't believe the (large) enterprises will jump on BB10 ship for its first iteration.
If RIM abandon BB7 ... this is the end. They have to keep it alive and in good shape (refers to the 200 people dedicated team) both to maintain corporate market and satisfy some countries where both the cost and the technology (networks) are perfectly in line with BB7 specs.
These devices can be offered for cheap now ... inventory "advantage".
Add the physical keyboard fans and you get the picture ...

[brucep1]

Several markets in several places with each specific needs.
I don't believe the (large) enterprises will jump on BB10 ship for its first iteration.
If RIM abandon BB7 ... this is the end. They have to keep it alive and in good shape (refers to the 200 people dedicated team) both to maintain corporate market and satisfy some countries where both the cost and the technology (networks) are perfectly in line with BB7 specs.
These devices can be offered for cheap now ... inventory "advantage".
Add the physical keyboard fans and you get the picture ...

I'm not saying abandon BB7, I'm saying they should have futureproofed their devices. Just my opinion, but I think this is a very undderated mistake that they made.

[sleepngbear]

I'm not saying abandon BB7, I'm saying they should have futureproofed their devices. Just my opinion, but I think this is a very undderated mistake that they made.

Who else future-proofs their devices? Surely not Android manufacturers, as that's one of the biggest complaints about the platform; and don't suggest Apple, because the updated OS's old iPhones get are watered-down shadows of the same versions on newer iPhones. Very few manufacturers do it. Fact is, despite not receiving the newest OS's, older BB's are among the most durable and longest-lasting phones out there. I'll even go as far as to suggest that this at least partially the reason for poor sales of new BB's, combined with the fact that most people don't know the difference between old and new BB's. Which also gets into the whole argument of doing things to encourage new phone purchases now that will DIScourage the purchases of new phones later. I.e., future-proofing phones now takes away a lot of the incentive to buy a newer phone later. You can't have it both ways.

[Spencerdl]

I'm not saying abandon BB7, I'm saying they should have futureproofed their devices. Just my opinion, but I think this is a very undderated mistake that they made.

I'm not really sure what you're saying??,

[codiak]

I just think that right now, there is a sweet spot.... users who bought Torch 9800 devices and Bold 9780 devices will be coming out of contracts or already have just finished them.

I really don't think these users will sign up to another two year term knowing that BB10 is coming. They may sign up to a 12 month term with a new device then switch to BB10 once that ends.

That way you get inventory into cash.

[brucep1]

Who else future-proofs their devices? Surely not Android manufacturers, as that's one of the biggest complaints about the platform; and don't suggest Apple, because the updated OS's old iPhones get are watered-down shadows of the same versions on newer iPhones. Very few manufacturers do it. Fact is, despite not receiving the newest OS's, older BB's are among the most durable and longest-lasting phones out there. I'll even go as far as to suggest that this at least partially the reason for poor sales of new BB's, combined with the fact that most people don't know the difference between old and new BB's. Which also gets into the whole argument of doing things to encourage new phone purchases now that will DIScourage the purchases of new phones later. I.e., future-proofing phones now takes away a lot of the incentive to buy a newer phone later. You can't have it both ways.

A couple of Android phones can be upgraded to Ice Cream Sandwich, either now or sometime in the future.

The water downed version of iOS 5 works great on my iphone 4. Not sure what features I'm missing comparied with iOS 5 on the 4s, but whatever it is I don't think its much.

So, Motorolla, Samsung, and Apple do it. Maybe HTC? I'm not sure.

I know the reality is that often times the newer OS's don't work perfectly on older versions of a phone. I get that. But it's nice to have the upgrade option. Shows some loyalty towards customers.

[brucep1]

I'm not really sure what you're saying??,

I'm saying part of the reason OS7 isn't selling is because people don't want to get locked into a contract right now when BB10 is being shown off and won't be available on BB7 devices.

[Superfly_FR]

I'm not saying abandon BB7, I'm saying they should have futureproofed their devices. Just my opinion, but I think this is a very undderated mistake that they made.

While BB10 won't run on BB7 devices, who said the U.I can't be revamped ?
A cascade-like interface may give this whole line a brand new rebirth #justsayin.

[brucep1]

While BB10 won't run on BB7 devices, who said the U.I can't be revamped ?
A cascade-like interface may give this whole line a brand new rebirth #justsayin.

If that was indeed the plan, RIM would have said so already.