[TgeekB]

Really? And just whom in the Cell phone industry controls what and how Blackberry advertises? Sorry, but that makes no sense whatsoever. BB made a strategic decision, and it bit them in the @ss. Blackberry got sloppy, complaisaint, and thought that they did not need to innovate, and it ended up biting them hard. Just look at Palm. Sorry, there is no "smoke filled room" of cell phone execs that can tell a company NOT to advertise. BB just f**ked up, pure and simple.

There's a secret society of cell phone cultists who meet yearly in a secret basement below as a secret castle in the woods......just to decide to shut out Blackberry from the secret society.

Everyone knows this.

[murphcid]

I need a new keyboard, I just sprayed tea all over mine ROTFLMAO!

There's a secret society of cell phone cultists who meet yearly in a secret basement below as a secret castle in the woods......just to decide to shut out Blackberry from the secret society.

Everyone knows this.

[Emaderton3]

But even if they marketed a ton, who is going to buy a phone with the hopes that it will one day get the apps they want? I don't see the average consumer taking that risk. If I need a computer that has to have Microsoft Office, I'm probably not going to buy some new OS with the hope that one day I can use my computer for what I actually bought it for.

Posted via CB10

[sentimentGX4]

If Coca Cola can sell millions of sodas even when people know they are bad for their health, so everything is marketable with a good marketing campaign.

The idea that marketing was Blackberry's most major flaw is laughable. The cold hard truth is that the most distinctive feature of the BB10 OS, gestures, was copied from WebOS and Meego.

If it were just Blackberry, okay. But when Blackberry, Nokia, and Palm can't sell their phone it should be a pattern to indicate that the problem isn't the marketing. Consumers simply don't care about the product.

[crackberry_geek]

The idea that marketing was Blackberry's most major flaw is laughable. The cold hard truth is that the most distinctive feature of the BB10 OS, gestures, was copied from WebOS and Meego.

If it were just Blackberry, okay. But when Blackberry, Nokia, and Palm can't sell their phone it should be a pattern to indicate that the problem isn't the marketing. Consumers simply don't care about the product.

What is laughable is expecting something to sell when no longer knows it exists.

Posted via CB10

[early2bed]

What is laughable is expecting something to sell when no longer knows it exists.

Most CrackBerrians' families, friends, and coworkers almost certainly know that new BlackBerry phones exist yet I'm sure the vast majority use other platforms.

[Superfly_FR]

I think this is the bottom line. As soon as BlackBerry saw the return rate, they knew no amount of advertising was going to make BB10 a success. There's no point in burning money to get people to buy the phones if they're quickly going to return them when they discover their limitations. It's worse than never having sold them in the first place, since it makes some people less likely to buy another BlackBerry in the future, and it creates grief for carriers.

We don't have, and probably never will have, real numbers on returns and retentions for BB10 (or any other) devices, but I'm personally convinced that the return rate was very high. If the return rate for the Priv is comparably high, we'll see the advertising fade out quickly. It just makes no sense to do otherwise. I hope, however, that the Priv does better.

I'm not sure whether the return rate or other factor did it.
But I do believe there has been an "emergency stop" (just after the Super Bowl ad) which I'll sum-up in "wait a minute ... we're not set to go full throttle, people and devs don't get it", months before John Chen joined the company.
I'm also pretty sure, by these times, Android track was already widely investigated as in : "should we spend the money to advertise or to try to [figure out if we can ] port Android ?"

What I mean here is that it's logical we don't have a similar campaign for Priv.
Priv is aimed at most where BB10 (after the SB add) has been restrained to enterprises and marketing efforts/expenses were hidden from the general public as they were more driven by sales forces on the field and product marketing (fleet bundles, 9720, migration deals ...) than 4X3 prints and TV ads.

As I mentioned before, we should start to observe the "never known level of marketing expenses" for the Priv starting ... now.

[Superfly_FR]

Sorry, but Coca cola is garbage and still has millionaire sales.
Posted via CB10

This is not how it works (IMHO & respectfully).
You describe Coke as garbage - and you're most likely right - if you consider the health POV.

But that's only part of the story.
Coke success is expanded by several promises; "pleasure", "uniqueness", "universality" and "social marker" (that's only examples).
Pleasure : that's mostly sugar (or derivatives). We all know how pleasant (and addictive) it can be.
Uniqueness : most tried but never succeeded to obtain the same flavor (create a myth : "the secret receipt")
Universality : Ask someone "a Coke ?", you'll get a yes/no answer, not a "what's that ?" (and in several areas : "wow, yes, I'd love to").
Social marker : Are you Coke or Pepsi ?

So your reasoning makes sense, but you omit that advertised promises must have legs. Or they flop, sooner than later. And, at the end of the day, Coke is an affordable fits-most (felt as) refreshing and festive beverage.
Coke delivers the goods.

[about Apple, Jobs and so on]
Marketing is observation; it can bet on future trends but it's not a matter of "creativity".
Jobs was a marketing genius, one step ahead of competitors. He had a vision, he knew how to anticipate users' attempts and limitations. His POV was "usability" focused.
Creativity was in the hands of competitors (yes, like RIM but also Xerox, Braun and so many others) and people like Steve Wozniak and Jonathan Ive.
He - brilliantly - orchestrated the mix of these precursor's ideas and (let's be honest) led some of them to the next level by challenging those in the knowledge.
We have to reckon his "secret receipt": he anticipated how selfish we'll all turn into ... "I" is for "me", "my precious". The device as an extension of self, the kind you'll find with Harley Davidson, but for Joes, as a massive social marker flag.

Bottom line : Just replace Coke with iPhone above ... See how it's similar ?

[Sridhara Shankara]

Yeah BBRY top management should own up to the fact that they mothballed a very good in fact a futuristic OS. They definitely are culpable

[Sridhara Shankara]

I do not agree you can't put Nokia, Palm together with blackberry. BBRY is class apart, some part of the blame should be apportioned to top echelons of BBRY

[Tre Lawrence]

Yeah BBRY top management should own up to the fact that they mothballed a very good in fact a futuristic OS. They definitely are culpable

For shelving a failed product? Shareholders might see it differently.

[JeepBB]

Hmmm... If I'm not mistaken, BlackBerry was the trendy one during the BBOS years. Then that nosedived during the BB10 era.

Not just trendy, but aspirational.

Getting a company-issued BB back in the day was a sure sign that you were on the executive fast track.

[Tre Lawrence]

Not just trendy, but aspirational.

Getting a company-issued BB back in the day was a sure sign that you were on the executive fast track.

I fondly recall people buying dummy BlackBerry devices on eBay.

[anon(55900)]

Looking at instagram, they're putting the priv on the subway in new york, billboards, this and that. Why didn't they do this for bb10?!

Posted via CB10

Why whine over the past? Blackberry failed because of those original two, you know who, who couldn't react fast enough to a competitor. Any thing beyond, those first two, you know who, and you have new folks trying to salvage a major fugu.

[jyrbain]

I concur. There were many BB10 and Z10 ads in Vancouver BC.

[domokeats09]

For shelving a failed product? Shareholders might see it differently.

For not bothering to try and sell and a good product. Innovators will disagree.

 PassportSQW100-1/10.3.2.2639 

[domokeats09]

I concur. There were many BB10 and Z10 ads in Vancouver BC.

Concurrence is an agreement

 PassportSQW100-1/10.3.2.2639 

[Tre Lawrence]

For not bothering to try and sell and a good product. Innovators will disagree.

BB10 was never going to sell. BBRY tried, but the writing was on the wall quite early.

[Aman Darred]

I'm not an instagram user but just had a look at Blackberry's instagram page. They have some pretty cool billboards running in big cities. One of my favorites says "Come Home".

Neat stuff.

Posted via CB10

[domokeats09]

BB10 was never going to sell. BBRY tried, but the writing was on the wall quite early.

ANYTHING can sell with good marketing. Anything. The only reason BlackBerry 10 never sold is because no body knew about it! Still no one knows about it!

Not saying it would've been able to compete entirely with iOS or Droid, but the biggest smartphone giant releasing the best mobile OS available and still dropping to less than 1% market share equals bad marketing plain and simple.

 PassportSQW100-1/10.3.2.2639 

[blackberrybrad]

ANYTHING can sell with good marketing. Anything. The only reason BlackBerry 10 never sold is because no body knew about it! Still no one knows about it!

Not saying it would've been able to compete entirely with iOS or Droid, but the biggest smartphone giant releasing the best mobile OS available and still dropping to less than 1% market share equals bad marketing plain and simple.

 PassportSQW100-1/10.3.2.2639 

Yeah that is still not true. Lots of marketing doesn't equal product success.

Posted via CB10

[DrBoomBotz]

ANYTHING can sell with good marketing. Anything. The only reason BlackBerry 10 never sold is because no body knew about it! Still no one knows about it!

Not saying it would've been able to compete entirely with iOS or Droid, but the biggest smartphone giant releasing the best mobile OS available and still dropping to less than 1% market share equals bad marketing plain and simple.

 PassportSQW100-1/10.3.2.2639 

So making a good product is a waste of money that should on be invested in marketing?

[early2bed]

ANYTHING can sell with good marketing. Anything. The only reason BlackBerry 10 never sold is because no body knew about it! Still no one knows about it!

So we gave you $1000 to use to market BB10 at your home, school, or work you could get half of them to switch platforms?

[JeepBB]

I fondly recall people buying dummy BlackBerry devices on eBay.

Heh-heh... reminds me of an incident, way back, when mobiles were the preserve of the rich and famous... or Execs with generous employers.

I was on a train, where a guy in a suit was talking (loudly and obviously) on his mobile phone a few seats down. One of the other passengers had a bit of a funny turn... no problem, just ask the guy with the mobile to phone ahead and get an ambulance to meet us at the next station. Except, much to everyone's contempt it turned out to be a dummy phone!

The conductor got the driver to radio ahead, so everything turned out OK. And the suit with the phone became "invisible" for the rest of the journey. LOL.

[Superfly_FR]

ANYTHING can sell with good marketing. Anything.

Marketing 101 : the opposite of what you wrote.