What are they not telling us?

**app_Developer** · 06-28-2012, 05:27 PM

Originally Posted by katiepea

not yet, though when they sell it will add to their value. the more they lose the more the foreseeable profit for an acquisition like that disappears though.

I don't think there is a technology company outside of Canada, or outside of the 1990s, who would pay for QNX, except as an entry into the automotive electronics market.

The value of RIM to whomever buys it will be their network and BBM. The automotive business is just a rounding error.

**BlackStormRising** · 06-28-2012, 05:27 PM

Originally Posted by chrism_scotland

Apparantly "RIM only went as far as to say that the integration of some key BlackBerry 10 features and the "associated large volume of code" has "proven to be more time consuming than anticipated."

Sounds like BBM to me.

And it hasn't made it onto Playbook yet, after 14 months.

**bk1022** · 06-28-2012, 05:30 PM

Consumer devices can be released without BES/BIS. Ship a freaking device. Thor needs a kick in the head, something is fundamentally wrong with the way RIM management thinks. If Jobs' spirit could take over Thor's body, a BB10 phone would be released by September.

Can anyone explain to me why the SEC isn't investigating Thorstein? As soon as he was aware there would be a delay in BB10 phone shipments -- as a material change to business -- he was obligated to issue a press release.

**chrism_scotland** · 06-28-2012, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by bk1022

Consumer devices can be released without BES/BIS. Ship a freaking device. Thor needs a kick in the head, something is fundamentally wrong with the way RIM management thinks. If Jobs' spirit could take over Thor's body, a BB10 phone would be released by September.

Can anyone explain to me why the SEC isn't investigating Thorstein? As soon as he was aware there would be a delay in BB10 phone shipments -- as a material change to business -- he was obligated to issue a press release.

I don't see how a Blackberry consumer focused or not can ship without BES/BIS?

**jd914** · 06-28-2012, 05:33 PM

Originally Posted by bk1022

Consumer devices can be released without BES/BIS. Ship a freaking device. Thor needs a kick in the head, something is fundamentally wrong with the way RIM management thinks. If Jobs' spirit could take over Thor's body, a BB10 phone would be released by September.

Can anyone explain to me why the SEC isn't investigating Thorstein? As soon as he was aware there would be a delay in BB10 phone shipments -- as a material change to business -- he was obligated to issue a press release.

Now he should be investigated by the SEC? Just a few months ago he was revered here on Crackberry and hailed as a great CEO and the guy that would turn RIM around. I guess not...

**katiepea** · 06-28-2012, 05:35 PM

Originally Posted by JD914

Now he should be investigated by the SEC? Just a few months ago he was revered here on Crackberry and hailed as a great CEO and the guy that would turn RIM around. I guess not...

that was funny wasn't it? the guy that brought you the storm, storm 2, and tour now bring you the hail mary to save RIM..

**njblackberry** · 06-28-2012, 05:36 PM

I'd bet that Class Action lawsuits are already in the works.
Unfortunate as that will further distract management and cost them more money.

**louzer** · 06-28-2012, 05:39 PM

I tuned in to the call about 15 minutes late. I didn't hear anything about the Playbook. Was there at least any news on 2.1? I assume that if it's still coming, it will include Bridge SMS but not BBM. If they're unclear on the future of BB10, I'd at least like to see the Playbook OS get leaned out. If Chris' statements at the end of the podcast hold any water about RIM being more like Microsoft than Palm, then at least a new Playbook OS might generate some positive buzz within this cespool of bad news.

When they say that they are focusing all resources on the completion of BB10, I hope they're also not telling us that they're abandoning the Playbook.

**jd914** · 06-28-2012, 05:41 PM

Originally Posted by katiepea

not yet, though when they sell it will add to their value. the more they lose the more the foreseeable profit for an acquisition like that disappears though.

I guess Thorsten is going to suffer the same e-lynching that his predecessors suffered. Time to get the popcorn and watch, this should be a hoot.

**katiepea** · 06-28-2012, 05:41 PM

Originally Posted by louzer

I tuned in to the call about 15 minutes late. I didn't hear anything about the Playbook. Was there at least any news on 2.1? I assume that if it's still coming, it will include Bridge SMS but not BBM. If they're unclear on the future of BB10, I'd at least like to see the Playbook OS get leaned out. If Chris' statements at the end of the podcast hold any water about RIM being more like Microsoft than Palm, then at least a new Playbook OS might generate some positive buzz within this cespool of bad news.

When they say that they are focusing all resources on the completion of BB10, I hope they're also not telling us that they're abandoning the Playbook.

i can't bring myself to fathom RIM caring all that much about a product that shipped 216,000 units last quarter. after laying 7,000 people off, watching billions in revenue disappear, and their stock dip in to $7 range, i would more be expecting a device that fails to sell a quarter million units to be discontinued.

**h20work** · 06-28-2012, 05:42 PM

Originally Posted by Foreverup

To you it's confirmed I guess but you telling me it is confirmed doesn't make me believe it.

Also why did they need to confirm to you RIM was using a demo app. Couldn't you tell by every demo video being exactly the same.

You could make a case the RIM is lying to investors if they are trying to sell a fake product, I'm almost positive that is illegal.

So you are saying you don't believe it and then ask me why I needed confirmation because the demos clearly show it? Seems legit

**njblackberry** · 06-28-2012, 05:44 PM

They sold 250,000 PlayBooks in the quarter.
Every resource they have has got to be working on BB 10 and their delayed shipping date.
I'd be shocked if they invested anything in the PlayBook.

**h20work** · 06-28-2012, 05:47 PM

Originally Posted by JD914

I guess Thorsten is going to suffer the same e-lynching that his predecessors suffered. Time to get the popcorn and watch, this should be a hoot.

Better throw a bag in the microwave now, it won't take long...

**madman0141** · 06-28-2012, 05:47 PM

Originally Posted by katiepea

what they aren't telling you is that likely the losses have mounted so high that they can't forecast profit even with the release of bb10. they have 0 reason to expect it to get them out of the red, out of hundreds of millions lost in operating profits and billions lost in revenue. why manufacture a product that you can't predict will make you money, especially after you've hired a consulting firm who is likely pointing you towards something that WILL make the board money, a sale/split.

I was mad when I heard BB10 was delayed now I am just sick to death of RIM. Sorry I'm just mad.

**ccbs** · 06-28-2012, 05:53 PM

The hit in consumer and potential purchaser confidence gonna be deadly. I believe a lot of business and government are already worry about the financial health before this, now this news pretty much put a stop on most of their purchase. With no new revenue stream and dwindling subscribers revenue, RIMM is bound for another even worse quarter ahead.
I seriously don't see them get through this themselves. They need help.

**dannyjoebrown** · 06-28-2012, 05:55 PM

How come bb's are so featured on UK tv. They sponsor movies and have commercials that make them seem or maybe seen. Why don't they buy ad time in the US

**h20work** · 06-28-2012, 05:58 PM

Originally Posted by dannyjoebrown

How come bb's are so featured on UK tv. They sponsor movies and have commercials that make them seem or maybe seen. Why don't they buy ad time in the US

My guess, they don't have anything worth advertising at this point. The current product line is pretty stale.

**the_sleuth** · 06-28-2012, 06:05 PM

I have not listened to the conference call yet. So no new products for remainder of 2012? No PlayBook LTE, no PlayBook 2?

New Chief but same old tribe at RIM, cannot execute. Again I feel sorry for CrackBerry team, difficult to believe in what RIM management keeps spinning turd.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9860 using Tapatalk

**Foreverup** · 06-28-2012, 06:09 PM

Originally Posted by h20work

So you are saying you don't believe it and then ask me why I needed confirmation because the demos clearly show it? Seems legit

You stated BB10 doesn't even exist, that are just saying it's coming to up their value. Sorry if I'm a little skeptical of your statements

Sent from my BlackBerry 9810 using Tapatalk

**DuexNoir** · 06-28-2012, 06:12 PM

If you go back and listen to the BB World Jam in Florida, Heinz said he promised that they will meet their deadline. He said they were on track...so with this delay, I wonder what went wrong? Surely, Heinz isn't foolish enough to say all that when he knew it couldn't be true?

Anyway, this will surely put an even greater doubt in developers' minds about developing for BB now...certainly doesn't help their cause (actually makes it more difficult) to expand their ecosystem.

**bk1022** · 06-28-2012, 06:12 PM

Originally Posted by chrism_scotland

I don't see how a Blackberry consumer focused or not can ship without BES/BIS?

It can ship the same way every other phone can ship without BIS. It's really VERY simple. You can buy a license for an email client in 10 seconds, and hack something into BBM to make it ship.

I can't, for the life of me believe that this is even the issue anyway. If six months ago, they said, hey, buy an OS7 phone and we'll give your carrier a $200 rebate if you upgrade to a BB10 phone in Q3, I'd have an OS7 phone already. That would probably have cost RIM $500 million for the North American market if AND ONLY IF they actually sell BB10 phones and dig themselves out of a the hole they put themselves in.

This is almost a lesson on how to p*ss off consumers and developers all at once.

**app_Developer** · 06-28-2012, 06:20 PM

Originally Posted by DuexNoir

If you go back and listen to the BB World Jam in Florida, Heinz said he promised that they will meet their deadline. He said they were on track...so with this delay, I wonder what went wrong? Surely, Heinz isn't foolish enough to say all that when he knew it couldn't be true?

He also told us the build we got there was old, not the latest, because they didn't want to give away any secrets. I think we can safely say that was a lie.

Maybe internally other people are lying to Heins.

**wayoung** · 06-28-2012, 06:23 PM

Originally Posted by app_Developer

He also told us the build we got there was old, not the latest, because they didn't want to give away any secrets. I think we can safely say that was a lie.

Maybe internally other people are lying to Heins.

It wasn't a lie, the secret is that the OS doesn't work!

**anthogag** · 06-28-2012, 06:39 PM

I think, as was previously mentioned, they are getting caught-up in trying to make it perfect

They should release a stripped-down version of what they're aiming for and release the dev alpha device to consumers. Now they have a name...they could call it BlackBerry Alpha.

Even a modified version of the playbook on the phone would be okay.

IMO, this delay is Thorsten's first real failure. Release a stripped-down version that works on a high spec device and give us software updates

I'm still staying with BlackBerry...my OS7 device is still an excellent communicator

**wayoung** · 06-28-2012, 06:47 PM

Originally Posted by anthogag

I think, as was previously mentioned, they are getting caught-up in trying to make it perfect

They should release a stripped-down version of what they're aiming for and release the dev alpha device to consumers. Now they have a name...they could call it BlackBerry Alpha.

Even a modified version of the playbook on the phone would be okay.

IMO, this delay is Thorsten's first real failure. Release a stripped-down version that works on a high spec device and give us software updates

I'm still staying with BlackBerry...my OS7 device is still an excellent communicator

It doesn't sound like they are trying to make it perfect to me - it sounds like they are trying to make it work, nd failing, and lying about it for 8 months now.

My OS 5 is not still an excellent communicator and can't justify spending the same amount of money on a 9900 this November when I can upgrade as it would cost me to buy a Windows 8 phone.