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  1. xnwrx's Avatar
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    Default OMAP4470, Snapdragon MSM8960... !

    Well, we know that the Playbook is running OMAP4430 and Playbook 4G is running OMAP4460. We know that Dev Alpha A is running OMAP4460 Soc and we've heard that Dev Alpha B is running OMAP4470 Soc.
    Finaly we've read that BB10 L serie will run MSM8960 Soc !!!

    The fact is that BB10 OS is currently running on OMAP SoCs with TI architecture and SGX530/544 3D. So what about MSM8960 with its Adeneo 3D in the coming BB10 smartphone...? That's particulary annoying if we consider that Dev Alpha B is the real world testing plateform for BB10 OS... ?

    Now my own speculation :
    Texas Instruments is planning to stop its SoC business (that's not speculation and has already been announced). RIM wants to become #3 ITC provider in the world. Samsung, Apple and Huawei already produce their own SoC. RIM could acquire TI SoC business, and OMAP5 plateform which is the most powerful to date ? We'll see...
    Last edited by xnwrx; 09-29-2012 at 03:48 PM.
  2. CrackedBarry's Avatar
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    It won't really make a difference, except for performance vise, and the two are roughly equal. Snapdragon is about 25% faster on the CPU side, but OMAP is about 25% faster on the GPU side.
  3. xnwrx's Avatar
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    Right, and 4470 is even less power hungry than 8960. I would strongly prefer OMAP.
    But the question is how possible would it be for BB10 to be developped and tested onto OMAP Soc, and sold onto Snapdragon SoC (and OMAP as well taking into account Playbook compatibility) ?
  4. CrackedBarry's Avatar
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    It's not a problem whatsoever... There are some differences between the two, but at the end of the day it's the same instruction set.

    The biggest problem IMHO is that they're both last generation CPUs. (Though the Snapdragon less so. More like half a generation)

    Premium phones next year will launch with either the next generation OMAP 5500 CPU, or with the next generation Snapdragon which are quad krait CPUs with the Adreno 330 GPU. So both the 4470 and 89XX will be kinda long in the tooth by then.
  5. kbz1960's Avatar
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  6. CrackedBarry's Avatar
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    That report is exaggerated. Don't worry, they'll still make their SOCs. They're just going to try and sell to a wider market, and get their chips in as many places as possible. The mobile market is too pressured by Apple and Samsung for their taste.
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  7. xnwrx's Avatar
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    Sorry to say, but they won't. No more TI SoC for smartphones and tablets : no more OMAP Soc.
    They will concentrate on TCI and TMS plateforms
  8. Jtaylor1986's Avatar
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    How do you know the dev alpha b is using the 4470? I thought they were using the S4 based on them saying it was representative of final hardware.
  9. BBPandy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xnwrx View Post
    Well, we know that the Playbook is running OMAP4430 and Playbook 4G is running OMAP4460. We know that Dev Alpha A is running OMAP4460 Soc and we've heard that Dev Alpha B is running OMAP4470 Soc.
    Finaly we've read that BB10 L serie will run MSM8960 Soc !!!

    The fact is that BB10 OS is currently running on OMAP SoCs with TI architecture and SGX530/544 3D. So what about MSM8960 with its Adeneo 3D in the coming BB10 smartphone...? That's particulary annoying if we consider that Dev Alpha B is the real world testing plateform for BB10 OS... ?

    Now my own speculation :
    Texas Instruments is planning to stop its SoC business (that's not speculation and has already been announced). RIM wants to become #3 ITC provider in the world. Samsung, Apple and Huawei already produce their own SoC. RIM could acquire TI SoC business, and OMAP5 plateform which is the most powerful to date ? We'll see...
    No it's speculation, & TI sent out a statment saying that those rumours were wrong. Yes they are expanding into other areas like automotive, but they still plan to also make mobile chips
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  10. greatwiseone's Avatar
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    Has anyone actually opened up the Dev Alpha to check if it's an OMAP? I'm not 100% sure about that.
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    As long as they put a faster processor in it than the 624Mhz small block Chevy in my 9800,frankly Scarlet I dont give a damn! Mainly I use my 9800 and 9860 for web browsing,texting and the occasional phone call. I'd like a BB10 with a big 4.5" screen and a slide out Qwerty keyboard.

    Sent from my BlackBerry 9800 using Tapatalk
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    #12  

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    Quote Originally Posted by greatwiseone View Post
    Has anyone actually opened up the Dev Alpha to check if it's an OMAP? I'm not 100% sure about that.
    Well, I'm pretty sure the Dev Alpha has a TI OMAP 4460, apparently it's been underclocked to 1 GHz though.

    As for the Dev Alpha B, I wouldn't be surprised if its a TI OMAP 4470 though.
  13. GTiLeo's Avatar
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    Apple and samsung do not produce their own SOCs for the longset time samsung produced apples CPUs and the GS3 is a snapdragon S4 plus and their LTE GS2 used snapdragon S3 and Ti OMAP4430 with the original released GS2 being on their own cpu

    On a side note its more costly for RIM to build their own in house chipsets when they can have them built by another manufacture that specializes in them. Also the acquisition of another company at this point is a dead point as the funds just aren't there
    Last edited by GTiLeo; 09-29-2012 at 10:09 PM.
  14. greatwiseone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goku_vegeta View Post
    Well, I'm pretty sure the Dev Alpha has a TI OMAP 4460, apparently it's been underclocked to 1 GHz though.

    As for the Dev Alpha B, I wouldn't be surprised if its a TI OMAP 4470 though.
    Um...ok. How do you guys explain "Qualcomm powered" in the legal page under the "About" tab in settings?
  15. mikeo007's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greatwiseone View Post
    Um...ok. How do you guys explain "Qualcomm powered" in the legal page under the "About" tab in settings?
    Baseband chip?
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  16. VerryBestr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrackedBarry View Post
    ... The biggest problem IMHO is that they're both last generation CPUs. (Though the Snapdragon less so. More like half a generation) Premium phones next year will launch with either the next generation OMAP 5500 CPU, or with the next generation Snapdragon which are quad krait CPUs with the Adreno 330 GPU. ...
    The rumor is that the first BB10 phones will use the SnapDrgon Pro S4 MSM8960T SoC. This chip uses only two Krait CPUs, but it does contain the Adreno 330 GPU. This chip contains the baseband processor rather than adding two additional CPUs. This SoC is in no existing phone, nor any announced phone as far as I know. This would be a design choice for RIM, I think, indicating that RIM gives priority to battery life rather than to the brute power of two additional CPUs.

    See the "Pro" section of this Wikipedia table, which lists the two models MSM8960T and APQ8064. Note that it lists a few design wins for the quad core APQ8064, but phones with this chip are only found today in limited runs and only in Asia.
    | Snapdragon (system on chip) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    The first direct comparison (S4 Pro -vs- iPhone 5) benchmarks I've seen indicate that the Adreno 330 GPU is approximately on a par with the GPU in the iPhone 5. Anandtech has some early benchmarks for the iPhone 5, which they call a "performance preview":
    | AnandTech - The iPhone 5 Performance Preview
    The biggest surprise however is just how well the Qualcomm Snapdragon S4 Pro with Adreno 320 GPU does by comparison. LG's Optimus G, a device Brian flew to Seoul, South Korea to benchmark, is hot on the heels of the new iPhone.
    I would suppose that those benchmark results are mainly driven by the GPU performance rather than the number of CPUs.

    With that kind of performance, a phone with the MSM8960T processor would hardly be outdated in six months.

    From what TI's VP Delagi said about "reprofiling" its investment and changing its OMAP R&D profile, I doubt that TI will continue to compete at the "bleeding edge" of SoC performance. Embedded customers have different needs. So I do think that mid-term, TI will be out of the mobile SoC market (except, possibly, for cheap low performance devices, if that market exists).
    | UPDATE 3-Texas Instruments eyes shift away from wireless | Reuters
    Last edited by VerryBestr; 09-30-2012 at 05:19 AM.
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  17. VerryBestr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greatwiseone View Post
    Um...ok. How do you guys explain "Qualcomm powered" in the legal page under the "About" tab in settings?
    Interesting observation, the first I've heard of that.

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeo007 View Post
    Baseband chip?
    I wondered about that, too.

    Also, was Qualcomm referenced in the same way on the first Dev Alpha phones? What about in PlayBooks on which some people have managed to get BB10 betas running? And what about the new LTE PlayBooks?
    Last edited by VerryBestr; 09-30-2012 at 05:01 AM.
  18. Bla1ze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goku_vegeta View Post
    Well, I'm pretty sure the Dev Alpha has a TI OMAP 4460, apparently it's been underclocked to 1 GHz though.

    As for the Dev Alpha B, I wouldn't be surprised if its a TI OMAP 4470 though.
    Dev Alpha A has TI OMAP 4460 / Dev Alpha B has 4470.
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  19. xnwrx's Avatar
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    Read today on a French IT media that the BB London was running an OMAP4 Soc. Don't know where they took this info from, but it makes more sense to me rather than Qualcomm SoC. If this is true, we should see OMAP5 in future devices and even sooner than one could beleive...
  20. undone's Avatar
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    Putting TI and RIM in the same room together as partners makes more sense then not. TI expressed they are getting more into embedded devices (cars and such), QNX is the embedded software side. Create some fast interlinking leveraging TI and RIM tech and you have a big bag of win, + certified secure.
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  21. lnichols's Avatar
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    I'd love to see a lower cost OMAP4 in the London as your $100 on contract entry phone and RIM to surprise everyone and be the first OMAP5 based phone with the Lisbon and Laguna as your $200 on contract offerings. Same for the N-Series. I'm hoping the leaks coming out of the spec sheets are the result of some misinformation campaign by RIM to really surprise people at the actual unveil. Imagine everyone going into the launch event thinking that RIM is going with the same Qualcomm chip that everyone else is using but instead announce they are the first phone with the OMAP5 and have a huge partnership with TI to bring OMAP and QNX to phones, tablets, and auto and unveil a new QNX reference car at the same time. I think that this is the type of excitement that RIM needs to create for the launch since we already know what the phones look like, what BB10 is basically going to look like, a decent number of features etc. Playbook and both Dev Alpha's are OMAP4, and the OMAP5 is a pin-for-pin replacement of the OMAP4 and backwards compatible software wise too. Probably dreaming but this is my hope for January.
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  22. xnwrx's Avatar
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    I think we've got here a very good and awesome plan. That would be a fantastic partnership between TI and RIM. These two are made to work together.
  23. BaconMunch's Avatar
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    How about this? TI OMAP 5 schedule really seems to followed RIM's BB10 release, delays and all. I think this is the infamous chip delay that Jim B. mentioned that everyone called foul on, however the dates still align...


    TI’s fifth generation chips with Cortex-A15 cores are on track and we should see first consumer products using these processors in early 2013.
    TI looks beyond mobiles and tablets for its OMAP 5 chips
  24. undone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lnichols View Post
    I'd love to see a lower cost OMAP4 in the London as your $100 on contract entry phone and RIM to surprise everyone and be the first OMAP5 based phone with the Lisbon and Laguna as your $200 on contract offerings. Same for the N-Series. I'm hoping the leaks coming out of the spec sheets are the result of some misinformation campaign by RIM to really surprise people at the actual unveil. Imagine everyone going into the launch event thinking that RIM is going with the same Qualcomm chip that everyone else is using but instead announce they are the first phone with the OMAP5 and have a huge partnership with TI to bring OMAP and QNX to phones, tablets, and auto and unveil a new QNX reference car at the same time. I think that this is the type of excitement that RIM needs to create for the launch since we already know what the phones look like, what BB10 is basically going to look like, a decent number of features etc. Playbook and both Dev Alpha's are OMAP4, and the OMAP5 is a pin-for-pin replacement of the OMAP4 and backwards compatible software wise too. Probably dreaming but this is my hope for January.
    It would also fit in with RIM looking to be more then another phone maker.
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  25. samab's Avatar
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    The big problem I have is that big 3D games have been optimized for specific GPU --- size of textures (i.e. detail vs. frame rate). It means that big 3D games may not be optimized for actual BB10 devices.
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