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  1. mrfreetruth's Avatar
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    Default New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Watching CNBC sqwack on the street and the reporters were talking about RIMM stock and also how their blackberries were working fine but their iphones where having issues. I remember reading stories in the past how blackberries are reliable during emergency situations.

    PIN-to-PIN Messaging Advantages

    BlackBerry users can directly communicate using PIN-to-PIN messaging in emergency situations, a feature that has proven invaluable during events such as the North American power outage of 2003, in the wake of Hurricane Katrina, and in other crises. The BlackBerry Enterprise Solution has also proven reliable, helping people communicate in less-than-ideal circumstances. For Ray Nagins, mayor of New Orleans during Hurricane Katrina, PIN messaging proved to be a lifeline; he stated “PIN was the only thing that worked for me.”

    BlackBerry PIN-to-PIN communication, which can be configured as needed by the system administrator, offers unique advantages in crisis situations. As shown in Figure 2, unlike conventional BlackBerry email, which relies on a functioning corporate infrastructure (including email server, BlackBerry Enterprise Server, and network servers), PIN messages are routed directly from one BlackBerry handheld to another by means of the wireless carrier networks and BlackBerry infrastructure. Using PIN messaging substantially shortens the chain of components required for transmitting and reduces the number of places where communications breakdowns can occur. This factor is especially important in disaster scenarios where corporate headquarters and datacenters have been adversely affected. Relying on BlackBerry PIN-to-PIN messaging is simpler and more cost-effective than establishing a redundant communications infrastructure for failover.

    Improving Communications in Emergency Situations
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  2. Superfly_FR's Avatar

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    #2  

    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    One more time.
    Serious matter = serious devices.
    Thanks for sharing.
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    #3  

    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    A video of that would be very cool.
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Hmmmmm..... The "article" is actually a whitepaper by some guy from a company called "Wallace Wireless." I'm sure there's no conflict of interest on his part, and most likely, the whitepaper was written around 2007-2008. He refers to PIN and MMS as "new." His diagram shows flip phones, old style PDAs, Pearls, but no sign of a modern smartphone.

    The title is very misleading since no where is there any reference to Hurricane Sandy in the "article."

    And of course the implied comparison of the use of technology during Katrina to use of technology during Sandy is very appropriate since not a single thing has changed in mobile technology since 2005. Oh wait.......
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    I had no problems at all during the storm or after I don't know how that relates to other platforms just glad I have my trusty crusty old curve its been like a old friend to me always there when I need it
    NYG. BIG BIUE WRECKING CREW

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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    If RIM's NOC can be used in emergencies like these effectively, the power of using it in better times is limited only to imagination.
    Children of tomorrow live in the tears that fall today
    Will the sunrise of tomorrow bring in peace in any way?
    Must the world live in the shadow of atomic fear?
    Can they win the fight for peace or will they disappear?

    -- Black Sabbath: Children of the Grave
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    I'd be interested in knowing what benefit PIN-to-PIN would have over SMS in an emergency situation.
    As far as I know, there would be the same number of failure points in either situation.
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Somebody get the video of them saying it and let's make it go viral
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeo007 View Post
    I'd be interested in knowing what benefit PIN-to-PIN would have over SMS in an emergency situation.
    As far as I know, there would be the same number of failure points in either situation.
    The biggest problem with sms is there's a more limited amount of tries before it fails completely.

    A bbm will sneak trough the smallest gap in the network and keeps trying to deliver for far longer, days I believe.
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Quote Originally Posted by belfastdispatcher View Post
    The biggest problem with sms is there's a more limited amount of tries before it fails completely.

    A bbm will sneak trough the smallest gap in the network and keeps trying to deliver for far longer, days I believe.
    That's based entirely on the device and network.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeo007 View Post
    That's based entirely on the device and network.
    SMS rules apply the same way to all devices.

    SMS is not data, they are sent trough service centers and they're not data dependent.

    http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Short_message_service_center
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Quote Originally Posted by belfastdispatcher View Post
    SMS rules apply the same way to all devices.

    SMS is not data, they are sent trough service centers and they're not data dependent.

    Short message service center - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    The standard involves device independent settings, but devices can still apply their own resend parameters. Still reliant on carrier settings. No advantage there. Only benefit I can see is BBM delivery status, since SMS doesn't guarantee accurate delivery reporting.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeo007 View Post
    The standard involves device independent settings, but devices can still apply their own resend parameters. Still reliant on carrier settings. No advantage there. Only benefit I can see is BBM delivery status, since SMS doesn't guarantee accurate delivery reporting.
    How do you do that? If you're talking about the validity period that's after the sms was sent and it defines how long an sms will wait in a service centre.
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    It only works if you want to message someone with a BB... So I wouldn't really call it a very good means of communications in the case of an emergency - or even in general these days.
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Quote Originally Posted by mrfreetruth View Post
    Watching CNBC sqwack on the street and the reporters were talking about RIMM stock and also how their blackberries were working fine but their iphones where having issues. I remember reading stories in the past how blackberries are reliable during emergency situations.
    ^^ THIS was the main point of OP. Bellow was a reminder of past situation.

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeo007 View Post
    I'd be interested in knowing what benefit PIN-to-PIN would have over SMS in an emergency situation.
    As far as I know, there would be the same number of failure points in either situation.
    Roughly I'd say that SMS will die at the first failure point while BBM will turn around.
    Last edited by Superfly_FR; 11-01-2012 at 06:39 PM.
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Quote Originally Posted by scalemaster34 View Post
    It only works if you want to message someone with a BB... So I wouldn't really call it a very good means of communications in the case of an emergency - or even in general these days.
    This is why emergency teams have BBs ...
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    Default New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    One requires carrier network resources the other only requires carrier connectivity.

    Sent from my BlackBerry 9930 using Tapatalk
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Quote Originally Posted by southlander View Post
    One requires carrier network resources the other only requires carrier connectivity.
    +
    Quote Originally Posted by mikeo007 View Post
    That's based entirely on the device and network.
    =
    Quote Originally Posted by Robin Bienfait CIO.com interview
    That was because cellular networks were overloaded, and your communications were going directly through RIM's infrastructure, correct?
    Yes. And even though we were boosting the network up, still the signal that was really traveling through was via BlackBerry. We've actually seen the same thing [recently] in Haiti and with the earthquakes overseas, in Japan. Same phenomenon.
    The ability of the device to get a signal is step #1 ...
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    Default New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Quote Originally Posted by Superfly_FR View Post
    +

    =


    The ability of the device to get a signal is step #1 ...
    Correct. With SMS if you connect to the carrier OK that does not mean the carrier has the resources to route your message. With BBM for example as I understand it it all gets off-loaded to RIM for transport/routing.

    Sent from my BlackBerry 9930 using Tapatalk
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeo007 View Post
    I'd be interested in knowing what benefit PIN-to-PIN would have over SMS in an emergency situation.
    As far as I know, there would be the same number of failure points in either situation.
    Not at all. SMS uses the cellular voice network control channels to operate. In an emergency situation where everyone is trying to use the network at the same time with either SMS or calls, because the voice networks are oversubscribed at high ratios, voice will get back a fast busy and SMS either won't go through or get serious delays. Data part of the network operates differently. Still oversubscribed, but there isn't an X control channel limit, just a finite amount of packets that can be processed per second, and everyone has a shot. BBM and PIN were developed to work reliably on low-bandwidth, spotty networks, so that is why when the Earthquake hit DC, and I couldn't call anyone and an SMS from my mom got to me 5 hours after she sent it, my BBM worked the entire time. Now if the tower is down, or data part of the tower is down then no BBM or PIM, but it is likely the voice side is down too in that situation.
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Quote Originally Posted by scalemaster34 View Post
    It only works if you want to message someone with a BB... So I wouldn't really call it a very good means of communications in the case of an emergency - or even in general these days.
    Which is why my immediate family has BlackBerry phones. The superior communication capabilities that the platform offers, especially for international travel and emergency situations, outweighs the advantages of the other platforms for my requirements. With BB10 I expect the gap between BlackBerry and the competition to widen with the requirements I have for a Smartphone.
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeo007 View Post
    Only benefit I can see is BBM delivery status, since SMS doesn't guarantee accurate delivery reporting.
    More than just delivery -- confirmation the the message was read.

    If you can't see why this is essential in an emergency situation, I can't help you.
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Quote Originally Posted by recompile View Post
    More than just delivery -- confirmation the the message was read.

    If you can't see why this is essential in an emergency situation, I can't help you.
    I don't see it as essential, but I do think it's useful. Any other advantages anyone can think of?
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeo007 View Post
    I don't see it as essential, but I do think it's useful. Any other advantages anyone can think of?
    Well imagine a coordinator trying to dispatch out supplies to locations in an emergency, medical or food and water. He can make a decision to send anyway or re allocate supplies to where he knows they are needed. If supplies are low then he could likely defer a shipment instead of risking it being less effective.

    What about just sending out a message for help. Wouldn't you like to know that someone go it? Again it all comes down to planning and taking the "right" course of action with the best possible information. If you don't know that your message got through, decision making just got difficult.
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    Default Re: New York City Cell Phone Sevice Spotty in lower Manhattan.....But not for Blackberries?

    Quote Originally Posted by dentynefire View Post
    Well imagine a coordinator trying to dispatch out supplies to locations in an emergency, medical or food and water. He can make a decision to send anyway or re allocate supplies to where he knows they are needed. If supplies are low then he could likely defer a shipment instead of risking it being less effective.

    What about just sending out a message for help. Wouldn't you like to know that someone go it? Again it all comes down to planning and taking the "right" course of action with the best possible information. If you don't know that your message got through, decision making just got difficult.
    Seems like in a disaster situation, it would be common courtesy to reply to a plee for help. Anyway, I was just asking for examples, not for people to critique what I deem necessary.

    I've honestly almost never used BBM, and have never been in a situation where instant cellphone communication is necessary.
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