06-10-08 07:11 PM
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  1. mattgibstein's Avatar
    So as everyone knows, the 3G iPhone was released today by Apple.
    It boasts new features like:
    GPS
    3G capability
    A revamped compatibility with Applications (they have an enormous amount of 3rd party Apps)
    Mobile Me (a crackberry user described it as: 'BIS but with push email, push contacts and push calendar'
    Stunning touch screen
    Etc...

    With price points of 200/300 for 8GB/16 GB one has to think how this is going to affect RIM.

    Do you guys think this is going to boost Apple's share of the smartphone market/ lower RIM's? If so, by how much
    06-09-08 03:10 PM
  2. CTenn's Avatar
    Yes, but how much is left up to how many iPhone users are willing to upgrade. With 6 million+ iPhone sales since it's release, many may not want to pay more for the features it has gained.

    I do see a large amount of people buying this, especially for the price it boasts. I think Apple's shares will be going up, however with the Bold on the horizon RIM's shares may compete when its new lineup is released.

    All we can do is speculate until the numbers come out...
    06-09-08 03:13 PM
  3. IrishJK09's Avatar
    It was announced today, not released. It comes out July 11th.

    My answer is... Absolutely. This will put a huge hurting on RIM's consumer growth, and possibly take a small amount away from their corporate/enterprise growth. The thing about the iPhone is that the prices are RETAIL. There is no subsidy! It doesn't matter if you are a new customer, or midway through your contract, you still get a great price. The iPhone is being sold retail for subsidized prices, and that is huge to people not up for contract renewal.

    I think RIM will always OWN the enterprise, but that isn't to say that the revamped iPhone won't hamper it just a bit.

    On the OTHER hand... Windows Mobile is in for a HUGE and PAINFUL eye opener in the Enterprise...
    06-09-08 03:14 PM
  4. gs warrior 88's Avatar
    So as everyone knows, the 3G iPhone was released today by Apple.
    It boasts new features like:
    GPS
    3G capability
    A revamped compatibility with Applications (they have an enormous amount of 3rd party Apps)
    Mobile Me (a crackberry user described it as: 'BIS but with push email, push contacts and push calendar'
    Stunning touch screen
    Etc...

    With price points of 200/300 for 8GB/16 GB one has to think how this is going to affect RIM.

    Do you guys think this is going to boost Apple's share of the smartphone market/ lower RIM's? If so, by how much
    Release date is July 11. Just announced today
    06-09-08 03:16 PM
  5. Reed McLay's Avatar
    Last Call: Apple falls after iPhone announcement

    Associated Press 06.09.08, 3:36 PM ET

    NEW YORK - Apple Inc. shares traded lower Monday after Chief Executive Steve Jobs unveiled a widely anticipated upgraded iPhone with a speedier Internet connection, GPS capabilities and lower price.

    Apple (nasdaq: AAPL - news - people )'s stock declined $6.28, or 3.4 percent, to $179.26. In the past year, the stock has traded between $111.62 and $202.96.
    ...
    Hungry Bears feasting on the rotting fruit pile is the image that comes to mind.

    June 9 (Bloomberg) -- Canada's main stock index erased its gain, after rising to a record earlier, as Research In Motion Ltd. declined on speculation increased competition from Apple Inc.'s iPhone will hurt sales of its BlackBerry e-mail device.

    ...Research In Motion dropped 2.3 percent to C$131.13. Apple Chief Executive Officer Steve Jobs said today 35 percent of Fortune magazine's 500 biggest U.S. companies have tested the next version of the software that runs the iPhone mobile handset. ...
    Only the half the Bears were gorging themselves on Berrys.

    We will see what tomorrow brings, but the basic equation is smart phone sales are growing at a fast clip and there are plenty of consumers for everything they can both build.

    Who am I betting on? Holding my RIM and continuing to ignore AAPL.
    Last edited by Stoner; 06-10-08 at 03:18 PM.
    06-09-08 03:16 PM
  6. jta1188's Avatar
    No. I think it will boost BlackBerry sales, just like the original iPhone. It brings attention to the smartphone market, and too many people are unwilling to give up their QWERTY keyboards for a virtual one. Also, at&t has a horrible reputation, and this alone will (and has in the past) keep many from switching to an iPhone.

    Remember, BlackBerry's market share actually went UP after the iPhone released, so I don't think things will change. They may lose a bit of the smartphone market share but will still easily hold the majority and will keep selling more phones. Besides, it seems to me that BlackBerry has just as much of an "it" cool factor as the iPhone, and BlackBerrys are becoming very "in."
    06-09-08 03:20 PM
  7. jenaywins's Avatar
    I would think that this wouldn't absolutely devastate RIM's sales, by any means.... Sure, people are going to be mesmerized by a new, shiny toy for a while.. But when it comes down to it, there really is no comparison (IMHO) between the two phones. Apples and Blackberries are like... Well... Apples and Oranges. Err some other fruit....

    Plus, there are always going to be those people who prefer a phone that offers tactile response. I could never, EVER use another touchscreen device after having the LG Chocolate... And it wasn't even a full touch screen.

    Yes, the new Apple phone will do amazing stuff and will be far superior to the original version, but at the end of the day, people are going to move on to the next newer and more exciting techie device. That's how gadget people are, IMO... However, us loyal Blackberry users are always gonna stick with what we know, and what works best for us.

    Just my opinion......
    06-09-08 03:24 PM
  8. IrishJK09's Avatar
    The stock is already back on the rise though. It is at 181.74 as of 4:24p.m.

    Yes, it is still down from this morning, but I see it going up over the next few weeks as the release date approaches. I think the July 11th thing hurt it a bit, but I feel it is a temporary sting.
    06-09-08 03:26 PM
  9. JasonHDD's Avatar
    Honestly, I think it's going to be impossible for one company to totally dominate the other...I belive it's going to be back and forth...
    Well, apple showed their stuff..now it's time for R I M!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    06-09-08 03:32 PM
  10. IrishJK09's Avatar
    I would think that this wouldn't absolutely devastate RIM's sales, by any means.... Sure, people are going to be mesmerized by a new, shiny toy for a while.. But when it comes down to it, there really is no comparison (IMHO) between the two phones. Apples and Blackberries are like... Well... Apples and Oranges. Err some other fruit....
    That's the thing. As of today, Apple unleashed a full scale attack on RIM's enterprise market, not just their consumer. The phones are far more comparable now than they ever were.

    On the corporate side, both phones offer:
    Push Mail
    Push Calendar
    Push Contacts
    Global Address List
    Remote Wipe
    In-house application availability

    On the consumer side, the iPhone + MobileMe will offer:
    Push Mail
    Push Calendar
    Push Contacts
    Photo syncing between the device, online application, and your desktop

    On the consumer side, the BlackBerry offers:
    Push Mail, and it costs more than the iPhone data plan+MobileMe service

    For everyone, they will both offer:
    3rd party apps, though the quality of apps available on the iPhone really are second to none.

    I do not see organizations that rely on top tier security ever leaving RIM. Organizations like the US Government, many Insurance companies, financial companies, etc. Companies that don't need that level of security can get all the features they get with RIM, only the will no longer need to pay for a BES solution, nor will they need to pay the higher data plan prices per device, and even more on top of that is that they will no longer need to pay device license fees.

    Nothing can be certain, but the market is going to be a wonderfully interest thing to watch over the coming months.
    06-09-08 03:33 PM
  11. CGF's Avatar
    It will make a huge dent in BlackBerry sales which would be even bigger if more people were capable of getting ATT service. Not to start another rant, but why can't RIM hook us up with a MobileME type service? Why do we have to use a third party BES hosting service? Why haven't we really seen BlackBerry Unite authorized for our carriers? Why does what we have seen of BB Unite look so terrible and perform so terribly? Consumer's are obviously just becoming a priority for RIM but they need to start improving the product for consumers...because they will lose enterprise customers with this incarnation of the iPhone.
    06-09-08 03:40 PM
  12. JasonHDD's Avatar
    @ crazetoon: i belive almost everything you said is true, and maybe i'm wrong, but I just don't see medium to large size corporations switching to the 3G iphone... 1) i know it's possible to play games, surf web, take and send pics, etc..etc.. on the BB. But the iphone gives off the impression that it's mostly a multimedia device, and made for just that. Even with all the new apps they just came out with. 2) I don't think most corporations will dig the virtual keyboard.
    This is just my opinion, and I could be wrong. who knows?? but the cheaper price for the iphone and price of the data plan will def make companies think
    06-09-08 03:47 PM
  13. CTenn's Avatar
    Yeah, along with Jason, how the iPhone is percieved by many will be a big drawback from corporate use. The impression of the iPhone is a device used for multimedia and entertainment, not executive business use. Apple may be trying to dispel this image by introducing all these features for business use, but the image will still remain simply by the amount of "chic" this phone exudes.
    06-09-08 03:55 PM
  14. Reed McLay's Avatar
    June 9, 2008, 3:49 pm

    The biggest news from Apple is what Steve Jobs didn’t say: It has completely changed the basis of its deals with AT&T and other wireless carriers.
    According to a press release from AT&T, the carrier will no longer give a portion of monthly usage fees to Apple. Instead carriers will pay Apple a subsidy for each phone sold, in order to bring the price from $399 down to $199 for the 8 Gigabyte model. The company did not specify the amount of the subsidy. Subsidies of $200 to $300 are common in the industry.
    What is more, consumers will now pay $30 a month for unlimited data service from AT&T, compared to $20 under the plan introduced last year. So even though the phone will now cost $200, consumers will be out more cash at the end of a two-year contract compared to the previous deal.
    Of course, that includes faster 3G data service, so the price increase may be worth it. But we should call it an iPhone price increase, not a cut.
    ...

    For Apple, this move to getting all its money up front has several advantages. By using the same economic model as every other cell phone maker, it makes it easier to bring the phone to carriers in every corner of the world.
    It also should help insulate Apple from the cost of people who buy iPhones and unlock them to use on carriers that don’t pay Apple the monthly fee. Now Apple will get its money, say $500, up front and it no longer has to police what people do with them. Whether Apple will still keep penalizing users who unlock their phones is one of the many questions that remain to be answered.
    ...
    Ahh.... Apple has see the light of day.
    06-09-08 04:14 PM
  15. jenaywins's Avatar
    That's the thing. As of today, Apple unleashed a full scale attack on RIM's enterprise market, not just their consumer. The phones are far more comparable now than they ever were.

    On the corporate side, both phones offer:
    Push Mail
    Push Calendar
    Push Contacts
    Global Address List
    Remote Wipe
    In-house application availability

    On the consumer side, the iPhone + MobileMe will offer:
    Push Mail
    Push Calendar
    Push Contacts
    Photo syncing between the device, online application, and your desktop

    On the consumer side, the BlackBerry offers:
    Push Mail, and it costs more than the iPhone data plan+MobileMe service

    For everyone, they will both offer:
    3rd party apps, though the quality of apps available on the iPhone really are second to none.

    I do not see organizations that rely on top tier security ever leaving RIM. Organizations like the US Government, many Insurance companies, financial companies, etc. Companies that don't need that level of security can get all the features they get with RIM, only the will no longer need to pay for a BES solution, nor will they need to pay the higher data plan prices per device, and even more on top of that is that they will no longer need to pay device license fees.

    Nothing can be certain, but the market is going to be a wonderfully interest thing to watch over the coming months.
    All absolutely valid and well spoken points.

    I agree with you - but just to a certain degree. I can't help but think of the iPhone as just another trendy gadget. Apple may be trying to get a piece of RIM's pie.. But I just don't think they have the fork to eat it with, ya know?

    The iPhone was first marketted heavily as a media/entertainment device. They pushed the browser capabilities so hard on that phone, it was ridiculous. I half expected to buy that phone and wake up to it not only displaying the New York Times online, but preparing me a fresh pot of coffee.

    And again, two words: tactile response. Anyone who uses their phone primarily for business is not going to put up with the irritation of texting on a touch screen. Especially us corporate girls with nails? Forget about it. RIM has the "business phone" market pretty much cornered. And I think that at first, when the new iPhone finally is released, people definitely will have to have it and the sales will be good, therefore slightly denting RIMs profits. But I stand by my thought that it won't devastate RIM in any way. People will get bored with it and realize that.. Hey. It's another touchphone. Woohoo.
    06-09-08 04:14 PM
  16. km2783's Avatar
    RIM survived the first iPhone, and even flourished more. It'll survive the next one
    06-09-08 04:21 PM
  17. JasonHDD's Avatar
    thats what i'm thinking
    06-09-08 04:26 PM
  18. CGF's Avatar
    I think the keyboard issue is overblown. I can type faster on the iPod Touch than I can on my Curve. Accuracy isn't as good though. Where the virtual keyboard really suffers is if you are distracted in any measure (i.e., driving, etc.), but it isn't that big of a deal. My belief is that physical keyboards won't exist in 5 years. I'm praying for a BB touchscreen with haptics. That would steal the iPhone's "thunder".
    06-09-08 05:03 PM
  19. SLVR6's Avatar
    No, the 3G iPhone will not hurt Blackberry sales. It hasn't yet, why would it now with the 3G Bold coming also in the near future and if the purported "Thunder" comes out also in the near future, RIM certainly is not worrying. I cannot see most companies that adopting iPhones over Blackberries. If a company has realized the benifits of an optimized BES installation allowing their users to access their intra net and all that type of stuff, no way. Also, there are still MANY companies that will not give employees a phone with a camera because they would not be allowed into a client building with it. Don't get me wrong, the iPhone is pretty cool, but it will not hurt RIM in the least.

    Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com
    06-09-08 05:16 PM
  20. km2783's Avatar
    I can type nearly 100% error free on my Curve w/ out looking at it. I can't begin to type w/ out looking on my iPod Touch and I've been using it a lot.

    Also, as I've said elsewhere but want to make sure I cover the bases, the pricing of the 3G iPhone is $199 and $299 WITH a two year contract. I work for AT&T and we got an email detailing this.
    06-09-08 06:02 PM
  21. ds7777's Avatar
    this will clearly come down to PRICE and AGE.

    the blackberry (bold) will be aimed at corporate, middle-aged to 50' year olds that need something simple and easy. the plans should also reflect this.

    the iphone, will be cheaper for the consumer and prosumer, however you need to be a little comp-savvy to use it.

    Put it this way: i bought my parents a blackberry which they could use in about 5 minutes. i showed them the iphone, they didnt even know where to start and were scarred off.
    06-09-08 06:03 PM
  22. jta1188's Avatar
    Oh I think Apple's fatal flaw is in the fact that they gave exclusive selling rights to at&t. The iPhone would have sold millions more on other carriers if it wasn't exclusive. While some were willing to leave their other carriers for the iPhone 1.0, many more are too skeptical of at&t's horrible reputation. Also, if you think about it, the new iPhone isn't as revolutionary as the first. Sure, it has GPS and 3G (more than a year after BB has had 3G on CDMA), but the "innovative" new features are things that BlackBerry has had for quite a while, it's nothing "revolutionary" like the awesome browser and media player, which were indeed awesome at the time. Simply adding GPS, 3G and MediaMe (or whatever its called) is only going to get current iPhone users to update; the ones who left their carriers have already done so, and if others lived without the first iPhone, they can certainly live without this one.
    06-09-08 06:13 PM
  23. latina berry's Avatar
    Honestly, I think it's going to be impossible for one company to totally dominate the other...I belive it's going to be back and forth...
    Well, apple showed their stuff..now it's time for R I M!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    I agree!!!!!
    06-09-08 06:16 PM
  24. tony2979#CB's Avatar
    I think the real "RIM Killer" (if there is any such thing) wasn't the phone itself....it was the pricing. Apple just took a 8gb iphone that it was selling for 3 or 4 hundred bucks....dramaticly improved it with GPS, 3G, etc and cut the price in half. Thats huge and basically says to RIM, "Ummm, how much are you going to sell your new phone for?" RIM is going to have to do something dramatic with the pricing of bold to stay in the consumer ballpark with Apple.
    06-09-08 06:31 PM
  25. ds7777's Avatar
    if the BOLD is $500 and the iphone 3g is $200.....im not ashamed to say, it makes me now consider touch-screen typing....
    06-09-08 06:46 PM
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