1. Ed YANG's Avatar
    ...removable battery form factor?
    They seal up the back, yet... the units can't be used in leisure activities that requires the unit to be waterproof.

    2 months with the Microsoft's Lumia 640 as my weekend partner, i find that it's actually much slimmer than the LEAP as well as the Z3! Well... they can do it. BB don't?
    08-02-15 11:25 AM
  2. CTU2fan's Avatar
    2 possibilities...the supposed "reboot issue" with removable battery phones like the Q10. And making fixed-battery models gives the phone a shelf life. As the battery ages and takes and keeps less of a charge you're forced to either take it in for repair or (their wish) buy new despite your current device being otherwise fine. Pretty sure that's why Apple does it anyway, since I believe they're evil LOL

    Posted via CB10
    bbnrs and silversmith75 like this.
    08-02-15 12:01 PM
  3. lnichols's Avatar
    I have always had problems with removable battery BlackBerry devices eventually developing an issue when you sit the device down or it takes a minor jolt, the device reboots. My boss has had two Z10 in less than a year that have had this happen too. A sealed battery unit has a different connector type. If they could make a reliable removable battery unit that this does not happen to, then fine, but if they can't then I will prefer sealed units with larger batteries.

    Posted via Z30
    bp2k7 likes this.
    08-02-15 12:20 PM
  4. Ed YANG's Avatar
    I've had my z10s, both black n white for a little more than 2yrs now... never encountered any "auto-reboot" issues like you mentioned.
    silversmith75 and extisis like this.
    08-02-15 12:24 PM
  5. donnation's Avatar
    I've had my z10s, both black n white for a little more than 2yrs now... never encountered any "auto-reboot" issues like you mentioned.
    It was a serious problem with the Z10 and many people did have he rebooting problem.
    08-02-15 12:46 PM
  6. mad_mdx's Avatar
    Well the batteries in the new BlackBerry phones are huge, first of all
    Second, the never ending q10 and z10 battery problems. It may not happen to you but just do a quick search and you'll see how many are affected
    Third, more expensive in development
    Fourth, the z30 loose buttons fiasco
    Fifth, the z10 loose/creaky rear door fiasco

    So many reasons... what's a reason for removal battery ? Oh that one time you're out camping and want to swap batteries... why not just use a battery pack and charge the phone?
    08-02-15 12:54 PM
  7. lnichols's Avatar
    I've had my z10s, both black n white for a little more than 2yrs now... never encountered any "auto-reboot" issues like you mentioned.
    I have had it happen to my Z10, 9900, and 9630. My boss has had two Z10 have this issue. I have read many posts here about it happening to others too. Glad you have not had the issue, but many have.

    Posted via Z30
    08-02-15 02:15 PM
  8. skstrials's Avatar
    I do think removable battery is an essential feature in a phone.

    The biggest reason I can think of would be that BlackBerry has outsourced it's hardware manufacturing to Foxconn, who does not really like removable battery phones.

    As for the supposed battery contact issues with the Z10 and the Q10, there is an easy fix: just stick a business card between the battery and the cover.

    Removable battery allows people to keep the phones for longer since people can simply swap out batteries once the original battery can no longer hold a charge because of degradation. This is why the batteries for the Q10 and the Z10 are still being sold In large numbers.
    But manufacturers do not want people to keep phones for long. They would prefer that people buy an entirely new phone when the battery of their old phones wear out. This is why I personally believe manufacturing phones, tablets, and laptops with removable battery should be enforced by the law, so that people have the freedom of keeping their electronics for as long as they want.



    Posted via CB10
    FF22 and bbnrs like this.
    08-02-15 02:26 PM
  9. carullo's Avatar
    By time your battery wears out...you can buy the same device probably cheaper then the battery....i don't see an advantage to have removable batteries between car chargers and standard chargers unless your stuck in the middle of the Sahara desert I didn't see an issue

    Posted via CB10
    08-02-15 03:33 PM
  10. CTU2fan's Avatar
    By time your battery wears out...you can buy the same device probably cheaper then the battery....i don't see an advantage to have removable batteries between car chargers and standard chargers unless your stuck in the middle of the Sahara desert I didn't see an issue

    Posted via CB10
    Don't be silly. No phone sells for the price of a battery.

    And having had a phone with a poor battery I definitely appreciate the option to swap, even though my Q's battery is excellent and I've never had the need to swap out.

    Posted via CB10
    bbnrs and acovey like this.
    08-02-15 04:23 PM
  11. skstrials's Avatar
    By time your battery wears out...you can buy the same device probably cheaper then the battery....i don't see an advantage to have removable batteries between car chargers and standard chargers unless your stuck in the middle of the Sahara desert I didn't see an issue

    Posted via CB10
    Show me a link where I can buy a brand new in box BlackBerry Q10 for $20. And we will talk.

    I do not see the logic in how an entire phone would be cheaper than getting a battery only.


    I said this before, but will say it again. All rechargeable batteries age, and lose the maximal amount of charge it can hold. Eventually, it will come to a point, where it cannot be used, and needs to be replaced.

    Posted via CB10
    acovey and Tatwi like this.
    08-02-15 04:23 PM
  12. dangerousfen's Avatar
    Show me a link where I can buy a brand new in box BlackBerry Q10 for $20. And we will talk.

    I do not see the logic in how an entire phone would be cheaper than getting a battery only.


    I said this before, but will say it again. All rechargeable batteries age, and lose the maximal amount of charge it can hold. Eventually, it will come to a point, where it cannot be used, and needs to be replaced.

    Posted via CB10
    Gotta agree here.

    "Z30 STA100-2 UK" 10.3.1.2582 Get's a Ten from Fen.
    08-02-15 04:27 PM
  13. lnichols's Avatar
    Show me a link where I can buy a brand new in box BlackBerry Q10 for $20. And we will talk.

    I do not see the logic in how an entire phone would be cheaper than getting a battery only.


    I said this before, but will say it again. All rechargeable batteries age, and lose the maximal amount of charge it can hold. Eventually, it will come to a point, where it cannot be used, and needs to be replaced.

    Posted via CB10
    And then you buy a replacement battery, open up the phone, remove a few screws, rules battery, and reverse the take apart procedure. 20 minutes every two years or so isn't a major thing. My Z30 feels way sturdier than my Z10 did and has battery that lasts all day. I never carried around replacement battery with any previous replaceable battery phone. I personally find no advantage to a replaceable battery but do find faults with BlackBerry's implementation on many devices.

    Posted via Z30
    08-02-15 04:31 PM
  14. skstrials's Avatar
    And then you buy a replacement battery, open up the phone, remove a few screws, rules battery, and reverse the take apart procedure. 20 minutes every two years or so isn't a major thing. My Z30 feels way sturdier than my Z10 did and has battery that lasts all day. I never carried around replacement battery with any previous replaceable battery phone. I personally find no advantage to a replaceable battery but do find faults with BlackBerry's implementation on many devices.

    Posted via Z30
    I will list a few advantages of removable batteries that I make use of.

    1. The ability to add a bigger extended battery with a bigger back cover.
    = I have a Mugen 3800mah battery on my Z10. It has a bigger battery than any BlackBerry phones produced. Unlike portable chargers, I do not carry a separate cable. I also do not have to worry about charging the charger separately. Since the battery does not have a charge transfer module, I maximize the battery size for the same physical size.
    http://www.mugenbattery.com/mugen-po...ry-z10-4g-lte/
    The battery can last upto 2 days with my usage.

    2. The ability to find a OEM battery
    = Since BlackBerry never released battery replacements through official sales channels for the Z30, Leap, or the Passport, you have to rely on shady Ebay sellers who might or might not give you a legitimate OEM spec battery.
    Whereas with the Q10 and the Z10, you can directly buy the battery from BlackBerry itself, or use Crackberry, both of which will give you a full support if the battery does not work.

    3. The difficulty of opening the phone
    = Not everyone is talented at opening phones. And I have seen many posts of people on here who stripped their bolts, or broke other parts while working on the phones themselves. Also, you have to buy the tools separately on top of the battery too.
    If you do get someone else to do it, you still have the issue of whether they would use a legitimate or a cheap knock off battery, while being charged a lot more for labour on top of the battery cost, not to mention being away from your phone for days.

    All in all, the biggest reason that I stick with my Q10 and the Z10 is because of the extended batteries. There is just no way that I can fit a 3800mah or a 4400mah with that little of a space, with no worries about connecting/disconnectiing charging cable, etc.

    Posted via CB10
    08-02-15 04:44 PM
  15. mad_mdx's Avatar
    I will list a few advantages of removable batteries that I make use of.

    1. The ability to add a bigger extended battery with a bigger back cover.
    = I have a Mugen 3800mah battery on my Z10. It has a bigger battery than any BlackBerry phones produced. Unlike portable chargers, I do not carry a separate cable. I also do not have to worry about charging the charger separately. Since the battery does not have a charge transfer module, I maximize the battery size for the same physical size.
    http://www.mugenbattery.com/mugen-po...ry-z10-4g-lte/
    The battery can last upto 2 days with my usage.

    2. The ability to find a OEM battery
    = Since BlackBerry never released battery replacements through official sales channels for the Z30, Leap, or the Passport, you have to rely on shady Ebay sellers who might or might not give you a legitimate OEM spec battery.
    Whereas with the Q10 and the Z10, you can directly buy the battery from BlackBerry itself, or use Crackberry, both of which will give you a full support if the battery does not work.

    3. The difficulty of opening the phone
    = Not everyone is talented at opening phones. And I have seen many posts of people on here who stripped their bolts, or broke other parts while working on the phones themselves. Also, you have to buy the tools separately on top of the battery too.
    If you do get someone else to do it, you still have the issue of whether they would use a legitimate or a cheap knock off battery, while being charged a lot more for labour on top of the battery cost, not to mention being away from your phone for days.

    All in all, the biggest reason that I stick with my Q10 and the Z10 is because of the extended batteries. There is just no way that I can fit a 3800mah or a 4400mah with that little of a space, with no worries about connecting/disconnectiing charging cable, etc.

    Posted via CB10
    Lol, all your complaints about shady cheap batteries, and your number one reason for easy access 'I have a shady cheap battery instead of the oem battery '

    Your argument has literally no credibility. And oem batteries can easily be bought, not to mention your precious replacement batteries will be old since they are out of manufacturing by the time you need to replace them.
    lnichols likes this.
    08-02-15 05:29 PM
  16. CTU2fan's Avatar
    I will list a few advantages of removable batteries that I make use of.

    1. The ability to add a bigger extended battery with a bigger back cover.
    = I have a Mugen 3800mah battery on my Z10. It has a bigger battery than any BlackBerry phones produced. Unlike portable chargers, I do not carry a separate cable. I also do not have to worry about charging the charger separately. Since the battery does not have a charge transfer module, I maximize the battery size for the same physical size.
    http://www.mugenbattery.com/mugen-po...ry-z10-4g-lte/
    The battery can last upto 2 days with my usage.

    2. The ability to find a OEM battery
    = Since BlackBerry never released battery replacements through official sales channels for the Z30, Leap, or the Passport, you have to rely on shady Ebay sellers who might or might not give you a legitimate OEM spec battery.
    Whereas with the Q10 and the Z10, you can directly buy the battery from BlackBerry itself, or use Crackberry, both of which will give you a full support if the battery does not work.

    3. The difficulty of opening the phone
    = Not everyone is talented at opening phones. And I have seen many posts of people on here who stripped their bolts, or broke other parts while working on the phones themselves. Also, you have to buy the tools separately on top of the battery too.
    If you do get someone else to do it, you still have the issue of whether they would use a legitimate or a cheap knock off battery, while being charged a lot more for labour on top of the battery cost, not to mention being away from your phone for days.

    All in all, the biggest reason that I stick with my Q10 and the Z10 is because of the extended batteries. There is just no way that I can fit a 3800mah or a 4400mah with that little of a space, with no worries about connecting/disconnectiing charging cable, etc.

    Posted via CB10


    All of this.

    And I will add that shoddy build quality is no excuse for depriving the user of the freedom to swap in a fresh battery or replace a worn out one. I don't doubt any of the battery issues I've read of in this thread, the loose batteries in the Q10 and Z10 are well documented. But the argument against removable batteries based on poor build quality is a weak one, similar to the whole "don't build a slider because the mechanism might fail" argument. Just build them well, and there's no issue.

    Posted via CB10
    bbnrs and anon(8063781) like this.
    08-02-15 05:32 PM
  17. skstrials's Avatar
    Lol, all your complaints about shady cheap batteries, and your number one reason for easy access 'I have a shady cheap battery instead of the oem battery '

    Your argument has literally no credibility. And oem batteries can easily be bought, not to mention your precious replacement batteries will be old since they are out of manufacturing by the time you need to replace them.
    I have the option of buying the official battery from a proper retailer IF I want to go that route. Either way, Mugen batteries are hardly cheap or shady. Again, extended batteries are an option that I can have since I can remove the battery. I can use the OEM battery through official channels if I want.


    With a sealed in battery phone, you don't even have that choice since the manufacturer never release the battery for the public.

    Posted via CB10
    08-02-15 06:01 PM
  18. skstrials's Avatar
    All of this.

    And I will add that shoddy build quality is no excuse for depriving the user of the freedom to swap in a fresh battery or replace a worn out one. I don't doubt any of the battery issues I've read of in this thread, the loose batteries in the Q10 and Z10 are well documented. But the argument against removable batteries based on poor build quality is a weak one, similar to the whole "don't build a slider because the mechanism might fail" argument. Just build them well, and there's no issue.

    Posted via CB10
    I disagree.

    It is better to have a plastic battery back phone that powers on and works instead of a pretty and shiny sealed in battery phone with a shot battery.

    Common sense.

    Posted via CB10
    08-02-15 06:04 PM
  19. Bluenoser63's Avatar
    We had Z10's in the company. Whenever there was any delay, they popped the battery like they did with BBOS. It caused many corruptions. When we told them to stop pulling the batteries, the corruption problems went away.
    Pcmx likes this.
    08-02-15 06:44 PM
  20. lnichols's Avatar
    I disagree.

    It is better to have a plastic battery back phone that powers on and works instead of a pretty and shiny sealed in battery phone with a shot battery.

    Common sense.

    Posted via CB10
    So they should build shoddy hardware to keep replaceable batteries around?! This is good for the brand? Luckily for the PKB fans they keep making shoddy, double typing PKB devices too.

    Posted via Z30
    08-02-15 06:47 PM
  21. skstrials's Avatar
    So they should build shoddy hardware to keep replaceable batteries around?! This is good for the brand? Luckily for the PKB fans they keep making shoddy, double typing PKB devices too.

    Posted via Z30
    It is possible to have a removable back and a good build quality.

    I do not understand why you think you can only have one.

    The Z10 and the Q10 still had a very good quality and feel.

    As for the random reboots, stick a business card on the inside of a back cover. It is not hard at all. I never had any issues with reboots myself on my Q10 or the Z10.

    As for the keyboard double typing, it has nothing to do with the battery. But I agree that the keyboard needs to be more solid.

    Posted via CB10
    08-02-15 06:58 PM
  22. CTU2fan's Avatar
    I disagree.

    It is better to have a plastic battery back phone that powers on and works instead of a pretty and shiny sealed in battery phone with a shot battery.

    Common sense.

    Posted via CB10
    I think you missed my point or maybe I wasn't clear. What I mean is, if the battery in the Z10 or Q10 is loose then they should do a better job building the devices. Not switching to fixed batteries the way they did. Fixed batteries were a lazy shortcut.

    Posted via CB10
    08-02-15 07:09 PM
  23. lnichols's Avatar
    It is possible to have a removable back and a good build quality.

    I do not understand why you think you can only have one.

    The Z10 and the Q10 still had a very good quality and feel.

    As for the random reboots, stick a business card on the inside of a back cover. It is not hard at all. I never had any issues with reboots myself on my Q10 or the Z10.

    As for the keyboard double typing, it has nothing to do with the battery. But I agree that the keyboard needs to be more solid.

    Posted via CB10
    The post you quoted was saying that BlackBerry needed to improve the quality, and you seem to say you were disagreeing and that a removable battery was more important than quality. You shouldn't need to rig a business card into a $500 to $600 phone to keep it from rebooting. These issues make the brand look cheap, and combined with the high price and low specs, make the brand look incompetent . I have had issues with double typing keys, optical track pads that wouldn't work in sunlight, and rebooting batteries that you say just need paper wedged into the device to work properly. It makes BlackBerry look incompetent. The Z30 is one of the better built BlackBerry devices I have had in a while, but the loose keys on the side and too much use of Plastic on the device show me their QA still sucks, and the device was never worth the $600 asking price. I wouldn't buy another PKB or removable battery device from BlackBerry ever again because they are simply too inept in design and/or QA to make reliable devices using these technologies. These are real issues that BlackBerry can't seem to overcome without eliminating those technologies from the devices like they did by moving to full touch and sealed batteries in my personal experience with the brand.

    Posted via Z30
    carullo and SMocek like this.
    08-02-15 07:19 PM
  24. green_ember's Avatar
    I've had a Z30 for well over a year now and have no idea what this "loose keys" issue is. The other Z30 on my account hasn't had any issue either
    08-03-15 08:30 AM
  25. RubberChicken76's Avatar
    Probably most people don't care in 2015. At least not enough to justify the cost, thickness etc.
    08-03-15 09:12 AM
51 123

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