[jmr1015]

But a laptop OS comes with a number of basic programs (apps if you insist on calling them that) and so does bb10 and linux. They all have file managers, text editors, mail tools, browsers and a host of many other commands that allow you to do pretty much everything. Even linux has games with the OS.

I use my mac to do my work without any apps downloaded from the app store. I don't even have an apple ID.
I have some opensoftware "apps" like x11 and openoffice, firefox, blend (which still works fine with the latest MacOS update) and that's it.

I don't use siri, or Apple mail, i-message, icloud, iTunes, apple maps, apple calender.

The real work is in Linux. Neither MacOS nor windows nor android have my work app for IC design, so they are basically useless for me.

Posted via CB10

Sure, a modern computer OS comes bundled with many basic applications now, but it wasn't that long ago that just including a web browser program bundled with the base OS was cause for a huge and public lawsuit against Microsoft.

That's great that your particular usage profile allows you to get fulfilling usage out of your hardware with a bare minimum of additional applications. But literally none of your usage mirrors my own, and that is exactly the importance of a wide selection of available applications. People have different usage profiles and needs. And having access to a larger number and variety of applications means a manufacturer's hardware can appeal to a wider market of people with varying wants and needs.

[kvndoom]

Sure, a modern computer OS comes bundled with many basic applications now, but it wasn't that long ago that just including a web browser program bundled with the base OS was cause for a huge and public lawsuit against Microsoft.

That's great that your particular usage profile allows you to get fulfilling usage out of your hardware with a bare minimum of additional applications. But literally none of your usage mirrors my own, and that is exactly the importance of a wide selection of available applications. People have different usage profiles and needs. And having access to a larger number and variety of applications means a manufacturer's hardware can appeal to a wider market of people with varying wants and needs.

That's the problem... Crackberry posters can't see beyond basic functionality, and think their use case applies to 7 billion other people. Flip phones for all!

Blackberry Poptart SE - Cricket Wireless

[Tre Lawrence]

There was no reason to go android! Consumers wanted Apps so get the Apps and market the phone. Part of the problem was that BlackBerry didn't know if they wanted to do a 'consumer' ph or not. The fact is that business ph users are also consumers and most don't want to carry 2 phones. To this day I personally don't know what the hype is with Apps. Basically Google and Apple convinced the masses that yes you need Apps! People followed like sheep and then they got bogged down by that particular ecosystem and liked the convenience of that which I kind of understand!

I love BB10 and will stick with my Passport for as long as possible since I am not into Apps I assume I should be ok for quite a while.

Posted via BlackBerry Passport

Yes!

An "Apple convinced the sheep to use unneeded apps" rejoinder... posted with the aid of (yep, you guessed it) an app.

[Emaderton3]

Yes!

An "Apple convinced the sheep to use unneeded apps" rejoinder... posted with the aid of (yep, you guessed it) an app.

Stop making sense!

We have gone way beyond social apps. I want to be able to watch Comcast on my phone or set my DVR remotely. I want the Red Cross Tornado app. I want the Things To Do app from my newspaper. I want local news apps. I want the several apps offered by agencies and companies that are important for my work. I want the safety app provided by my employer.
You can control drones, set your home temperature, check your security cameras, etc.with apps. And there will be more and more.

It's not just Facebook and Instagram. And even so, companies, schools, government agencies, etc. are using social media for all kinds of stuff--reminders of events, closings, etc.

Posted via CB10

[stlabrat]

that was then, this is now or may be future... Google AMP: Are Standalone Smartphone Apps Becoming Obsolete? @returnOnNow
that is why bb10 might still has hope. (or other alternative OS)

[sorinv]

Sure, a modern computer OS comes bundled with many basic applications now, but it wasn't that long ago that just including a web browser program bundled with the base OS was cause for a huge and public lawsuit against Microsoft.

That's great that your particular usage profile allows you to get fulfilling usage out of your hardware with a bare minimum of additional applications. But literally none of your usage mirrors my own, and that is exactly the importance of a wide selection of available applications. People have different usage profiles and needs. And having access to a larger number and variety of applications means a manufacturer's hardware can appeal to a wider market of people with varying wants and needs.

That's exactly why I described my usage profile. Because android, apple or windows do not address it. There is NO app for it on any of those platforms, only on Linux.



Posted via CB10

[Tsepz_GP]

Stop making sense!

We have gone way beyond social apps. I want to be able to watch Comcast on my phone or set my DVR remotely. I want the Red Cross Tornado app. I want the Things To Do app from my newspaper. I want local news apps. I want the several apps offered by agencies and companies that are important for my work. I want the safety app provided by my employer.
You can control drones, set your home temperature, check your security cameras, etc.with apps. And there will be more and more.

It's not just Facebook and Instagram. And even so, companies, schools, government agencies, etc. are using social media for all kinds of stuff--reminders of events, closings, etc.

Posted via CB10

You, see the Anti-App Gang don't know most of those things are possible with all the apps we have available as they have chosen to stick to the old way of doing things.

Sort of guys who chose to carry on with the Horse Drawn Cart when the Ford Model T arrived.

Same sort of guys who asked what the point of GPS on a phone is, and what the point of a Camera in a Phone is and why 3G when EDGE is just fine for emails and texts.

Apps have helped turn our Smartphones into NOT JUST Work tools, but Entertainment and Lifestyle Tools.

I can now manage my Medical Aid (Medical Records, Doctors visits, Medical Aid Claims, COMMUNICATE WITH MY DOCTOR, allowed my Doctor to track how I am doing etc etc etc...) on my Smartphone without having to call or get onto their website, everything in the app is tailored to be done quickly and easily.

Something else that is truly awesome is apps like Uber and UberEATS, which have made getting a cab and food delivery so much simpler. No more having to direct anyone, or meet them by the main road or any of that crap. Your exact location is sent to them and they navigate to it, simple and easy.

What's the point of owning a SMARTphone if all it can do is basic communication and your work? We are no longer in 2005.

If people do not understand the use of apps then they must just say so, not bash them.

[Eumaeus]

But a laptop OS comes with a number of basic programs (apps if you insist on calling them that) and so does bb10 and linux. They all have file managers, text editors, mail tools, browsers and a host of many other commands that allow you to do pretty much everything. Even linux has games with the OS.
Y
I use my mac to do my work without any apps downloaded from the app store. I don't even have an apple ID.
I have some opensoftware "apps" like x11 and openoffice, firefox, blend (which still works fine with the latest MacOS update) and that's it.

I don't use siri, or Apple mail, i-message, icloud, iTunes, apple maps, apple calender.

The real work is in Linux. Neither MacOS nor windows nor android have my work app for IC design, so they are basically useless for me.

Posted via CB10

So you don't get the "hype" with "apps", which you admit means "software applications", without which a computer is useless. And you don't need them, except for the half dozen you named, one of which, X11 is an ecosystem hosting thousands of "apps"... and a specific app which was the determining factor for your choice of OS and ecosystem.

I this this post neatly sums up why Blackberry died for lack of "apps".

[bb10adopter111]

If people do not understand the use of apps then they must just say so, not bash them.

Your assumption that the only reason people wouldn't use apps is because they don't understand them is simply incorrect. I would MUCH rather do all the things you mention on my PC, where I can enjoy a large screen, mouse, and full-size keyboard with number pad to speed up every aspect of I/O.

My phone is a great work accessory, but I would never use it for most of the things you mention.

I absolutely understand why apps are great for millions of people who don't access computers constantly throughout the day. That's one reason they have become so prevalent. But that does NOT mean the people who don't need them are living in the past.

The things that my phone does better than my computer can be summarized as follows:

1) Availability for phone calls everywhere
2) Faster than my PC for triaging and responding to written communication, calendar, notes and tasks. (I often do these essential functions on my phone even when sitting at desk.
3) Mobile maps
4) Camera availability (though I keep a real camera handy for anything important)
5) Web browsing away from my computer, including social media.

That's about it. My phone is a work tool. I use it to keep things moving when I'm not able to access a computer. When I'm not working, it's typically in a bag and silenced, and I check it every 3-4 hours. After being plugged in to electronic communications for 50-60 hours at work each week, the last thing on earth I want is to be distracted by the damned thing during my leisure time. LOL

I don't expect the rest of the world to work as hard as I do or to use a smartphone like I do, but I know I'm not the only person who still sees mobile devices as a business necessity, but not as a leisure activity or tool for managing things like my health care, social life, banking, or other personal business. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but it's simply not a priority for me.



Posted with my trusty Z10

[Tsepz_GP]

Your assumption that the only reason people wouldn't use apps is because they don't understand them is simply incorrect. I would MUCH rather do all the things you mention on my PC, where I can enjoy a large screen, mouse, and full-size keyboard with number pad to speed up every aspect of I/O.

My phone is a great work accessory, but I would never use it for most of the things you mention.

I absolutely understand why apps are great for millions of people who don't access computers constantly throughout the day. That's one reason they have become so prevalent. But that does NOT mean the people who don't need them are living in the past.

The things that my phone does better than my computer can be summarized as follows:

1) Availability for phone calls everywhere
2) Faster than my PC for triaging and responding to written communication, calendar, notes and tasks. (I often do these essential functions on my phone even when sitting at desk.
3) Mobile maps
4) Camera availability (though I keep a real camera handy for anything important)
5) Web browsing away from my computer, including social media.

That's about it. My phone is a work tool. I use it to keep things moving when I'm not able to access a computer. When I'm not working, it's typically in a bag and silenced, and I check it every 3-4 hours. After being plugged in to electronic communications for 50-60 hours at work each week, the last thing on earth I want is to be distracted by the damned thing during my leisure time. LOL

I don't expect the rest of the world to work as hard as I do or to use a smartphone like I do, but I know I'm not the only person who still sees mobile devices as a business necessity, but not as a leisure activity or tool for managing things like my health care, social life, banking, or other personal business. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but it's simply not a priority for me.



Posted with my trusty Z10

Using apps doesn't mean you're constantly on the phone either, LOL.

You pretty much told me not to paint people who don't use apps with the same brush, but then you went ahead and did that for people who do. Oh the irony.

Using apps doesn't mean I'm going to sit in my phone the whole day, they point is that EVERYTHING I want and need is there no matter where I am. If I find myself in a car accident which I recently did and I'm not in a good state the paramedic can immediately access my medical record and know how to start treating me from the scene to the hospital, not only this, with my car insurance linked to my car and phone when an impact happens they are alerted and they can trace my location and find me as well as contact my next if kin, all in no time.


All that doesn't mean I am on the phone all day, it means my phone is a true Tool that will not ONLY get me through Work, but could save my or my family or friends life or just make my life more convenient.

If you find all if this useless then fair enough, in my opinion it just ensures that things that can be dealt with quickly no matter what.

My laptop will certainly not be there when I'm out.

[Emaderton3]

Using apps doesn't mean you're constantly on the phone either, LOL.

You pretty much told me not to paint people who don't use apps with the same brush, but then you went ahead and did that for people who do. Oh the irony.

Using apps doesn't mean I'm going to sit in my phone the whole day, they point is that EVERYTHING I want and need is there no matter where I am. If I find myself in a car accident which I recently did and I'm not in a good state the paramedic can immediately access my medical record and know how to start treating me from the scene to the hospital, not only this, with my car insurance linked to my car and phone when an impact happens they are alerted and they can trace my location and find me as well as contact my next if kin, all in no time.


All that doesn't mean I am on the phone all day, it means my phone is a true Tool that will not ONLY get me through Work, but could save my or my family or friends life or just make my life more convenient.

If you find all if this useless then fair enough, in my opinion it just ensures that things that can be dealt with quickly no matter what.

My laptop will certainly not be there when I'm out.

Some apps make some services faster and more efficient than a computer browser too.

Posted via CB10

[Thud Hardsmack]

If people do not understand the use of apps then they must just say so, not bash them.

Your assumption that the only reason people wouldn't use apps is because they don't understand them is simply incorrect.

Your assessment of his assumption is incorrect.

[jmr1015]

Your assumption that the only reason people wouldn't use apps is because they don't understand them is simply incorrect. I would MUCH rather do all the things you mention on my PC, where I can enjoy a large screen, mouse, and full-size keyboard with number pad to speed up every aspect of I/O.

My phone is a great work accessory, but I would never use it for most of the things you mention.

I absolutely understand why apps are great for millions of people who don't access computers constantly throughout the day. That's one reason they have become so prevalent. But that does NOT mean the people who don't need them are living in the past.

The things that my phone does better than my computer can be summarized as follows:

1) Availability for phone calls everywhere
2) Faster than my PC for triaging and responding to written communication, calendar, notes and tasks. (I often do these essential functions on my phone even when sitting at desk.
3) Mobile maps
4) Camera availability (though I keep a real camera handy for anything important)
5) Web browsing away from my computer, including social media.

That's about it. My phone is a work tool. I use it to keep things moving when I'm not able to access a computer. When I'm not working, it's typically in a bag and silenced, and I check it every 3-4 hours. After being plugged in to electronic communications for 50-60 hours at work each week, the last thing on earth I want is to be distracted by the damned thing during my leisure time. LOL

I don't expect the rest of the world to work as hard as I do or to use a smartphone like I do, but I know I'm not the only person who still sees mobile devices as a business necessity, but not as a leisure activity or tool for managing things like my health care, social life, banking, or other personal business. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that, but it's simply not a priority for me.



Posted with my trusty Z10

That's great that so much of your work can wait until you're back to your desk. Everyone isn't as lucky. Some of us need to create review or edit engineering schematics, spreadsheets or documents on the go, access ERP software and other proprietary custom apps, etc etc etc.

If I had to wait until I was seated at my computer to do work, I wouldn't get nearly as much done in my work week.

[sorinv]

So you don't get the "hype" with "apps", which you admit means "software applications", without which a computer is useless. And you don't need them, except for the half dozen you named, one of which, X11 is an ecosystem hosting thousands of "apps"... and a specific app which was the determining factor for your choice of OS and ecosystem.

I this this post neatly sums up why Blackberry died for lack of "apps".

I couldn't care less if BlackBerry died or dies and for whatever reason.

My point was and is that "apps" used to be programs and, like X11, browsers, word processors, etc. have been around for decades, way before smartphones and "apps" had been reinvented as marketing terms.
My work "app" is still not available on IoS, MacOS, windows or android, although it has been around since the 1980's on Unix workstations and later on Linux PCs and laptops. My work "app" has continued to evolve.
It is the app used to design all the integrated circuits that go in your phone, your laptop, your tablet and your every gadget, connected or not to the IoT.

A smartphone is a portable computer that can now also make calls and has a number of sensors that were not small enough and low power enough to have been installed on a laptop 20 years ago.

The progress has been in computer, radio hardware and sensors.
Apps are just programs.

There is nothing revolutionary about apps and this is the reason why apps developers are the lowest paid among software engineers according to the latest industry salary surveys in Noth America.

P.S. I do use my phone a lot, as a laptop, very rarely to make phone calls.

Posted via CB10

[sorinv]

That's great that so much of your work can wait until you're back to your desk. Everyone isn't as lucky. Some of us need to create review or edit engineering schematics, spreadsheets or documents on the go, access ERP software and other proprietary custom apps, etc etc etc.

If I had to wait until I was seated at my computer to do work, I wouldn't get nearly as much done in my work week.

That's not what he wrote!

Posted via CB10

[Thud Hardsmack]

That's not what he wrote!

Posted via CB10

That's exactly what he wrote.

[Thud Hardsmack]

I couldn't care less if BlackBerry died or dies and for what reason.

My point was and is that "apps" used to be programs and, like X11, browsers, word processors, etc. have been around for decades, way before smartphones and "apps" had been reinvented as marketing terms.
My work "app" is still not available on IoS, MacOS, windows or android, although it has been around since the 1980's on Unix workstations and later on Linux PCs and laptops. My work "app" has continued to evolve.
It is the app used to design all the integrated circuits that go in your phone, your laptop, your tablet and your every gadget, connected or not to the IoT.

A smartphone is a portable computer that can now also make calls and has a number of sensors that were not small enough and low power enough to have been installed on a laptop 20 years ago.

The progress has been in computer, radio hardware and sensors.
Apps are just programs.

There is nothing revolutionary about apps and this is the reason why apps developers are the lowest paid among software engineers according to the latest industry salary surveys in Noth America.

P.S. I do use my phone a lot, as a laptop, very rarely to make phone calls.

Posted via CB10

It's not that apps are revolutionary. It's that some users around here think unless they're baked in from release, they're extraneous and fail to understand that apps are "programs lite" at the very least and that they are not all users.

[sorinv]

It's not that apps are revolutionary. It's that some users around here think unless they're baked in from release, they're extraneous and fail to understand that apps are "programs lite" at the very least and that they are not all users.

Sure, but neither were programs all "baked" into the PC OS. You usually purchased them separately from third party developers or downloaded them from opensoftware or university websites.
Again, nothing new here.

Posted via CB10

[Thud Hardsmack]

Sure, but neither were programs all "baked+ into the PC OS. You usually purchased them separately from third party developers or downloaded them from opensoftware or university websites.
Again, nothing new here.

Posted via CB10

Right, it's nothing new nor out of the ordinary; yet what people here have been trying to point out is the hypocrisy of those same people buying and/or downloading software not included with their PC/Mac saying "if a phone doesn't include it then it's not necessary, we don't need apps, and neither does anyone else" and so on. They believe 3rd party software on a phone to be "silly", even though I'm pretty sure the vast majority of these same users have desktops and laptops with software they've installed from other sources - antivirus software, Chrome, Firefox, Thunderbird, anything that didn't come with the machine they bought yet they lambaste smartphones' 3rd party software. I haven't come across anyone who switched from BB10 to another platform merely because the interface alone pleased them, it was because of what they could do and/or get done with their chosen platform, whether working or playing. Or that they hated their BlackBerry because they just wanted to be left alone when they weren't at work. But mostly for what they could do with it. 3rd party software enhances the experience, and it sure helped legacy BBOS phones in their rise to the top. It's also the rug pulled out from under BB10; it needed the same boost which never came, and here we are.

[Tsepz_GP]

I couldn't care less if BlackBerry died or dies and for whatever reason.

My point was and is that "apps" used to be programs and, like X11, browsers, word processors, etc. have been around for decades, way before smartphones and "apps" had been reinvented as marketing terms.
My work "app" is still not available on IoS, MacOS, windows or android, although it has been around since the 1980's on Unix workstations and later on Linux PCs and laptops. My work "app" has continued to evolve.
It is the app used to design all the integrated circuits that go in your phone, your laptop, your tablet and your every gadget, connected or not to the IoT.

A smartphone is a portable computer that can now also make calls and has a number of sensors that were not small enough and low power enough to have been installed on a laptop 20 years ago.

The progress has been in computer, radio hardware and sensors.
Apps are just programs.

There is nothing revolutionary about apps and this is the reason why apps developers are the lowest paid among software engineers according to the latest industry salary surveys in Noth America.

P.S. I do use my phone a lot, as a laptop, very rarely to make phone calls.

Posted via CB10

Actually there is plenty revolutionary with apps in phones as they have essentially changed how we use the mobile phone.

Apps have been able to take advantage of the multiple sensors in phones and make our lives safer and more convenient.

Last time I checked, my laptop is not capable of telling me that I am driving through a Carjacking Hotspot, my phone with the Hijack Hotspot APP will alert me of that.

Just because YOU don't believe any of this is a big deal doesn't mean it isn't. In many situations across the globe apps in Smartphones have really helped millions of us.

Your usage of salary statistics is rather hilarious, as that doesn't really reflect how important a function is, just how much demand there is for it, demand doesn't mean it's less or more important, if there was suddenly a huge demand for clowns because everyone wants to be entertained it doesn't make them anymore more important than Surgeons who by the way also don't make some of the crazy sums of money the bankers who have sunk entire economies make.

[anon(9710735)]

BB10 has been available for license since last fall. Nobody wants to license it.

Blackberry Poptart SE - Cricket Wireless

So sad. The same with carriers not carrying BlackBerry because nobody wants it...

Posted via CB10

[bb10adopter111]

That's great that so much of your work can wait until you're back to your desk. Everyone isn't as lucky. Some of us need to create review or edit engineering schematics, spreadsheets or documents on the go, access ERP software and other proprietary custom apps, etc etc etc.

If I had to wait until I was seated at my computer to do work, I wouldn't get nearly as much done in my work week.

Yes, that's a different use case. I almost always have my laptop workstation available for real work. My BlackBerry is for keeping other people on track when I'm between meetings or traveling. I can't think of any serious engineering or process work that I could do better on my BlackBerry 10 phones, Android tablet or iPad. I own all three for testing purposes but only ever carry the BB.

Posted with my trusty Z10

[Emaderton3]

Yes, that's a different use case. I almost always have my laptop workstation available for real work. My BlackBerry is for keeping other people on track when I'm between meetings or traveling. I can't think of any serious engineering or process work that I could do better on my BlackBerry 10 phones, Android tablet or iPad. I own all three for testing purposes but only ever carry the BB.

Posted with my trusty Z10

I guess it depends on one's work. I can't do any real work on any mobile device either. Ultimately need my laptop for analysis, stats, and graphs.

Posted via CB10

[sorinv]

Actually there is plenty revolutionary with apps in phones as they have essentially changed how we use the mobile phone.

Apps have been able to take advantage of the multiple sensors in phones and make our lives safer and more convenient.

Last time I checked, my laptop is not capable of telling me that I am driving through a Carjacking Hotspot, my phone with the Hijack Hotspot APP will alert me of that.

Just because YOU don't believe any of this is a big deal doesn't mean it isn't. In many situations across the globe apps in Smartphones have really helped millions of us.

Your usage of salary statistics is rather hilarious, as that doesn't really reflect how important a function is, just how much demand there is for it, demand doesn't mean it's less or more important, if there was suddenly a huge demand for clowns because everyone wants to be entertained it doesn't make them anymore more important than Surgeons who by the way also don't make some of the crazy sums of money the bankers who have sunk entire economies make.

There is nothing that prevents a manufacturer from putting the same sensors that are in your phone in a laptop or tablet.

In fact most already have all those sensors.

There is no fundamental difference between a phone, a laptop or a tablet. They all run programs, also called apps, and they all can have all the sensors.

The difference is mostly in size with all the other differences and restrictions that follow from that.

The progress in the last ten years in smartphones has been driven by hardware advances:
-processor miniaturization and power consumption reduction while increasing functionality,
-powerful RF transceivers covering wider bandwidth and working at higher data rates, and
-new typed of miniature sensors and screens (also hardware).

Apps existed before the smartphone. They have just adpated to new hardware.

They are more powerful now simply because they have more and better hardware to run on and sensors to control which did not exist on phones and computers before.

All of those sensors, processors and transceivers can be and are being incorporated din computers, too, when it makes sense to do so.

Just like some tablets are connected to the cellular network, so can laptops, microwave ovens, fridges, your elbow and your knee.

Even your knee could be tagged, have a GPS and mems sensors in it, and could tell you or your monitor when you are about to be knee-jacked. You don't need a phone for that, but you might need an app.

Posted via CB10

[Tsepz_GP]

You don't need a phone for that, but you might need an app.

Posted via CB10

Exactly! And that is my point. They have advanced and revolutionised how we use the Mobile Phone.