04-03-17 11:58 PM
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  1. K Ts's Avatar
    When You search news about BlackBerry, all You can find is just a bad one. Over the last few years You can't really find a positive review. The thing is, many of those news and reviews were completely wrong. All reviews on Web like CNET, arenaGsm,motley etc.. gave away poor notes about BB10 devices where really poor made and low budget android phones with medicore specs were praised, not to mention Samsung devices, Do You think there was ever any agenda with one goal to finish BlackBerry? social media is the strongest marketing tool right now and branding is absolutely everything nowadays, BlackBerry had a grip on the last market share where no other competitor could step in.

    Posted via CB10
    02-21-17 11:47 PM
  2. Troy Tiscareno's Avatar
    Most reviews were actually quite fair - the criticisms were true and honest, and most of all, factual. BB's BB10 phones used less-than-flagship processors but carried a flagship price at launch, and later, they continued to use that same SoC long after it could even fairly be considered "mid-grade". The S4 Plus (it wasn't even the S4 Pro) is a 2012 processor that was used in the Z10, Q10, Q5, and Z30 (all launched in 2013), in the Z3 and Classic in 2014, and in the Leap in 2015! Even the Passport's 801 was already a generation behind when it launched. BB had to charge more for their phones because their costs were so high (mostly the software costs of the OS and overall platform, but to some degree the hardware too), so they weren't price-competitive with Android phones which had similar hardware.

    But the main criticism against BB10 was the lack of apps, and again, that was absolutely true and absolutely needed to be reported. And while the workarounds were sometimes mentioned, keep in mind that they were neither official nor "legal" - anything having to do with getting apps from Google Play were methods that violated the Play Store's TOS, and further, they simply weren't practical for the average user, who expects to be able to open the native app store, search for an app, hit "Install", and have it work perfectly. Regular consumers were not going to side-load, patch, or install Snap or Cobalt's hacked Play Store.

    Sure, there were a few articles that went too far, but most articles told the truth - even if it was a truth that BB10 fans didn't want to admit to. And as journalists, telling the cold hard truth is their job!

    BB themselves admitted that they waited too long to get into the game, and then moved way too slow once they finally got going, and they missed the window of success. Even they didn't blame the failure of BB10 on anyone else, because they know it was their own failure.

    Apple and Google were not concerned about BB10 - it had no chance of doing either any real harm, so they had no reason to do anything about it; the market was going to solve that problem for them, and it has. Same with WinPhone and all the other niche OSs. So, no need to look for any conspiracy theories. If you want to know how BB blew it, go to Amazon and buy yourself a copy of the book "Losing The Signal" and you'll have a much better understanding of what happened.
    02-22-17 12:36 AM
  3. early2bed's Avatar
    BlackBerry had a grip on the last market share where no other competitor could step in.
    The smartphone pie that BlackBerry owned back in the day was less than 1/10th the size of the current one. More importantly, they were consistently out-innovated by their competitors. They were focused on what their existing customers wanted while their competitors catered to everyone else who had never used smartphones. Sometimes it's better not to listen to what your customers want but rather to anticipate the desires of people who aren't your customers yet. Plus, you can't just look at the handsets. They were out-marketed and, more importantly, out-executed in terms of manufacturing.

    You perceive a media bias which may have been true when everyone was looking for a BlackBerry Killer but, for the past 9 years, people have been looking for iPhone Killers. The one that comes to mind is the Palm Pre, the CES Best in Show 2009. BlackBerry killed its own brand with dated hardware design and specs and some pretty bad handsets over the years.
    southlander likes this.
    02-22-17 03:18 AM
  4. donnation's Avatar
    I don't think the reviews for BB10 were biased. If you look at the Z10, it was deservingly bashed when it was released. It had a two hour battery and a beta OS on it that was unfinished and unrefined. As far as the other devices many of them got decent reviews, but where BB got bashed was with poor cameras (justified) and charging ridiculously high prices for phones that people weren't willing to pay for due to BlackBerry's poor reputation.
    02-22-17 05:26 AM
  5. MikeX74's Avatar
    An agenda to finish off BlackBerry? Really? Please stop with the conspiracy theories. No conspiracy or agenda was needed to put BlackBerry where it is right now. The company's self-inflicted wounds did that. Why is blaming others for BlackBerry's failures so common?
    02-22-17 06:30 AM
  6. kputock's Avatar
    Whenever there is competition, there is an agenda to eliminate the competition. This is how competitions are won and lost. The degree to which this was 'intentional' or otherwise 'self-inflicted' is certainly debatable...but to say any such effort (against BlackBerry) was completely non-existent on the part of its competitors is extremely naive, at best.
    deremi likes this.
    02-22-17 08:45 AM
  7. Dunt Dunt Dunt's Avatar
    Whenever there is competition, there is an agenda to eliminate the competition. This is how competitions are won and lost. The degree to which this was 'intentional' or otherwise 'self-inflicted' is certainly debatable...but to say any such effort (against BlackBerry) was completely non-existent on the part of its competitors is extremely naive, at best.
    I think in 2007, it was clear that Steve jobs was out to get BlackBerry customers.... for a few years after that he made reference to things like 7" tablets.

    In 2013... neither Google or Apple were paying much attention to BlackBerry. And most the reviews were correct in their criticisms.

    As for the media... it's all about clicks, you can count of a negative (but truthful) article getting you a number of clicks - My how the KING has fallen. Heck throw up a poll and you'll need more bandwidth for your servers.
    02-22-17 09:24 AM
  8. kvndoom's Avatar
    It's a conspiracy!

    Blackberry Poptart SE - Cricket Wireless
    02-22-17 09:51 AM
  9. kputock's Avatar
    In 2013... neither Google or Apple were paying much attention to BlackBerry.
    There is no evidence to support this claim. For example, both Google and Apple introduced much more granular permissions, and much improved security and encryption...clearly following the lead of BB10. If they were basically ignoring BlackBerry at this point why did they make these changes? It wasn't as if their customer base as demanding better security at the time. Why did Samsung develop Knox and their own version of the hub? How about their add-on keyboard appendage? How about Blackphone? Clearly everyone WAS paying attention to BlackBerry because they were poaching all their best ideas. Is this what a competitor does when they are "ignoring" you? Lol.
    02-22-17 10:38 AM
  10. Soulstream's Avatar
    There is no evidence to support this claim. For example, both Google and Apple introduced much more granular permissions, and much improved security and encryption...clearly following the lead of BB10. If they were basically ignoring BlackBerry at this point why did they make these changes? It wasn't as if their customer base as demanding better security at the time. Why did Samsung develop Knox and their own version of the hub? How about their add-on keyboard appendage? How about Blackphone? Clearly everyone WAS paying attention to BlackBerry because they were poaching all their best ideas. Is this what a competitor does when they are "ignoring" you? Lol.
    iOS introduced granular permissions in iOS 6 which launched in 2012, so before BB10 was released. Android, ok, they introduced that in 2015 with Android 6, but BB10 was not the first.

    I agree with you, that their bases didn't demand much more security, I don't think it was because of BB10 that iOS/Android started focusing on that. I think it was more of "ok, we have the consumer market won already, now let us go for the corporate market".
    02-22-17 12:00 PM
  11. AluminiumRims's Avatar
    BB10 was the best mobile operating system ever. Already out the box it had tons of built-in features. If you compared Android and Windows Phone, they were very crude from the beginning while more features were added later on. Windows Phone was from the beginning very limited, almost like a feature phone. This despite of being developed by one of the richest software company in the world. Despite that Windows Phone sucked, it still lives on today and will new phones will be in future, probably rebranded as "surface phone" or something like that.

    The power of BB10 was a threat to the US dominance in the operating system world and it had to be shut down. Shares was bought up by "investors", mainly from Wall Street who later instated John Chen as CEO. The purpose of John Chen was to kill BB10 so that there are only operating system from the US that are made for consumers (read population control). Notice how this story is very similar to what happened to Nokia, a method of success that could be used a second time.

    Notice how BB10 is just killed. There is no attempt to.

    1. License BB10 to Asian manufacturers. Usually Asian manufacturers are very open to new markets and companies like Samsung have made several attempts with different HW/SW in the past.
    2. Push BB10 in other markets, like system for embedded systems like TVs or automotive entertainment.
    3. There is no attempt to further develop BB10 internally.

    basically, Blackberry under John Chen does not want BB10 to be anywhere because his job is to "chen" BB10.
    arkenoi likes this.
    02-22-17 12:23 PM
  12. MikeX74's Avatar
    Whenever there is competition, there is an agenda to eliminate the competition. This is how competitions are won and lost. The degree to which this was 'intentional' or otherwise 'self-inflicted' is certainly debatable...but to say any such effort (against BlackBerry) was completely non-existent on the part of its competitors is extremely naive, at best.
    Of course there are efforts to eliminate competition, but that has nothing to do with the negative reviews the OP mentioned. The notion that news outlets/ blogs have some sort of agenda or bias against BlackBerry and/or go out of their way to write negative reviews about BB products is what I consider naive.
    02-22-17 01:04 PM
  13. early2bed's Avatar
    Wow. I didn't realize that people still believed in the anti-BlackBerry conspiracy around here. Going after your competition's customers is a normal business practice. If Apple or Google really thought that BlackBerry was that much of a threat, they could have just bought it. By the time you spin off QNX, bank the cash, and add the patents to your portfolio, it probably would have cost less than a billion dollars.

    The reason why you think that everyone was copying BB10's features is that BB10 was designed, specifically, to include features that competition currently lacked. It's how you differentiate yourself as a minor player - here's what the big guys don't have.

    Apple is known for holding off on features until they feel they are well-polished at the expense of being the first mover. Imagine if they had released a tablet that was as incomplete as the Playbook. That would have been a total disaster for the brand. For BlackBerry? It's just another swing and a miss and they move on like it never existed. What's the worst thing that could happen? Exit hardware?
    02-22-17 01:51 PM
  14. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    Fifty Shades of Black: the return of BlackBerry fan fiction.

    It's been a while since we updated the saga. Last we heard, BB10 was being targeted by a multinational cabal of shadowy interests. CBK was a part of the conspiracy.

    Now, we add Chen... and maybe even Bla1ze?
    deremi and app_Developer like this.
    02-22-17 03:21 PM
  15. StephanieMaks's Avatar
    These theories all fall into what I think of as the "everybody's fault but BlackBerry" category.

    Apple and Google were out to get them! The media conspired against them! The reviewers are biased! The public are all mindless sheep! Why oh why won't everyone just wake up and recognize the genius that is BB10?!?!?!?!

    The only ones who had a hand in 'finishing off BB' were Mike and Jim, followed by their hand-picked replacement Thor. Not intentionally of course, just through mismanagement and ineptitude.
    02-22-17 03:59 PM
  16. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    These theories all fall into what I think of as the "everybody's fault but BlackBerry" category.

    Apple and Google were out to get them! The media conspired against them! The reviewers are biased! The public are all mindless sheep! Why oh why won't everyone just wake up and recognize the genius that is BB10?!?!?!?!

    The only ones who had a hand in 'finishing off BB' were Mike and Jim, followed by their hand-picked replacement Thor. Not intentionally of course, just through mismanagement and ineptitude.
    You're one of them...
    02-22-17 04:03 PM
  17. kvndoom's Avatar
    These theories all fall into what I think of as the "everybody's fault but BlackBerry" category.

    Apple and Google were out to get them! The media conspired against them! The reviewers are biased! The public are all mindless sheep! Why oh why won't everyone just wake up and recognize the genius that is BB10?!?!?!?!
    Don't forget the evil gubmint!
    02-22-17 04:12 PM
  18. Ralph Morgotch's Avatar
    I wonder how well other Canadian companies do elsewhere in the world.....or in the US for that matter. And as we are told MANY times in Canada, "The US is the market that matters."

    There likely are/were many people that would not buy them because they are a Canadian company, just like many might not if it is a product from China or Mexico, for whatever reason they deem for themselves. People have their own biases. I personally do not think they made it as easy for "foreign" companies to compete in the US market and you can bet that is true now more than ever. But in the end people can buy what they want.

    To break through in a sea of American commercials cannot be an east feat for any "foreign" company. Sure there were some commercials but who cared. People blame Blackberry for this but when times were getting lean, who has a massive budget for advertizing for a product that was considered old and antiquated?

    I DO remember positive reviews for iphones and very negative reviews for Blackberry" and that negativity certainly did NOT help things and many of the so called "opinions" were based on personal bias from older models, and not so much on functionality.

    Like how some people despise Chen and some absolutely love him and credit him for keeping the company alive. It all comes down to personal subjective opinion for many.

    Some people will NEVER buy an American car, including many Americans, for whatever reason. So yes I think there can be many reasons for sales. Call it "Protectionism" call it whatever you want. But it does exist in the consumer market.


    -sent from a beautiful Bold 9900
    Last edited by Ralph Morgotch; 02-22-17 at 04:42 PM.
    02-22-17 04:30 PM
  19. Ralph Morgotch's Avatar
    Then again look at Samsung, so I digress.

    -sent from a beautiful Bold 9900
    02-22-17 04:46 PM
  20. kputock's Avatar
    Wow. I didn't realize that people still believed in the anti-BlackBerry conspiracy around here. Going after your competition's customers is a normal business practice. If Apple or Google really thought that BlackBerry was that much of a threat, they could have just bought it. By the time you spin off QNX, bank the cash, and add the patents to your portfolio, it probably would have cost less than a billion dollars.

    The reason why you think that everyone was copying BB10's features is that BB10 was designed, specifically, to include features that competition currently lacked. It's how you differentiate yourself as a minor player - here's what the big guys don't have.

    Apple is known for holding off on features until they feel they are well-polished at the expense of being the first mover. Imagine if they had released a tablet that was as incomplete as the Playbook. That would have been a total disaster for the brand. For BlackBerry? It's just another swing and a miss and they move on like it never existed. What's the worst thing that could happen? Exit hardware?
    Apple simply moved iOS from computer to smartphone. It didn't take a huge leap of genius...just shoehorning a computer into a smartphone box. Apple and Google/Android have lifted all sorts of ideas from BlackBerry. Including the idea of running apps on a smartphone, which BlackBerry had largely pioneered on its own BBOS. The Z10 eliminated the home button in 2013. In 2017 both Apple and Samsung will proudly announce they have eliminated the home button and call it an innovation...Lol!
    Tim-ANC likes this.
    02-22-17 06:06 PM
  21. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    Apple simply moved iOS from computer to smartphone. It didn't take a huge leap of genius...just shoehorning a computer into a smartphone box. Apple and Google/Android have lifted all sorts of ideas from BlackBerry. Including the idea of running apps on a smartphone, which BlackBerry had largely pioneered on its own BBOS. The Z10 eliminated the home button in 2013. In 2017 both Apple and Samsung will proudly announce they have eliminated the home button and call it an innovation...Lol!
    Creative borrowing... Which is why the king of pkb launched a touchscreen device as its flagship.
    02-22-17 06:35 PM
  22. kputock's Avatar
    Creative borrowing... Which is why the king of pkb launched a touchscreen device as its flagship.
    Nice try...BlackBerry had touchscreens long before the Z10. And are if you are looking for an iPhone copy - go talk to Samsung and ask them about their lawsuit. Lol.
    02-22-17 06:47 PM
  23. donnation's Avatar
    There is no evidence to support this claim. For example, both Google and Apple introduced much more granular permissions, and much improved security and encryption...clearly following the lead of BB10. If they were basically ignoring BlackBerry at this point why did they make these changes? It wasn't as if their customer base as demanding better security at the time. Why did Samsung develop Knox and their own version of the hub? How about their add-on keyboard appendage? How about Blackphone? Clearly everyone WAS paying attention to BlackBerry because they were poaching all their best ideas. Is this what a competitor does when they are "ignoring" you? Lol.
    I wouldn't say they were ignoring them in the sense that they didn't think they had good ideas. They were ignoring them because Blackberry was shooting itself in the foot every chance it got and it wasn't concerned with them from a sales standpoint because they were stuck in the past.
    MikeX74 likes this.
    02-22-17 07:09 PM
  24. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
    Nice try...BlackBerry had touchscreens long before the Z10. And are if you are looking for an iPhone copy - go talk to Samsung and ask them about their lawsuit. Lol.
    BlackBerry had an all touch screen device prior to the Z10? Keep in mind that most vets refuse to acknowledge the Storm, which still was a response to the iPhone.

    I know there is a segment of folks that believe all civilization sprouted in Waterloo, but the other tech companies did fine
    02-22-17 07:14 PM
  25. donnation's Avatar
    BlackBerry had an all touch screen device prior to the Z10? Keep in mind that most vets refuse to acknowledge the Storm, which still was a response to the iPhone.

    I know there is a segment of folks that believe all civilization sprouted in Waterloo, but the other tech companies did fine
    I'll acknowledge the Storm as the start of the disaster that ensued immediately after its release.
    02-22-17 07:44 PM
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