[ThaSwapMeetPimp]

I'm not normally one to agree with people from Google. I hate Google and it's mission to encompass all human thought in the next 15 or so years. But I was reading an article on Biblioteca Pleyades and I for one agree with Sergey Brin:

"Sergey Brin, co-founder of Google has recently said that he believes the biggest threat to internet freedom is,
“a combination of governments increasingly trying to control access and communication by their citizens, the entertainment industry’s attempts to crack down on piracy, and the rise of “restrictive” walled gardens such as Facebook and Apple, which tightly control what software can be released on their platforms.”"



The Global Elite’s Digital Agenda Played Out as Censorship and Cyber Warfare

One of the reasons I never got into Apple is because of the fact that they are a "walled garden". I don't like restrictions, especially on something I pay so much for. If I want to put something on a device that makes it more functional, even if it could mess it up, I like to know I have the freedom to do so without having to do anything special to the device. And if RIM ever went in this direction, I would have to give up my beloved BB. Now I'm there may be features that rooting my Playbook would give me, so some might say that's a wall in the garden, I'm sure. But it doesn't stop me from putting third party apps or apps that are not on app world on my tab, thanks to sideloading. I hope they never get rid of it.

[BB10FTW]

Sideloading will be disabled eventually because of the high rate of pirated apps. For some reason delevopers don't like that, go figure. RIM doesn't want us to feel locked in, however they do not want us to feel unsecure. I believe they have the right idea, Android is great for customizing but, I have several friends who own Android phones and they bricked them because the firmware they loaded wasn't good. I am hoping for themes to be available for BB10 and I can't see why they cannot do that. It may take awhile though.

[jrohland]

I see it like this:

Apple - control everything and in exchange you get a system that is easy to use and works. But it is inflexible and increasingly, you are getting marketing instead of information. Like riding on a train. You go where it takes you but are fed a decent meal and can use the toilet when you want.

Android - totally open and flexible. But, you give up privacy. Like riding an ATV totally naked.

BlackBerry - flexible within some boundaries. Like driving on a multi-lane motorway. You can use any lane you want, can enter and exit when you want but you must stay in the lanes and only use the official entrances and exits.

[ThaSwapMeetPimp]

Sideloading will be disabled eventually because of the high rate of pirated apps. For some reason delevopers don't like that, go figure. RIM doesn't want us to feel locked in, however they do not want us to feel unsecure. I believe they have the right idea, Android is great for customizing but, I have several friends who own Android phones and they bricked them because the firmware they loaded wasn't good. I am hoping for themes to be available for BB10 and I can't see why they cannot do that. It may take awhile though.

Ok well I have a question. On my BB I have always been able to install third party apps OTA. Is there any reason OTA can't work for the PB? Would still give access to apps that are not in app world. If possible, could that replace sideloading?

[Thunderbuck]

Ok well I have a question. On my BB I have always been able to install third party apps OTA. Is there any reason OTA can't work for the PB? Would still give access to apps that are not in app world. If possible, could that replace sideloading?

I believe OS2.1 allows OTA installations.

[jrohland]

It has always been possible to install apps on BBs through sideloading and from Web pages. I can't see that being stopped. What is likely to happen is developers will require a key associated with your BBID. That will make pirating much harder but allow customers to run the app on all their devices, as long as it is registered under the same BBID.

[ichat]

Dude, blackberry's are flexible to the hacking point. I wouldn't have one good reason to hack a playbook.

I was reading this very interesting article and it was about apple's terms and conditions.

They said by the wording of the conditions, they have the authority over you to make your device a $600 plastic/ fake aluminum slab.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9860 on 7.1.0.342 with Tapatalk and my fingers

[ichat]

I see it like this:



Apple - control everything and in exchange you get a system that is easy to use and works. But it is inflexible and increasingly, you are getting marketing instead of information. Like riding on a train. You go where it takes you but are fed a decent meal and can use the toilet when you want.



Android - totally open and flexible. But, you give up privacy. Like riding an ATV totally naked.



BlackBerry - flexible within some boundaries. Like driving on a multi-lane motorway. You can use any lane you want, can enter and exit when you want but you must stay in the lanes and only use the official entrances and exits.

Good explanation!

Sent from my BlackBerry 9860 on 7.1.0.342 with Tapatalk and my fingers

[reeneebob]

The walled garden isn't a bad thing sometimes. There have been several apps I've downloaded on BB and Android that didn't play nicely with my phone and I had to work to get the phone working properly again (Moreso on Android - I remember at least 3 times an app rendered my SGS in a reboot loop and it took some work to get it working again). At least walled gardens generally mean that the apps are vetted to not cause instability.


I got blisters on me fingers! from using Tapatalk.

[sam_b77]

The walled garden isn't a bad thing sometimes. There have been several apps I've downloaded on BB and Android that didn't play nicely with my phone and I had to work to get the phone working properly again (Moreso on Android - I remember at least 3 times an app rendered my SGS in a reboot loop and it took some work to get it working again). At least walled gardens generally mean that the apps are vetted to not cause instability.


I got blisters on me fingers! from using Tapatalk.

True about certain apps not playing nicely with BB, but I can delete it. The basis of what the OP is saying is "CHOICE" . I want choice which,etc not compromising on my privacy. BB offers that.

[jrohland]

The walled garden isn't a bad thing sometimes. There have been several apps I've downloaded on BB and Android that didn't play nicely with my phone and I had to work to get the phone working properly again (Moreso on Android - I remember at least 3 times an app rendered my SGS in a reboot loop and it took some work to get it working again). At least walled gardens generally mean that the apps are vetted to not cause instability.

You are correct. If you don't want the challenges of liberty, Apple gives you the easiest way. If you want options, you will make mistakes and bad choices occasionally. As we can see by purchasing and voting decisions, more and more people are willing to give up liberty and options for the easy path.

[ThaSwapMeetPimp]

The walled garden isn't a bad thing sometimes. There have been several apps I've downloaded on BB and Android that didn't play nicely with my phone and I had to work to get the phone working properly again (Moreso on Android - I remember at least 3 times an app rendered my SGS in a reboot loop and it took some work to get it working again). At least walled gardens generally mean that the apps are vetted to not cause instability.


I got blisters on me fingers! from using Tapatalk.

A tyranny is a tyranny. Someone dictating to you what you can or can not do with your own possessions (I include your body, mind, and soul among those) is never good. Freedom is the freedom to screw everything up, just like it's the freedom to be scared or the freedom to die at any moment. I refuse to give up freedom for security. Makes me a rare American I know. But the micro is the macro and the macro is the micro. Except in quantum physics/mechanics. Accepting tyranny on the small scale shows one will accept it on the large. I love RIM because it's not a tyranny, it's a semi-controlled market. Allows freedom, but won't put its approval on something that is not quality (I'm sure it does sometimes, but for the most part)

[ichat]

True about certain apps not playing nicely with BB, but I can delete it. The basis of what the OP is saying is "CHOICE" . I want choice which,etc not compromising on my privacy. BB offers that.

And PRIVACY is the keyword here.

BB does it better than anyone else.

Sometimes I think, having no front facing camera on a BB is a good thing!

The reason is:

Apple wants to stalk you so bad, they may just take glimpses of you with that camera o.o

Sent from my BlackBerry 9860 on 7.1.0.342 with Tapatalk and my fingers

[ichat]

You are correct. If you don't want the challenges of liberty, Apple gives you the easiest way. If you want options, you will make mistakes and bad choices occasionally. As we can see by purchasing and voting decisions, more and more people are willing to give up liberty and options for the easy path.

Taking the simple path is like a trap. You fall into it and can't get out. Apple does that with the twist of taking advantage of simplicity and stalks you like prey.

Hey blackberry has become simple. Have you ever tried transferring contacts from iphone? O.o

Sent from my BlackBerry 9860 on 7.1.0.342 with Tapatalk and my fingers

[reeneebob]

It wasn't as bad for me, I can hack the heck out of my phones. I jailbreak and rooted and custom rommed and manually shrink an OS (the best way to technical support a phone is to hack it so you know how the OS works, right?)...but those times on stock android where I got the reboot loop frustrated me so imagine joe blow off the street handling it?


I got blisters on me fingers! from using Tapatalk.

[ichat]

It wasn't as bad for me, I can hack the heck out of my phones. I jailbreak and rooted and custom rommed and manually shrink an OS (the best way to technical support a phone is to hack it so you know how the OS works, right?)...but those times on stock android where I got the reboot loop frustrated me so imagine joe blow off the street handling it?


I got blisters on me fingers! from using Tapatalk.

Yea but that sometimes goes into illegal borders. We want legal flexibility.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9860 on 7.1.0.342 with Tapatalk and my fingers

[itmccb]

Gross exaggerations. You're not electing world leaders, you're buying tools/toys
At the worst, if something goes awry, it'll be little more than a minor inconvenience.

[jrohland]

It wasn't as bad for me, I can hack the heck out of my phones. I jailbreak and rooted and custom rommed and manually shrink an OS (the best way to technical support a phone is to hack it so you know how the OS works, right?)...but those times on stock android where I got the reboot loop frustrated me so imagine joe blow off the street handling it?

Sure you can dig a hole under the garden wall. But it begs the question; why did you volunteer to be locked in Apple's walled garden in the first place?

I know someone who jail broke his iPhone and now Siri doesn't work. Now, I think that is a good thing as it looks like Siri mostly gives you only what Apple has been paid to deliver.

[jrohland]

Gross exaggerations. You're not electing world leaders, you're buying tools/toys

In terms of the people using these devices, there may not be any real difference. Remember, some companies and some politicians know "the useful idiots" and how to take advantage of them.

[ThaSwapMeetPimp]

It wasn't as bad for me, I can hack the heck out of my phones. I jailbreak and rooted and custom rommed and manually shrink an OS (the best way to technical support a phone is to hack it so you know how the OS works, right?)...but those times on stock android where I got the reboot loop frustrated me so imagine joe blow off the street handling it?


I got blisters on me fingers! from using Tapatalk.

Joe blow off the street should take the time to learn what he is doing before trying to do something like that. And he probably has the freedom to learn how to do such things, if he would just take the time to learn. Freedom to screw things up.....freedom is not just all those wonderful ideas its scary as heck. But it's worth that fear.

I don't know how to double quote on this, so for those bringing up the privacy angle I have something to add: The price of liberty is not privacy. It is eternal vigilance. Not towards outside threats. No outside threat could ever take my liberty. It is the internal threat, the destruction if our liberty from within. Here in the U.S. our politicians approval ratings are so low that they should not be allowed to represent us anymore. But they are so entrenched, and while they are still holding their position with the strength of the ignorance of the people behind them, they are consolidating power, making their unconstitutional dictates into law. They have given themselves the power to incarcerated us for anything, named our country (the homeland, sounds awfully Nazi-esque to me) part of the battlefield, and asserted their right to kill us anywhere in the world if we step out of line. All because of the complacency and ignorance of the people who give them their power. We have to stop giving them this power over us, we have to cry liberty or death. Otherwise all is lost.

Sorry to rant. Getting harder to hold this stuff in.

[jrohland]

Sorry to rant. Getting harder to hold this stuff in.

You should tell us how you really feel. Anyway, this is probably not the best forum for that. Let's hope things actually change this November.

[ThaSwapMeetPimp]

You should tell us how you really feel. Anyway, this is probably not the best forum for that. Let's hope things actually change this November.

I know it's not the best forum for it, but that's the great thing about freedom of speech, it knows no rules or boundaries. One free conversation can lead to all types of other free conversations, in any format.

November will be a sad time for me. I voted for Obama. And he did everything I thought the republican choice would do. Our system is too flawed. I cannot in good conscience continue to exercise the freedom to choose who represents me from their limited pool of choices. None of their provided choices do. I can only enter a vote of "No confidence", if that's even an option.

I hope that it's not too late, that they will listen to our voices before the rest of the public arrives at the same conclusion I already have: that they don't understand our words anymore, they don't really speak the language, and that the only language they understand is the language of force. The voice of the gun.

And to make it BB related, thank you RIM for being a holdout. For protecting our privacy. So many of us claim that the security of our data is why we stay. You are one of the last bastions of true freedom from the coming tyranny that we have.

[reeneebob]

Sure you can dig a hole under the garden wall. But it begs the question; why did you volunteer to be locked in Apple's walled garden in the first place?

I know someone who jail broke his iPhone and now Siri doesn't work. Now, I think that is a good thing as it looks like Siri mostly gives you only what Apple has been paid to deliver.

Because I'm happy with how it works jailbroken or not. I could remove my jailbreak right now and would be fine with it.

Jailbreaking isn't illegal, either (you didnt say that but anoter poster implied it). Now, some people abuse it by stealing apps - those people are thieves and you can do that on stock BB and Android as well as jailbroken iOS. Have I done it? No. Have I seen plenty of cracked BB and android apps on non hacked phones? Absolutely.

I left android because in order for my SGS to get decent battery and stability I had to root it. Keeping up on all the patches felt like work. I had my iPhone for almost a year before I jailbroke. I had iPod touches since they launched and never jailbroke. I like that it worked as it should out of the box, something that I have never experienced with any of my previous smartphones. Ever.

I guess that's why I chose to lock into apples ecosystem. Like I said, if apple announced tomorrow that jailbreaks were being made illegal, I'd restore to stock without grumbling. I just like a couple of the tweaks like Intelliscreen x.


I got blisters on me fingers! from using Tapatalk.

[reeneebob]

A tyranny is a tyranny. Someone dictating to you what you can or can not do with your own possessions (I include your body, mind, and soul among those) is never good. Freedom is the freedom to screw everything up, just like it's the freedom to be scared or the freedom to die at any moment. I refuse to give up freedom for security. Makes me a rare American I know. But the micro is the macro and the macro is the micro. Except in quantum physics/mechanics. Accepting tyranny on the small scale shows one will accept it on the large. I love RIM because it's not a tyranny, it's a semi-controlled market. Allows freedom, but won't put its approval on something that is not quality (I'm sure it does sometimes, but for the most part)

Dude...no offense but it's a cell phone. So because I don't mind Apples ecosystem I would be fine living in a tyrannical society? Good lord.

What's ironic is that RIM is in a country with socialised medicine and a lot of government control over its citizens. Something I'm okay with. In the states you guys guard your gun rights. "From your cold dead hands". Well that's exactly how we feel...about medicine for all.

I personally think you have bigger problems down there than what you seem paranoid over. IMHO.

I got blisters on me fingers! from using Tapatalk.

[reeneebob]

Joe blow off the street should take the time to learn what he is doing before trying to do something like that. And he probably has the freedom to learn how to do such things, if he would just take the time to learn. Freedom to screw things up.....freedom is not just all those wonderful ideas its scary as heck. But it's worth that fear.

I don't know how to double quote on this, so for those bringing up the privacy angle I have something to add: The price of liberty is not privacy. It is eternal vigilance. Not towards outside threats. No outside threat could ever take my liberty. It is the internal threat, the destruction if our liberty from within. Here in the U.S. our politicians approval ratings are so low that they should not be allowed to represent us anymore. But they are so entrenched, and while they are still holding their position with the strength of the ignorance of the people behind them, they are consolidating power, making their unconstitutional dictates into law. They have given themselves the power to incarcerated us for anything, named our country (the homeland, sounds awfully Nazi-esque to me) part of the battlefield, and asserted their right to kill us anywhere in the world if we step out of line. All because of the complacency and ignorance of the people who give them their power. We have to stop giving them this power over us, we have to cry liberty or death. Otherwise all is lost.

Sorry to rant. Getting harder to hold this stuff in.

You misunderstand me. I was referring to joe blow off the street downloading an app that doesn't play nicely with their stock device. Do you know how may people I have that come to me at the store saying they downloaded something or changed a setting and now their stock device has gone haywire?

You need to remember that those of us on a tech forum are the minority. There is a large segment of society that doesn't get tech and doesn't know where to start.

I love when adult children buy their parents a galaxy s 2 or iPhone and they neglect to teach them how to use it. Makes my job SO much fun.

As far as the rest of it, I think you may need to step away from Fox news or whatever has you so paranoid. The nazis? Really? We are talking about cell phones here.

I got blisters on me fingers! from using Tapatalk.