[Elite1]

That's why the Z30 was released there last week. What, Malaysia isn't part of Canada???

Hey solid point!
You're right, obviously. Plus if Canadians were true BB supporters we obviously would have had BB Jam Asia here too. Right???

Tmobile are the first to pull the pin on stocking Blackberry (actually, they're not, as there are carriers here that don't carry them at all - but they would be the biggest). I wouldnt be surprised if you can only buy a Z30 through 3rd party resellers e.g. Best Buy or KMart. You'd have to order it in, though, as there's no-one going to be brave enough to stock this puppy.

In the US, Verizon has already confirmed they're carrying the Z30.
In Canada, Telus has already confirmed they're carrying the Z30.
Facts are your friends.

[kevinnugent]

Hey solid point!
You're right, obviously. Plus if Canadians were true BB supporters we obviously would have had BB Jam Asia here too. Right???

In the US, Verizon has already confirmed they're carrying the Z30.
In Canada, Telus has already confirmed they're carrying the Z30.
Facts are your friends.

Carrying is very different to either stocking or selling.

[Bla1ze]

They are also no longer stocking q5 in stores, order only.

They never carried it to begin with. As for the others, prices had to drop anyway in order for people to even consider it. That's a double edged sword. Optimist will see it as "Good, the price drop will move units" while the pessimist will say "Damn. Fire sale. They might as well just burn all the inventory and claim insurance!"

[richardat]

I agree that the sales people shouldnt push phones on people, and in this case detailing the situation of BB is needed. BUT, i know for a fact that sales people were pushing other phones over BBs the day of Z10 and Q10 launches. In my opinon, you need to make a sale on what best fits the user... you make the user try out a variety of phones and they pick the one that fits them the best. If that isnt a blackberry... who cares... but flat out saying 'this phone is no good and blackberry is closing shop' on the day of a major phone/os launch is what many people were doing to BB. The sales persons job is to state facts and show the features of the devices, personal opinion, or wild conjecture based on nothing at all, should not be a part of the job (the current BB situation is obviously not included in this as it IS fact). But, that is my opinion obviously, and others may disagree... no problem there.

I agree that the customers make their own decisions - and ultimately I believe they do in the majority of cases. Frankly, I don't believe that their was any systematic ploy to push other brands over BB, there simply is no data on this,

I am sure some people here encountered that just as they are claiming....I am sure, just as was reported by some, that there were pro-BB sales people as well, and people who were neutral. I guarantee every single brand has similar stories of "bias". Of course, now that we know absolutely how poorly sales were going, one must also realize that many of those sales people who told posters that the BB phones weren't moving.....were not crazy devils trying to sabotage BB....they were telling the truth!

In any case, just as then, I would say anyone who wants a BB phone should go get one! Just do so aware of the circumstances, and dont' be surprised if it comes back to bite you.

[richardat]

Carrying is very different to either stocking or selling.

It will be interesting to see the "efforts". I expected some effort - no doubt agreements were put in place some time ago- but I don't think anyone will be throwing in good money if they aren't obligated to. I don't think this is gonna be pretty, I think it's going to be just....savage.

I think the carriers actually made a really strong effort before to support BB....90% or more of the TV ads I saw were from them, as was much of the print advertising, and the z10 was front and center on websites and other promotional material....now, unless obligated, they have every reason not to push them....in fact, I couldn't blame them if they didn't want to sell any.

[FSeverino]

I agree that the customers make their own decisions - and ultimately I believe they do in the majority of cases. Frankly, I don't believe that their was any systematic ploy to push other brands over BB, there simply is no data on this,

I am sure some people here encountered that just as they are claiming....I am sure, just as was reported by some, that there were pro-BB sales people as well, and people who were neutral. I guarantee every single brand has similar stories of "bias". Of course, now that we know absolutely how poorly sales were going, one must also realize that many of those sales people who told posters that the BB phones weren't moving.....were not crazy devils trying to sabotage BB....they were telling the truth!

In any case, just as then, I would say anyone who wants a BB phone should go get one! Just do so aware of the circumstances, and dont' be surprised if it comes back to bite you.

Wise words

Posted via CB10

[FFR]

Q10 isn't dropping in price as much as the Z10. Wonder why that is.

Posted via CB10

You shouldn't have to wonder;

They manufactured more z10's than q10's.

There is still time for the q10 to receive a write down,
We should know more tomorrow.

[pantlesspenguin]

I get ticked at the accusations that US carriers didn't push BB10 devices. At every T-Mo and Best Buy I went to they had huge displays in the front of the store (or in front of their mobile section in Best Buy's case) with lots of live demo units, dummy units, and information. The sales associates that were at the store I went to pick up my Z10 on launch day were excited to sell me the device. They hadn't received their demo unit yet and they were eager for me to open the puppy up and start setting things up so they could watch me navigate the OS. I stopped by a week or two after the Q10 launch just to play around with it. One of the associates remembered me and asked if I was there to look at the Q10, and pulled his own out of his pocket.

But after a few months of them not selling as well as other devices, it's completely understandable to me that displays were minimized and moved to other areas of the store. It's understandable to me that they would try to push the more popular devices on the odds that the customer will be satisfied with that purchase.

I think a primary failure was the lack of marketing, resulting in lack of interest from the public. There were no ads that made the distinction that BB10 was an entirely new OS and not just a different UI slapped on the old system that was plagued with freezing apps and required battery pulls. The ads they showed were highly conceptual and barely focused on the phone itself (like the keep moving spot). In the weeks before the Z10 launch I was telling everyone that was going to be my next device, and more often than not I was met with "Oh, I'd never get another BlackBerry." I had to tell them that it was an entirely different OS, and even then I was met with skepticism. This is something that BlackBerry failed to address. So when people saw BlackBerry devices in the stores it's understandable that they were glossed over because people simply didn't know any better.

[cgk]

The other side of it is that the carrier support is almost always directly connected to the support a company is putting behind a device - so if you don't see a big push on the Z30, it is because BBRY is not giving it a big marketing budget.

[ADGrant]

Thanks for the objection, i should elaborate because (as I just wrote in another rant), I"m not one who buys into the more fanciful conspiracy theories regarding Watsa and Heins - so I'll make that clear once again!

Nor am I saying that either have committed fraud in a way that they are criminally answerable for - though that may be the result more of a lack of evidence.

I also would seperate Watsa in the lying department....other than his "40$" comment, which I think was pure, utter BS, I am not thinking of any clear lies he has made - and arguably, that could have simply been pure....stupidity on his part. Heins though, has absolutely lied and committed fraud (whether criminal or not). The PB, the sales, the apps......these were all clearly intentional misleads and sometimes, explicit lies. I don't buy into "optimism" on his part, I have suspected, and then been sure, for quite some time now that he never believed that BB10 was likely to succeed - not that I expected him to admit it. So, much of what he said- was not out-of-line for typical troubled CEO lies....but that doesn't justify them morally or personally. Some, like the PB lie, were in my mind, way-over-the-top.....I believe absolutely that he knew LONG ago that b10 wasn't coming to the PB. I believe he knowingly said that it was (oh...sure...the "out" being, he still had 2 guys in the basement "working" on it), but then when he subsequently fell silent for a long time, and then announced as if it were a recent discovery? Outright lying. I believe he knew WELL before he went silent. There simply would be no way for a CEO and the engineering teams to be that grossly incompetent.....and I'm saying that as somebody who doesn't have much faith in either when it comes to BB!

I think you would be surprised. There really is no limit to how incompetent a CEO can be (e.g. the Time Warner CEO who bought AOL) and I have no doubt that Heins is incompetent.

Seldom do senior managers speak to engineering teams and when they do, the engineering teams may just tell them what they want to hear. Telling a senior manager something he doesn't want to hear is rarely career enhancing.