07-09-08 12:36 PM
- Now you are being intentionally ridiculous.
Now I see the problem. You seem to equate defending yourself and property with violent acts of homicide. If you cannot differentiate between a measured forceful response to a criminal act and disproportional acts of violent murder then maybe you should seek professional help.
If some drunk at a local bar tried to ROB MY WIFE in any way shape or form he would get a sound beating and a ride to the local jail from one of our fine law enforcement officers. That is called DEFENDING YOUR LOVED ONES. I would not MURDER someone for property. I would protect my right to own property as well as what is dear to me by any reasonable means.
The fact that you seem to see any and all violence (even in self defense) as unreasonable is your problem. I hope that you never are faced with a situation in which you must protect your family by fighting.....for their sake. But who knows. Maybe you would find the fortitude to look past your distaste of our "Violent" ways and realize that force is sometimes a necessary evil. You may not have seen the kind of things I have seen and so you don't understand that. All people can be reasoned with. But some CHOOSE to be unreasonable. Many of those people then CHOOSE to be violent or malicious. That is when conversation and negotiation no longer work. I hope you never have to witness that type of behavior.
Either way I am sure you are a good person, Red. We just have a different way of viewing things. Perhaps being a little less judgmental could keep from causing so much misunderstanding?
I sincerely apologize for calling you self righteous. I just thought it a bit presumptuous to assume that just because someone has children that they are automatically above resorting to violence, be it justified or not. They are two separate issues. Being a good Dad doesn't mean I will never resort to violence. It means I must set an example of when (and when not) to use violence and to use the proper amount of restraint in order to keep things from going too far. Whether it is in defense of self or others who cannot defend themselves. Becoming a parent doesn't necessarily make someone a better person. Sometimes it is exactly the opposite. I have booked quite a few people for violent or neglectful (and some worse crimes that I will not stain these forums with) crimes that they committed AGAINST their children. It is in the character of the individual that determines whether or not you are a good parent and ,therefore, a good human being.
If I am sitting at the McDonald's and someone attempts to physically harm a PERSON in my family, then I would go into one of those "red haze" moments and try to kill the person.07-09-08 11:20 AM
- Then I guess we can agree, somewhat.
It is only where we draw the line that differs. Your line is when safety of family or friend is at risk. A truly laudable philosophy and perfectly reasonable.
I view any criminal act against myself or anyone for that matter as grounds for me to use force (within reason) to stop said criminal act. (not smashing through windows or stabbing but an incapacitated criminal is much easier to restrain) Whether it is petty theft or full out assault and battery. It isn't the property that is being taken that I am responding to. It is the illegal act itself that I have no tolerance for.
A slightly more strict philosophy but certainly within reason.
Just a matter of personal boundaries.
Last edited by adambigge; 07-09-08 at 12:20 PM.07-09-08 12:17 PM
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