[grahamf]

Many companies (Sobeys, Costco, Canadian tire, etc) partner with banks to offer their own credit cards. Maybe Blackberry could do the same thing which would allow them full control over the properties of the card, such as integrating it into Blackberry 10 as a nfc payment method.

You would still get a physical card (with a cool blackberry design or maybe it's optionally personalized), but the card will also be linked to your BBID and NFC payment would be in the core of the OS, accessible by a simple gesture or in the quick dropdown menu.

This would be independent of any carrier and would work with any NFC pay terminal worldwide (currency conversion applies and some require you to sign), and would help tout the security of Blackberry devices.

Thoughts? I know for a fact I'd get one and make it my primary card.

[Thunderbuck]

That's actually more involved than what needs to happen.

You're talking about what's known in the credit card business as an "affinity" card. Such cards offer some kind of bonus, like loyalty points or perhaps a small donation to a non-profit. Since BlackBerry sells relatively little directly to the public it's hard to see how much benefit this would provide users.

Current NFC-payment implementations in Canada don't require a special credit card. They DO require a special SIM, so the carrier has to be on board (so far I think only Rogers is at the moment). CIBC definitely has a deal with Rogers, and I believe ScotiaBank does as well.

[RUU_CB]

TD has one that works with RoBellus.

Posted via CB10

[grahamf]

That's actually more involved than what needs to happen.

You're talking about what's known in the credit card business as an "affinity" card. Such cards offer some kind of bonus, like loyalty points or perhaps a small donation to a non-profit. Since BlackBerry sells relatively little directly to the public it's hard to see how much benefit this would provide users.

The benefit would be for Blackberry users. Maybe cash-back towards Blackberry Phones and accessories directly from the Blackberry Store? That'd make me a permanent Blackberry customer. Even savings towards blackberry World purchases would be nice. Admittedly this might not the thing for every customer, but would work as a lock-in for those that do use it. Plus it could be rolled out internationally.

Current NFC-payment implementations in Canada don't require a special credit card. They DO require a special SIM, so the carrier has to be on board (so far I think only Rogers is at the moment). CIBC definitely has a deal with Rogers, and I believe ScotiaBank does as well.

The problem is that now you need a special SIM, and the right carrier and bank. I have RBC and Koodo, and I have no intention of giving either up, especially my grandfathered Koodo plan with decent data. RBC has not partnered with Telus, and Koodo does not offer a pay SIM.



And the biggest thing is: this works as a proof of concept for Blackberry's security. The reason for the special SIM is because the system was made for Android in mind, and thus sensitive info must be segregated from the OS as much as possible. Blackberry can use this to prove to banks that their phones can handle sensitive data without involving the carrier, and then banks eventually integrate into Blackberry's payment system.

[Thunderbuck]

No, the SIM requirement has nothing to do with OS or any perceived weakness with Android. It makes provision for secure data that the banks require (possibly higher level or proprietary encryption, I'm not sure). The new iPhone will need to meet this requirement too.

There is no way around this; mobile payments requires carrier support.

Posted from CB10 running on my awesome Z30 2B6927F7

[grahamf]

No, the SIM requirement has nothing to do with OS or any perceived weakness with Android. It makes provision for secure data that the banks require (possibly higher level or proprietary encryption, I'm not sure). The new iPhone will need to meet this requirement too.

There is no way around this; mobile payments requires carrier support.

Posted from CB10 running on my awesome Z30 2B6927F7

if Apple required carrier support, than shouldn't there have been mention that they were working with carriers? It would be rather important.

[WArcher]

That's actually more involved than what needs to happen.

You're talking about what's known in the credit card business as an "affinity" card. Such cards offer some kind of bonus, like loyalty points or perhaps a small donation to a non-profit. Since BlackBerry sells relatively little directly to the public it's hard to see how much benefit this would provide users.

Current NFC-payment implementations in Canada don't require a special credit card. They DO require a special SIM, so the carrier has to be on board (so far I think only Rogers is at the moment). CIBC definitely has a deal with Rogers, and I believe ScotiaBank does as well.

Rogers in Canada is actually a Bank, as well (Rogers Bank). There is a consortium already in place which already includes BlackBerry and it is called "EnStream" (in fact there is a press release here on CrackBerry about this: BlackBerry announces three-year deal with EnStream for secure financial transactions | CrackBerry.com)

The interesting thing about EnStream is that the consortium needed a super secure private cloud network which was bullet proof and which stood up to CSEC requirements (super tight security of a military grade). The BlackBerry NOC fit the bill perfectly.

All the infrastructure is there and it's already running and BlackBerry is already fully on board - at least in Canada.

[Thunderbuck]

if Apple required carrier support, than shouldn't there have been mention that they were working with carriers? It would be rather important.

Let's put it this way: what carrier would risk losing customers by NOT supporting this?

Posted from CB10 running on my awesome Z30 2B6927F7

[grahamf]

Let's put it this way: what carrier would risk losing customers by NOT supporting this?

Posted from CB10 running on my awesome Z30 2B6927F7

Verizon.

[darkehawke]

Wasn't bbm money coming and due to be expanded into something like this? Why do blackberry take forever to do these things and lose out as a result

Posted via the Android CrackBerry App!

[Thunderbuck]

Wasn't bbm money coming and due to be expanded into something like this? Why do blackberry take forever to do these things and lose out as a result

Posted via the Android CrackBerry App!

Last I heard BBM Money was being piloted in SE Asia, and would likely expand to Africa after that since in those regions they're already VERY comfortable with mobile payments. You'd think India would be on the list but any foreign financial operator faces a nightmare of red tape to set up shop there.

Posted from CB10 running on my awesome Z30 2B6927F7

[kimosabi]

While it's true that they require a special sim for monetary transactions and carrier support, the main reason behind the sim requirements is not security but just desiring to make money per transaction. It's totally possible to have relatively secure nfc payments without carrier support but they're not going to let that slide.

[KenFletch]

I have the Rogers payment app but so far no card support that I'm interested ed in using due to extra fees.

It's called suretap wallet

Expect uptake is poor

HTC TOUCH, Nokia-N97, BlackBerry Torch 9800, Z10

[Lia Levin]

I think BlackBerry must do differently. No need to connect to visa/master. I hope they develop that make our live simple.
I put money to have a Starbucks card, a toll card, a movie card etc. I hope BlackBerry can take all that card and so all I need is my Q10. I just put my money in my Q10.

Posted via CB10

[KenFletch]

Suretap has a collection of top-up-able store gift cards and no credit cards

Pretty sure the problem is who pays.

In the USA Apple can probably arm twist the banks, in Canada not so much.

But once the precedent is in that the banks share their slice with the tap app provider then it can move quickly

HTC TOUCH, Nokia-N97, BlackBerry Torch 9800, Z10

[TGR1]

Last I heard BBM Money was being piloted in SE Asia, and would likely expand to Africa after that since in those regions they're already VERY comfortable with mobile payments. You'd think India would be on the list but any foreign financial operator faces a nightmare of red tape to set up shop there.

Posted from CB10 running on my awesome Z30 2B6927F7

Has Nokia lost out there with the decline in phones? They were huge with micro payments there.

[TGR1]

Suretap has a collection of top-up-able store gift cards and no credit cards

Pretty sure the problem is who pays.

In the USA Apple can probably arm twist the banks, in Canada not so much.

But once the precedent is in that the banks share their slice with the tap app provider then it can move quickly

HTC TOUCH, Nokia-N97, BlackBerry Torch 9800, Z10

As I understand it Apple negotiated a reduction in bank fees so they get a cut per transaction although it appears there isn't an increase for the merchant (no drop either, sigh). If it is true that in the US credit card revenue is about a couple trillion a year (read this, haven't personally looked it up) then even a smallish % will add some nice revenue for Apple. Banks will not lose out either if fraud losses do indeed drop and if the numbers work better than chip-PIN alone I imagine it is more likely that international banks will get on board.

[Playbook007]

I think Apple Pay was an ingenious way to to make the iphone 6 appear to be something newer/ better and definitely a must have device. However, I also believe that this will prove to be a major headache and distraction to the company. It will take a massive effort to match Visa/Mastercard etc world wide and I don't believe these big players and most banks are going to play nice. It's a nice concept, but in time I think it will be more of a nightmare.

Posted via CB10

[TGR1]

I think Apple Pay was an ingenious way to to make the iphone 6 appear to be something newer/ better and definitely a must have device. However, I also believe that this will prove to be a major headache and distraction to the company. It will take a massive effort to match Visa/Mastercard etc world wide and I don't believe these big players and most banks are going to play nice. It's a nice concept, but in time I think it will be more of a nightmare.

Posted via CB10

Apple Pay is not a competitor. It is more a facilitator- the make nice middleman between the poor little consumer and the big bad world. Granted, in the long term it has the potential to give the issuers grief but I am not sure Apple even wants to go that way - banks and credit card issuers are pretty well hated and handle a lot of regulatory crap. And it's not an empty marketing ploy but a service with quite a bit of upside potential for all the players. That's decent value if it pans out.

[asherwiin]

I have the Rogers payment app but so far no card support that I'm interested ed in using due to extra fees.

It's called suretap wallet

Expect uptake is poor

HTC TOUCH, Nokia-N97, BlackBerry Torch 9800, Z10

Ya, they require you to sign up for a special new prepaid Mastercard credit card just to use the NFC enabled wallet. You can't just link any existing CC to the app. And the special card has monthly fees attached to it even if you don't use it. You can also purchase and link a range of retail stores/restaurants gift cards to it as well.

This will a non-starter for a lot of people.

On the other hand, it does segregate your cards so that if your phone ever got hacked, your exposure would be quite limited.

Posted via CB10