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  1. saintforlife's Avatar
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    Default BlackBerry vs Windows Phone - What does RIM need to do to secure the No.3 spot long term?

    Other than knocking it out of the park with BB10 of course?

    Also somehow RIM needs to convince the customers that they too have an 'ecosystem'. It seems to be all the rage these days.
    Last edited by saintforlife; 01-31-2013 at 11:22 PM.
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  2. Dapper37's Avatar
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    Carry on creating explosive brand awareness and buzz! Just like their doing!
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  3. Maxey05's Avatar
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    Default BlackBerry vs Windows Phone - What does RIM need to do to secure the No.3 spot long term?

    RIM needs to gives its consumers a reason not to have to use other devices and platforms. The reason I use other platforms is because my BlackBerry isn't capable of doing certain things... Satisfy our needs and they will secure the number 3 spot!
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  4. G-bone's Avatar
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    Two words : show up.


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    We're takin' it back!
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    Default BlackBerry vs Windows Phone - What does RIM need to do to secure the No.3 spot long term?

    Quote Originally Posted by G-bone View Post
    Two words : show up.


    #BB10Believe
    1 word - Marketing.

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  6. bitek's Avatar
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    Default Re: BlackBerry vs Windows Phone - What does RIM need to do to secure the No.3 spot long term?

    one word : excel

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    Any mistakes Microsoft made their wp8 launch the RIM needs to executed perfectly. The product should be available very soon after launch, same as iphone are. Big marketing campaign. Competitive price. On par hardware specs. Continue to cultivate developer love, aim for big name exclusivity. Excellent customer service. Something like that maybe
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  8. BBPandy's Avatar
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    They don't need to "secure" the #3 spot. They already have it. They need to KEEP it

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  9. SuperionMaximus's Avatar
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    In order for RIM to keep the number 3 spot they currently enjoy they need to:

    - Offer a more complete user experience then Windows Phone. This, we already know to be true as we haven't seen everything yet and already BB10 is a more feature complete Platform then Windows Phone and RT. People passed on Windows Phone for the last couple years because the OS - never mind the ecosystem - isn't finished, it's lacking to much compared to the makor platforms.

    - Marketing. Since RIM went in a different buttonless direction with BB 10 they need to be able to teach people how to use it and communicate the benefits of the UI effectively. People have to 'get it'. They need to understand why gestures are better and the ease of one handed operation.

    - Retention. They need to keep us in the BlackBerry camp. As many of the 79 million current users as possible.

    - Developers. If they do transition a large portion of their user base to BB10 then they need to keep wooing developers to get their apps on BlackBerry 10.

    - Carriers. They need carrier support to continue even if initial sales are week. Windows Phone had great carrier support initially but since it's move less then 3 million units total in North America since launch, carriers aren't that hot for it anymore other then lining up to accept Microsoft's money.

    - Expansion. RIM needs to grow the QNX business, the MDM and M2M Business with maybe even a couple more acquisitions along the way to set them selves up as the mobile computing company they want to become and not just the Smart Phone company they are today. That's ultimately how they will compete with Apple, Google and Microsoft.
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  10. Vorkosigan's Avatar
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    And one more - exploit Windows phone weaknesses. If you pop into the windows forum there appears to be a few gaps in the OS - glaring enough that if RIM can show they don't have those gaps it might help sway people to bb. This is a narrow window (no pun intended) of opportunity. According to the Windows faithful these gaps will be rectified soon.
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    If BB10 comes out of the gate with a number of popular apps that are not yet available on WP8 (and lets consumers know this!), can take advantage of the two to three month ahead with no other major device drops from competitors, and can successively take advantage of their installed base early, then it won't be a huge task to maintain third in the short term. . .it would be unit sales that will determine long term success
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  12. AluminiumRims's Avatar
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    I think RIM is on the right path to secure spot nr. 3. They have done great efforts in creating their own platform but unlike Microsoft they have tried to make it easy for developers to port their programs as BB10 will support different SDKs and frameworks. Microsoft went the other way and tried to diverge, isolating themselves which is suicide in this market. Microsoft isn't really a threat to RIM, I would rather say that Firefox OS or Ubuntu on cheap phones would pose a greater threat for RIM than Microsoft. Microsoft has tried now for almost 3 years to become significant but has failed every time. While RIM provide a good OS, it is more the arrogance and incompetence of Microsoft that makes them less of a threat.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AluminiumRims View Post
    I think RIM is on the right path to secure spot nr. 3. They have done great efforts in creating their own platform but unlike Microsoft they have tried to make it easy for developers to port their programs as BB10 will support different SDKs and frameworks. Microsoft went the other way and tried to diverge, isolating themselves which is suicide in this market. Microsoft isn't really a threat to RIM, I would rather say that Firefox OS or Ubuntu on cheap phones would pose a greater threat for RIM than Microsoft. Microsoft has tried now for almost 3 years to become significant but has failed every time. While RIM provide a good OS, it is more the arrogance and incompetence of Microsoft that makes them less of a threat.
    Saying Microsoft 'went the other way and tried to diverge out of arrogance' is pretty clueless. Microsoft provided excellent dev tools and moved the entire platform to the Windows NT kernel with significant elements in common with Win 8/RT to allow devs easily port apps made for those other platforms. As it stands, there's strong WP8 support in many popular dev tools and engines like Unity and Unreal Engine.

    I think Microsoft's issue has been marketing...and some incompetence with respect to some core OS functionality. The WP7/7.5 debacle didn't help...the OS then constrained OEMs to low-to-midrange hardware specs the carriers just didn't like and consumers scoffed at.

    We'll see how the BB10 launch goes...fingers crossed everything goes well
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  14. Bold_until_Hybrid_Comes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BBPandy View Post
    They don't need to "secure" the #3 spot. They already have it. They need to KEEP it
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    Default BlackBerry vs Windows Phone - What does RIM need to do to secure the No.3 spot long term?

    Simply be RIM and stick to their core values and that in the business and consumer market. BB10 will take off in Asia and the Middle East.

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  16. brmiller1976's Avatar
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    RIM and WP should not be taking aim at each other, since they're both upstart challengers and couldn't survive simply by eating the other's userbase.

    They have to take aim at Google and Apple.
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    Quote Originally Posted by texazzpete View Post
    Saying Microsoft 'went the other way and tried to diverge out of arrogance' is pretty clueless. Microsoft provided excellent dev tools and moved the entire platform to the Windows NT kernel with significant elements in common with Win 8/RT to allow devs easily port apps made for those other platforms. As it stands, there's strong WP8 support in many popular dev tools and engines like Unity and Unreal Engine.
    Sorry, but I use WP8 and I have to agree with the arrogance thing.

    Microsoft launched a flagship handset -- the Lumia 900 -- that it completely abandoned four months later.
    Microsoft promised 100% compatibility with WP7 apps, but most of the most important ones -- Spotify, BofA, Chase -- still don't work properly or at all.
    WP8 is less stable than WP7 was. Random reboots and system crashes happen more often.
    Microsoft RUINED the sync experience completely. Zune was great -- WP8 Sync is darn near unusable.
    The launch of WP8 was a fiasco -- no coordination.
    Launching the SDK on launch day for the hardware meant a downright lousy experience until devs could fix broken apps.
    There are still devices out there waiting for the Portico update.
    And so on.

    Microsoft has shown, consistently, that it's not putting user experience first. It puts carriers and its handset partners first and tells users "shut up and stop whining, it's for your own good."

    And while I like WP8, I don't like the attitude that Microsoft has adopted -- including many of its fans -- telling users with real issues to "shut up and deal, we broke it for long term success." Microsoft cannot afford to keep breaking its OS, or it won't go anywhere. Competitors like RIM aren't sitting still, and Microsoft ain't king o' the jungle anymore.
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    Not rest on its laurels.
  19. Tre Lawrence's Avatar
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    Default Re: BlackBerry vs Windows Phone - What does RIM need to do to secure the No.3 spot long term?

    Ecosystem. Simple.

    For a lot of people, having an all-around device that has access to legitimate content trumps hardware or UI.

    An example of a question RIM must be able to answer (IMHO): How can the end user procure music fluidly at a reasonable cost that it's accessible on multiple devices?

    In other words, I think RIM should be able to produce an overall experience that at least is on par with what the competition does. The little things count.
  20. cgk
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    Default Re: BlackBerry vs Windows Phone - What does RIM need to do to secure the No.3 spot long term?

    Out spend the combined marketing spend (above and below the line) of all windows phones OEMs.

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    Default BlackBerry vs Windows Phone - What does RIM need to do to secure the No.3 spot long term?

    Quote Originally Posted by saintforlife View Post
    Other than knocking it out of the park with BB10 of course?

    Also somehow RIM needs to convince the customers that they too have an 'ecosystem'. Whatever that is. It seems to be all the rage these days.
    The START point would be providing as many languages as WPs do (twice more).Yeah, I know some take me for a crazy person here for keeping saying this : the greatest majority of people here live in English-speaking counties and think that as soon as English is there, everything's OK. It is not ok and that's why all the big players (and all other small players to be honest) do give it attention. A language=a market. 20 languages missing? 20 markets missing in the profit of others, as simple as that.



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    I think they need to really train the carrier reps that sell the phones and change their attitude towards RIM. If carrier reps are still telling customers RIM is bankrupt, blackberry is a terrible experience, etc., RIM will suffer.
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  23. simu31's Avatar
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    There are several good comments in this thread. Especially the reminder that RIM is still number 3... although the understanding of the word "secure" can be different in different eyes

    I especially like hearing from WP8 users. Their experiences are very interesting.
    I'd like to just make a comment about this line >>>
    Quote Originally Posted by brmiller1976 View Post
    Microsoft cannot afford to keep breaking its OS, or it won't go anywhere. Competitors like RIM aren't sitting still, and Microsoft ain't king o' the jungle anymore.
    Microsoft were never king of this jungle... but I'll add that their arrogance towards PC users does seem to be showing it's face in the Windows Phone market... in that (as with Windows PC OS), when something doesn't work right, it is always a wait for them to sort themselves out... funnily reminiscent of Apple's attitude toward their customers, especially when you think about antenna-gate ("you're not holding it right").

    Anyway, to answer the original question: If RIM keep going in the same direction they seem to be on now, then I think 3rd is almost guaranteed, it's almost more down to the users now than it is down to RIM - if they keep things going at the same pace as they have for the past few months (and stepping up a notch following the launch as it looks like they will be).

    Just to add a little to the discussion, if the BB10 launches well and their 3rd is as guaranteed as I think it is, then I see them gunning for 2nd pretty soon after.... now that would be an interesting fight

    Si.
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  24. astraith's Avatar
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    Default Re: BlackBerry vs Windows Phone - What does RIM need to do to secure the No.3 spot long term?

    In mu opinion, they need to make solid and unique devices. Windows Phone has ots Lumia with the unique unibody design. The iPhone is leading in terms of design (the iPhone 5 is beautiful). Android has some the Nexus 4. Even though I'm no fan of the glass design (this is a major reason i don't have an iPhone) i still think the Nexus 4 is an amazing looking device.

    Everything else I think they are doing.

    (note: from the latest images, the Z10 looks like the iPhone 5 in terms of design which is very nice)
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    Default Re: BlackBerry vs Windows Phone - What does RIM need to do to secure the No.3 spot long term?

    Quote Originally Posted by cgk View Post
    Out spend the combined marketing spend (above and below the line) of all windows phones OEMs.

    Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk HD
    Hello! I noticed you from WebOS Nation.

    Okay back on topic now ...
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