[birdman_38]

There have been a lot of comparisons between BlackBerry and their competitors, but consider this:

Apple: $156.5 billion income, 80,000 employees
Google: $50.1 billion income, 54,000 employees
Microsoft: $73.7 billion income, 93,000 employees
BlackBerry: $11 billion income, 12,700 employees.

When you take into consideration BlackBerry has built and released a brand new operating system from scratch with the resources they have compared to the others, they have done something truly remarkable. BlackBerry 10 is in many ways as good as its competitors.

[boeingrules]

I think the proper way to compare it is to see the other companies income plus workforce when they released their first phone. If I remember correctly, Apple was nearly bankrupt when they released the first iPhone.
Comparing these brands when they are all at different stages is unfair.

Posted via CB10

[birdman_38]

I think the proper way to compare it is to see the other companies income plus workforce when they released their first phone. If I remember correctly, Apple was nearly bankrupt when they released the first iPhone.
Comparing these brands when they are all at different stages is unfair.

BlackBerry was at a critical stage. Their brand was damaged, their revenues, reputation and relevance were going down the drain, plus they were going through a full executive management change, restructuring, and downsizing. Yet they were still able to pull it off.

[eddy_berry]

That is really interesting comparison to see. Truly remarkable. I like this side of you birdman. Standing up for the underdog even after being bitten in the ***. BlackBerry has a long way to go but is showing remarkable promise, even now in the face of certain doom. We need to show people the many sides of BlackBerry bad and good. Too many people exaggerate the bad. The better it gets the less people will get bitten.

[nycspaces.]

and profit per an employee...??? :-(

[Wiki Cydia]

I think the proper way to compare it is to see the other companies income plus workforce when they released their first phone. If I remember correctly, Apple was nearly bankrupt when they released the first iPhone.
Comparing these brands when they are all at different stages is unfair.

Posted via CB10

Unfortunately you don't remember correctly. Apple's brush with bankruptcy was in 1997-'98; the iPhone didn't come along until 2007.

[Wiki Cydia]

There have been a lot of comparisons between BlackBerry and their competitors, but consider this:

Apple: $156.5 billion income, 80,000 employees
Google: $50.1 billion income, 54,000 employees
Microsoft: $73.7 billion income, 93,000 employees
BlackBerry: $11 billion income, 12,700 employees.

When you take into consideration BlackBerry has built and released a brand new operating system from scratch with the resources they have compared to the others, they have done something truly remarkable. BlackBerry 10 is in many ways as good as its competitors.

From Apple's most recent 10-K:

Employees
As of September 29, 2012, the Company had approximately 72,800 full-time equivalent employees and an additional 3,300 full-time equivalent temporary employees and contractors. Approximately 42,400 of the total full-time equivalent employees worked in the Company’s Retail segment.

So, if you remove the retail employees in order to improve the comparison (assuming roughly 58% of Apple employees are retail, based on the above), you get numbers that look like this:

Google: $50.1 billion income, 54,000 employees
Microsoft: $73.7 billion income, 93,000 employees
Apple: $156.5 billion income, 33,600 non-retail employees (estimated)
BlackBerry: $11 billion income, 12,700 employees.

[serbanescu]

I think the proper way to compare it is to see the other companies income plus workforce when they released their first phone. If I remember correctly, Apple was nearly bankrupt when they released the first iPhone.
Comparing these brands when they are all at different stages is unfair.

Posted via CB10

No, they were not bankrupt, quite the opposite - they were riding high on the wave of cash brought by the iPod success.

I must say that, while BB10 is the most beautiful mobile OS right now and has the potential to be the best on the market, BlackBerry's overall execution was uneven and, as a consequence, failed to fully capitalize on the new OS. The reboot issue, underspending in marketing and the PlayBook BB10 update (or lack of it) fiasco are just a few things that come to mind. If their overall performance as a company would have been at the same level as Apple's, their competitors would have been toasted.

Sadly, they don't seem to have the focus that's needed in these hard times.
One example to support my point:
- on the one hand, they say they positioned themselves primarily on the business segment, they don't want to be a company catering to all tastes and needs (statement made on the last conference call with investors)
- on the other hand, BlackBerry World has a game / apps imbalance (in favor of games) showing, in my opinion, that (at least at first) they tried to make the BB10 platform compete on the consumer segment.

This lack of focus on the management floor is very costly and threatens to waste the work and achievements of those talented people that actually made BB10.

--------------------

Calorie Monitor Pro for Z10, Q10, Q5 and PlayBook

[birdman_38]

- on the one hand, they say they positioned themselves primarily on the business segment, they don't want to be a company catering to all tastes and needs (statement made on the last conference call with investors)
- on the other hand, BlackBerry World has a game / apps imbalance (in favor of games) showing, in my opinion, that (at least at first) they tried to make the BB10 platform compete on the consumer segment.

This lack of focus on the management floor is very costly and threatens to waste the work and achievements of those talented people that actually made BB10.Calorie Monitor Pro for Z10, Q10, Q5 and PlayBook

What you're describing with their enterprise and consumer (BB10 gaming) success defines both the most proudly brilliant yet incredibly frustrating aspects of the company. They have had an identity crisis for the past three years trying to satisfy both markets and have been bent like Gumby in different directions.

[bcolton]

As much as I would like to see BlackBerry do well, I don't view playing catch-up to the market as remarkable - it's actually a whole lot of frustrating. BB10 is arguably a product that should have come out 4-5 years ago.

Being "as good as its competitors" is subjective and effectively at the mercy of 3rd party developers - because an OS is only as good developers that support the platform.

[Jerale Hoard]

As much as I would like to see BlackBerry do well, I don't view playing catch-up to the market as remarkable - it's actually a whole lot of frustrating. BB10 is arguably a product that should have come out 4-5 years ago.

Being "as good as its competitors" is subjective and effectively at the mercy of 3rd party developers - because an OS is only as good developers that support the platform.

Actually the product that should have came out 4-5 years ago is the new BBOS 7 device. That could've led people on to the BB10.

Posted via CB10

[imz]

From Apple's most recent 10-K:

Employees
As of September 29, 2012, the Company had approximately 72,800 full-time equivalent employees and an additional 3,300 full-time equivalent temporary employees and contractors. Approximately 42,400 of the total full-time equivalent employees worked in the Company’s Retail segment.

So, if you remove the retail employees in order to improve the comparison (assuming roughly 58% of Apple employees are retail, based on the above), you get numbers that look like this:

Google: $50.1 billion income, 54,000 employees
Microsoft: $73.7 billion income, 93,000 employees
Apple: $156.5 billion income, 33,600 non-retail employees (estimated)
BlackBerry: $11 billion income, 12,700 employees.

How can you remove Apple's front-line force for a true comparison, they are truly passionate, fully equipped on the knowledge therefore experts on the product they are selling.

I'd argue a true comparison MUST include them.
Surely it is the rough 58% who vastly contributed to the income of 156.5 billion via the retail outlets.

[donnation]

You do realize that they've had massive layoffs over the past several years. Its not like they are working out of a garage. They have less workforce because they've needed less because of the massive slide in market share. If they ever get it built back up they will have more employees.

[Harvey Specter]

There have been a lot of comparisons between BlackBerry and their competitors, but consider this:

Apple: $156.5 billion income, 80,000 employees
Google: $50.1 billion income, 54,000 employees
Microsoft: $73.7 billion income, 93,000 employees
BlackBerry: $11 billion income, 12,700 employees.

When you take into consideration BlackBerry has built and released a brand new operating system from scratch with the resources they have compared to the others, they have done something truly remarkable. BlackBerry 10 is in many ways as good as its competitors.

And when you combine the above with problems caused by the Americans then you see what kind of fight BlackBerry is up against.

[Brandon Orr]

From Apple's most recent 10-K:

Employees
As of September 29, 2012, the Company had approximately 72,800 full-time equivalent employees and an additional 3,300 full-time equivalent temporary employees and contractors. Approximately 42,400 of the total full-time equivalent employees worked in the Company�s Retail segment.

So, if you remove the retail employees in order to improve the comparison (assuming roughly 58% of Apple employees are retail, based on the above), you get numbers that look like this:

Google: $50.1 billion income, 54,000 employees
Microsoft: $73.7 billion income, 93,000 employees
Apple: $156.5 billion income, 33,600 non-retail employees (estimated)
BlackBerry: $11 billion income, 12,700 employees.

You can't look at it like that. Retail employees are also service employees that manage and repair iPhone's or more likely replace them. Customer service is an essential job for any company. Without it Apple would not be where it is today.

Posted via CB10

[zeeten]

From Apple's most recent 10-K:

Employees
As of September 29, 2012, the Company had approximately 72,800 full-time equivalent employees and an additional 3,300 full-time equivalent temporary employees and contractors. Approximately 42,400 of the total full-time equivalent employees worked in the Company�s Retail segment.

So, if you remove the retail employees in order to improve the comparison (assuming roughly 58% of Apple employees are retail, based on the above), you get numbers that look like this:

Google: $50.1 billion income, 54,000 employees
Microsoft: $73.7 billion income, 93,000 employees
Apple: $156.5 billion income, 33,600 non-retail employees (estimated)
BlackBerry: $11 billion income, 12,700 employees.

If you remove retail employees from Apple, you need to remove them from the other companies also.

Posted via CB10

[JonCBK]

I think the proper way to compare it is to see the other companies income plus workforce when they released their first phone. If I remember correctly, Apple was nearly bankrupt when they released the first iPhone.
Comparing these brands when they are all at different stages is unfair.

Posted via CB10

You remember incorrectly since the iPhone was released after and during the height of the stunning success and profits from the iPod.

But before the iPod, there was a time when Apple was near bankrupt and had to get bailed out by Microsoft (which was concerned about anti trust issues and being seen as a monopoly if Apple went out of business).

[markus_13]

This is remarkable and why I continue to buy BlackBerry products. It's nice to see the work hasn't stopped either. I have had the Z10 since day one and the updates have continued to make this device better and better




Posted via CB10

[brucep1]

There are really too many variables to even consider this a valid comparison. Google is primarily a search engine company whose profits mostly come from ad revenue.

The only valid observation I would make from this is that Blackberry did well for a smaller company.

[Thunderbuck]

There are really too many variables to even consider this a valid comparison. Google is primarily a search engine company whose profits mostly come from ad revenue.

The only valid observation I would make from this is that Blackberry did well for a smaller company.

I'm pretty sure that was the OP's point to begin with.

From the awesome virtual keyboard of my Z10

[southlander]

No question BlackBerry has far less resources than these others and manages to play in roughly the same space in mobile. The question is can they turn profits.

Posted via BlackBerry 10

[Thunderbuck]

No question BlackBerry has far less resources than these others and manages to play in roughly the same space in mobile. The question is can they turn profits.

Posted via BlackBerry 10

Well, they have had profitable quarters this past year, their FY loss is... tolerable, and BB would have been pretty much profitable without that $72 million charge on currency from Argentina.

They actually have MORE cash on hand now than they did a year ago.

They need to pour it on with the marketing now.

From the awesome virtual keyboard of my Z10

[Wiki Cydia]

How can you remove Apple's front-line force for a true comparison, they are truly passionate, fully equipped on the knowledge therefore experts on the product they are selling.

I'd argue a true comparison MUST include them.
Surely it is the rough 58% who vastly contributed to the income of 156.5 billion via the retail outlets.

Well of course they contribute. . . but "who contributes?" wasn't the question. I mean, the actual hardware manufacturers (i.e. Foxconn, etc) "contirbute" as well, but they aren't included in the numbers.

[MasterOfBinary]

Well, they have had profitable quarters this past year, their FY loss is... tolerable, and BB would have been pretty much profitable without that $72 million charge on currency from Argentina.

They actually have MORE cash on hand now than they did a year ago.

They need to pour it on with the marketing now.

From the awesome virtual keyboard of my Z10

And apps.

[Jerry A]

Well, they have had profitable quarters this past year, their FY loss is... tolerable, and BB would have been pretty much profitable without that $72 million charge on currency from Argentina.

They actually have MORE cash on hand now than they did a year ago.

They need to pour it on with the marketing now.

From the awesome virtual keyboard of my Z10

They need to pour it into a product that can be marketed.