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  1. leftypepper716's Avatar
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    Default Anyone else feeling the non-love for BlackBerry by US carriers?

    The other day I called Sprint to ask them a question on my future upgrade and their 14 day return policy, The CSR boldly ask me (No pun intended) Why would I even think of considering a BB 10 next year since, in her opinion, "BlackBerry is pretty much dead device now". It seems this is the overall opinion of not only Carriers, but Obliviously consumers in the US alike. Really? What can RIM do to even get at leat 10 percent of their former subscribers back? Let alone 20-25 percent?
  2. simu31's Avatar
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    I would have made a note of her name at the beginning of the call and asked to speak to her manager after such a statement. She obviously needs more training.

    Si.
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  3. pythons's Avatar
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    Most sales consultants at the store level simply got tired of having their heads tore off from customers who bought BB 7 devices.....
    ...Not because of what they could do but because of what they couldn't do.
    ....I'm the phone admin for the company I work for and that's what I was told by Sprint
    ....The facts are that a current BB isn't functional in the view of most consumers in North America.

    That said I've spoken face to face with some store and district managers who personally got to see ( and play with ) BB10.....
    ...These same people were previously very down on RIM and said the same things you quoted the sales rep you spoke with as saying.
    ...After playing with the new device the people I know were very excited.

    It takes time for things to trickle down and I firmly believe that IF RIM can produce those apps - the lack of which cost them their market share...
    ..RIM will stop the blood loss and immediately build it's market share back to a very safe level.
    ...It will take time and won't happen overnight but the company will get itself out of the fire and back in the frying pan.
    ...From there it would be just a matter of time as other people on IOS or Droid seeing someone using a BB10.

    What I fear is that RIM, for whatever reason, will not be able to produce the big name apps such as Skype and Netflix....
    ...And instead will say "but look at how cool peek and flow is" - the average consumer will care less about that.
    ...IF they can't peek and flow from the Apps THEY believe are the APPS of value.

    Just to be sure, I've talked to some people who were very negative about RIM who have personally handled the BB10....
    ...They are VERY excited about what they have seen so far - that's a massive change in perception.
    A reluctant iPhone 4s user who would STILL be a Blackberry user had RIM not messed it's own bed by putting a "Fisher Price Camera" in it's "flagship" Blackberry Bold 9930.
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  4. AVPTI's Avatar
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    Carrier employees are trained to sell phones out NOW...there is no incentive for the carrier to have a customer wait till Febuary to buy a new phone.

    They just want your money/contract now, instead of later.

    Once BB10 is out, it will probably change as more trainig for the OS/Devices will be available.
    XoXoXo
  5. leftypepper716's Avatar
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    Yes, but if BB 10 cannot devilver popular consumer apps, while any Android or iPhone can, and also have FaceTime (IMO really does sell well for family and friends to also have an iPhone, simply because the rest of their family does) It will take BB10 as excellent as it sounds, to climb a ver steep consumer US market. Like I said, going from one percent sales to even ten percent sales will be a huge undertaking.
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  6. AVPTI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftypepper716 View Post
    Yes, but if BB 10 cannot devilver popular consumer apps, while any Android or iPhone can, and also have FaceTime (IMO really does sell well for family and friends to also have an iPhone, simply because the rest of their family does) It will take BB10 as excellent as it sounds, to climb a ver steep consumer US market. Like I said, going from one percent sales to even ten percent sales will be a huge undertaking.
    BBM Voice/Video will be on BB10. So that solves the FaceTime issue.
    XoXoXo
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    Default Anyone else feeling the non-love for BlackBerry by US carriers?

    Actually, at the AT&T store near me there is one person who always chats with me A LOT.
    He is all excited about BB10 , said he is definitely getting one. Store manager has a very bruised 9900 and she's also waiting for BB10.
    Going in there is like going to a RIM pep rally.

    VZW, not so much.


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    Quote Originally Posted by pythons View Post
    What I fear is that RIM, for whatever reason, will not be able to produce the big name apps such as Skype and Netflix.....
    I'm curious why the gold standard for a platform is measured by whether or not it has Skype or Netflix? I'm sure there are other apps that people are waiting for but all I ever hear about it Skype and Netflix. I can see why Skype is essential but Netflix honestly has a terrible programming selection (IMO). Personally, I think RIM should do one of two things...... either partner with their current video store vendor (name is escaping me at the moment) to offer a similar online-only rental model like Netflix......or partner with a company like Dish Network/Blockbuster to bring new release content as well as streaming tv content (Sling media) to the PlayBook and BB10 handsets.
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  9. leftypepper716's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AVPTI View Post
    BBM Voice/Video will be on BB10. So that solves the FaceTime issue.
    But can you use it if you have a BB10 and your family has an iPhone?, iPad?
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    I cry if Netflix isn't on the latest devices, but I never end up using it. Why bother with Netflix on a 4" screen? Who caaaares.
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    Yes, I understand that, the Sprint CSR was fully aware my upgrade isn't until June 2013. She was just giving me her overall opinion of the huge decline Blackberry has taken, and sees no rebound, even with the BB 10.
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    Well why would BlackBerry make an almost 5" screen if they were not concerned of consumers watching movies or playing games? Lets not kid ourselves, when you see friends who can pull up the latest video apps or games, then look down at your BlackBerry and it is light years from that...pretty sure consumer confidence is wained.
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftypepper716 View Post
    But can you use it if you have a BB10 and your family has an iPhone?, iPad?

    Can you use FaceTime if you have an iPhone and your family has a BB10 phone or PlayBook?

    What's your point?
    XoXoXo
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  14. cjcampbell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftypepper716 View Post
    Yes, I understand that, the Sprint CSR was fully aware my upgrade isn't until June 2013. She was just giving me her overall opinion of the huge decline Blackberry has taken, and sees no rebound, even with the BB 10.
    That's one opinion. We have all heard it. Analysts have been saying that for quite some time now but that is all changing. Now that people are actually being able to see and experience what this new platform is about and can do, opinions are changing. As for the title of this thread.... a CSR is not the carrier. Carrier support is there and in a strong way. Once we get closer to launch date, they will be training staff so that they are actually educated on the topic.
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  15. cjcampbell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftypepper716 View Post
    But can you use it if you have a BB10 and your family has an iPhone?, iPad?
    Can't use FaceTime with any Android device either... what's the point here?
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  16. Thunderbuck's Avatar

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    So, a few points here:

    --As Pythons aptly pointed out, Sales Reps do not reflect the overall attitude of the company they represent. A big part of why RIM stock rose so quickly this week is because financial analysts have been talking to their contacts at the carriers, and are reporting back that the carriers themselves are actually very enthusiastic about BB10.

    --We don't know that Skype or Netflix will be on board for BB10, but each has a good reason to be there for launch. In Netflix' case, we could see upwards of 20mil BB10 devices by the end of 2013, and that market isn't quite as easy to ignore as the >2mil Playbooks out there now. As for Skype, Microsoft's decision to abandon Windows Live Messenger in favor of Skype means they are kind of obligated to make it available on additional platforms. No, nobody's holding a gun to MS' head on that, but it's not good business, either.

    --We've seen a few other cross-platform vid chat possibilities such as FaceFlow and any browser-based software that uses Flash or HTML5.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cjcampbell View Post
    Can't use FaceTime with any Android device either... what's the point here?
    This isn't serious is it?

    Besides the fact that FaceTime runs on: Mac OS, Apple TV, iPhone, iPad, iPod Touch, and all of those can also run Skype (which can be run on basically every platform except BlackBerry - yes I know about the Verizon non-video exception) everyone's (or at lest the vast, vast, vast majority) family has some tech platform that runs FaceTime or Skype (I don't have FaceTime anywhere, but have Skype on my laptops and TVs). Very, very few families (generously less than 5%) will have BB10.

    In other words, a proprietary BlackBerry VOIP and Video solution that is not cross-platform (and not even cross BB platform) is not a solution and certainly not the equivalent of FaceTime - not even comparable.
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  18. nocturnal123's Avatar
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    Personally I could careless about skype or netflix I think watching tv or movies on a phone is stupid
  19. AVPTI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonty12 View Post
    This isn't serious is it?

    Besides the fact that FaceTime runs on: Mac OS, Apple TV, iPhone, iPad, iPod Touch, and all of those can also run Skype (which can be run on basically every platform except BlackBerry - yes I know about the Verizon non-video exception) everyone's (or at lest the vast, vast, vast majority) family has some tech platform that runs FaceTime or Skype (I don't have FaceTime anywhere, but have Skype on my laptops and TVs). Very, very few families (generously less than 5%) will have BB10.

    In other words, a proprietary BlackBerry VOIP and Video solution that is not cross-platform (and not even cross BB platform) is not a solution and certainly not the equivalent of FaceTime - not even comparable.
    What you said is more understandable than what the other whatshisface said...you have reasoning behind your opinion.

    The other guy stated a fact...and we turned it against him.

    Solid points were made on your part. I do believe Skype will make it's way to BB10.

    It is also yet to be seen if BBM will be available on desktop. With BBID being the main component behind BBM now, it is possible. Not saying it's gonna happen, but there's a chance.
    XoXoXo
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  20. cjcampbell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonty12 View Post
    This isn't serious is it?

    Besides the fact that FaceTime runs on: Mac OS, Apple TV, iPhone, iPad, iPod Touch, and all of those can also run Skype (which can be run on basically every platform except BlackBerry - yes I know about the Verizon non-video exception) everyone's (or at lest the vast, vast, vast majority) family has some tech platform that runs FaceTime or Skype (I don't have FaceTime anywhere, but have Skype on my laptops and TVs). Very, very few families (generously less than 5%) will have BB10.

    In other words, a proprietary BlackBerry VOIP and Video solution that is not cross-platform (and not even cross BB platform) is not a solution and certainly not the equivalent of FaceTime - not even comparable.
    Yes, I was serious. I wasn't talking of Skype, I was talking of FaceTime. FaceTime is not cross platform like BBM isn't. Yes, I understand the numbers of people who use Skype and other video chat options and we already know BB10 will have cross platform options available. I wasn't opening up the Skype debate on yet another thread.

    Having a proprietary option is a good idea. It's just another option and one that BB users will use between each other. And what do you mean not even cross BB platform? Because it won't work on pre BB10 devices? Or do you mean via PB?
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    Quote Originally Posted by cjcampbell View Post
    Yes, I was serious. I wasn't talking of Skype, I was talking of FaceTime. FaceTime is not cross platform like BBM isn't. Yes, I understand the numbers of people who use Skype and other video chat options and we already know BB10 will have cross platform options available. I wasn't opening up the Skype debate on yet another thread.

    Having a proprietary option is a good idea. It's just another option and one that BB users will use between each other. And what do you mean not even cross BB platform? Because it won't work on pre BB10 devices? Or do you mean via PB?
    I mean pre-BB10 devices (the video portion which is the part that is attractive to the aforementioned "families"). Also, if you understand the "numbers" of people who use FaceTime, it's the same argument as Skype (or at least very similar). There are, literally, exponentially more people who use video "chatting" on FaceTime as there would be on BBM. Also, what do you mean by "we already know BB10 will have cross platform options available"? We do? Really? Or are you referring to BB handset and a PlayBook as cross platform, which it isn't because both are the same QNX platform.

    Finally, I didn't introduce Skype into this thread, Pythons did when he brought up the crux of the problem - lack of "name" apps, specifically the usual suspects - Skype and Netflix.
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    Whether or not Skype and Netflix are not considered "must have" apps by many in the BB community, the fact remains that it is one of the benchmarks by which smartphones are judged. It does not even matter how well they may work. It is a matter of perception. The realilty is that if Skype and Netflix are not at launch... it will be one of the main poiints of negative press.... Many Android and Apple users consider Skype and Netflix as "must have".... and RIM will be hard presses to convince those who think that way to leave their chosen phone. For the record I am one of those users that has not use for Skype or Netflix... but thought it is time to move the discussion of why it is important out for the BB realm so to speak.....
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    Quote Originally Posted by AVPTI View Post
    What you said is more understandable than what the other whatshisface said...you have reasoning behind your opinion.

    The other guy stated a fact...and we turned it against him.

    Solid points were made on your part. I do believe Skype will make it's way to BB10.

    It is also yet to be seen if BBM will be available on desktop. With BBID being the main component behind BBM now, it is possible. Not saying it's gonna happen, but there's a chance.
    Thanks for the reasonable, non-reflexive response. I'm also hopeful that the "new" BBM platform will solve the main problems - have a desktop component, and as some rumors suggest, be cross-platform with Skype.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonty12 View Post
    I mean pre-BB10 devices (the video portion which is the part that is attractive to the aforementioned "families"). Also, if you understand the "numbers" of people who use FaceTime, it's the same argument as Skype (or at least very similar). There are, literally, exponentially more people who use video "chatting" on FaceTime as there would be on BBM. Also, what do you mean by "we already know BB10 will have cross platform options available"? We do? Really? Or are you referring to BB handset and a PlayBook as cross platform, which it isn't because both are the same QNX platform.

    Finally, I didn't introduce Skype into this thread, Pythons did when he brought up the crux of the problem - lack of "name" apps, specifically the usual suspects - Skype and Netflix.
    Ok... Well they won't be able to use pre BB10 devices for video but chat is available. I get the sheer numbers of people on iproducts vs BB so not gonna try and argue that one..... As for the cross platform options, no, I did not mean within the BB family, I meant FaceFlow will be coming to BB10.

    Sorry if you thought I meant you were bringing in Skype to this... I didn't. I was just trying to point out I was talking of one specific feature on one specific platform. That's all.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonty12 View Post
    Thanks for the reasonable, non-reflexive response. I'm also hopeful that the "new" BBM platform will solve the main problems - have a desktop component, and as some rumors suggest, be cross-platform with Skype.
    It's how forums are supposed to work.

    I don't know if Skype will be tied into BBM directly...or if the whole video chat experience will be all-in experience. Where you have all video chat contacts in one location. Kinda mixing BBM and Skype together. I don't expect to be able to call a Skype friend from my BBM profile. BBM to BBM. Skype to Skype. But all found in one spot.

    My thoughts are so scrambled on the potential of VoIP that they don't make sense most of the time
    XoXoXo
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