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  1. Mr4aces's Avatar
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    Default After being on this forum since April, it amazes me how much money RIM wasted.

    I am moving the posting from the Classic Forum to this as I got out of hand on the subject matter.

    If ML/RIM would have just up dated the 9900 with new hardware, camera(s), speakers and maybe a HDMI port instead of coming out with a Q10 without a tool belt and wrote BB10 for gesture phones only where would today's BlackBerry/RIM be today?

    BB10 was written for both gesture phones and the Qwerty phones. If they would have left the Qwerty phones alone and improved the specs we would now have the 3 and 4 generation of the 9900 by now. Instead BlackBerry has to go back 3 years and make a phone that should have come out 3 years ago.

    The new Q20 (Classic) is only a Q10 with a tool belt. Nothing more nothing less. It does not have all the features Bold 9900 user love in a working man's phone. No charging contacts, no removable battery, no convenience button and most important the ergonomic keyboard.

    Contrary to what BB10 users say the BB10 is not as good as OS6/7 and might never be. To many things lost in the update. Mostly in the BBM BB10 no RSS feeds no multiple sharing. In OS7 why do we need gesturing in a working phone with a small screen? I know I never use gesturing. All it did was use more RAM when there isn't any in the 9900 to begin with.

    The 9900 is a working man's phone and users that don't play Candy Crush.

    Think about how much money ML/RIM flush down the drain. Now John Chen and his group has to fix the enormous BB10 that has so much money invested in it they can't scrap it.

    BLACKBERRY: All we want is a 9900 that should have come out 3 years ago with a better motor, stereo and back up mirrors. We want a "retro" Bold 9900.
    Last edited by Mr4aces; 08-30-2014 at 09:34 AM. Reason: Corrected Never to Might
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  2. matador22's Avatar
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    I have used the Q10 for the last year and a half. And I have a P'9981 in the mail. Once I switch over I can better comment on this thread. But I have a feeling I will agree with you. Something about the Q10 just never felt like the classic blackberries. It felt like they took the iphone and married with a qwerty BlackBerry. Anyway. Frontwards. Maybe 10.4 update will bring back even more "classic" features.

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  3. SlcCorrado's Avatar
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    Wow, I completely disagree. BB10 is waaay better than OS6/7. I LOVED OS5/6/7, and yeah we are missing a few things, but I'd never go back.
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  4. Mr4aces's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlcCorrado View Post
    Wow, I completely disagree. BB10 is waaay better than OS6/7. I LOVED OS5/6/7, and yeah we are missing a few things, but I'd never go back.
    I think if you were a mouse in BlackBerry/John Chen's conference room you would have heard bad things about how BB10 is way over written just to cover gesture and Qwerty phones at the same time. ML/RIM should have just written BB10 for gesture phones and updated OS7. Here we are 2014 and BlackBerry is making the Q20 (you call it a Classic) that is only a Q10 with a tool belt. That is if the Q20 has Q10 or Z30 specs. Why didn't a gen2 9900 come out 3 years ago? And why didn't they just update the OS7 and call it BB10? When you download you have to download specific for the phone you are using. Why not continue the OS7 under the BB10 roof?

    The Q10 is only half the phone the 9900 is. Where are all the 9900 features?
    Last edited by Mr4aces; 08-28-2014 at 05:39 PM.
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  5. Ax
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    no way would better hardware have helped the outdated java based BBOS
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  6. idssteve's Avatar
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    Yeah, "better" is in the eye of the beholder. Diversity is a wondrous thing! Better or worse, BB10 is just starting to approach OS7's maturity. Unfortunately, BB10 compatible hardware takes one step backward for each step forward. Z10 lost everything Bold lovers loved. It, at least, had a swappable battery. Q10 brought a keyboard but no tool belt. Now we FINALLY get a tool belt Q20 but they take away the swappable battery! It's as if they're afraid to give us more than two Bold features in the same device. Go figure...
  7. Mr4aces's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ax View Post
    no way would better hardware have helped the outdated java based BBOS
    Ok I am not a programer. If you were in charge of BlackBerry what would you have done?
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  8. Mr4aces's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by idssteve View Post
    Yeah, "better" is in the eye of the beholder. Diversity is a wondrous thing! Better or worse, BB10 is just starting to approach OS7's maturity. Unfortunately, BB10 compatible hardware takes one step backward for each step forward. Z10 lost everything Bold lovers loved. It, at least, had a swappable battery. Q10 brought a keyboard but no tool belt. Now we FINALLY get a tool belt Q20 but they take away the swappable battery! It's as if they're afraid to give us more than two Bold features in the same device. Go figure...

    I would give you more than 2 but they don't have a symbol for toes.
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  9. THBW's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SlcCorrado View Post
    Wow, I completely disagree. BB10 is waaay better than OS6/7. I LOVED OS5/6/7, and yeah we are missing a few things, but I'd never go back.
    No kidding, I simply don't get how people can think like this. Maybe there is a group of blackberry users that work on muscle memory and nothing else.
  10. idssteve's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ax View Post
    no way would better hardware have helped the outdated java based BBOS
    Yeah, JAVA is a mess. QNX IS the future, IMO. That said, my JAVA based 9900 is still doing the job i need it to do BETTER than Z or Q ever did. Despite over a year of devotion to the BB10 devices. Early 9900 OS's were pretty flaky but 7.1.0.1066 has been solid for many of us. RAM limits are the biggest single headache with 9900, IMO. Other sd2 8255T implementations utilized 1024MB. A bump from 768 to 1024MB might have at least helped the ram limit. Assuming there wasn't some sort of ram addressing bottleneck in BBOS?? Such an upgrade could have provided RIM/BBRY with additional sales, IMO. Fun to dream..
  11. crackbrry fan's Avatar
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    Belfast is that you?

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  12. Mr4aces's Avatar
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    I might be able to live with the short comings of the BB10 OS, but don't you think 9900 users should have at least all the features we have now? BBM on BB10 is a joke don't know why android and iphone user would want to upload it.

    BTW: Feel free to voice your opinion on the Classic, BB10 and ML/RIM poor business decisions.
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  13. serbanescu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr4aces View Post
    Ok I am not a programer. If you were in charge of BlackBerry what would you have done?
    Their fault was not in developing a new OS based on QNX (that was a great idea) but in choosing not to include in the new OS team any of the old BBOS developers. In doing so they lost a lot of knowledge about the functional (not technological) features that made the old BBOS a highly productive environment.
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  14. Mr4aces's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by serbanescu View Post
    Their fault was not in developing a new OS based on QNX (that was a great idea) but in choosing not to include in the new OS team any of the old BBOS developers. In doing so they lost a lot of knowledge about the functional (not technological) features that made the old BBOS a highly productive environment.

    Exactly, just think the QNX would have been on BlackBerry's Qwerty phone for 3 years and they would have been that much further with the QNX. Some people "just don't get it'! They are influenced by what they read instead of thinking it out logically. Doesn't take a scientist to figure out all the mistakes ML/RIM made. Just think how much money was wasted and how much could have been made. It just blows my mind.

    Now John Chen has to fix all this without a budget
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  15. #15  

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    I have the q10 and agree it's nothing like the bold 9900 iconic phone...

    Bold 9900 truly had the best keyboard in history....

    I can't type on the q10. Can't stand the keyboard!!!

    Anxiously awaiting the Passport!!!

    Miss my bold 9900 (it was stolen) ...

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  16. matt0135's Avatar
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    OS 7 had the productivity features that were needed but was no longer able to support new features that the masses clearly craved, or else blackberry wouldn't have been in the situation they are in today.

    With that being said bb10 in my opinion is far superior in OS terms. What's to say they can't implement OS7 features like they've started to already?

    Like many have already said OS7 would not have played nice with updated specs, so it is really dead in the water.

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  17. serbanescu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr4aces View Post

    Exactly, just think the QNX would have been on BlackBerry's Qwerty phone for 3 years and they would have been that much further with the QNX. Some people "just don't get it'! They are influenced by what they read instead of thinking it out logically. Doesn't take a scientist to figure out all the mistakes ML/RIM made. Just think how much money was wasted and how much could have been made. It just blows my mind.
    Well, they couldn't do it so quickly.

    To clarify my previous statement: I think that the gesture-based BB10 is a great solution - but they could have done it better if they would have included in the BB10 team some "old boys" that knew what BBOS features (not BBOS code - that was nearly impossible and anyway counterproductive) are highly valuable and MUST be included in the new OS.
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  18. prplhze2000's Avatar
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    Love the Q keyboard. Got this bad boy totally figured out. Can almost do it by feel.

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  19. Mr4aces's Avatar
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    I know John Chen was green to RIM so during his learn curve, how much bad influence did he get. Did the 20 year old's in R and D, that didn't even own a Bold, give him bad advice? He has his knowledgeable staff in place now and has gotten rid of the RIM employees that brought RIM down.

    Will JC make the mistake of releasing a Q20 (Classic) that is not what 9900/Bold users want? If BlackBerry releases the Q20 (Q10 with a tool belt) the sales will not be good and it might be another Q10 failure. Did BB/JC do a 180 and redesign the it and gave the first design to Foxconn? We won't know until October.
    Last edited by Mr4aces; 08-28-2014 at 06:27 PM.
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  20. Mr4aces's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by world traveler and former ceo View Post
    I have the q10 and agree it's nothing like the bold 9900 iconic phone...

    Bold 9900 truly had the best keyboard in history....

    I can't type on the q10. Can't stand the keyboard!!!

    Anxiously awaiting the Passport!!!

    Miss my bold 9900 (it was stolen) ...

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    Thank you. I would be very interested what you think about the ML/RIM management. I also was self employed and have a bias opinion.
    Last edited by Mr4aces; 08-28-2014 at 06:32 PM.
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  21. Mr4aces's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by THBW View Post
    No kidding, I simply don't get how people can think like this. Maybe there is a group of blackberry users that work on muscle memory and nothing else.
    Have you owned a Bold/9900?
    Unless you are using your phone to play Candy Crush, you have no idea how good the 9900 functions.
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  22. DaSchwantz's Avatar
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    I've used bbos phones for work since forever, including the bold, and had an iPhone for personal use. I now have 3 different bb10 phones (new personal, old personal, and work) and have convinced 4 different family members to get them as well, I like them so much.

    I agree that RIM should have introduced the classic (toolbelt querty) and BES 12 (single server) right from the get go and they would have been better off (aggressive upgrades of bbos users), rather than competing directly for the consumer market. Still, bb10 is waaay better, in my opinion. You couldn't even use the web properly without pain and suffering on bbos....better as an email machine maybe, but not much else. bb10 is still young...give it time.

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  23. Mirk's Avatar
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    I see a lot of problems with this line of thinking... BBOS wasn't going anywhere, it was an outdated mess... there was no choice, it had to be scrapped, albeit BB10 could mirror BBOS's features better, but all that development takes time. Then there are things like the Hub that I wouldn't give up.

    I'm sorry to say but I respectfully disagree with your sentiments. BlackBerry would be dead, chopped to pieces, and sold for pennies on the dollar if they didn't scrap BBOS. If anything it should have been done sooner.

    You are recommending that they should have maintained course when they knew it was going to run aground. BBOS users where and still are becoming fewer and fewer.
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  24. SlcCorrado's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr4aces View Post
    Have you owned a Bold/9900?
    Unless you are using your phone to play Candy Crush, you have no idea how good the 9900 functions.
    I'm with ya on that one... The 9900 was probably the best legacy device BlackBerry ever made. Superb device
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  25. conite's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirk View Post
    I see a lot of problems with this line of thinking... BBOS wasn't going anywhere, it was an outdated mess... there was no choice, it had to be scrapped, albeit BB10 could mirror BBOS's features better, but all that development takes time. Then there are things like the Hub that I wouldn't give up.

    I'm sorry to say but I respectfully disagree with your sentiments. BlackBerry would be dead, chopped to pieces, and sold for pennies on the dollar if they didn't scrap BBOS. If anything it should have been done sooner.

    You are recommending that they should have maintained course when they knew it was going to run aground. BBOS users where and still are becoming fewer and fewer.
    Agree with this 100%. BlackBerry was bankrupt in 12 months if they didn't make the move.

    I also agree that it would have been nice to have more legacy features on the new devices right out of the gate, but it's all about allocating engineering resources, and they hit the wish list as best they could. Different people see different things as deal-breaker issues on their devices. OP has his priorities, and I have mine.

    BB10 is the best mobile OS on the planet in my opinion. Not too bad for a small company with limited resources. It this getting better all the time

    I was a 9900 power user for 2 years before upgrading to the Z10 and now the Z30. I pick up my old phone now and it reminds me of a pager. I run my business on the Z30. I could not on my 9900. Period.

    Z30STA100-5/10.3.0.1xxx
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