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  1. greyw0lf01's Avatar
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    Default Is the Z10 launch tracking the Playbook launch...

    The arch seems to be trending the same:

    • Hardcore fans flock to it;
    • The press is mixed, but mostly positive;
    • The platform lacks apps;
    • Version 1 has bugs;
    • Defenders shout down any dissenters even if they are blackberry lovers;
    • Defenders scream at the top of their lungs that it’s the best in class;
    • Any issues w/ the device/software must be the users fault;
    • Crashes, freezes;
    • No sales figures;
    • Most of the apps are still ported;
    • Acknowledged issues will be dealt with sometime in the future;
    • Availability limited or no show in the US;
    • Constant comparisons to being better than iToy even though the numbers don’t bear it out;
    • Complaints that android is buggy and filled w/ malware even though its your only route to apps;
    • Claims that QNX is the best and powers nuclear power stations even though the phone requires battery pulls or security wipes or software re-installs.


    Here’s a link to the Playbook Forum... tell me how this doesn’t track Z10... practically comment for comment. Read every 100 pages or so to get the flavor:

    http://forums.crackberry.com/blackberry-playbook-f222/

    I see way too many similarities than I do differences. I hope I’m wrong come 3/28 when earnings are announced.
  2. sk8er_tor's Avatar
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    #2  

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    Do you even have one to make such a claim? I have a Z10 and it's night and day difference between it and the PlayBook.
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  3. AVPTI's Avatar
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    I think there are way more differences.

    • Complete OS (aka, not missing PIM)
    • Largest app selection for a brand new platform
    • Competitve pricing
    • No Execs stating timeframes for updates
    • A happy dev community
    • A much simpler method to develope (no more dependency on Air)
    • BBM
    • Proper markting campaign


    Sure the OS isn't complete, but no OS 1.0 is feature complete.

    Everything will have positives and negatives, it's just much easier for people to rant about negatives because "anger" and "hate" are much more impulsive emotions
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  4. Silverfern's Avatar
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    I feel this is a lot more stable than pkaybook
  5. greyw0lf01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sk8er_tor View Post
    Do you even have one to make such a claim? I have a Z10 and it's night and day difference between it and the PlayBook.
    Perhaps night and day between the playbook & Z10, perhaps not. The point is still the same, but the arch of the penultimate launch are tracking the same; even the comments.
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  6. Pandastrong's Avatar
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    He's not saying the software and hardware are the same, He's just saying the launch/reception/public response is mirroring that of the Playbook's. I have to agree, however i hope the Z10 manages to gain popularity over the long run outside the tight circle of Blackberry fans. The Playbook is an amazing bit of kit, and the Z10 has a lot of potential. Fingers crossed we'll see people realising just how good the Z10 is, and making the move from IOS and Android.



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    Curve 8520, Torch 9810, Playbook 64GB, Black Z10.
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  7. AVPTI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greyw0lf01 View Post
    Perhaps night and day between the playbook & Z10, perhaps not. The point is still the same, but the arch of the penultimate launch are tracking the same; even the comments.
    Do you have a Z10? Or are you basing your entire argument on what the media says?
    XoXoXo
  8. cman5's Avatar
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    I think if the PB had been launched in the state it's in right now, (stable OS, native email client, the apps now available and at the $200 price point) it would have been a great success. But we all know what happened.
    And there lies the difference between the PB launch and the Z10 launch. The Z10 (still waiting for MTS to launch it, so I can pick mine up) has all the required items and is at the right price point for this type of smart phone. So I don't believe the outcomes will be the same. Far from it.
    Last edited by cman5; 02-22-2013 at 04:09 PM. Reason: spelling
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  9. Pandastrong's Avatar
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    Whether he has a Z10 or not has no effect on the point being made, neither does how the Z10 and Playbook stack up against each other. All that is being claimed is that the 'current' response from people on forums and the media in general is very similar to the reaction we saw after the Playbook's launch.

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    Curve 8520, Torch 9810, Playbook 64GB, Black Z10.
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  10. lawguyman's Avatar
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    Having lived through it I can say that this is nothing like PlayBook launch.

    PlayBook got poor reviews. Read CBK's review. Even he was lukewarm on it from what I remember.

    PlayBook was a BlackBerry without freaking email. Just what the world was asking for. PlayBook pushed the Bridge but att refused to release the bridge app. Remember that? The Z10 is a feature complete OS. No comparison.

    Z10 is way ahead of PlayBook on apps too. The claim with PlayBook was that you didn't need apps because the browser ran Flash. Still, Z10 does need more apps, especially Big Apps.

    PlayBook sold out nowhere. Z10 has sold out plenty of places.

    Oh yeah PlayBook had no Android player until like a year after release.

    My Z10 has never frozen locked up or required a battery pull.


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  11. katesbb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lawguyman View Post
    PlayBook was a BlackBerry without freaking email. Just what the world was asking for. PlayBook pushed the Bridge but att refused to release the bridge app. Remember that? The Z10 is a feature complete OS. No comparison.
    The Z10's puzzling lack of BBOS features (custom notifications, sound profiles) reminds me of the PB's lack of email.
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  12. lawguyman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by katesbb View Post
    The Z10's puzzling lack of BBOS features (custom notifications, sound profiles) reminds me of the PB's lack of email.
    These things tell me that this is no longer BBOS and I'm okay with that.

    Posted via CB10
  13. Dlanod's Avatar
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    Default Is the Z10 launch tracking the Playbook launch...

    Quote Originally Posted by greyw0lf01 View Post
    The arch seems to be trending the same:

    •Hardcore fans flock to it;
    •The press is mixed, but mostly positive;
    •The platform lacks apps;
    •Version 1 has bugs;
    •Defenders shout down any dissenters even if they are blackberry lovers;
    •Defenders scream at the top of their lungs that it’s the best in class;
    •Any issues w/ the device/software must be the users fault;
    •Crashes, freezes;
    •No sales figures;
    •Most of the apps are still ported;
    •Acknowledged issues will be dealt with sometime in the future;
    •Availability limited or no show in the US;
    •Constant comparisons to being better than iToy even though the numbers don’t bear it out;
    •Complaints that android is buggy and filled w/ malware even though its your only route to apps;
    •Claims that QNX is the best and powers nuclear power stations even though the phone requires battery pulls or security wipes or software re-installs.


    Here’s a link to the Playbook Forum... tell me how this doesn’t track Z10... practically comment for comment. Read every 100 pages or so to get the flavor:

    http://forums.crackberry.com/blackberry-playbook-f222/

    I see way too many similarities than I do differences. I hope I’m wrong come 3/28 when earnings are announced.
    Yup. Totally agree.
  14. Pandastrong's Avatar
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    Again i do think the response is similar.

    Playbook did receive lukewarm reviews, but on the whole so has the Z10.

    Playbook didn't sell out, but reports of the Z10 selling out may be a little misleading, for instance the store i got my Z10 from (which is in the centre of the 4th largest city in England) only got 4 in stock fpr the launch, of which they had sold 2 by the second week they'd been on sale.

    The Playbook was missing some key features when it was released, which left many Blackberry fans, and reviewers perplexed. However the Z10 is also missing key things people expect on a modern smartphone, such as gmail calender sync, any of the big name apps (obviously we have to wait to see how this problem pans out), and is also lacking any really groundbreaking USP. The predictive text is a nice feature but not a sole reason to buy a phone. The hub is a nice thing to have but is far from groundbreaking.

    The problem is that people dont want to buy a new phone and have to take a step backwards, something both non-blackberry users and in some respects blackberry OS7 users may feel like they are doing on BB10.

    Alot is made on these forums of apps not being top big a deal, but for a huge amount of smartphone users they are a deciding factor.

    Take one example like Twitters. He bb10 app is absolutely crap. Someone shouldnt go from OS7 to a very expensive new phone and not be able to do as much with it.

    BB10 is missing a lot which people come to expect as standard on a modern smartphone. This is the same as how upon launch the Playbook was missing a lot which people expect from a modern tablet.

    Im almost certain BB10 will massively improve just as the playbook has, however the majority of people only remember the initial hype and marketing about a product and dont tend to check back to see if any OS updates have been released since they last checked. First impressions count a lot in the technology market, especially where companies need to sell a huge number of products.

    I love Blackberry,ive exclusively used thwir phones for years and use my playbook everyday. However, seeing what im seeing its hard not to worry a little.

    Posted via CB10
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  15. adrenaline_x's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by katesbb View Post
    The Z10's puzzling lack of BBOS features (custom notifications, sound profiles) reminds me of the PB's lack of email.
    what? There are sound profiles, and you can change each notification sound for bbm, bbm video, facebook, txt, email (accounts) etc.

    Had you not found it under notifications?

    The lack of tones that ship with the phone was a tad annoying but i just clicked on downloads on the crackberry site and downloaded about 50.. for free.
    --- Sent From Mobile Device While on the Can! ---
  16. Lumute's Avatar
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    I have my Z10 since launch day, I may be biased but to be honest I have not had any of the mayor problems you mention:

    - Battery is not the best but lasts a day and I am used to charge overnight so no issues for me here...

    - I have 5 Exchange active sync addresses configured plus Facebook, tweeter and LinkedIn, all work flawless

    - I have not had to do a single battery pull ever on this phone, a couple of restarts but no battery pulls

    - I have experienced app crashes but I normally attribute it to app bugs and not OS bugs, not a mayor issue for me, I just open the app again.

    - The OS is incredibly responsive compared to OS7 and even compared to playbook, no lags or wait times or hang ups for me.

    - Really like the keyboard and auto-correct is really good, fixes most of my many typos. no auto-correct on the Playbook for a long long time...

    - App World on the playbook was awfully buggy when launched, works very well on OS10.

    - Playbook was lacking all the email / calendar and contact applications on launch so it was pretty much useless for non blackberry phone users. Not the case here at all.

    - Huge application catalog compared to playbook launch, yes, tons of crappy applications but very good ones too.

    - Native BBM with voice and video support brings BlackBerry's strongest selling point to the table, and improved, non existing for Playbook.

    - One of the best mobile browsing experiences out there at the moment.

    - There are some beautiful 3D games that run very well, fast and responsive.

    - Music and Movie stores right from launch day.

    - Improved and reasonable boot time, not the best when compared to competitors but reasonable. Playbook was and continues to be awful here...

    So, are there bugs and things to improve? Yes, obviously, maybe I am biased, maybe I'm not a regular user, but NO I do not agree: nothing at all like the playbook launch...


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    Last edited by Lumute; 02-22-2013 at 05:40 PM.
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  17. SDTRMG's Avatar
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    Its bull**** to say everything's the same when the phones only been out for 2.5 weeks. Most developers are waiting to see how many phones sell before creating there app.

    Bb10 is better then iOS OS wise, having more features etc. I'm an ex iPhone 5 owner And can say iOS only has apps and loyalty.

    I haven't had one freeze, glitch or battery ull on my z10, and even at that I have friends who's android restart and freeze all the time so that doesn't mean nothing.

    Android has malware because of its OS, and it runs its apps in a dalvak runtime(which is open to malware), blackberry created a safer more secure runtime to run android apps on bb10, and always has 2 steps(machine scans the code, and humans search the code) apps must pass before going into blackberry world.

    The phone not being released in the US has to do with carriers and carriers only. And the playbook was an unfinished OS rushed to the market. Bb10 is not.
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  18. iphonyustoopid's Avatar
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    Default Some similarities, many differences

    Quote Originally Posted by greyw0lf01 View Post
    The arch seems to be trending the same:

    • Hardcore fans flock to it;
    • The press is mixed, but mostly positive;
    • The platform lacks apps; Really?? The app argument again?? 70000 is not enuf for a start?
    • Version 1 has bugs; Ok, not to point fingers, but was there not just a 7yr old OS update causing all sorts of issues with security ect?
    • Defenders shout down any dissenters even if they are blackberry lovers;Happens across all platforms
    • Defenders scream at the top of their lungs that it’s the best in class;see above
    • Any issues w/ the device/software must be the users fault;most of my issues I have found to be my issues with how I was doing things.
    • Crashes, freezes;no battery pulls yet - have had a few freezes, but can always reset the OS without any problems - no restarts/batt pulls
    • No sales figures;Holy Crap - it's been like 3 weeks -
    • Most of the apps are still ported;Ok - Not enuf apps, now ported apps are not good either - what an OS - BTW can any other platform do this?
    • Acknowledged issues will be dealt with sometime in the future;how else can you fix things - I have been trying to fix problems in the past, but I keep running into myself. Hard to know where to look when that happens - very awkward.
    • Availability limited or no show in the US;Carrier Testing - mmmm.
    • Constant comparisons to being better than iToy even though the numbers don’t bear it out;again - holy ****e - it's been 3 weeks
    • Complaints that android is buggy and filled w/ malware even though its your only route to apps; again with the apps????
    • Claims that QNX is the best and powers nuclear power stations even though the phone requires battery pulls or security wipes or software re-installs. QNX is a very good OS . the only reason I think people keep pointing at a battery pull, is it seems to be the easiest way to restart - I think that most issues could be solved by looking at the symptoms and following them to the Problem. But its just easier to pull the battery. Another analogy would be to look at automobiles, they all break, they all need maintanence, even the Bentley has issues.


    Here’s a link to the Playbook Forum... tell me how this doesn’t track Z10... practically comment for comment. Read every 100 pages or so to get the flavor:

    http://forums.crackberry.com/blackberry-playbook-f222/

    I see way too many similarities than I do differences. I hope I’m wrong come 3/28 when earnings are announced.
    Nothing is going to be good enuf for the short sellers - the manipulation that the US Stock market is doing is criminal - BBRY is just the latest in the long list of manipulated stocks. I wonder why Wall St doesn't want regulations, it interferes with profits.
    Torch 9800 Black Z10. playbook 16gb playbook 64gb torch 9800 White Z10(2nd) PlayBook ™ 16GB. (3rd)
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  19. RubberChicken76's Avatar
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    I see way too many similarities than I do differences.
    - PlayBook launched with 3,000 apps, Z10 with 70,000.
    - PlayBook had no NDK, Z10 had it well in advance ... see above
    - PlayBook had no email, no contacts, no calendar and no Android support. Z10 has all of the above
    - PlayBook's browser was somewhat criticized, Z10's is generally positive
    - PlayBook was shoved into an unfamiliar retail channel, Z10 in the familiar carrier channel
    - Z10 has a staged roll-out. PlayBook was stuffed into the channel and inspired a half billion dollar write-down
    - PlayBook had no video store and a third party music store. Z10 has them in app world
    - PlayBook had air based UI, Z10 has rich cascades framework
    - PlayBook has a 7" screen and was sold for the same price as the market leader. Z10 sells for $139.
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  20. greyw0lf01's Avatar
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    How is BB10 better than iOS? Different, yes... Better, subjective at best.

    Why does Apple have loyalty, because they do what they say and do what they say.

    Sales - most flog their opening weekend numbers/first week sales to generate additional buzz. This buzz drives developers to look closer at the platform.

    Security - iOS had hiccups with their 6.1 rollout but as a former iphone user you should know that there are 2 ways to secure the phone thus eliminating the lock screen issue.

    When the original iphone rolled out, did 700k apps exist?

    Like I said, BB10 is tracking the playbook down to you defending... The various things will come.
  21. greyw0lf01's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RubberChicken76 View Post
    - PlayBook launched with 3,000 apps, Z10 with 70,000.
    - PlayBook had no NDK, Z10 had it well in advance ... see above
    - PlayBook had no email, no contacts, no calendar and no Android support. Z10 has all of the above
    - PlayBook's browser was somewhat criticized, Z10's is generally positive
    - PlayBook was shoved into an unfamiliar retail channel, Z10 in the familiar carrier channel
    - Z10 has a staged roll-out. PlayBook was stuffed into the channel and inspired a half billion dollar write-down
    - PlayBook had no video store and a third party music store. Z10 has them in app world
    - PlayBook had air based UI, Z10 has rich cascades framework
    - PlayBook has a 7" screen and was sold for the same price as the market leader. Z10 sells for $139.
    $139... Really?

    Same defense of the playbook....
  22. RubberChicken76's Avatar
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    Playbook didn't sell out, but reports of the Z10 selling out may be a little misleading, for instance the store i got my Z10 from (which is in the centre of the 4th largest city in England) only got 4 in stock fpr the launch, of which they had sold 2 by the second week they'd been on sale.
    I wish people would stop doing this. "The world must be this way, because my three friends do this" thinking. I swear to god, my stats prof is rolling over in his grave. I agree that they may be pointless or misleading, but you walking into one store, in one country, does not mean all stores in all countries are the same.

    For example, my Best Buy went through 50 in three days and it's been moving briskly since.

    The Playbook was missing some key features when it was released, which left many Blackberry fans, and reviewers perplexed. However the Z10 is also missing key things people expect on a modern smartphone, such as gmail calender sync, any of the big name apps
    The two products are not even comparable in terms of how they were at launch. What you list is an annoyance. The PlayBook didn't have fricken email, contacts or calendar appointments at launch. The Z10 has all the bases covered with some kinks to iron out. It's not even remotely the same.

    BB10 is missing a lot which people come to expect as standard on a modern smartphone.
    What is this big long list of 'a lot'?

    This is the same as how upon launch the Playbook was missing a lot which people expect from a modern tablet.
    You have some serious revisionist history happening if you think the Z10 and the PlayBook launched with all the same deficiencies ...
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  23. RubberChicken76's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greyw0lf01 View Post
    $139... Really?

    Same defense of the playbook....
    It's $139 on contract, which is less than iPhone 5. PlayBook went for the same price as the iPad when it launched at $499. AKA, BlackBerry is more realistic in terms of pricing. The PlayBook's price cuts started coming months later.
  24. dj_matty_s's Avatar
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    I thought, and still do think, that the playbook is a fantastic tablet.

    I thought, and still do think, that the z10 is a fantastic phone.

    I could care less what anyone else thinks, I'm quite satisfied with the products and whether someone at CNET, BGR or on Wall Street agrees with me, or not, makes zero difference.
  25. Silverfern's Avatar
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    i gave up on playbook, but its because i simply prefer a full sized laptop with a large keyboard, mouse and the power (i have gaming laptop). would have given up on any tablet. MOAH POWAH!
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