Do NOT pull the battery

**jstirtzinger** · 02-22-2013, 03:11 PM

I think maybe there are some old habits here that were learned on old BB devices that aren't necessary with QNX.
As an experiment...DO NOT PULL YOUR BATTERY when you are tempted to do it and instead try in this order to resolve and only move to the next item if the previous didn't work...

1) Wait a minute for it resolve itself
2) Swipe and Close the offending app
3) Power off and restart.

There is also the 5x swipe move to reset the hub if that is ever necessary.

**Lendo78** · 02-22-2013, 03:15 PM

But what's the difference between waiting for the device to restart and pulling the battery?

**QuantumQnx** · 02-22-2013, 03:16 PM

You can also reset by holding the power button for 10 seconds. Pulling the battery is unnecessary wear and tear on the device.

Posted via CB10

**howarmat** · 02-22-2013, 03:21 PM

Sometimes an actual battery pull works better. Removing the power source is different than a restart

**jstirtzinger** · 02-22-2013, 03:27 PM

But that's my point...I don't think removing the power source is needed in the new OS and perpetuates the old stereotypes.

**jstirtzinger** · 02-22-2013, 03:29 PM

Most times I bet you don't even need to restart...just swiping and closing the offending app is enough. Think about the Playbook...you can't remove the battery so in worst case scenarios a restart is sufficient.

**Lendo78** · 02-22-2013, 03:31 PM

Originally Posted by jstirtzinger

Most times I bet you don't even need to restart...just swiping and closing the offending app is enough. Think about the Playbook...you can't remove the battery so in worst case scenarios a restart is sufficient.

Doing a hard reset on the playbook is the equivalent of a battery pull.

**jstirtzinger** · 02-22-2013, 03:36 PM

Originally Posted by Lendo78

Doing a hard reset on the playbook is the equivalent of a battery pull.

Right....and how often is that really needed? My point is too many people are a) using old habits that are not needed, 2) are impatient and 3) unnecessarily increase the wear/tear on the device. A "restart" is common now and then in ALL devices...dismantling your phone to get it to work is not :-P So let's stop perpetuating that the new OS is just the same as the old OS. See what I mean?

**Lendo78** · 02-22-2013, 03:38 PM

Originally Posted by jstirtzinger

Right....and how often is that really needed? My point is too many people are a) using old habits that are not needed, 2) are impatient and 3) unnecessarily increase the wear/tear on the device. A "restart" is common now and then in ALL devices...dismantling your phone to get it to work is not :-P So let's stop perpetuating that the new OS is just the same as the old OS. See what I mean?

I do, and I kinda agree. I had an issue with loss of sound and nothing worked except the battery pull, but that could be as you said my impatience.

**D Mac** · 02-22-2013, 03:40 PM

Originally Posted by isle989

You can also reset by holding the power button for 10 seconds. Pulling the battery is unnecessary wear and tear on the device.

Posted via CB10

Is that any different from holding the power button for one second and hitting Restart?

**peter9477** · 02-22-2013, 04:07 PM

D Mac, the 10s power button press can be different from just tapping restart, but only when especially bad things have happened. That's very rare... in almost all cases, a simple restart will be sufficient.

It is, however, a fact that people (me included) have sometimes done several restarts with no resolution of their problem, then did the "hard" reset and had the issue clear up. Whether that "should" make a difference is something only a few software guys in QNX could answer, I suspect... It's quite possible this is a simple case of correlation not implying causation. Perhaps if we'd simply done a third restart it would have had the same effect.

Note that the 10s reset is supposed to be (as I understand it) no different from the old-style Reset button on PCs. That didn't actually remove power from the system, but merely triggered a special input to the digital circuitry, called RESET (or /RESET or *RESET various similar names). Such an input basically forces all the electronics to a known starting state, effectively identical to how it is when it first comes alive when you turn the power on. From that point on, there "should" be no difference in behaviour between actually removing power (i.e. power off, or battery pull) and doing a "hard' reset.

A reset may be different from a Restart, however, and I don't think anyone here knows whether or not an actual RESET occurs at the end of the Restart sequence. It's optional... it's the designer's choice whether or not to implement a restart this way. I've built systems that did it one way and systems that did it the other.

I kept putting "should" in quotation marks above, because I'm an engineer. Programmers and engineers are well aware that "can't" and "shouldn't" aren't in the vocabulary of the systems with which they work on a daily basis. ;-)

**Bold_until_Hybrid_Comes** · 02-22-2013, 04:35 PM

I have never had a full system freeze on my PlayBook in two years or on my z10 yet. I think anyone saying an actual battery pull works better probably has never even seen a z10 yet?

**howarmat** · 02-22-2013, 04:52 PM

no its just a fact that removing all source of power can help things. Kinda like removing a battery when a phone gets wet is not the same as just shutting the phone down. Im not saying that you should always do a battery pull instead of a restart, just that sometimes taking the battery out and letting a phone sit for 15-30 seconds is not the same as a restart

**EauRouge** · 02-22-2013, 04:53 PM

Ill give this a try! #butoldhabitsdiehard

**peter9477** · 02-22-2013, 04:58 PM

Originally Posted by howarmat

no its just a fact that removing all source of power can help things. Kinda like removing a battery when a phone gets wet is not the same as just shutting the phone down. Im not saying that you should always do a battery pull instead of a restart, just that sometimes taking the battery out and letting a phone sit for 15-30 seconds is not the same as a restart

FYI, as soon as the voltage drops below a certain level, the chips get a real RESET signal. This would happen within probably less than 50ms of you pulling it out.

There's no longer any need to wait for a while for all power to drain and the RAM to "clear out" like that, or whatever the reason was that we used to do it. I even remember doing it too! :-) Anyone recall a specific device where that truly was required? I'm thinking C-64 era or maybe even earlier. (Was probably something with relatively large capacitors on it, and old slow RAM that held a charge for quite a while.)

Pulling the battery should instantly reset it, same as if you do the 10s power button thing. Only the software restart is potentially different (but as the OP said, people should rarely need anything else now).

**xamdam** · 02-22-2013, 05:08 PM

Ok this has been posted and argued about several times now.

**Josh Brolin** · 02-22-2013, 06:39 PM

Battery pull is the quickest means to an end. Thats why i do it instead of letting the phone sit

**Lendo78** · 02-22-2013, 06:42 PM

Originally Posted by xamdam

Ok this has been posted and argued about several times now.

And it won't be the last thread started about it either lol

**joickle** · 02-22-2013, 06:46 PM

I agree with OP, battery pulls are not necessary on QNX, Do you reach behind your computer and yank out the power cable? lol

**Lendo78** · 02-22-2013, 06:48 PM

Originally Posted by joickle

I agree with OP, battery pulls are not necessary on QNX, Do you reach behind your computer and yank out the power cable? lol

Only during a thunder storm or during a power failure.

**Josh Brolin** · 02-22-2013, 07:04 PM

When my playbook died completley i had to pull the battery to let it charge. The only option left was to plug the charger in and out for each time the red light flashed which can take upto 30 mins

**ecarlin** · 02-22-2013, 07:56 PM

Originally Posted by Lendo78

Only during a thunder storm or during a power failure.

I'll second that.

**b1mmuo27** · 02-22-2013, 08:25 PM

After the update from Blackberry this morning saying it's about the battery I let it update. I have had it lockup since getting this 2 weeks ago. So today it refused to go to the telephone key pad although I could see I kept pushing it with no reply. Just stayed stuck on the call list. Pulled the battery it worked again fine. Don't know what all was in this update this morning.

**Omnitech** · 02-23-2013, 04:02 AM

I have never seen a case even on my old 9650 or 9630, where a battery pull did anything useful that the old "three finger salute" wouldn't do.

With one possible exception: if it got into a situation where the state of the battery itself was messed-up (ie 0% charge or worn out entirely), sometimes it wouldn't start. But as far as clearing os issues and so on, regular soft reset has always worked for me.

**ari_paku** · 02-23-2013, 04:25 AM

Uh, twice I tried restarting my Z10 and it didn't turn back on. I tried pressing the button a few times, even tried holding it down a few seconds, nothing. Removed the battery for a few seconds, put it back in and hey, turned on.

Case in point: pulling the can be necessary in some cases.

BlackBerry Z10 & BlackBerry PlayBook