[jeremycrews]

I know there have been several threads to address this issue in the past, but the most recent one is now over 2 years old and it referred to the Storm 2 rather than the Torch 9810, so here goes.

Is there any prevailing theory as to why the batteries on these phones seem to act completely different on a day-to-day basis, or is it just mine? To be as precise as possible without delving into a true scientific investigation, what I'm referring to is:

What could be causing the phone to drain at 1.7%/hour one day, then 4.92%/hour the next day, then back down to about 2.4%/hour on the 3rd day... with, basically, an identical level of usage? Heck, it's even sitting in the same spot on the same desk in the same office, yet weirdly the battery life varies like this all the time.

Yesterday, the Device Analyzer read it as draining at 1.4%/hour. I went to bed last night with a battery that still had 77% charge. I was a happy camper. Today, it has gone from a full charge down to 29% battery in 14 hours. The schizo Device Analyzer is showing it as having drained at 4.06%/hour, but that math is off by several percentage points. Either way, that represents a huge difference from yesterday... with no increase in usage. This is not an isolated incident.

Full bars H+ via Microcell. WiFi on; signal crappy, but no worse than usual (big house, 100+ years old, thick oak construction). Bluetooth off. Facebook and Twitter apps set to never refresh. Social Feeds app nuked long ago.

Do I maybe need to replace my battery, or are others here having similar difficulties (or have they had anything similar in the past)?

[californiablackberry]

Replace the battery, see if anything changes, if not - return the battery and contemplate on what else it could be.

[jeremycrews]

Replace the battery, see if anything changes, if not - return the battery and contemplate on what else it could be.

I forgot to say that I have already tried 3 different batteries, but the other 2 are all equally old and I have no way of knowing how badly they were abused by the previous owner (they were given to me by a family member who upgraded from the 9800 to the Bold 9900).

EDIT: 30 minutes into hour 14 and it's dropped from 29% to 26%. Going to bed now; I'll check back here tomorrow to see if anyone has left any further advice as well as to gauge tomorrow's performance versus today's.

[newcollector]

Two pieces of advice:

1. Make sure you don't have an app running in the background. The worst thing about Apps is that some close by hitting the back arrow, and some don't. I have used the escape key more than once to get out of an app or hit the menu key and selected "close" to shut down an app. Some apps you actually have to select from the menu "exit" to get it to close. When you hit and hold the "freckle" menu key, what shows on your screen? It should only show the icons for home, bbm, phone, browser, and email. Anything else showing, and you have an app running in the background. I just checked mine and found out QR Scanner was still running in the background even though I escaped out of it last night. So I opened QR, hit the menu key, selected "exit" and shut the thing down. Now I am good to go.

2. Go buy a new battery.

[tsells]

Stop checking the battery analyzer so much and enjoy the phone. It makes no difference if you get 2%/hr or 4%/hr, as either one will get you through an entire day.
Close all apps after you are finished with them and put the phone on a charger every night.
A full day's use on your phone without a charge is way better than any Android or I-Phone can do.

[jeremycrews]

Two pieces of advice:

1. Make sure you don't have an app running in the background. The worst thing about Apps is that some close by hitting the back arrow, and some don't.

Nothing running but the same 5 that always run on every Blackberry (a terrible design flaw, in my opinion). I learned that lesson a long time ago as well.

2. Go buy a new battery.

Ordered one today.

Stop checking the battery analyzer so much and enjoy the phone. It makes no difference if you get 2%/hr or 4%/hr, as either one will get you through an entire day.

Close all apps after you are finished with them and put the phone on a charger every night.

I hear you, but the point you're missing is that this was with almost no usage. I'm talking 3-4 short emails, 2-3 pics (with flash), zero video recording or watching, a smattering of SMS and MMS messages (sharing the 2-3 pics I spoke of a moment ago with 2 other people), almost no browsing whatsoever, zero BBM or any other chat, zero calls, Bluetooth turned off, and checking FB/Twitter maybe 3 times over a 13-14 hour period. Oh, and hitting the button to wake the device up periodically to check the time (screen brightness all the way down to 10% and time-out at 10 seconds).

On one of my "good" days, when this tiny amount of usage is draining the battery at 1.4%/hr and I'm left with 77% at the end of the day, I am confident that I would've gotten through the day even with heavier usage. Maybe it would've been at 20%-30% when I went to bed instead of 77%, but that is perfectly acceptable *WHEN I'VE ACTUALLY USED THE PHONE*.

But, on a "bad" day like yesterday, when that same tiny level of usage leaves me at only 25% at bed-time, that means using my phone like a normal person would've resulted in it being completely dead in 4-6 hours. Even less if I was out somewhere using the turn-by-turn GPS in Blackberry Traffic. As it stands, this Fall I will be terrified to carry this phone when I go out of town to football games, etc. That kind of poor performance is both completely unacceptable and maddening, because it makes absolutely no sense why it would fluctuate so wildly day-to-day with nearly identical usage.

I took the attached screen grabs last night, just before bed, btw.

A full day's use on your phone without a charge is way better than any Android or I-Phone can do.

I hear that all the time, but the iPhone 3Gs I bought for my mother over a year ago has never once dropped below 50% battery, and she doesn't have to keep her Bluetooth off all the time she isn't using it or set her social apps to never refresh like I do. In fact, her Bluetooth literally hasn't been off since I turned it on over a year ago to help her pair her headset.

My cousin has the iPhone 4 and he is a very active kid (a college student as well as a freelance reporter and photographer for local newspapers/radio stations). He is a Foursquare fanatic, checking-in via GPS at probably 20 different locations a day, is all over both Twitter and FB constantly, and has the iCloud running 24/7 (he takes probably 20-50 pictures every day that auto-sync to his Win7 PC -- and yet his phone has never once dropped below 15%... and has only ever been that low once or twice.

I'm hoping the new battery does the trick for me, because I love my 9810. I'm a Blackberry guy, but the simple truth is I'm unwilling to continue carrying a sub-par device forever just because of brand-loyalty. A grown man should not have to carry a go-bag full of extra phone batteries and chargers with him every time he leaves the house.

Btw, 2 hours off charge so far today and battery is at 95%. Not great, but not nearly as bad as yesterday. Sometimes, even on a "good" day, though, it drops really quick for the first 2-3 hours then levels-out. I will update again later tonight.

[troshs]

I know what you mean here. Mine has been doing the same as well. The last 2 days, with very little usage and constantly making sure I had no apps running (I have been in Wifi the whole time so no searching) I would end up with the battery actually showing red by the end of the day, with just maybe 2 phone calls and a few texts here and there. Same thing today, but I was actually searching appworld and running pandora for about an hour, now all of a sudden its almost fully charged and I am almost ready to go to bed. This time yesterday I had it on the charger. Maybe different background processes run from day to day depending on various things, of which I wouldn't know what, I tend to notice though if I give it a full charge and then some, I usually have a good day, if I only wait until my fully charged sound plays and then take it off the charger, I seem to get less...maybe the extra time reinforces the battery? Anyways I hope you get it fixed. You might enjoy it instead of checking analyzer, however you will enjoy less time with your BB if it constantly wants to die...

[jeremycrews]

I know what you mean here. Mine has been doing the same as well. The last 2 days, with very little usage and constantly making sure I had no apps running (I have been in Wifi the whole time so no searching) I would end up with the battery actually showing red by the end of the day, with just maybe 2 phone calls and a few texts here and there. Same thing today, but I was actually searching appworld and running pandora for about an hour, now all of a sudden its almost fully charged and I am almost ready to go to bed. This time yesterday I had it on the charger. Maybe different background processes run from day to day depending on various things, of which I wouldn't know what, I tend to notice though if I give it a full charge and then some, I usually have a good day, if I only wait until my fully charged sound plays and then take it off the charger, I seem to get less...maybe the extra time reinforces the battery? Anyways I hope you get it fixed. You might enjoy it instead of checking analyzer, however you will enjoy less time with your BB if it constantly wants to die...

I charge mine almost exclusively overnight, so it's on-charge for a good long while even after it's done charging. I didn't actually take it off-charge today until 2:30pm (I work from home, so I keep weird hours), and, in the 6 hours since, it has dropped to 82%. Device Analyzer is showing it as having drained at 2.74%/hr. Far better than yesterday, yet twice the drain of Thursday with the same level of usage.

If I was out in the world using it like other people use their phones, I'd be perfectly happy with even higher drain than that... but to be getting what I'm getting (remember, yesterday was over 4%/hr), while the phone just sits on a desk is, quite frankly, embarrassing.

Thanks, btw. I hope you start getting better performance as well.

[BigBadWulf]

Even sitting in the same spot, the signal quality will vary. Currently, they could even be working on the tower. No mention whether you'd contacted the carrier at all, unless I missed it.

I know it's an old house, but I presume it's wired for electric by now. Keep it charged, and don't worry about it.

[jeremycrews]

Even sitting in the same spot, the signal quality will vary. Currently, they could even be working on the tower. No mention whether you'd contacted the carrier at all, unless I missed it.

No provider services my very rural area whatsoever; my house is right in the middle of a valley dead zone, surrounded by mountains. I'm a Microcell user; signal is straight-up H+ with full bars all the time with no fluctuation. The WiFi, on the other hand, I'm sure does fluctuate.

[jeremycrews]

UPDATE: 13 hours off-charge with very minimal stand-by level usage and battery is at 45% -- Device Analyzer reads 4.26%/hour drain. Not bad on the surface, but, if I had been actually using the phone, it would be far lower or perhaps even dead altogether a long time ago. Coincidentally, the iPhone 3Gs that is owned by my mother has been used more than mine today and is sitting two rooms further away from the Microcell and WiFi router, yet it is still at 82%... and it's been off-charge longer than mine. That does not make me happy.

Screen grabs attached. NOTE: Capturing said screen grabs and emailing them to myself dropped the battery by another 3% to 42% in a 2-minute span of time.

I suppose I could try keeping WiFi off tomorrow, except when I need it. I can't tell you how much the idea of having to do that p*sses me off, though, and, even if it helps, I refuse to consider it a solution. I'm already leaving Bluetooth off, which is something no other person I know has to do. It's one thing to kill the WiFi when away from a known signal (i.e. driving through known dead areas, which covers everything from my driveway to the next decent-sized town), but not at home. That's asinine; I might as well just take the battery out and leave the handset shut-off if turning-off everything that makes it a smartphone is the so-called solution.

I pray the new battery I ordered fixes these issues. When I'm traveling to Knoxville and Morgantown this Fall, I'd prefer to be carrying a smartphone, rather than a very stylish-looking brick in my pocket.

Can someone more knowledgeable than me please take a look at the screen grabs I've posted and see if anything looks wonky with any of the numbers. I'm not 100% sure what half that stuff means.

[BigBadWulf]

I'm so confused.

You have no signal, except for the microcell. The phone never moves from it's location in the house. Is that correct?

Were that so, simply moving the phone room to room in such an old house, could have a significant impact on microcell signal, let alone stepping outside. If it's in one spot predominantly, then leave it on the charger, and forget about the battery.

One more thing to consider. A brief scan here, shows the microcell while your only solution, is still nowhere near an ideal one.

[californiablackberry]

Should I be worried that I browse Crackberry all day, and it's almost 2AM here, yet I am still on. I always happen to have a tab open.
This thread is a great read, I like the detailed paragraphs. Seriously, not joking.

Anyways, this makes me appreciate that I live in a somewhat urban area where I get service without having to use an extender.

[jeremycrews]

Yes, but I bet you don't get bears in your yard like I do.


Sent from my BlackBerry 9810 using Tapatalk

[homer1475]

I'm with tsells, if it gets you through a full day, throw it on the charger at night and quit looking at the device analyzer like its the word of god.

I have days where I get home with 80% battery, and days I get home with 25%, typically the same usage every day, but it gets me through the day and I throw it on the charger when I get home.

[jeremycrews]

To BigBadWulf: the Microcell sucks, but its that or nothing, and the iPhone doesn't seem to mind it.

To clarify the rest, the phone is moved room-to-room a bit, but it spends most of the day on my desk. I could leave it plugged-up all that time, but then how would I know what to expect when I'm not at home?

I took it out a few days back to a meeting at a restaurant in town and lost 50% of my charge in 3 hours.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9810 using Tapatalk

[jeremycrews]

To homer1475: But you're using yours. I'm not. It's in stand-by almost the whole time. If I were using it, it wouldn't be lasting a day.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9810 using Tapatalk

[BigBadWulf]

Jeremy

You live in an area with little to no signal, so you should expect terrible battery life. Keep the two spares charged and with you. Relax, and enjoy living in the country, away from many other issues.

[jeremycrews]

Jeremy

You live in an area with little to no signal, so you should expect terrible battery life. Keep the two spares charged and with you. Relax, and enjoy living in the country, away from many other issues.

I hear you, my friend, but an important point isn't being addressed: the iPhone sitting 2 rooms away isn't having these same problems, so it isn't just a signal issue. It either has to be a bad battery or a bad phone, in my opinion. I ordered a new battery, so let's hope that fixes it. My reason for starting the thread was to see if others were having similar issues.

When I was in town the other day and bled almost 50% in a 3 hour span, I had all the antennae off until I got into a service area. Once I got there, I left WiFi off and had a strong H+ signal the whole time in the restaurant. I took one brief phone call (the others wondering where I was), sent/received two SMS messages, and took, like, maybe seven pictures with the flash on. The only really outrageous thing I did was to use the turn-by-turn GPS in Blackberry Traffic for all of 10-15 minutes, just to try it out. And that cost me 50% of my battery. That is simply unacceptable.

By way of another comparison, the iPhone owner forgot to turn-off either of her antennae when she went into town yesterday, meaning the handset was searching for signal the whole time she was driving through the dead-zone (10 miles or better in either direction) and kept searching for WiFi even after it found the mobile network signal. She was gone for several hours. She returned home with 66% battery, and was freaking-out because it's only ever been that low a few times.

There's another Blackberry user here in the house as well (9900) who also has terrible battery-life. He has to charge his at night and at least once during the day. It's impossible to make a real comparison, though, as he browses sports blogs and stuff all day and insists on keeping at least one app running all the time, so his battery would be crapping-out anyway.

If the new battery doesn't fix me, I'm not sure what I'm gonna do. I suppose, at least for the nonce, I'll be forced to carry a homemade Blackberry emergency kit full of extra batteries and chargers, but I cannot express to you how ridiculous that is.

[f0xx386]

Maybe your battery cycles are out off sync, but I doubt it. I thought I'd tell you because it will be something for you to google instead just stewing untill the new one gets here.

[troshs]

I could do the above myself, but sometimes it dies before I go to bed, say around 6 or 7 o clock I have to throw it on the charger. I don't run 7.1 whatsoever, its stock OS for me. Boyfriend is getting an HTC from one of his friends and he may give me his battery from his 9800, I'll see how that fares...6 month old phone should not behave this way, especially if I keep my memory card clean of pictures constantly and I have very few apps.

[BigBadWulf]

Jeremy, I can't answer why the iphone behaves differently. What iphone model is it? That may be the difference. Since both BlackBerries behave the same on the microcell, there could be an issue with it also. I can tell you, 4% would be a dream come true for me. These are much higher powered phones than all BlackBerries before, so like all new phones, the battery drops faster.

troshs, you can't possibly compare the battery on a 9800 to a 9810. This is especially true if you insist on running 7.0. Double the processor speed and half again the screen resolution, while on the same exact battery = less life. Plain and simple. It's a great phone. Update it, and enjoy it.

[troshs]

Well, my point was since its the same battery, it might tell me whether my battery is bad or if its something else I'm doing. But I do enjoy the phone at all costs. I am wary of doing updates because I did it with my last phone and none of the updates worked out so well, they were all really buggy on my phone, and the phone was never the same again. Its actually the reason why I have a replacement Torch. Thanks, but no thanks on the update.

[Pete6]

Yes, but I bet you don't get bears in your yard like I do.

Well, there's ya problem. Bears are well known for causing signal losses especially if they eat the microcell, the phone or, the owner. Very bad rep., bears. Nasty hairy things .

What you are reportung is hard to quantify or replicate. You should not blame the 5 apps that run continually. This is a normal function of a multi-tasking OS (like Windows). Unless an app runs, how can it continually check emails, BBM or SMS messages. All phones have at least ONE job running. The instant you need two running, you actually need 3 because the third one does the switching between the other two. It's the waey all multi-tasking OSs run. The BklackBerry OS, like Windows has a task manager (this is a very good thing) so that you can see what is running. In your case, it is five jobs. I guess these are Home, Browser, Messages, BBM and Phone.

These are standard RIM apps and should not cause problems.

With all the above said, I too have had the ocassional inexplicable battery drain. I hate this. Unusual battery drain happens for two main reasons.

1). An app is using lots of CPU ticks and/or lots of network hits for feed downloads.

2). The carrier network is weak, inconsistent or has multi-pathing issues.

With only 5 RIM apps running this has to be the microcell. I did a Google search for "microcell causes battery drain" and got a page full of complaints about AT&T's microcell draining phone batteries of just about every phone type out there.

Why does this happen? The microcell is connected to your internet connection and therin lies the problem. Cell phones normally look for the network about twice a minute. This goes up enormously if the phone has a weak signal OR, as I suspect in your case, the microcell does not respond correctly.

There is a protocol between phones and cell and it basically goes:
Phone: Hi who are you, here I am.
Cell: Hi there, I am here, you have signal and traffic ability

The phone will also evaluate which tower (if there's more than one) is the closest and which has the strongest signal and which ones are bouncing off local buildings, bridges and whatnot. In you r case this is not happening much since the phone has a choice of one cell.

What I suspect is happening is the last part of the Cell dialog. The cell is not getting a good connection from your internet and it is telling your phone that something is wrong. This is a random and intermittent failure by the microcel to communicate with AT&T over the internet. Why does this happen? I don't know for sure but it would seem likely that AT&T and/or your internet provider may remove bits of hardware and software ar odd moments durin the day or night. Take the wrong bit out and YOU have a problem.

How can you check this? Not that easy unfortunately. At first glance it would seem that you could use any old AT&T cell phone running beside your phone and if both batteries drained then my theory is correct. However only your BlackBerry uses data and it may be just the dataplan part of the GSM service that is temporarily out of service.

I offer this as my own explanation. It is based on 40 years of being in electronics, telecom , IT and IT management. My personal corollary to Murphy's Law is that Murphy was a born optimist.

Good luck.

[Pete6]

Well, my point was since its the same battery, it might tell me whether my battery is bad or if its something else I'm doing. But I do enjoy the phone at all costs. I am wary of doing updates because I did it with my last phone and none of the updates worked out so well, they were all really buggy on my phone, and the phone was never the same again. Its actually the reason why I have a replacement Torch. Thanks, but no thanks on the update.

The 9810 has a faster processor than the 9800 so for sure it will chew through its battery more quickly.

OS 7.1 is a lot better than OS 7 for battery life. At least that has been my experience. I am running .391 which was officially released by Rogers, Canada. I am very happy with it.

My battery lasts the whole day and sometimes two but I don't use the phone very much and only have Berry Weather as an app that uses the web outside of my control. I also live in a high signal area.