1. mem0ryburn's Avatar
    Also, to the OP, I can't believe you gave the iPad the edge for the back camera o.O

    Regardless, I agree with everything else and find this to be a fantastic, honest, and unbiased review. Thanks for being objective!
    03-21-12 06:18 AM
  2. varunsain's Avatar
    There are also quantum processors
    Random stuff..

    You mean this claim?

    "Pardon me, but 4G/LTE is becoming the new standard around the globe. So you want Apple to wait when it's present in all countries?"
    And 80% of market share of GSM(3G) is just going to drop and give way to 4G/LTE to become the standard. And all before 2013? hmm..

    Are you sure you have to convert?
    iPad does not have native MKV support. Unless you consider AVPlayerHD or such Apps to be native support. To play MKV without any Apps.. Yes, MKV will have to be converted.

    There are also quantum processors Oh, and the small cold fusion reactors will take care of the battery drain anyway.
    Finally your mind is opening up to new possibilities. You're now thinking outside the box..

    Man, get real. No need to talk about non-existent technology as if it was present today.
    Umm.. Aren't talking about Retina based apps that aren't 'present'? weren't you talking about iPad3 when it wasn't present? Im seeing your trend on picking..

    Are you sure?
    Omg yes mother I am sure SAMOLED+ is cheaper than Retina.


    Oh man. You definitely don't know what market capitalization is. Hint: it is not a resource that a company can use to invest in production
    Who ever said it was? I just said Apple holds high budgets and financials ($500bn in brackets).. If you were smart then you would obviously understand I'm talking about market caps and not sales figures.. Bro no need to argue on everything..
    Last edited by varunsain; 03-21-12 at 06:57 AM.
    03-21-12 06:54 AM
  3. nimrodity's Avatar
    Also, to the OP, I can't believe you gave the iPad the edge for the back camera o.O

    Regardless, I agree with everything else and find this to be a fantastic, honest, and unbiased review. Thanks for being objective!
    i gave the ipads back camera the edge bacause of the way better pictures,in terms of videos the are pretty similar,but like mentioned,didnt use both that much
    03-21-12 08:11 AM
  4. Vindicators's Avatar
    I already read this document a while ago, beside the fact that it say nothing about RTOS, it actually said that microkernel OS must be directly optimized for the processor in order to get performance up to the level of monolithic kernel. And it is a different approaches, not a advanced technology.

    You still failed to point out what is wrong in my post, is WinCE not a RTOS or RTOS have some great advantage in general purpose computer that I don't know?
    Better start at something basic, right?

    What is a Real-Time Operating System (RTOS)? - Developer Zone - National Instruments
    Do I Need a Real-Time System? - Developer Zone - National Instruments
    Real-Time Systems - OSDev Wiki

    Then later you can do some research about the drawback of RTOS for general purpose computer, like context switch, low throughput, etc...

    So, like I said before, different systems for different purpose. Plus the fact that WinCE running on many PDA in a decade is a RTOS.
    Sorry to break your illusion, but nothing fancy or revolutionary about RTOS, it isn't even new in mobile space.
    Last edited by Vindicators; 03-21-12 at 08:48 AM.
    03-21-12 08:46 AM
  5. varunsain's Avatar
    Microkernel RTOS, in fact, do sacrifice performance and better fitted for single task embedded systems, thats why you don't see many general purpose computer use RTOS.
    Microkernel RTOS sacrifice performance? Please highlight some sacrifices. Single task embedded systems are known to use Microkernel RTOS for it's kernel structure, size, simplicity, cost and reliability. For their needs, only an RTOS system provides solution. In short, microkernels succeed when the task switching and intertask communication is fast, and fail when they are slow. As for reliability, alot of systems cannot do without a Microkernel RTOS. Systems such as space systems, aircraft navigation, funds transfer and market making, automated sales and service, etc.. can function only because of RTOS.

    You still failed to point out what is wrong in my post, is WinCE not a RTOS or RTOS have some great advantage in general purpose computer that I don't know? Better start at something basic, right?
    No relation between RTOS and general purpose computer. General purpose computers don't require RTOS. We are talking about Tablets and not general purpose computers so don't keep falling back to that point.. Tablets for different people can hold different uses such as car navigation system for some, stock and trade monitors, stock and sales management device.. So with the help of a Microkernel and RTOS your playbook can be transformed easilyto be made use of as a customized device and yet almost immediately fall back to its original state. With RTOS ensure reliability and dependability. Very soon the self operating cars you see can utilize a PlayBook to drive them around since only an RTOS system can cater to such kind of needs. Maybe operators can load a parallel single purpose 3rd party OS. I'm talking far fetched but that's the future and the reason to go with a Microkernel and RTOS. See playbook use in medical facilities. Playbook can be immediately transformed as a Monitoring device. Playbook can be self acting in medical situations, eg provide oxygen when pressure falls low, or allow insulin flow or provide shock if heart fails. Here again, only RTOS can cater to such needs. Boy you are sleeping in this real world. Because only with RTOS can brakes hit on time and auto-medical treatment can be provided to a patient because RTOS means to set a definite timeline for an action and give preference to important tasks. If your system was non-rtos in above example - your car would not be able to prioritize if it should turn or hit brake first. It would maybe even hit the brakes a second or 2 late since it does not have a definite execution time. So I don't know about the advantage of RTOS in general computer but in Tablet world RTOS and QNX have opened up a new market. People have started selling QNX Car2 systems, Law enforcement and Protection systems, Medical systems, etc. all on the PLAYBOOK!! Woohoo

    The fact that WinCE running on many PDA in a decade is a RTOS. Sorry to break your illusion, but nothing fancy or revolutionary about RTOS, it isn't even new in mobile space.
    Hmm.. Rev�o�lu�tion�ar�y : radically new or innovative; outside or beyond established procedure, principles, etc.: QNX Microkernel RTOS I think can fall under this dictionary meaning of revolutionary since it is 1. radically new and innovative.(RIM and QNX have together developed a new OS based on QNX Nuetrino RTOS system so its radically new; and innovative because QNX RTOS has been put to use as a Mobile computer by RIM) 2. It is breaking away from established procedures and principles. (breaking away from iFad)

    hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm today is a bad day but good learning.
    Last edited by varunsain; 03-21-12 at 10:30 AM.
    03-21-12 10:12 AM
  6. Vindicators's Avatar
    Microkernel performance.... in the very document you just posted, right?

    And based on what you just said, I think you don't even understand the important part of RTOS (hard real-time scheduling, priority deadline, response time,...)

    General purpose computers, like your tablet, run all sort of system services, keep multi network connection, play media in background, do graphic animation, game and office stuff, fancy GUI,... yes, it is a general purpose computer.

    For the last part, I already said that WinCE is a RTOS, is it that hard for you to accept reality? LOL
    03-21-12 11:03 AM
  7. varunsain's Avatar
    So atleast you agree RTOS has some importance.. I guess those important parts are what's required. We are on a consensus here?

    It is only Steve Jobs who said that the tablet was better than a personal computer (well sort of in a way at ipad1 launch) but now the world thinks that even the tablet is a general purpose computer.

    So even your new age radio is a general purpose computer.. Did you know that?

    Let's leave the tablet as a 'mobile computer'.

    But for argument sake I would like to refer to any pc or mac as a general computer and everything else has it's category..

    WinCE itself is developed for embedded systems and I posted earlier that embedded systems require RTOS.
    03-21-12 11:51 AM
  8. Vindicators's Avatar
    LOL, really?
    WinCE is a RTOS but it is not revolutionary because it is developed for embedded systems but QNX is revolutionary because it is developed for embedded systems, wait, what???

    So, I get it that you don't have any slightest idea about RTOS, context switch, throughput, priority, schedule,... in general, but love to talk about the revolutionary based on your illusion. And you don't even read (or understand) the link posted by yourself.
    It is not worth for me to continue this debate, sorry.
    Last edited by Vindicators; 03-21-12 at 12:28 PM.
    03-21-12 12:25 PM
  9. varunsain's Avatar
    Who said it wasn't revolutionary? It was.. but somehow revolutionary can just be a one time thing for you..

    QNX can be revolutionary for RIM in the simplest of terms let alone for consumers.

    Ofcourse I don't have detailed knowledge on RTOS.. Not an engineer.. but I love to talk about it since I know the kind of things that can be achieved by an RTOS system.

    The link simply states the performance of Monolithic kernel vs. Microkernel.. Because you stated that Monolithic are superior since general computers prefer using them..

    Your points have dissolved from many to none.. Ofcourse it's not worth for you to continue.
    03-21-12 12:37 PM
  10. Vindicators's Avatar
    Just start from something like WinCE is a RTOS since forever, nothing advanced about it. Microkernel RTOS, in fact, do sacrifice performance and better fitted for single task embedded systems, thats why you don't see many general purpose computer use RTOS.
    Completely wrong.
    Yes, some how WinCE indeed is a RTOS, and I provided the link about RTOS and the drawback of context switch and low throughput, and how it is better fitted for single task embedded systems, not your tablet with multi program, services, connection and GUI.

    oh, even your link said that microkernel OS (just microkernel, don't have anything regard to RTOS) must be directly optimized for the processor in order to get performance up to the level of monolithic kernel.

    Of course my points have dissolved, lol
    03-21-12 12:56 PM
  11. dagggg's Avatar
    Here’s my problem with your review. Although it reads very objectively, you appear to attribute the same weight to every element which in my view is its weakness. If we consider the PC and Mac debate of yesteryear, one point that Mac users would point to was how good Macs were at Photoshop and graphic design in general. Software developers have closed the gap and the diff is not so big. On the enterprise side, for the longest time PCs were the only option so the debate on semantics was almost pointless.

    My point is this, for a tablet or other mobile smart-device, Apps are everything. You can talk of camera resolution, processor speed, 4G connectivity, form factor and so forth but if there are no Apps then it’s a nice paperweight. This is this PB Achilles heel. Android and Apple are so far ahead that BB, Microsoft and the likes are constantly trying to catch up but it’s an uphill battle because it relies solely on developers to step up and develop and/or convert existing apps. I find there is a serious lack of productivity apps which I can easily find on my Android and iOS devices. I should mention that I own a PB, iPad 2 and G Note.

    I was underwhelmed by the OS2 update. It does all that it should have done back when it was launched but then it should have from the outset.

    I freelance so for the purpose of real-world testing, I’ve travelled with each device separately just to see which was best. In the end, for me it was the G Note hands down. iPad suffers from poor integration with my work tools, and its inability to do true multitask is a problem. The PB simply does not have enough tools and I also find it integrates poorly unless you use native apps ad even then I’m not a big FB or Twit user. It’s not a bad device but RIM failed from the outset and I like many have moved on. We gave them a shot and they blew it and I’m not here to be liked by them they should be pandering to me not expecting me to wait almost a year for basic functionalities.

    The review compared pricing by noting the quality of the build but value is far more than the sum of its parts. The PB has some enviable traits and the OS has some cool features, but WebOS and the Pre had that also and look where that got them. My sad prediction for the PB is a slow and ungraceful demise due almost exclusively to a poor selection of Apps and not for any other inherent weakness. It checks all the right boxes on features and specs. It always did.
    03-21-12 01:16 PM
  12. kennyliu's Avatar
    Random stuff..
    You are hilarious. If this is random, then you are the master of random things. "True software" and "i5/i7 tablet processors"

    And 80% of market share of GSM(3G) is just going to drop and give way to 4G/LTE to become the standard. And all before 2013? hmm..
    Don't remember saying anything about GSM dropping. And again 4G iPad supports 2G and 3G GSM unlike what you claimed. So your argument about Apple unwisely focusing on 4G is an absolute non-sense.

    iPad does not have native MKV support. Unless you consider AVPlayerHD or such Apps to be native support. To play MKV without any Apps.. Yes, MKV will have to be converted.
    No need to convert. I don't know how you see things but if there is a way to play a movie without many hours of conversion, people choose the easier way.

    Finally your mind is opening up to new possibilities. You're now thinking outside the box..
    Possibilities are endless, but we are talking about the new iPad in 2012 where there is no technology that is even close to i5/i7 tablet processors. Mind you that Intel is also sitting on a pile of cash that is quite comparable to that of Apple's and as you know Intel specialized on chips, unlike Apple. So even Intel couldn't come up with anything close to i5/i7 tablet processor (whatever that may mean) and is trying hard to compete with underpowered (by desktop processors' standards) ARM and the only thing that they could come up is Medfield. Here is another fail in your argument that Apple, being a non-chip-maker could develop a revolutionary "i5/i7 tablet processor' just because it has resources.

    Umm.. Aren't talking about Retina based apps that aren't 'present'? weren't you talking about iPad3 when it wasn't present? Im seeing your trend on picking..
    Retina-based app?. This is something new.

    Also no need to twist things. Everybody knew the iPad 3 was coming. But the only person who seems to know i5/i7 tablet processor could be coming in 2012 was you.


    Omg yes mother I am sure SAMOLED+ is cheaper than Retina.
    Of course you are. We know how fact-based your arguments are

    Who ever said it was? I just said Apple holds high budgets and financials ($500bn in brackets).. If you were smart then you would obviously understand I'm talking about market caps and not sales figures.. Bro no need to argue on everything..
    OK, let me try it again. Market capitalization is not, I repeat, is NOT something that a company holds or owns. It is definitely not "monetary budgets and financials that Apple holds" that can be used for R&D or production investment.

    Furthermore, I don't remember that I ever said anything about sales revenues. So you may want to look up the definition for "assets" as well. They are not sales.
    Last edited by kennyliu; 03-21-12 at 01:26 PM.
    03-21-12 01:23 PM
  13. varunsain's Avatar
    Yes, some how WinCE indeed is a RTOS, and I provided the link about RTOS and the drawback of context switch and low throughput, and how it is better fitted for single task embedded systems, not your tablet with multi program, services, connection and GUI.
    I pointed out wrong on this.. It is clearly showcased on the RIM PlayBook that RTOS and Microkernel can provide enhanced multi-tasking capabilities and also embedded OS functions which can enable device to be used as single-purpose tabs. So I don't understand why you say there is a performance drawback and this kind of system is not suited for Tablets. Please explain in detail rather than make general statements.

    oh, even your link said that microkernel OS (just microkernel, don't have anything regard to RTOS) must be directly optimized for the processor in order to get performance up to the level of monolithic kernel.
    And so the kernel on the PlayBook is optimized directly for the processor and provides the performance. It's right that this needs to be done to bring it up to the performance of a monolithic.. But that's half information. Once the kernel is optimized, it provides additional functions like multi-tasking, etc. which the monolithic kernel cannot match.

    Of course my points have dissolved, lol
    Read up a little more in detail rather than rushing into an argument.
    EricB1968 likes this.
    03-21-12 11:41 PM
  14. varunsain's Avatar
    You are hilarious. If this is random, then you are the master of random things. "True software" and "i5/i7 tablet processors"
    Quantum processor (irrelevant here) vs. True software and i5/i7 Tablet processor..

    So let's see what's random in this dicussion. We were discussing about OS/Processors and Kernels being able to run embedded programs which would take advantage of the build structure.

    Difference Between Software and Application | Difference Between | Software vs Application - Take this website for example.

    'True software' would refer to 'Software' in this article and 'Software' would be referring to 'Applications'.

    i5/i7 Tablet Processors... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrandale_(microprocessor) - Arrandale is the code name for a mobile Intel processor[clarification needed], sold as mobile Intel Core i3, i5 and i7... I'm sorry - I should have referred to i5/i7 Tablet processors as i5/i7 Mobile Intel processor.

    i5/i7 Tablet processor doesn't seem so mythical after all right? Please explain how is it mythical, random, false, misinformation, sci-fi jabber, etc.? ASUS Eee Slate Tablet EP121-1A011M is already using Intel i5 tablet processor. Hmmmmmmm the horror.

    How is Quantum processor relevant in this discussion?


    Don't remember saying anything about GSM dropping. And again 4G iPad supports 2G and 3G GSM unlike what you claimed. So your argument about Apple unwisely focusing on 4G is an absolute non-sense.
    You said that 4G is becoming the standard which I clearly denied (since we were talking about year 2012). It might become the standard in mobile communication but by maybe the year 2015. Until then GSM is the definite standard. My argument here was that iPad could hold off their 4G support until next year launch (when 4G gains momentum) and focus on other priority issues on the iPad (since iPad2 already has 2G & 3G support). As of now, 4G/LTE is also a major factor in battery drain & overheating on the new iPad.

    No need to convert. I don't know how you see things but if there is a way to play a movie without many hours of conversion, people choose the easier way.
    We are talking about native support. You cannot base your argument on 3rd Party software. MKV is NOT natively supported by iPad or Apple. End of discussion. It does talk much about a product when you have to spend $599 and yet rely on cheap 3rd Party software.

    Possibilities are endless, but we are talking about the new iPad in 2012 where there is no technology that is even close to i5/i7 tablet processors. Mind you that Intel is also sitting on a pile of cash that is quite comparable to that of Apple's and as you know Intel specialized on chips, unlike Apple. So even Intel couldn't come up with anything close to i5/i7 tablet processor (whatever that may mean) and is trying hard to compete with underpowered (by desktop processors' standards) ARM and the only thing that they could come up is Medfield. Here is another fail in your argument that Apple, being a non-chip-maker could develop a revolutionary "i5/i7 tablet processor' just because it has resources.
    Yawn.. What do you call this? FUD? I don't believe in that though.. Again. i5/i7 Tablet Processors... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arrandale_(microprocessor) - Arrandale is the code name for a mobile Intel processor, sold as mobile Intel Core i3, i5 and i7... I'm sorry - I should have referred to i5/i7 Tablet processors as i5/i7 Mobile Intel processor. ASUS Eee Slate Tablet EP121-1A011M is already using the i5 Mobile Intel processor which I mistakenly called i5 Tablet processor.

    Retina-based app?. This is something new.
    It is new for you since I believe you have never seen or used the iPad3. There is a special category / section in App store for Retina-Apps which has only around 60 Apps as of now.

    Also no need to twist things. Everybody knew the iPad 3 was coming. But the only person who seems to know i5/i7 tablet processor could be coming in 2012 was you.
    I don't expect everyone to know about the i5/i7 tablet processor since iPad3 seems to be of much greater importance.

    Of course you are. We know how fact-based your arguments are
    Again, SAMOLED+ is cheaper than Retina.

    OK, let me try it again. Market capitalization is not, I repeat, is NOT something that a company holds or owns. It is definitely not "monetary budgets and financials that Apple holds" that can be used for R&D or production investment.
    I'm sorry for trying to refer to 2 points collectively. 1. Monetary budgets (condition) and Financials of Apple. 2. $500bn Market Cap.

    Furthermore, I don't remember that I ever said anything about sales revenues. So you may want to look up the definition for "assets" as well. They are not sales.
    You mentioned 120-150$ bn so I assumed you were talking about 'Apple had $127.8 billion in sales during the 2011 calendar year' .. Next time you can be a bit more specific on the figure as I don't understand how Assets, Revenues or any financials can be quoted as a range?

    And furthermore, market capitalization is based on a market estimate of a company's value, based on perceived future prospects, economic and monetary conditions. So mentioning market cap can be of more interest rather than sales revenue or assets.


    Ps. I don't get into much arguments or debates on forums, but I've noticed you ruining every justified RIM/PlayBook thread by misleading people in here so I did not want to let it go this time.
    Last edited by varunsain; 03-22-12 at 01:15 AM.
    EricB1968 likes this.
    03-22-12 12:21 AM
  15. kennyliu's Avatar
    Quantum processor (irrelevant here) vs. True software and i5/i7 Tablet processor..

    So let's see what's random in this dicussion. We were discussing about OS/Processors and Kernels being able to run embedded programs which would take advantage of the build structure.

    Difference Between Software and Application | Difference Between | Software vs Application - Take this website for example.

    'True software' would refer to 'Software' in this article and 'Software' would be referring to 'Applications'.

    OK, I don't really know what prevails in your comments. Ignorance or you being so relentless.

    Anyway, there are no such things as "true software". That's a term that you just made up. And, please, reread your linked article. The four criteria listed do not support how you described a 'true software' in any way.

    i5/i7 Tablet Processors... Arrandale - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia - Arrandale is the code name for a mobile Intel processor[clarification needed], sold as mobile Intel Core i3, i5 and i7... I'm sorry - I should have referred to i5/i7 Tablet processors as i5/i7 Mobile Intel processor.

    i5/i7 Tablet processor doesn't seem so mythical after all right? Please explain how is it mythical, random, false, misinformation, sci-fi jabber, etc.? ASUS Eee Slate Tablet EP121-1A011M is already using Intel i5 tablet processor. Hmmmmmmm the horror.
    There is no such thing as a i5/i7 tablet processor. There is no such thing as a i5/i7 tablet processor. There is no such thing as a i5/i7 tablet processor. There is no such thing as a i5/i7 tablet processor. Enough?

    It's another term made up by you.

    Now go to the Arandale description and take a look at the TDPs. How on earth are you going to get 20+ hours with that?

    Go to the Asus Slate Tablet specs. Here is a link for you:

    Newegg.com - ASUS Eee Pad (Eee Slate) EP121-1A011M Tablet PC Intel Core i5 470UM(1.33GHz) 12.1" Wide SVGA 2GB Memory DDR3 1333 32GB SSD HDD Intel HD Graphics

    See what the battery life is? 3 hours. That's with a 34 W/h battery, which is only 20-25% less than the one on the new iPad.

    20+? Really? You must be a time traveler form 2020.

    How is Quantum processor relevant in this discussion?
    It is as relevant as a non-existent i5/i7 tablet processor that gets you 20+ hours.


    You said that 4G is becoming the standard which I clearly denied (since we were talking about year 2012). It might become the standard in mobile communication but by maybe the year 2015. Until then GSM is the definite standard. My argument here was that iPad could hold off their 4G support until next year launch (when 4G gains momentum) and focus on other priority issues on the iPad (since iPad2 already has 2G & 3G support). As of now, 4G/LTE is also a major factor in battery drain & overheating on the new iPad.
    LTE is becoming standard. I don't know how to rephrase this in any other way, but it is. Especially, in countries where Apple has the most sales in. For other countries, there is 3g/2g.

    See the bolded text above. That's not what your argument was. You just realized that you were wrong by saying iPad should have 2G/3G instead of 4G, whereas it has all three.

    We are talking about native support. You cannot base your argument on 3rd Party software. MKV is NOT natively supported by iPad or Apple. End of discussion. It does talk much about a product when you have to spend $599 and yet rely on cheap 3rd Party software.
    Define native? I download native apps off of the App World. Or am I downloading cheap 3d party software? False software?

    Yawn.. What do you call this? FUD? I don't believe in that though.. Again. i5/i7 Tablet Processors... Arrandale - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia - Arrandale is the code name for a mobile Intel processor, sold as mobile Intel Core i3, i5 and i7... I'm sorry - I should have referred to i5/i7 Tablet processors as i5/i7 Mobile Intel processor. ASUS Eee Slate Tablet EP121-1A011M is already using the i5 Mobile Intel processor which I mistakenly called i5 Tablet processor.
    See above. There is no such thing as an i5/i7 tablet processor that can run the iPad (even with the old screen) for 20+ hours. Sci-Fi at this stage.


    It is new for you since I believe you have never seen or used the iPad3. There is a special category / section in App store for Retina-Apps which has only around 60 Apps as of now.
    Facepalm. Are they called "Retina-based"?

    Again, SAMOLED+ is cheaper than Retina.
    Yeah, you wish.

    'm sorry for trying to refer to 2 points collectively. 1. Monetary budgets (condition) and Financials of Apple. 2. $500bn Market Cap.
    Another FACEPALM. So you were referring to two different things? Or you simply didn't know. Maybe I should quote you saying that I have to read more? Or will you find that embarrassing remark yourself?

    Btw, what is "monetary budgets"? "Financials"?


    'You mentioned 120-150$ bn so I assumed you were talking about 'Apple had $127.8 billion in sales during the 2011 calendar year' .. Next time you can be a bit more specific on the figure as I don't understand how Assets, Revenues or any financials can be quoted as a range?
    It's OK to acknowledge you don't know shayt. Instead of trying to find an excuse and saying people misinterpreted you. It's good all you've said is documented, and people can decide for themselves.

    And furthermore, market capitalization is based on a market estimate of a company's value, based on perceived future prospects, economic and monetary conditions. So mentioning market cap can be of more interest rather than sales revenue or assets.
    Absolutely not. It cannot be of more interest when what you said was they can use that market cap that they "hold" (hint: they don't hold it) to invest in development of a mythical i5 tablet processor.


    Ps. I don't get into much arguments or debates on forums, but I've noticed you ruining every justified RIM/PlayBook thread by misleading people in here so I did not want to let it go this time.
    Examples?

    I can give you an example:

    Playbook "Javascript Browser" Beats iPad because the PB scores higher on Sunspider

    ROFL


    Edit: Don't bother responding. As the above shows you really don't know what you are talking about. Don't cause more harm.
    Last edited by kennyliu; 03-22-12 at 02:21 AM.
    03-22-12 01:43 AM
  16. Bla1ze's Avatar
    You all keep reporting each others posts, if it's that big of an issue.. stfu and move on. I'm not killing any of your posts, you're the ones sitting here arguing with yourselves and are too stubborn to walk away from each other. If you can't manage to do that, then stop wasting my and the rest of the mod teams time by reporting each other.
    03-22-12 02:04 AM
  17. kennyliu's Avatar
    You all keep reporting each others posts, if it's that big of an issue.. stfu and move on. I'm not killing any of your posts, you're the ones sitting here arguing with yourselves and are too stubborn to walk away from each other. If you can't manage to do that, then stop wasting my and the rest of the mod teams time by reporting each other.
    Thanks Bla1ze. I sometimes forget the priceless advice offered by the proverb about arguing with certain people who will eventually beat you with their experience.

    I am out of this.
    Last edited by kennyliu; 03-22-12 at 02:30 AM.
    03-22-12 02:25 AM
  18. varunsain's Avatar
    kennyliu I don't even know what I can quote from your last post. I'm still trying to make sense out of it..

    You're going on arguing with stuff like when I say 'there's water in the glass..' you come back with a response like 'non-sense.. there's NO water in the glass.. there's just 30 ml of clear liquid in there..'

    Asus is using an i5 processor on its tablet which I have been trying to convey since the very beginning.. and now that you understand that - you're bringing battery life into issue. Don't you think Apple is better capable of providing improved battery life than Asus?

    Ofcourse there is no official term as 'True Software' but I think I clearly explained the meaning of it earlier.. I don't know why you going crazy over this like you have never heard people make up a term for something that doesn't have an official name?

    Same with i5 Tablet processor - You can keep repeating that i5 Tablet processor does not exist.. but it does not change the fact that 1. Intel has a modified version of it's desktop i5 processor for use in tablets. 2. Asus is using i5 tablet processor which is a stripped down version of the i5 desktop processor and called i5 mobile processor. So technically even your tablet is a mobile computer but you call it a tablet computer right?

    Sure it might not be called i5 'Tablet' processor but it's definitely an i5 Mobile processor which is being used on a tablet.. Something like Retina display is not actually like your 'Retina' but it's called so because it's the closest right..

    i5 Tablet processor/120gb storage/+20 hours battery life/ Minus(-) Retina display /4G /Quad graphics.. It was a suggestion brother.. You wanna pick dirt on this?

    'You say, LTE is becoming standard atleast in the markets where Apple has most sales in' .. China which is second largest market for Apple (and was to be considered as the largest) has to wait on LTE for next 2-3 years. Europe, Asia also have no LTE availability. Coming back to my point, 4G is only readily available is US and Canada.. So I suggested that iPad should have retained its 2G/3G status and provided some other feature rather than 4G.

    And don't hold a stupid argument. It's obvious that any successor provides legacy support.

    Retina-Based apps - Again, arguments with you are very repetitive. They might not be called 'Retina-based' apps but they are surely called 'Retina-Ready' apps all over the internet. Refer to my water example stated in the beginning. And I have to correct myself - there are NOT 60 but infact only 24 apps in this category.

    Some personal grudges in the middle to which I don't have any remarks and they are pretty much expected..

    And the Sunspider score was from one of the initial new iPad test results which marked the iPad at 2300ms and the PB at 2240.. Test results might have been off.. and can change overtime.. like PB browser would lead in HTML5 score but now Opera takes first place.. That was a light-hearted post since that day was a mad pb vs. ipad day on all threads.. so it was with some sarcasm.. but you had to troll on that too.. anyways

    don't think you have anything left to share since you've shouted out everything that came to your mind..
    03-22-12 03:24 AM
  19. Vindicators's Avatar
    I pointed out wrong on this.. It is clearly showcased on the RIM PlayBook that RTOS and Microkernel can provide enhanced multi-tasking capabilities and also embedded OS functions which can enable device to be used as single-purpose tabs. So I don't understand why you say there is a performance drawback and this kind of system is not suited for Tablets. Please explain in detail rather than make general statements.



    And so the kernel on the PlayBook is optimized directly for the processor and provides the performance. It's right that this needs to be done to bring it up to the performance of a monolithic.. But that's half information. Once the kernel is optimized, it provides additional functions like multi-tasking, etc. which the monolithic kernel cannot match.



    Read up a little more in detail rather than rushing into an argument.
    LOL, you are talking about a kernel, because it have revolutionary technologies and RTOS and blah blah. I just pointed out that RTOS already used in mobile device from a decade ago and microkernel RTOS is a different approach not a advanced technology.
    Did you even read anything at all?

    The PlaybookOS or iOS, Android are a different story, because it is consumer OS with software stack, touch interface and GUI build on top of those QNX, Mach/XNU, Linux kernels. It is not likely Android running in a supercomputer, PlaybookOS powered a nuclear power plant or something need hard realtime schedule, low latency,.....


    And what exactly are the things you called "enhanced multi-tasking capabilities" and "additional functions the monolithic kernel cannot match"???

    It is not "clearly showcased" because the way I see, the multitasking model in the Playbook is exactly like my WM 5 phone from years ago, they keep all apps running with fully UI render in background, oh, and with WM 5 you can even have overlay windows and app hooked up to another app, is this what you called "enhanced" lol
    BTW, googled Nokia N900, it's also have enhanced multi-tasking capabilities =)

    Sorry but the world moves on, they realize that with the current state of mobileOS which is a single window, single application model, you can't see another program in backgroud. There is no point to waste resource render UI in background, so they switch to background service multitasking model.


    To sum it up, that "enhanced multi-tasking capabilities" is a design decision's model, nothing to do with a kernel, and it is not even new, in fact it is too old that most of other mobile OS shifted to another model.


    Oh, and BTW, that retina-ready category you said, it is apps promoted by Apple. Nothing to do with the number of retina-ready apps, that thing updated day by day. I can counted at least over 100 apps are retina-ready in AppStore, and that is just from their top paid/top free categories. Get your fact straight =)

    About the benchmark score, no, it is not change overtime, it change by software update. And in fact, from iOS4 and PBOS1 to iOS5 and PBOS2, javascript performance of iOS always superior than PBOS, and browsermark score always almost double PBOS score.

    Don't spin it, just stick with your illusion about those i5 processer and 'True Software' =))
    Last edited by Vindicators; 03-22-12 at 04:07 AM.
    03-22-12 03:58 AM
  20. nimrodity's Avatar
    I really don't understand how this thread could get so much off the rails.
    This whole rant has nothing to do with my original post.
    PLZ people put yourself together and take this somewhere else
    03-22-12 04:09 AM
  21. varunsain's Avatar
    Just goin round n round
    03-22-12 04:47 AM
  22. LeKeiser's Avatar
    I say : buy the tablet you like and want and be happy with it...
    03-22-12 07:30 AM
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