1. cbvinh's Avatar
    That's assuming Apple or Samsung doesn't undercut any pricing that BlackBerry Mobile comes in with. Those two can afford to take a loss on devices to maintain or gain marketshare at the expense of a competitor. It wouldn't be the first or last time that it's been done.

    BlackBerry Mobile (TCL) can't take a loss on this device. If they do, then that would contradict the argument of them pricing it as low as they could. We know Apple and Samsung have way deeper pockets to be able to take loss leaders just to get their hands on other things like iPads or anything else they can sell to the client.

    Losing $10 Million to kill off a competitor is a good strategy if it results in one less competitor in your space. Especially if your revenues are topping $40 Billion/quarter.
    It's doubtful that either Apple or Samsung would choose to loose money any time soon to eliminate BlackBerry Mobile. T-Mobile has been snipping at Verizon and AT&T's heels for years and they're both finally reacting. BlackBerry Mobile would have to do quite well before there's any undercutting.

    As for the price being as low as it could be, it probably isn't. BlackBerry Mobile probably built in a buffer to account for the expected steady price decrease over the life of sales. Further, if sales aren't as robust as it could be, they could always drop the price a bit and move more units. If they start out low and sales aren't robust, they immediately move into losses.

    Low initial sales may not be caused by pricing. Maybe advertising wasn't enough. Perhaps there was another phone announced/released at the same time that stole the limelight. Perhaps they couldn't get the phones into carriers so that people can finance the phones; meanwhile, the next iPhone's and Samsung's are advertised at $100-$200 walk-out-the-door-price, even though the true cost is tacked onto the monthly bill. At least with a bit higher initial pricing, they could announce a short special pricing period, or just drop the price, and regain momentum after interest in the other phones have waned.
    03-01-17 04:50 AM
  2. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    You have no idea what their licensing agreement says. It could be 100 pages and give BlackBerry all sorts of veto rights or outright decisions to make.

    Why do Chen/BlackBerry defenders always act like they know things and try to bully people when really they are just speculating?

    Posted via CB10
    I'm not "defending (Chen's) BlackBerry", in this case, probably the opposite.
    I'm stating that the DTEK50 "let's go curve" strategy (I formerly applauded) didn't work as expected and was the consequence of Chen's study/statement evaluating the good sale price in the $400's. Consequently, one may think the TCL - aka BlackBerry Mobile - strategy may very well nor prioritize it.

    You're right I have no access to the agreement. Still I was there at launch an discussed (or listened other discussing) with TCL team, at various levels. I also mention the fact that J.C didn't even sent a welcome/congrats tweet and I believe this alone tells a bit about "who decides what". Call this "speculation" if you want, I'd rather call it "feeling" or "deduction" but anyhow, take my $0.02 for what they worth !

    And if you felt brutality in my answer, sorry; that's unfortunate, there was none (may be due to my unconventional English ?).
    Last edited by Superfly_FR; 03-01-17 at 05:24 AM.
    03-01-17 05:01 AM
  3. gallopiton's Avatar
    Well, it is what it is... I would have preferred $499 but I guess it wasn't possible... there is one spec I don't like for that price, and that's the amount of RAM... 4 GB would have been better for Android... not sure if with the chipset 625 this isn't possible, but assuming it is then I would have felt more comfortable paying the $549 with a midrange SoC but with a nice RAM plus a great physical kb... just my two cents...
    03-01-17 05:54 AM
  4. ummie4's Avatar
    Without the blackberry branding this is a $499 phone. Remember TCL is paying BlackBerry a royalty probably between 7-10 percent, which is where the price comes from
    03-01-17 06:05 AM
  5. CranksterBB10's Avatar
    BlackBerry KEYone vs OnePlus 3T - Phone specs comparison

    One Plus 3T with 6gb ram and 128gb is $650 canadian. if KeyOne is a penny more how is it justified?

    I fully agree that the keyboard is a great feature, and right now it is the ONLY reason I havent bought a 3T. But if OnePlus can get 6gb and all the other features it has for $650 I dont see the possible $750ish price of the KeyOne
    Don't forget the snapdragon 821 processor! My z30's performance was slowing down. It was time to switch. My wife went with the dtek60, I decided to go with the oneplus 3t . The dtek60 60 is experiencing slowness and lately starts freezing for a few seconds. The oneplus 3t is a tank. I tried waiting for the mercury/ keyone or BlackBerry's next phone but unfortunately they were taking way too long and decided to make the leap for the first time in 8 years do a different manufacturer.

    For me, I can't justify paying between $700-$750 CDN for a midrange phone when others are putting out phones with updated hardware. I was looking forward to the keyone and eager to use a pkb. The phone looks great. The keyboard looks amazing and the form factor is perfect but unfortunately I can't justify the price. I'm sure the Keyone will be a great phone but unfortunately it won't see much success priced at what it currently is.
    03-01-17 06:36 AM
  6. ToniCipriani's Avatar
    Without the blackberry branding this is a $499 phone. Remember TCL is paying BlackBerry a royalty probably between 7-10 percent, which is where the price comes from
    That may be what BlackBerry is charging, but the market isn't buying it. Precisely 99.951875% of the market.
    03-01-17 07:40 AM
  7. ummie4's Avatar
    No doubt Toni. But I think most people are over looking the fact that unlike all the previous BB phones where only BlackBerry needed to make money off the sale, now its TCL and BlackBerry trying to make money. That's why the price is probably a little higher than what most were expecting.
    03-01-17 09:15 AM
  8. ToniCipriani's Avatar
    No doubt Toni. But I think most people are over looking the fact that unlike all the previous BB phones where only BlackBerry needed to make money off the sale, now its TCL and BlackBerry trying to make money. That's why the price is probably a little higher than what most were expecting.
    Not the point. Point being job one for them is to fix the brand first, before you can even think about trying to make money.
    Superfly_FR likes this.
    03-01-17 09:23 AM
  9. cbvinh's Avatar
    Not the point. Point being job one for them is to fix the brand first, before you can even think about trying to make money.
    What's going to work better for BlackBerry Mobile, paying for traditional advertising or selling the KEYone cheaper and let word of mouth take care of advertising? I would venture to say traditional advertising would be better at this point, as it would reach more people than the number of people buying the KEYone, even at a discounted price. The main reason is that availability will be limited compared to other brands and people probably won't risk spending $449-$499 on a device unseen in person.
    03-01-17 03:50 PM
  10. Dillon Sandhu's Avatar
    Hoping for a $600 CDN price range.
    Maybe carriers will sell for less
    03-01-17 04:05 PM
  11. BB-JAM215's Avatar
    Maybe carriers will sell for less
    The full cost paid through a carrier plan is almost always equal to or more than the current retail price.
    03-01-17 04:44 PM
  12. Dillon Sandhu's Avatar
    The full cost paid through a carrier plan is almost always equal to or more than the current retail price.
    Oh I thought sometimes they have a discount or credit off or even a trade in phone system.
    03-01-17 05:00 PM
  13. Pinot2015's Avatar
    Are we are still comparing an Android PKB phone to Touch only phones?

    You can't, you either want PKB or Touch only. If you want touch only then compare away. If you want PKB with Android OS how many choices do you have?
    Comparing KEYone to full touch phones is completely ridiculous.
    anon(10101748) likes this.
    03-01-17 05:23 PM
  14. BB-JAM215's Avatar
    Oh I thought sometimes they have a discount or credit off or even a trade in phone system.
    Once you're locked in a carrier plan they want you to believe they are giving you credits, "loyalty" rewards or discounts, but invariably it's your money they're using to do that.
    03-01-17 05:29 PM
  15. ToniCipriani's Avatar
    What's going to work better for BlackBerry Mobile, paying for traditional advertising or selling the KEYone cheaper and let word of mouth take care of advertising? I would venture to say traditional advertising would be better at this point, as it would reach more people than the number of people buying the KEYone, even at a discounted price. The main reason is that availability will be limited compared to other brands and people probably won't risk spending $449-$499 on a device unseen in person.
    Yes, because word of mouth worked so well for them for BB10. Their fans are among the vocal ones, I mean that's how this site is still around...
    Superfly_FR likes this.
    03-01-17 05:46 PM
  16. JDSharpe00's Avatar
    I'm not worried about the KEYone costing $550. People always pay for what they want. —I'm worried about how:

    1. TCL will convince the average Android consumer that their next upgrade should be a BlackBerry/how do you convince a Galaxy owner that there next phone should be a BlackBerry?
    2. How will TCL convince Police, Government, and Education that Android w/ BlackBerry is must have in order to be protected at the highest level?

    My answer;
    I think TCL will need to focus solely on marketing the PKB and Security to both the consumer and business markets. TCL has to take advantage of the cyber security conversation/scare that is happening everywhere. And play up the Social element of things with how much easier it is to communicate using a PKB. That's all the KEYone has going for is vs other Androids anyways.

    If TCL is smart they'll tap into the "creative class" (i.e. Painters, Writers, Musicians, Photographers, Designers, etc.). People always follow the artist. They set the trends. TCL will do this via Infuncer Marketing and forming strategic partnerships with music festivals, popular stores, fashion designers, and art events.

    Influencer Marketing can make or break the success of the KEYone.

    FYI: A PKB is a really important feature. A feature that has been overshadowed/forgotten by touch keyboard over the last decade. A feature that BlackBerry does best. The use of Social Media, Instant Messaging, and E-Mail has more than tripled over since the height of BlackBerry in 2008. People do indeed type messages way more these days. So is a PKB being a powerful selling point very farfetched?
    krazyatom likes this.
    03-01-17 06:00 PM
  17. WT44's Avatar
    But that's the whole point! The pkb!
    Which is different but all the market evidence tells us is not a differentiation (something people will pay for).

    At £500 in the UK, it's DOA.
    Agreed, but only the absolute keyboard die-hards will even give it a go at this price. They would have had a much bigger market if it priced in much closer to the Z Play without a $150 keyboard "premium", but sadly this will be a super niche device at this price and clearly will not be the resurgence of the Blackberry brand.
    I currently use a Priv.
    For me it's not +$150 extra for the Keyboard that I'm paying, to me it's also the Google Pixel cam + 8MP selfie cam which is worth paying the extra dough. I love photography (i.e. shooting with smartphone cams*), and the better cam + better keyboard & it always being present + crappy PRIV GPS makes it worthwhile for me to upgrade in April. *Yea, I'm aware of the iPhone and the Galaxy prolly having a better cam and/or cam (post processing) software, but aside from the fact I will never buy a 800-1000 bucks phone anymore, PKB is a must for me. Regardless, the K1 is overpriced, spec wise, but so was the Priv. I don't think I want to wait for like X-mas for it to be on sale (if it ever happens). Those three mentioned reasons "force" me to buy on the day of the release.:=)
    Last edited by WT44; 03-04-17 at 07:38 AM.
    Superfly_FR and krazyatom like this.
    03-01-17 06:01 PM
  18. anon(10101748)'s Avatar
    I'm not worried about the KEYone costing $550. People always pay for what they want. —I'm worried about how:

    2. How will TCL convince Police, Government, and Education that Android w/ BlackBerry is must have in order to be protected at the highest level?
    Don't worry. It's simple. I'm part of a 13,000 person workforce. We all moved from Bolds to a choice of iPhone 5 or Galaxy S5 years ago. We are are all on a cycle or get a replacement if broken. The current issued phones are or a 6s or S6. If there's a break or replacement needed it's 7 or S7. The price point alone to shift our workforce to KEYone's over the next year will save the agency between 1.5 and 3.0 million USD. It's not difficult to believe in a world of locked down Enterprise with strong MDM systems the KEYone will fair way better than the PRIV, DTTEK50, or DTEK60.
    Superfly_FR likes this.
    03-01-17 10:02 PM
  19. keypad's Avatar
    Are we are still comparing an Android PKB phone to Touch only phones?

    You can't, you either want PKB or Touch only. If you want touch only then compare away. If you want PKB with Android OS how many choices do you have?
    Comparing KEYone to full touch phones is completely ridiculous.
    You make a good point.

    But BlackBerry Mobile is not even remotely in the position to justify its monopoly position on physical qwerty keypads.

    If I make the only burgers in town and they are great, I can change people what the hell I want for them.

    But if my burgers are overpriced C#ap, then my customers are well within their rights to go and purchase food from Peatys Perfect Pizzas or Charlie's Chunky Chicken shop.
    03-02-17 06:22 AM
  20. Pinot2015's Avatar
    You make a good point.

    But BlackBerry Mobile is not even remotely in the position to justify its monopoly position on physical qwerty keypads.

    If I make the only burgers in town and they are great, I can change people what the hell I want for them.

    But if my burgers are overpriced C#ap, then my customers are well within their rights to go and purchase food from Peatys Perfect Pizzas or Charlie's Chunky Chicken shop.
    Fair but not really because the Android software is the same on on phones if not best on BlackBerry phones. So we would be talking about the bun only or special sauce in this case. Some like it , some don't. The ones that do will pay a little extra for it.
    The KEYone is only priced mid range. So saying overpriced would be a stretch considering cost of Pixel, iPhone 7 and S7.
    All things equal with software which is most important then it becomes a "beauty (and speed) is in the eye of the beholder"
    Superfly_FR likes this.
    03-02-17 06:47 AM
  21. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    Not the point. Point being job one for them is to fix the brand first, before you can even think about trying to make money.
    Target #1 is clear at least for this year : current BlackBerry customers.
    A significant penetration here would be considered as a success, as per their [BlackBerry Mobile] words.
    P.S: Don't use the current (sales) market shares, it'll be erroneous; the user base is in the 27Million worldwide.

    From what I understood, the parallel goal is to reposition the (devices) brand (can't count the number of "Iconic" they've pronounced) to its highest levels in terms of perception. But this does not mean only "high range"; more likely the "quality balanced" based on trust, durability and specificity (here, PKB).
    03-02-17 07:09 AM
  22. Superfly_FR's Avatar
    crappy PRIV GPS
    [OT alert !]
    Must admit I noticed that too (after a SW update, months ago), thought I was alone ... apparently not.
    03-02-17 07:13 AM
  23. keypad's Avatar
    Fair but not really because the Android software is the same on on phones if not best on BlackBerry phones. So we would be talking about the bun only or special sauce in this case. Some like it , some don't. The ones that do will pay a little extra for it.
    The KEYone is only priced mid range. So saying overpriced would be a stretch considering cost of Pixel, iPhone 7 and S7.
    All things equal with software which is most important then it becomes a "beauty (and speed) is in the eye of the beholder"
    Are you seriously considering the KEYone a "Mid range" handset in 2017?

    The very fact that you put it up against the Pixle, S7/8 and iPhones in price comparison range, creates your first and biggest problem.

    I'm my opinion, a "midrange" handset in 2017 would cost around the £400/ 450 USD price mark, not £499/ 549 USD mark.

    £400 is still at the higher end of the Mid range mark and to me, a true midrange handset would cost me £299 or about 349 USD.

    Well, lets see how this pricing strategy for the KEYone plays out for BlackBerry Mobile.

    The majority of technology reviews are saying, PRICE! PRICE! PRICE!

    While BlackBerry Mobile are saying, enterPRICE! ENTERprice! ENTERPRICE!
    03-02-17 07:35 AM
  24. conite's Avatar
    Are you seriously considering the KEYone a "Mid range" handset in 2017?

    The very fact that you put it up against the Pixle, S7/8 and iPhones in price comparison range, creates your first and biggest problem.

    I'm my opinion, a "midrange" handset in 2017 would cost around the £400/ 450 USD price mark, not £499/ 549 USD mark.

    £400 is still at the higher end of the Mid range mark and to me, a true midrange handset would cost me £299 or about 349 USD.

    Well, lets see how this pricing strategy for the KEYone plays out for BlackBerry Mobile.

    The majority of technology reviews are saying, PRICE! PRICE! PRICE!

    While BlackBerry Mobile are saying, enterPRICE! ENTERprice! ENTERPRICE!
    If it truly costs $549 for a low-cost manufacturer to put out a pkb device, no other arguments matter. It simply is what it is.
    03-02-17 07:52 AM
  25. keypad's Avatar
    If it truly costs $549 for a low-cost manufacturer to put out a pkb device, no other arguments matter. It simply is what it is.
    You are absolutely correct.

    My suggestion would then be, to not insult the intelligence of the customer, be they, enterprise user, CrackBerry forum user or even with a big pinch of salt, the general mass population potential buyers.

    By claiming that this is a "Flagship device" and then saying that the KEYone is priced in the "Midrange" of the smartphone market, is well:

    Not very smart @ all.
    03-02-17 08:05 AM
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