[F2]

I probably don't follow but can someone explain something?

The Playbook's standard ac charger is sold as a Premium and I believe FAST charger for the bb phones. I use it regularly and I *THINK* it speeds up charging. Am I mistaken or is the pb charger able to charge my 9930 faster?

[olblueyez]

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/a..._ion_batteries

Mine never takes the quick dip from 100 to approx 90 that others complain about.

But then I don't use the standard charger.

[sbcdk]

Weird dips in battery charge is usually due to lack of calibration. Most manufacturers advise you to completely drain and then fully recharger once every month. This is done to let the software controlling the battery 'see' both max and min levels and then adjust the charge indicator accordingly.

[Jake90087]

Charging Lithium-Ion Batteries

Mine never takes the quick dip from 100 to approx 90 that others complain about.

But then I don't use the standard charger.

Click to view quoted image

Sorry to burst your bubble, but mine doesn't either and I use the old RIM chargers...

[olblueyez]

Sorry to burst your bubble, but mine doesn't either and I use the old RIM chargers...

Dont remember complaining about the older units. Just the new USB type included with the OS7 devices.

Do you have an OS7 phone? If so then why are you using the older chargers?

[cranky_berry]

I bought a a 2.1 amp dual (4.2A total) car charger with USB connections for $17+shipping. When I plug my 9900 into this it complains not enough power to charge phone.

Something is strange. When I plug the phone into the base station my battery monitor app say battery status 10101 (anyone know what that means)?

Any idea what's going on? How can a 2.1 amp USB port not have enough current to charge this thing?

@ocgltd have you tested any of the solutions provided here? I'd be interested in finding out how or if you've solved the problem.

Thanks

[olblueyez]

Why would anyone get an error if "The phone only draws the power it needs"?

Extra power translates into heat if the phone controls every aspect of the charge. Right?

"Some lower-cost consumer chargers may use the simplified "charge-and-run" method that charges a lithium-ion battery in one hour or less without going to the Stage 2 saturation charge. "Ready" appears when the battery reaches the voltage threshold at Stage 1. Since the state-of-charge (SoC) at this point is only about 85 percent, the user may complain of short runtime, not knowing that the charger is to blame. Many warranty batteries are being replaced for this reason, and this phenomenon is especially common in the cellular industry."

Found this on the page I linked to earlier.

[cranky_berry]

I'll wait until ogcltd responds. This one track discussion with you is pointless.
Either you want to help or not.

[olblueyez]

I'll wait until ogcltd responds. This one track discussion with you is pointless.
Either you want to help or not.

Thank You.

I did help when I made good sugesstions for choosing a car charger.

Just let me know when you figure out why some chargers provide more battery life than others.

[cranky_berry]

Actually the question was why the charger he bought didn't work.
The answer was because he was using a standard USB data cable not a USB charging cable.

[olblueyez]

You never charged your phone with a data cable? Like the one that came with the phone?

[cranky_berry]

No I haven’t used a data cable unless I’m hooked into a computer.

I think you’re missing a couple of things here:
• Chargers (USB car, regular car, or AC) are cheap no-brains devices. They have minimal current limiting circuits and no way to detect charge levels etc.
• Just because they are rated for 700ma, or 3A doesn’t mean the device they are connected to will draw all that current. Just like you house has a 100A or 200A service I doubt that it would draw that much or else every breaker in the house would blow.
• Most modern electronics (BlackBerry’s, HTC etc.) build the brains into the device. They have circuits that limit the current based on the charge, circuits that monitor the health of the battery. They ensure the correct charging curves are being applied to the battery. They will have 4 or 5 temperature sensors on the board to monitor the heat so if the battery does overheat they will reduce the charging current.

Your constant referral to the battery university site, while the information is correct, it’s given from the point of view of a company that makes smart charger and are interested in selling them to people. The smart chargers are wasted on smartphones because the circuits are built into the devices.

To get back to the main point of discussion. Using a USB charger that can delivery 5V @ 3A will not damage the device.
• First the device will only draw up to the maximum current that it was designed to handle
• The charging circuits will apply the correct charge curve for the current being drawn
• The rest of the power management circuits will do their job reducing the current draw as required. The heat sensors will shut things down if something does go awry.
If the designers of the phone feel that it can draw 1A and charge correctly then why wouldn’t I do that? Yes it will charge quicker at 1A vs. 500mA and perhaps it will generate a slight rise in temperature but if it’s designed correctly and within specs it will be fine.

So the upshot of all this is that’s it’s my belief, backed by my personnel and design experience, that if you use the right cable and the right charger you can safely charge any device. I have not experienced any overheating or battery degeneration in the 2 years of using these methods.

Now about cables:
• In most cases a regular USB data cable will work for devices that draw less than 500mA
• If you’re using a car charger that has a sufficient current rating and you get a message saying there is insufficient current to charge. Try switching the cable to a USB charging cable. This can be easily made by cutting open a cable and shorting the green and white wires. BTW do not use this cable with a computer.
• A charger with that is under rated will still charge your device, if you use a charging cable, it will just charge slower. However keep an eye on it for the first while and check the temperature of the charger it may overheat if it doesn’t have any protection circuits in it. BTW I don't recommend this.

Apple and Sony both have special configurations for their charging cables. Pull up resistors on the data lines signal how much current the device can draw. I don't use these products so i don't have first-hand knowledge of their functions.


You most likely will find points to argue here so knock yourself out and have fun. I'm done.

[cranky_berry]

Just to back up the statement above. see section 1.4.7 Dedicated Charging Port (DCP)

" A DCP shall short the D+ line to the D- line "

You can read the attached USB Battery Charging Spec at your leisure.

[olblueyez]

The OP could have picked up a paper route and made some extra cash by now so he can afford a proper charger with the data lines shorted. You know, like the ones I recommended on the first page.

[cranky_berry]

The 2 Amp (2000mA per port) charger is 3 to 4 times the proper output to properly charge your phone without damaging the battery. The Nokia DC-6 at 1/2 Amp (550mA) is what you need.

If you want a dual USB unit than some of them are 3/4 Amp (750mA) per port and that would be perfect for your phone. The AT&T dual USB charger is 750mA per port. Motorola has one like that too.

Use that charger and you will destroy your battery. Use a power only cable with the green and white wires shorted and you risk damaging the phone. No Bull.

So you said the charger the OP had would damage the phone - incorrect

Why buy the Motorola unit when he already has a serviceable charger?

Using the OP's charger will destroy the battery - incorrect

Using a cable with the green and white wires shorted would damage the phone - incorrect

So the only issue is why the vendors do not short pins 2 and 3 on the USB charger?

Answer:
Other companies (Apple and Sony for example) use a different part of the spec to set charging currents in their devices. They do this by putting pull up resistors on the data lines to signal to the portable device (PD) that it can draw a certain amount of current. The two methods are in-compatible. So the manufactures of the chargers leave the pins unterminated and the users have to supply the correct cable. This gives them access to the largest market at lowest cost.

I'm not sating this is the right way to do business, it's just the way it is.

[olblueyez]

No I haven’t used a data cable unless I’m hooked into a computer.



I think you’re missing a couple of things here:

• Chargers (USB car, regular car, or AC) are cheap no-brains devices. They have minimal current limiting circuits and no way to detect charge levels etc.

• Just because they are rated for 700ma, or 3A doesn’t mean the device they are connected to will draw all that current. Just like you house has a 100A or 200A service I doubt that it would draw that much or else every breaker in the house would blow.

• Most modern electronics (BlackBerry’s, HTC etc.) build the brains into the device. They have circuits that limit the current based on the charge, circuits that monitor the health of the battery. They ensure the correct charging curves are being applied to the battery. They will have 4 or 5 temperature sensors on the board to monitor the heat so if the battery does overheat they will reduce the charging current.



Your constant referral to the battery university site, while the information is correct, it’s given from the point of view of a company that makes smart charger and are interested in selling them to people. The smart chargers are wasted on smartphones because the circuits are built into the devices.



To get back to the main point of discussion. Using a USB charger that can delivery 5V @ 3A will not damage the device.

• First the device will only draw up to the maximum current that it was designed to handle

• The charging circuits will apply the correct charge curve for the current being drawn

• The rest of the power management circuits will do their job reducing the current draw as required. The heat sensors will shut things down if something does go awry.

If the designers of the phone feel that it can draw 1A and charge correctly then why wouldn’t I do that? Yes it will charge quicker at 1A vs. 500mA and perhaps it will generate a slight rise in temperature but if it’s designed correctly and within specs it will be fine.



So the upshot of all this is that’s it’s my belief, backed by my personnel and design experience, that if you use the right cable and the right charger you can safely charge any device. I have not experienced any overheating or battery degeneration in the 2 years of using these methods.



Now about cables:

• In most cases a regular USB data cable will work for devices that draw less than 500mA

• If you’re using a car charger that has a sufficient current rating and you get a message saying there is insufficient current to charge. Try switching the cable to a USB charging cable. This can be easily made by cutting open a cable and shorting the green and white wires. BTW do not use this cable with a computer.

• A charger with that is under rated will still charge your device, if you use a charging cable, it will just charge slower. However keep an eye on it for the first while and check the temperature of the charger it may overheat if it doesn’t have any protection circuits in it. BTW I don't recommend this.



Apple and Sony both have special configurations for their charging cables. Pull up resistors on the data lines signal how much current the device can draw. I don't use these products so i don't have first-hand knowledge of their functions.





You most likely will find points to argue here so knock yourself out and have fun. I'm done.

All that to say "The 2 data pins need to be shorted"?

[Mystic205]

Given you have no electrical or electronics training, perhaps you would consider not to give advice on topics you have little to no understanding?

To charge a battery require a charging source, a charge controller and a battery.
1. A charging source is your USB..this is a voltage source with current capability.
2. the charge controller resides in the device.. it should monitor battery voltage, incoming voltage, battery temperature and charge current.. its function is to set and limit the charge current applied to the battery...in this case, excess power is dissipated by this circuit
3. a battery.. a battery will accept current. you cannot PUSH current into a battery and it will charge at a rate it desires unless limited by the charge controller.

* It seems reasonable that the charge controller has an overcurrent limit/shutoff to prevent excess dissipation/destruction of the battery, given that Li-ion can charge faster than they sanely should.
* Do you understand that a microUSB contact is limited to 1A max?.. constant use of a higher courrent source, and charging at the current would destroy your contacts and so render your device incapable of charge.

Screwing with contacts, and or controls to bypass the charge controller can easily destroy your microUSB socket, melt your charge controller or cause destruction of your battery.. with not great side effects.

i don't have my electrical license but thats not true. all you are doing is charging the battery at a faster rate, which would just create it to heat up a bit more then normal charging. Yet no hotter then heavy usage would in reverse order.

charging a phone battery is no different then charging a car battery. 2a 10a or 30a, its all the way just faster charges.

If Rim didn't want you to be able to connect your phone to a 2a charger why would they produce one and sell it as a phone accessory

[olblueyez]

My advice was to buy some chargers that I know work. Had the OP asked these questions before buying and not after than there would have never been a problem.

Did you even ask the OP if he has a soldering iron, shrink tubing, or electrical tape, and a USB cable he can butcher?

No, you didn't.

Keep on telling everyone how modifying a cable is the only way to go but you don't have a clue if that is true for the OP, do you?

Keep on telling everyone all chargers are the same too. Your wrong about that but I'm sure you don't care as long as you get the last word in.

[cranky_berry]

You can create your own charge cable by cutting open the cable and shorting the green and white wires at the device connector end. This tells the device that it's connected to a charging current source.
Or you can buy an iGo charging cable and tip from The Source for $9.95 each
For more information on the USB charging spec Google it.

I did give him a source to buy the charging cable. I just find it too expensive for such a simple mod.
Why so angry?

[jefo13]

All you have to do is go into the engineering screen (look up how to enable it) then go into the OS engineering screen, then battery, the battery charging screen. Click here menu key and select force ACADEMY. That is all you will have full charging capabilities.

Of course as always with the eScreen use it at your own risk.

[cranky_berry]

Your right that will work, but will the OP what to do this when ever he wants to charge the phone?
On mine its Force AC but same idea

[nd1983]

Your wrong about that but I'm sure you don't care as long as you get the last word in.

i think alot of people feel the samne way about you...

[sydneygato]

All you have to do is go into the engineering screen (look up how to enable it) then go into the OS engineering screen, then battery, the battery charging screen. Click here menu key and select force ACADEMY. That is all you will have full charging capabilities.

Of course as always with the eScreen use it at your own risk.

Hmmm.... looks like the ticket, but the menu options on my 9930 are different, and there is no [Force ACADEMY], only [Force Discharge], [Force 100], [Force 500], and [Force AC].

Any ideas?

[gees97]

Hmmm.... looks like the ticket, but the menu options on my 9930 are different, and there is no [Force ACADEMY], only [Force Discharge], [Force 100], [Force 500], and [Force AC].

Any ideas?

How do you get to that screen? And does this ruin anything on phone? I don't wanna end up with more issues I already have

[sydneygato]

1. Search [engineering screen]
2. Yup, it *can*; all of the detailed threads on it mention "spontaneous total existence failure" if you screw something up.