Duplicate PINs?

**mipacho** · 02-10-2009, 01:00 PM

Is it possible that two different Blackberries from two different parts of the world has the same exact pin?

This might sound strange. But I recently bought a blackberry bold and when I turned it on and activated the service, I started recieving emails from an unknown person. What I immediately thought was its prolly from the previous owner who forgot to release the pin from their provider prior to selling it.

So I did what any nice person would do and emailed the person informing him that I was recieving his emails and that he should change his password and notify his carrier to release the PIN.

A few weeks went by and nothing happened but then things started to act strange again when I began to recieve his emails again. Then a friend of mine tried to PIN message me only to get a reply from the guy (lets name him Person1) in the states! He had begun to recieve my emails and have the mail icon with my email address on top of it!

"sorry this is not (mipacho) but I have been getting his messages on my blackberry" -- Person 1

I then emailed him and soon it led to a phone conversation until we both confirmed that we have the Same exact pin on the blackberry device! It was to the point that we both took out the battery on the device to check the pin and confirm each number and letter. ITS AN EXACT MATCH! his is ATT branded and mine is O2 branded.

Lucky for him, he lives in the USA where ATT would probably give him a new blackberry bold if he explained the problem. But what about me? I'm in indonesia and I purchased this blackberry from a reseller that bought it from O2. Theres no way I can return it! I mean this is insane! what should I do and how do I even begin to explain it to 02 or RIM.

Is it even possible that there can be two exact pins? I dont believe its possible. I consider myself to be quite a blackberry expert (im a blackberry developer). I just think this is extremely bizarre.

please help and give your input on what I should do next. Thanks so much.

**editionfws** · 02-10-2009, 01:01 PM

thats crazy... i dont know haha.

**Username00089** · 02-10-2009, 01:06 PM

That is some weird stuff. Just recently my friend got a pin request from some girl in the Dominican Republic. And she said she thought she was requesting her friend who had the same pin as well. I think calling O2 and asking for a new device wouldn't be unreasonable at all. Same pin as another person no matter where they are is a big problem.

**mipacho** · 02-10-2009, 01:10 PM

yea i will write an email to O2 to explain the problem but the annoying part is that I have all these confidential emails and contracts on my Blackberry and for a device thats supposed to be secure enough for Obama to use, this is just crazy. Im so annoyed that I can be receiving this guys emails and he can view my inbox from his device. I guess since the service books were sent to him too when I resent mine.

**editionfws** · 02-10-2009, 01:11 PM

actually they dont want abama to use his berry anymore becuase they are scared of what can happen.

anyway, i really didnt think it was possiable for 2 devices to have the same pin, but i guess they could mess up

**Username00089** · 02-10-2009, 01:12 PM

Originally Posted by mipacho

yea i will write an email to O2 to explain the problem but the annoying part is that I have all these confidential emails and contracts on my Blackberry and for a device thats supposed to be secure enough for Obama to use, this is just crazy. Im so annoyed that I can be receiving this guys emails and he can view my inbox from his device. I guess since the service books were sent to him too when I resent mine.

I would immediately get ahold of your carrier to resolve this. This isn't something that should wait. Fill us in on what happens. This is kind of interesting and pretty coincidental with what my friend experienced last week.

**ST79** · 02-10-2009, 01:16 PM

Is it possible for someone to clone a bb pin?? Is this an example for that??

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**aka.arj** · 02-10-2009, 01:23 PM

This is pretty wierd.. Never heard of this before..

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**mandony** · 02-10-2009, 01:23 PM

>>>Is it even possible that there can be two exact pins? I dont believe its possible. I consider myself to be quite a blackberry expert (im a blackberry developer). I just think this is extremely bizarre.
please help and give your input on what I should do next. Thanks so much.

First possibility: the Bold was stolen and was hacked with the replacement PIN.
If so, return it to the seller.

Second possibility: The PIN# was assigned by RIM.
Even though your phone has gone thru several hands then RIM should resolve this. Even though you do not want to go to your carrier, you are still their customer and they have an obligation to contact RIM for you. If not then contact RIM:

Corporate Head Office
Research In Motion
295 Phillip Street
Waterloo, Ontario
Canada N2L 3W8

tel: (519) 888-7465
fax: (519) 888-7884

Company - Contact Information - Research In Motion

**abban** · 02-10-2009, 02:34 PM

That is strange and scary to hear dang!!!!!

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**Branta** · 02-10-2009, 03:00 PM

There are three plausible ways a PIN could be duplicated.

1. Manufacturing error - probably assigning the same block twice, so there could be hundreds of duplicate pairs. RIM QA should detect this and stop the duplicates before they are shipped to users.

2. Illegally reprogrammed phone. Likely to be a stolen phone which was given a new identity. IMO this option has the highest probability, and there could be one duplicate or hundreds with the same PIN.

3. Counterfeit product. Relatively unlikely to occur.

It would be interesting to know if the IMEI is also duplicated. AFAIK there's a RIM database which links PIN and IMEI, so any duplications due to manufacturing error should be easy for RIM to detect and resolve by recalling and replacing the devices involved. It is likely that a reprogrammed or cloned device would have a mismatch between IMEI and PIN when compared to the master database.

**rudog** · 02-10-2009, 07:46 PM

Well, I posted this same question yesterday in this forum. I am from indonesia, and the blackberry craze has been a storm (excuse the pun). I did receive a several emails and messages regarding the issue discussed here. Furthermore, I have heard rumours that program has been developed in china that allow duplication of pins and allow these people to inject stolen blackberries with duplicated pins. The idea is a bit far-fetched for me, but nevertheless we all should be careful on giving away our pins to strangers.

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**danielx** · 02-10-2009, 09:13 PM

sounds like we have a potential security blockbuster on our hands

**red-angelz** · 02-11-2009, 02:41 AM

Hmm.. why don't you return the blackberry to the reseller you bought from? They usually have distributor's warranty such as ASC, QTel etc.. Unless you buy from some random bloke.

I've read it somewhere too that BBPin cloning is possible.. Its from mailing list, but it stated a BBPin started with 6xxxxxx. Which IMO, if its possible cloning the PIN, then it shouldn't be impossible to clone any PIN..

**mipacho** · 02-11-2009, 10:35 AM

Pin cloning is definitely possible. I can 100 percent confirm this and all the chatter on id-blackberry is the real deal. The program that was leaked on the internet via bittorent was able to change settings on a blackberry such as lock status, vendor id (even to an EU -1 unit). Pin cloning is real too. I have seen a rim blocked blackberry get unblocked. I personally believe even though its illegal, its totally fine if you are cloning an old blackberry pin into a new pinblocked blackberry if you own the old blackberry and not planning to use it. Yes this is a real security issue I am wondering how rim is going to fix this. Note to RIM: blocking hardware number (not bb pin) can also be undo-ed now.

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**era3z** · 02-11-2009, 11:18 AM

yes... Mipacho I'm Indonesian too... So I really know what's going on...

Do you still have the contact's number? Our country's BB fever is high, that makes unresponsible people try to make much profits with less outcome... They bought pin suspended Blackberry (It's so cheap... for bold they can sell it for $300), and they just inject new IMEI and new PIN, and even restart the data and voice usage to 0.0... and.. WALLAAAA!!! a BNIB (brand new in box) BB and will be sold for $500....

So.. just contact your seller (I hope you're buying the one with guarantee --> even a local guarantee), and ask him for a replacement... If he doesn't want to replace it, just open a public forum =)

And yeah.. note to RIM... please upgrade your PIN security.... It's lacked and hacked.. =)

Don't want to be cloned >.< important email....... >.<

**mrusli** · 03-07-2009, 12:45 AM

Mipacho / era3z,

do you know of anyone who can 'reprogram' blackberry that are suspended? I have bought a Bold abt 2 months ago from Hong Kong which is branded 02 and its a problem one. I live in Jakarta, Indonesia as well.

thx.

**Branta** · 03-07-2009, 07:31 AM

What you are requesting is a crime almost everywhere in the world. Its the same as putting new plates on a stolen car.

You bought stolen property? Take it back to the seller and demand your a refund. Or cooperate with the authorities to get these criminals shut down.

**confusednfrustated** · 03-24-2010, 03:47 PM

I have exactlly the same problem as you. Heeelllpppp...
I have my ? for more than ? year noe, and everything work fine, untill few months ago, when I bring my ? to some store in ambassador mall (I also come from Indonesia) to update the software. After I come back from there, all my email account are gone, and everytime I tried to register again, they said there are somebody else who using XL have exactly the same pin and imei as me. I can still use my bbm or surfing the internet, just can not register my email to my ? anymore.
Than problem start to cummilated more and more. My friends told me that sometimes my nickname change into somebody else, or I started not getting any of their message to me. Sometimes I also started to get message from people that I dunno.
I finally able to talk with the other person that having the same pin as me, and maybe we can solve the problem. But he seems that he does not care, and don't see the problem.
I check to my provider, and manage to find out that my phone is the right one, not the clone one, and said that I should go to XL to ask them to turn off the other connection. But XL told m? that they will not do such things if the other user did not authorize it. This is start to drive me crazy, because it getting worst everyday. Help... I really dunno what to do...

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**oz1421** · 03-24-2010, 07:30 PM

This is pretty crazy. Have you tried contacting the seller to see what he says, maybe he is also oblivion to the fact this is going on.

**blarghh** · 03-26-2010, 07:35 AM

Guys, this is a common issue in our country. That's why you have to be careful when fixing, installing cracked programs or updating your OS in an unauthorized local store. You can't trust these people. They will steal your PIN info and clone it into their "illegal" BBs.

And no, you can't get a refund in our country. If you got your PIN suspended, they will fix your BB by injecting another cloned PIN into your BB. Of course this won't fix the problem. After a couple of months you will get your new PIN suspended, again. Then they will get you another new PIN and so on.

That's why you should've bought your bb from an authorized reseller, cause you'll never get your PIN suspended and they will help you if these kind of problems occur. I know it will cost you more, but at least you get a legit bb?

**paulbrigth** · 08-08-2012, 09:50 PM

Please the same thing happen to me and I don't know what to do I'm sharing the same bb pin with some one in another state but the same country nigeria so I don't know what to do because she was able to return her own and I try to return my but they didn't collect it, reason I have been using it for more than 4 month, so please what can I do

**dynalmadman** · 08-10-2012, 04:02 PM

Sorta the same but different with my phone. I bought the 9000 when new and used it religiously for 2 years. Then I went to the iphone4 (don't ask). Recently I have reactivated the 9000, new SIM, same service.

Everything worked, except I could not connect to the BIS. Said my account was deactivated or suspended.

NUMEROUS calls the 611 and BB tech support, they finally told time that there was another phone in another zone with the SAME PIM and SAME IMEI!!!

What? Yah, that is what they said. Told me it would take about 24 hours to deactivate that handset and then all would be well with mine.

Sure enough, next day I was able to connect to the BIS and set up my emails. Their explanation was the someone in 'the other zone' probably mistyped their numbers. Yah, exactly my numbers? And if so, didn't they then knock them off the grid?

Riiiiiiiiiiiiight. Nevertheless, I am switching away from the BB next month. Sounds like a huge security issue.

Michael