1. mithrazor's Avatar
    Yes, I know that quote, and YOU know exactly what I meant. It's a functionality that's been in every version of a BB OS since at least 2007, and I was saying that it's now been removed from what the OS offeres. You know full-well that that's what I meant. By your rational, it would be ok if the Z10 didn't have texting, because ... " it was never to be there in the first place. Not a single line of code from legacy BBOS is in BB10."

    Don't be silly.
    Yeah and your rebuttal of mimicing my "rational" is even dumber because a phone is a communications device so not including texting is way more detrimental than any missing feature in the phone right now.

    And since you're so smart why can't you figure out that they've made this OS in 2 years. Meaning they've had to push back some features for a later update.

    Smart guy trying to be smart fail.
    02-04-13 12:15 AM
  2. Hypnoboy's Avatar
    easy there, clearly this device and OS does not fill your needs.....you know what's next
    But it DID before. I expect it to get BETTER, not worse. I expect MORE functionality, not less. Can you see how this is frustrating to long loyal users? Surely you can see WHY this would be frustrating.
    brianatbb, JeepBB, h20work and 2 others like this.
    02-04-13 12:18 AM
  3. mithrazor's Avatar
    I'm saying that, after all of the delays, it should be DONE. The product hasn't been out a week yet, and people are already talking about what needs to be in the first update. That's not good, boys and girls. Not good at all.
    Your expectation of what was done in 15 years of BBOS, should be done in 2 years of development for BB10 (starting from ground up, laying foundation and architecture of the OS) is very unrealistic.

    And frustrating maybe, but don't you think if they could do that, they would?
    ubizmo likes this.
    02-04-13 12:22 AM
  4. ealvnv's Avatar
    But it DID before. I expect it to get BETTER, not worse. I expect MORE functionality, not less. Can you see how this is frustrating to long loyal users? Surely you can see WHY this would be frustrating.
    yes i can, I've been a BlackBerry user since the 8700 device days, and yes i got excited when we got 4.5, 5.0, 6.0, 7.0, 7.1 updates and guess what? none of them had non missing features or removed in the process, the key was that everyone adapted, and to me BB10 has way more functionality then BBOS so is a matter of user by user POV, and to clarify something QNX became a part of BlackBerry in 2010, they started working on the OS by Q4 of that year so by numbers it probably took more then 1 yr to get the OS built from 0 to where it is now.
    Look Android has gone a long way and even now they hammered for the lack of xxxx all the time, so to expect BB10 to be fully polished now is non sense, but hey that is my POV, as I said, what is good for one is bad for the other.
    jesse_h likes this.
    02-04-13 12:26 AM
  5. Hypnoboy's Avatar
    Yeah and your rebuttal of mimicing my "rational" is even dumber because a phone is a communications device so not including texting is way more detrimental than any missing feature in the phone right now.

    And since you're so smart why can't you figure out that they've made this OS in 2 years. Meaning they've had to push back some features for a later update.

    Smart guy trying to be smart fail.
    They didn't make this in two years. It's been DELAYED almost two years. It's been in the works longer than that.

    Yes, a phone is a communication device. A Blackberry is multi-functional in that regard as it has phone, email, texting, BBM and so on. What has happened in the NEW phone and OS is that some of the functionality that it HAD before (in it's previous incarnations) is no longer available. For the folks who USED that functionality, it's a "MISSING" thing. So it's very similar to having a feature like TEXTING removed. Again, I think you know exactly what I mean. I was clearly using a metaphor.

    Why do people on message boards have to pick fights when it's clear what a person is trying to say? I don't get that.
    BigAl_BB9900 likes this.
    02-04-13 12:31 AM
  6. ealvnv's Avatar
    They didn't make this in two years. It's been DELAYED almost two years. It's been in the works longer than that. .
    How could this be if the company building it was acquired little more then that? and just so you know you do not build the hardware at same time as the OS...two years ago there was not TI OMAP 4470 lol
    jesse_h likes this.
    02-04-13 12:35 AM
  7. Hypnoboy's Avatar
    Your expectation of what was done in 15 years of BBOS, should be done in 2 years of development for BB10 (starting from ground up, laying foundation and architecture of the OS) is very unrealistic.

    And frustrating maybe, but don't you think if they could do that, they would?
    So let's say the CEO of Blackberry goes on TV tomorrow morning and someone says to him, "Hey, your OS seems a little incomplete to me, just my opinion." and HE replies, "Hey, you're being unrealistic. We've only been working on this for TWO years!" The interviewer says, "Yes, but you're Blackberry. We would think you'd have this down by now", and the CEO replies, "Look, if we could make it better, don't you think we would??"

    The next news story is how Blackberry stock TANKED within minutes and that's it for the company. Bye Bye Blackberry.

    Why are people apologizing for an incomplete OS? Remember how everyone complained about the Playbook being incomplete? Isn't this the same thing, really??
    mikeo007, JeepBB, h20work and 4 others like this.
    02-04-13 12:43 AM
  8. Hypnoboy's Avatar
    How could this be if the company building it was acquired little more then that? and just so you know you do not build the hardware at same time as the OS...two years ago there was not TI OMAP 4470 lol
    "In the works" means more than writing actual code and building actual hardware. "In the works" means planning and development.
    02-04-13 12:45 AM
  9. FantomLightning's Avatar
    That is what I mean, instead of getting notified by ringtones, we can peek what kind of notifications that came in, personal or work. Maybe that is why they took away the customized ringtones for you to utilize the peek and flow I guess. troublesome much? maybe because we are not use to it yet? just saying...


    Sent from my BlackBerry 9860 using Tapatalk
    The point is with the old BB setup you don't even need to pick up the device...
    Hypnoboy likes this.
    02-04-13 12:52 AM
  10. InvalidUser0510's Avatar
    Seriously, this thread needs to get closed. Everything written here has so far either been ignorant, matter of personal opinion, stupidity, etc.
    02-04-13 01:22 AM
  11. Hypnoboy's Avatar
    Seriously, this thread needs to get closed. Everything written here has so far either been ignorant, matter of personal opinion, stupidity, etc.
    We can't share personal opinions on the message board?
    Ignorant? Maybe some people don't know everything, and this is a great place for them to find things out, no?
    mikeo007, Admorris, JeepBB and 2 others like this.
    02-04-13 01:28 AM
  12. ealvnv's Avatar
    "In the works" means more than writing actual code and building actual hardware. "In the works" means planning and development.
    If you never worked in developing, which you said you haven't you have no idea what you're talking about. planning comes first, writing code or development after and you then build the hardware, while you build the hardware you keep on developing to polish the foundation of the os, the you keep developing to fix bugs and add features, is called updates.

    Just one app takes months to be barely done now think about a whole new platform including the backend architecture that goes with it, but of course you have no idea since you never worked in the development world.

    That said in no replying to you anymore is pointless for me and you
    jesse_h likes this.
    02-04-13 01:32 AM
  13. InvalidUser0510's Avatar
    We can't share personal opinions on the message board?
    Ignorant? Maybe some people don't know everything, and this is a great place for them to find things out, no?
    The author literally made a website stating his reasons why bb10 sucks, and 31/35 faults listed are based on ignorance, personal preference, and misunderstanding. It is prett obvious that he was trolling with a hidden agenda. That becomes even more obvious when one realizes that he has an iPad and yet complains about BB10's notifications. Lol. If people want to discuss in a legitimately helpful manner, a new thread needs to be made for them.
    jesse_h likes this.
    02-04-13 01:35 AM
  14. lotuslanderz's Avatar
    Wow... I'm really glad I read your post before getting one. I was originally planning to get one from Rogers on the release date, now I'm not so sure anymore
    The OP also provided lots of good points. Those are definitely making me lean towards getting one soon. I'll be eligible for a free upgrade in 2 months. I'm not a power user in the traditional BB sense, but here's hoping these irritations will be worked out both by BB and the OP as he gets more used to the new OS.
    elGuapoTorres likes this.
    02-04-13 01:35 AM
  15. mountainman's Avatar
    I don't think this thread needs to be closed at all. The OP has valid points. As a BB Veteran, I myself am very jacked about the notifications.

    I loved to theme my BBs as well. Not anymore.

    The point is that the things that made BB unique and useful are now gone. They actually took the good part (notifications) and basically threw it out the window. My mama didn't raise no dummies -- I know it's a new OS -- but IMO it is an epic fail that they did not carry it over to BB10. Why shouldn't the BB faithful be jacked about this? The granularity of the notifications was what separated BB from the others. The themes were rocking too. What differentiates BB's now? Gestures and the Hub?

    I am a BB supporter, but I've been a Crackberry lurker ever since I switched to an iPhone. Do you think that Apple, when they release OS7, is going to remove functionality that is already there? If you do think that -- you are living in a fantasy world.

    I wanted to like BB10, I really did. I guess I will just hold out until they finally get it right. More waiting --- when you are a BB fan - you get used to that. But, I can still be jacked about it and post it in these forums, right?
    PJD642, jonty12, jdhooghe and 3 others like this.
    02-04-13 02:02 AM
  16. qbnkelt's Avatar
    . It is prett obvious that he was trolling with a hidden agenda. That becomes even more obvious when one realizes that he has an iPad and yet complains about BB10's notifications. Lol. If people want to discuss in a legitimately helpful manner, a new thread needs to be made for them.

    So a person with an iPad who points out bugs or states a preference is trolling.

    So in your considered opinion I'm trolling if once I get the device I find things about it that I feel are poorly implemented or handled better in my iPad. Or my iPhone. Or my SGIII. And I state so.

    Just because I own those devices it is your opinion that anything I say should be discounted as trolling. Please, really, tell me you are not that much of an apologist for BB...


    Sent from my SEXY HOT RED SGIII using Tapatalk 2
    02-04-13 02:14 AM
  17. ealvnv's Avatar
    There is a difference between removed and not yet added, it will be added in futures updates.... is not yet fully implemented, but rest assured it will be back
    02-04-13 02:18 AM
  18. Hypnoboy's Avatar
    I don't think this thread needs to be closed at all. The OP has valid points. As a BB Veteran, I myself am very jacked about the notifications.

    I loved to theme my BBs as well. Not anymore.

    The point is that the things that made BB unique and useful are now gone. They actually took the good part (notifications) and basically threw it out the window. My mama didn't raise no dummies -- I know it's a new OS -- but IMO it is an epic fail that they did not carry it over to BB10. Why shouldn't the BB faithful be jacked about this? The granularity of the notifications was what separated BB from the others. The themes were rocking too. What differentiates BB's now? Gestures and the Hub?

    I wanted to like BB10, I really did. I guess I will just hold out until they finally get it right. More waiting --- when you are a BB fan - you get used to that. But, I can still be jacked about it and post it in these forums, right?
    This is pretty much what I've been pointing out, but apparently this makes me an ***** because I'm not a developer and I don't know any better, and apparently I should be ok with a half-baked OS.

    And to the people who say, "...it will be added in futures updates.... is not yet fully implemented." I want to remind you that that's what was said about certain features on the Playbook. Not having a fully cooked OS at launch is why the general tech public considers the Playbook a total failure. If it got out there that the NEW Blackberry device is being thought of as having features that are "not yet fully implemented" at launch, especially after such a long delay, then Blackberry is cooked. It's all about perception in the "Smart Phone" world, and if THAT'S the perception, we can kiss out BB's good bye.
    02-04-13 02:38 AM
  19. Hypnoboy's Avatar
    And to the people who say, "...it will be added in futures updates.... is not yet fully implemented." I want to remind you that that's what was said about certain features on the Playbook. Not having a fully cooked OS at launch is why the general tech public considers the Playbook a total failure. If it got out there that the NEW Blackberry device is being thought of as having features that are "not yet fully implemented" at launch, especially after such a long delay, then Blackberry is cooked. It's all about perception in the "Smart Phone" world, and if THAT'S the perception, we can kiss out BB's good bye.
    PS. Here's CNET.com's review headline of the Z10:

    "Classy handset hampered by OS flaws"

    Doesn't that say it all?
    02-04-13 02:47 AM
  20. qbnkelt's Avatar
    This is pretty much what I've been pointing out, but apparently this makes me an ***** because I'm not a developer and I don't know any better, and apparently I should be ok with a half-baked OS.

    And to the people who say, "...it will be added in futures updates.... is not yet fully implemented." I want to remind you that that's what was said about certain features on the Playbook. Not having a fully cooked OS at launch is why the general tech public considers the Playbook a total failure. If it got out there that the NEW Blackberry device is being thought of as having features that are "not yet fully implemented" at launch, especially after such a long delay, then Blackberry is cooked. It's all about perception in the "Smart Phone" world, and if THAT'S the perception, we can kiss out BB's good bye.
    THIS is what I'm concerned about. BB needs to hit the ground running with these phones and grab consumers away from Android and iPhone as well as bring back BB users who have left. They need to COMPETE. This phone will release in the U.S. against the SGIV.
    02-04-13 02:54 AM
  21. thorstenpleasefixit's Avatar
    ^^^ Different ringtones for your contacts can be set, according to the users guide.
    As far as different notification sounds, why don't you guys think the 'peek' feature can be a good replacement? At a quick glance, you see who has sent the messages and you know which ones are important.
    this is NOT the issue. The issue is being able to set different alerts for TYPE of event, and in multiple different profiles. So in all BB's before this, you could for example set an alert for such things as "Level One" events. Then you could set different volumes too, different vibrations (long/short and number of pulses). Real granular control of the alerts ultimately minimising the times you actually had to respond to an alert. You can indeed set a different ringtone file for a contact in BB10, but that's it.


    You can have a different tone for each and every contact and each contact can have a different tone for messages from calls!!! Tones can be any sound or music track on the device. Let's try to be accurate
    there are some issues here. MP3 files don't seem to play, or at least, it's buggy and in a bad way i.e. lets you pick an mp3 file, even previews is.. but when the phone rings? Silence! Currently M4A seem a bit more reliable. But.. and it's a big but.. the lack of ringtone per contact is not the same issue as the changes made to control of the notifications at an event level, which is the real biggy (see above)

    With the exception of number 4 I don't think I would ever look for these other "features". Then again I never had a BlackBerry before so nothing lost. Q10 should cater more to the BB die hards - 3.5% of the market or so Z10 should cater more to the the remaining 96.5% that have moved on and are currently using iPhone or Android devices
    if you've never had a BB you'd probably really enjoy the Z10. The browser is amazing.

    You understand that what has happened is that there's a functionality that has been REMOVED, right? If they knew how to do this in an older, less sophisticated OS, why wouldn't they have it be in their new OS? I think it's a very valid thing to be concerned about if it's one of the main things that you LIKE about your device. Also, why be snarky about it? I don't get that.
    the snarkyness is famed on sites like this (not BB specific - it's fan boy specific), hence my fresh registration to have this debate (which I'm very glad I did). The removal is exactly that. Everyone seems to be saying "it's a new OS" but it's not really.. you can argue the toss about code builds, QNX etc but in reality the concept of BB is more than 10 years old. If they had removed stuff like BBM, or the flashing alert LED, and just said "well, it's new" then there would be uproar. It's exactly the issue with what they've done re: notifications personalisation. That literally was a BB power user feature that nothing else on the market came close too.

    The author literally made a website stating his reasons why bb10 sucks, and 31/35 faults listed are based on ignorance, personal preference, and misunderstanding. It is prett obvious that he was trolling with a hidden agenda. That becomes even more obvious when one realizes that he has an iPad and yet complains about BB10's notifications. Lol. If people want to discuss in a legitimately helpful manner, a new thread needs to be made for them.
    ah, the hidden agenda. My iPad 2 let the cat out of the bag. Why ever did I voluntarily put that info in my profile. Black helicopters, man.

    This is pretty much what I've been pointing out, but apparently this makes me an ***** because I'm not a developer and I don't know any better, and apparently I should be ok with a half-baked OS. And to the people who say, "...it will be added in futures updates.... is not yet fully implemented." I want to remind you that that's what was said about certain features on the Playbook. Not having a fully cooked OS at launch is why the general tech public considers the Playbook a total failure. If it got out there that the NEW Blackberry device is being thought of as having features that are "not yet fully implemented" at launch, especially after such a long delay, then Blackberry is cooked. It's all about perception in the "Smart Phone" world, and if THAT'S the perception, we can kiss out BB's good bye.
    it had a whiff of PB and we need to kill that idea straight away. If they can get a release out in the next 60 days then this can become a really powerful handset (assuming things like the rotation delay aren't hardware related).
    02-04-13 03:13 AM
  22. Boogydefarno's Avatar
    Very interesting, I Have been waiting for an unbiased user review. I am really hoping that BlackBerry take notice of these type of reviews and update the OS rapidly. Thanks.
    BigAl_BB9900 and GreenCopperz like this.
    02-04-13 03:31 AM
  23. krusty0's Avatar
    There is a difference between removed and not yet added, it will be added in futures updates.... is not yet fully implemented, but rest assured it will be back
    Well, maybe it will be added, maybe it won't. Without a clear roadmap from BBRY it's just guessing whether they've just ran out of time and had to postpone stuff or decided to get rid of those features for good. You assuring us that it'll be there eventually doesn't really matter in any way.
    JeepBB and BigAl_BB9900 like this.
    02-04-13 03:33 AM
  24. latarnik's Avatar
    Thank you for this thread, OP. I am definitely a BB fan, but this means that I actually enjoy its features, especially separate notifications for different inboxes. I have few e-mail addresses and each of them has different priority for me, so I do understand your main concern. Before this is fixed in BB10, I am staying with my current handset. But I am now more than certain that I want to wait for Q10 anyway.

    I am also very happy with my PB (and have been from the 1st day it went on sale in the UK), so I do understand benefits of Z10, smoothness, browsing experience, etc. I will be happy to see the PB upgraded to BB10. But on the handset front, if they won't add notifications, bedside modes, desktop charging options (in whatever way they can execute it) and options for deleting the messages (device vs. server+device, which I use a lot), I will stay with my current BB 9780 or upgrade to 9900 only.
    02-04-13 04:12 AM
  25. thorstenpleasefixit's Avatar
    I will stay with my current BB 9780 or upgrade to 9900 only.
    you sound very similar to me. My 9780 is pretty worn out (and in fairness as great as BB5 is it's due an update!) so the 9900 is looking likely at the moment. That said, I've learned that a maintenance release for Z10 could be coming soon, so the question is whether to hope that it addresses the notifaction/rotation issue. Or wait for the Q10.
    02-04-13 04:25 AM
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