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  • 1 Post By Innovatology
  1. Andrew4life's Avatar
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    Default Blackberry 10 OS/Browser: Poor Application Isolation?

    So I recently ported over my Playbook Webworks app over to the BB10. The app is somewhat data intensive (stores a large webdatabase locally). I finished it, loaded it onto my BB10 Dev Alpha, and to test how much my app might lag other applications, I fired up the Browser.

    It was horrendous. The browser started artifacting and glitching up. This shows that there is poor isolation between applications and I'm hoping that this is only because the Dev Alphas are running on Dev code and not final code. Hopefully issues like this are fixed, because I certainly don't want a rogue app to be messing up the browser while I'm doing my banking, or something like that.

    Going back to my own app, the keyboard glitched up along with the whole OS and the keyboard because squeezed to half and the other half was just black. It stayed like that until I rebooted the Dev Alpha. This also shows the OS is not completely finished yet and there's probably a lot of fixing required in the coming weeks. Hopefully the OS will be completely finished in time for Feb launch.
  2. The Me's Avatar
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    How much RAM and CPU does your app use?
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  3. Innovatology's Avatar
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    Post a bug report here so RIM can fix it:
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  4. ffejrobins30's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew4life View Post
    So I recently ported over my Playbook Webworks app over to the BB10. The app is somewhat data intensive (stores a large webdatabase locally). I finished it, loaded it onto my BB10 Dev Alpha, and to test how much my app might lag other applications, I fired up the Browser.

    It was horrendous. The browser started artifacting and glitching up. This shows that there is poor isolation between applications and I'm hoping that this is only because the Dev Alphas are running on Dev code and not final code. Hopefully issues like this are fixed, because I certainly don't want a rogue app to be messing up the browser while I'm doing my banking, or something like that.

    Going back to my own app, the keyboard glitched up along with the whole OS and the keyboard because squeezed to half and the other half was just black. It stayed like that until I rebooted the Dev Alpha. This also shows the OS is not completely finished yet and there's probably a lot of fixing required in the coming weeks. Hopefully the OS will be completely finished in time for Feb launch.
    So what you're saying is that the OS is clearly buggy because you've written and installed an app that is perfect in code and doesn't use hardly any system resources although it's very data intensive? Nice work on the app!

    I have a feeling that you're app is not a good citizen when it comes to true multitasking and freeing some resources while in the background. Even on a PC this becomes a problem with very data and resource intensive apps. It's not a problem with the OS, it's the compromise that has to be made between limited resources on any given machine being shared between all running processes. I believe it's also a problem with selfish coders that don't think that they should give up resources when they aren't needed so that other apps can run well. That's one thing that iOS and Android don't have to worry about because they don't run true multitasking with active background processes. It happens on all platforms where true multitasking happens. It's not your fault, just how the most recent generation of coders have been taught.
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  5. RubberChicken76's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ffejrobins30 View Post
    I have a feeling that you're app is not a good citizen when it comes to true multitasking and freeing some resources while in the background. .
    Is that really necessary? What if he's uncovered a legitimate issue with software that hasn't yet gone gold?
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    Quote Originally Posted by RubberChicken76 View Post
    Is that really necessary? What if he's uncovered a legitimate issue with software that hasn't yet gone gold?
    You're right. I meant no offense to the OP. It's just that there a lot of programmers that blame the OS for problems and don't really think there is a possibility that it may be a problem with their app using resources and that it HAS to be a problem with the OS.

    OP, I'm sorry for singling you out, but I hope you understand the intent of my post. While you admit that your app is very data intensive, you do not say what kind of resources you are using while it's in the background doing whatever it does. This is where I believe there is a lack of understanding when it comes to good programming practices. I just ask that before you cast stones at the OS, you make 100% sure that you are doing your due diligence in consolidating and freeing your resources when your app does not have focus.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew4life View Post
    It was horrendous. The browser started artifacting and glitching up.
    Definitely please file a bug report as Innovatology advises. There's really no value in complaining about it here.

    Also, your app doesn't use the run_when_backgrounded permission, does it? If it does not, then there's really little excuse for that sort of result, contrary to ffejrobins30's suggestions (which are valid if you are using that restricted feature). The OS should be rock-solid enough to avoid such things, and as long as you're not consuming most of the memory in the system it doesn't seem anyone could point to your app and blame it for messing up the system. QNX is better than that (in released/final versions, anyway).

    Have you enabled the "diagnostic overlay" to see what sort of resource usage your app causes? That's the top-left swipe thing that you can easily google to learn more about...
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  8. samab's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew4life View Post
    So I recently ported over my Playbook Webworks app over to the BB10. The app is somewhat data intensive (stores a large webdatabase locally). I finished it, loaded it onto my BB10 Dev Alpha, and to test how much my app might lag other applications, I fired up the Browser.
    There are a lot of changes from playbook to bb10 in terms of html5 + html5 file API access to directories and systems + webdatabase --- such as no point of using deprecated web SQL when BB10 has Indexed DB. There are also improvements to File API access to directories and systems.

    The HTML5 test - How well does your browser support HTML5?

    Most likely you were using older and less efficient ways to do certain things because the Playbook didn't have them.
  9. Andrew4life's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ffejrobins30 View Post
    So what you're saying is that the OS is clearly buggy because you've written and installed an app that is perfect in code and doesn't use hardly any system resources although it's very data intensive? Nice work on the app!

    I have a feeling that you're app is not a good citizen when it comes to true multitasking and freeing some resources while in the background.
    You're right, I'm no expert coder. But at most it should use 30MB of memory.
    But regardless, it certainly shouldn't mess up the keyboard:
    Picture with the keyboard only showing half of it. (I believe when I took the screenshot the keys/numbers were actually showing, that might not have gotten captured)


    And it also shouldn't cause artifacting in other apps, though the browser app likely has shared resources with any webworks app.

    Quote Originally Posted by samab View Post
    There are a lot of changes from playbook to bb10 in terms of html5 + html5 file API access to directories and systems + webdatabase --- such as no point of using deprecated web SQL when BB10 has Indexed DB. There are also improvements to File API access to directories and systems.

    The HTML5 test - How well does your browser support HTML5?

    Most likely you were using older and less efficient ways to do certain things because the Playbook didn't have them.
    webSQL is depreciated but supported on the BB10.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Blackberry 10 OS/Browser: Poor Application Isolation?-img_00000036.jpg   Blackberry 10 OS/Browser: Poor Application Isolation?-img_00000037.jpg  
  10. samab's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrew4life View Post
    webSQL is depreciated but supported on the BB10.
    I know that it is supported in BB10 but the spec is deprecated in favor of indexed db.

    But my point is that you claimed that your webworks app is a database intensive app that writes a lot of data to the device --- so you have 2 likely potential bottleneck issues. The first potential bottleneck is the actually writing of data to the device --- which BB10 webworks have now better File API access to directories and systems. The second potential bottleneck is the database itself --- which RIM has now incorporated indexed db into their system.

    If you attempt to write a lot of data using a less efficient method --- it is going to affect other apps that are running at the same time. Even on a desktop PC, if you transfer massive amount of data using an older method (maybe IDE instead of SATA), other programs that are running may stutter.
  11. jeroen_13's Avatar
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    Did you recompiled your app with the GOLD SDK ? The Gold sdk contains a lot of bugfixes.
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