[ljfong]

Yes that would have helped possibly save the company from this 5 year Sh1t Show. Mike and Jim were trying to convince carriers to not upgrade networks to keep BUS relevant instead of making phones that would take advantage of the new networks. But what is done is done. Blackberry might have even had been able to save things if they had waited to launch BB10 when it was ready, not early and beta quality, and made the first all touch the Z30. The Z10 was simply released to late after it was intended to be released to be a serious contender and to move the units they committed too. The other possibility would have been to just sale the Z10 dirt cheap from the start to drive adoption given its shortcomings.

Posted via Z30

BlackBerry 10 was released already in a very late do or die manner so I doubt they could have had waited till it was ready. When the delay into 2013 was announced pundits were already busy erecting BlackBerry virtual tombstones. With that said I completely agree that Z30 is truly what Z10 should have been.

[Notna Nosyel]

Blackberry will still be in Waterloo.

Posted via Telegram

[Soulstream]

I think BB would be in a better shape if they went Android in 2011. People fail to realise the huge costs of developing and OS. BB not spending money for the OS, for trying to convince devs to build apps for BB10 etc, would have made BB a more stable company financially.

So, going Android in 2013 when BB10 released, wouldn't have changed much.
But going Android in 2011, would have resulted in a healthier company.

[keithhackneysmullet]

Over @ Android Central!

Posted from Nederland!

Lol.

Seriously much better off. I would say 12-15 % market share a solid number two in the android world. It would have stopped most of those bbos defections to android that happened in 2011-2012. I think android would be better off with BlackBerry contributing to the android code. They would benefit from having a company with a security / enterprise mindset. We certainly had enough java programmers to make it happen.

Nokia and BlackBerry made similar decisions to build a in house os against the rising tide of android both companies paid dearly. Both could have continued to be major players

Posted via CB10

[keithhackneysmullet]

I think BB would be in a better shape if they went Android in 2011. People fail to realise the huge costs of developing and OS. BB not spending money for the OS, for trying to convince devs to build apps for BB10 etc, would have made BB a more stable company financially.

So, going Android in 2013 when BB10 released, wouldn't have changed much.
But going Android in 2011, would have resulted in a healthier company.

It killed the company to change platforms. BlackBerry had to rebuild the ecosystem from scratch. Should have jumped aboard the android train.



Posted via CB10

[lnichols]

It killed the company to change platforms. BlackBerry had to rebuild the ecosystem from scratch. Should have jumped aboard the android train.



Posted via CB10

They really didn't have an ecosystem with BBOS. Few apps, some basic cloud services like protect, and BBM. BIS was nothing more than a proxy service and offloading some functions that smartphones of the time now had the power to do without the BIS. BBOS and BIS did a lot of damage to the brand in the late 2000s in developed nations. BB10 has been able to do everything my BBOS phones could do and more. Yes I use more data to do it, but I was on an unlimited data plan with my BBOS device and still am with BB10. Lack of apps, horrible reputation, and poor pricing is what is killing BlackBerry currently. They were late to the game, had to develop a new OS twice, or maybe 1.5 times because Adobe pulled out of mobile and TabletOS was heavily Adobe reliant.

Posted via Z30

[mcstravi]

Lol.

Seriously much better off. I would say 12-15 % market share a solid number two in the android world. It would have stopped most of those bbos defections to android that happened in 2011-2012. I think android would be better off with BlackBerry contributing to the android code. They would benefit from having a company with a security / enterprise mindset. We certainly had enough java programmers to make it happen.


Posted via CB10

Agreed 100%. There would have been a lot less defections and a lot more developer support. Add to that the initial market share would have been much less damaged to start with.
If they make the Android switch now ( assuming they can secure it like the securetab partnership with Samsung) they still have a possibility of recovering but the road will be much more difficult due to the damaged brand.

As an aside the decision to spend millions on a Super bowl add, when the phones weren't even available in the US for several more months was just idiocy. If they had an Android phone at the time in the market maybe that would have been a good decision.

Posted via CB10

[GadgetTravel]

BlackBerry would be just another insignificant Android OEM and losing their security edge. All government contract would be lost to Samsung / iOS.

Posted via CB10

This and several other posts neglect what happened. They ARE losing those contracts as it is. They do have have about 0.5% market share. And dropping fast. BB10 failed. If they had switched to Android and captured 2% of the Android market they would have an overall market share more than 3 times what it is now. As posted by someone above, it is hard to see how it could be worse than it is.

[skibnik]

This and several other posts neglect what happened. They ARE losing those contracts as it is. They do have have about 0.5% market share. And dropping fast. BB10 failed. If they had switched to Android and captured 2% of the Android market they would have an overall market share more than 3 times what it is now. As posted by someone above, it is hard to see how it could be worse than it is.

People are forgetting that the original BB/RIM devices were created for business and government use, meaning fast and secure communication. Non professional consumer use was an afterthought. Apple changed the playing field when it decided to create a new market for smartphones,things would have been a lot different if Blackberry had any forward thinkers on staff when Apple introduced the Iphone. They should have been one of the first companies to sign up for the OHA and kept BBOS for enterprise use. instead they decided to release the "Iphone killer" Storm.

[Loc22]

I'm of the opinion that it could have gone either way. My analysis is this ;

1. BlackBerry could have sold more phones as it went to market earlier with a more updated OS & ecosystem. However BlackBerry is a profit generating company & as we know that the Android phone manufacturers are generally having extremely thin margins BlackBerry could have already exited the mobile phone market by now.

Reason for that is that the returns on investment will not be meeting the shareholders requirements. BlackBerry also does not have the economies of scale of other larger Android phone manufacturers to compete in this market.

2. What the. Would be the unique selling point for a BlackBerry? It would have been the same with any other Android phone in the market.

Why would you choose a BlackBerry & not a Samsung or HTC or a Sony? In view of this I would either have continued using my 9900 or would have bought a Samsung as the pressure to be the same with my peers are really so great.

3. BlackBerry phones has always been more expensive than others in the market & their specs are usually far behind the rest in the market. I would not be surprised if their Android based device specs is going to outdated as well. Even if they are able to come out with a device that has updated specs I'm doubtful that they have the bargaining power to negotiate & source the raw materials for the device to be at a low enough cost to be competitive. This will then mean that BlackBerry will also have to exit the devices market sooner or later.

Posted via CB10

[GadgetTravel]

People are forgetting that the original BB/RIM devices were created for business and government use, meaning fast and secure communication. Non professional consumer use was an afterthought. Apple changed the playing field when it decided to create a new market for smartphones,things would have been a lot different if Blackberry had any forward thinkers on staff when Apple introduced the Iphone. They should have been one of the first companies to sign up for the OHA and kept BBOS for enterprise use. instead they decided to release the "Iphone killer" Storm.

I agree generally. They had lost any possibility to maintain a significant market share by about 2011 or so by failing to respond to Apple and Android rapidly enough. Maybe by even as early as 2009 or 2010. By the time BB10 was released it had no chance to be successful.

[GadgetTravel]

I'm of the opinion that it could have gone either way. My analysis is this ;

1. BlackBerry could have sold more phones as it went to market earlier with a more updated OS & ecosystem. However BlackBerry is a profit generating company & as we know that the Android phone manufacturers are generally having extremely thin margins BlackBerry could have already exited the mobile phone market by now.

Reason for that is that the returns on investment will not be meeting the shareholders requirements. BlackBerry also does not have the economies of scale of other larger Android phone manufacturers to compete in this market.

2. What the. Would be the unique selling point for a BlackBerry? It would have been the same with any other Android phone in the market.

Why would you choose a BlackBerry & not a Samsung or HTC or a Sony? In view of this I would either have continued using my 9900 or would have bought a Samsung as the pressure to be the same with my peers are really so great.

3. BlackBerry phones has always been more expensive than others in the market & their specs are usually far behind the rest in the market. I would not be surprised if their Android based device specs is going to outdated as well. Even if they are able to come out with a device that has updated specs I'm doubtful that they have the bargaining power to negotiate & source the raw materials for the device to be at a low enough cost to be competitive. This will then mean that BlackBerry will also have to exit the devices market sooner or later.

Posted via CB10

Except people ARE choosing different Android manufacturers rather than BB. Again, if BB captured 2% of the Android sales they would more than triple their current market share.

[Paraliotis3]

This scenario is not possible. Android is not secure, nor can BlackBerry secure it.

So BlackBerry would have gone bust. Plus the Z10 had old spec's. For its initial $600+ price tag for a Z10 Android for exampke, people would have LAUGHED at them. Lol


Witmen, great point. And the Error by THOR. I've always said, release new devices with the PlayBook UI and and work hard on BB10 then upgrade all hardware that are capable of upgrading to BB10. At least this way they would have had new devices running the auto OK UI. That would have eliminated the LONG DELAY that forced many BB7 owners to move on.


Posted via CB10

ΕΤΣΙ ειναι !
no new devices like z 10 Z 30 just passport why just this and now leap why leap leap is even worst than Z 30!! why you realease such device??? Why they are stuck in PKB's full touch screens is the future !!!
no playbook since the first one ! why???
why no 2 SIM card device ?? what are you waitning for ???
opportunities maybe be but you should take the risk and grab them ! if you want move they want give you what you are expecting!

[Powdah]

I woke not be owning a BlackBerry

Posted via CB10

[Loc22]

Except people ARE choosing different Android manufacturers rather than BB. Again, if BB captured 2% of the Android sales they would more than triple their current market share.

That would be really far fetch for BlackBerry to capture 2% of the Android market. There are only a few players in the market ;

1. Xiaomi - because they are cheap

2. Samsung - coz they are the leader in the market.

3. Sony - coz they are water resistant.

The rest of the others are just too insignificant and are probably dead. What unique selling point do you think #BlackBerry would have to be visible in this market & survive?

Posted via CB10

[GadgetTravel]

Motorola, LG, Sony and HTC all have more than 2%. If BB had 1% they would be better than they are with BB10.

[lnichols]

Motorola, LG, Sony and HTC all have more than 2%. If BB had 1% they would be better than they are with BB10.

HTC made less profit than BlackBerry did a couple quarters ago too. So market share in the Android world does not equal profitability. Android world is cut throat and margins are razor thin. Blackberry couldn't compete in the high end or low end and would still be niche player with people wondering why the specs to price ratio sucks compared to other Android OEM makers and why it takes BlackBerry so long to get the next release/update out (because it is waiting for FIPS approvals). Android isn't some magic pill that will fix the many, many issues that BlackBerry has up in Waterloo.

Posted via Z30

[GadgetTravel]

HTC made less profit than BlackBerry did a couple quarters ago too. So market share in the Android world does not equal profitability. Android world is cut throat and margins are razor thin. Blackberry couldn't compete in the high end or low end and would still be niche player with people wondering why the specs to price ratio sucks compared to other Android OEM makers and why it takes BlackBerry so long to get the next release/update out (because it is waiting for FIPS approvals). Android isn't some magic pill that will fix the many, many issues that BlackBerry has up in Waterloo. I

Posted via Z30

They made less on handsets? Other parts of BB are making money. Not handsets.

[lnichols]

They made less on handsets? Other parts of BB are making money. Not handsets.

But will an Android BlackBerry, given the fact the handsets won't change but will simply be running a different OS, sell in ebough numbers to make money? You know BlackBerry can't make them cheaper or better, so I simply don't see how Android is going to do anything for BlackBerry and improving the handset business. Are all the people on here that have lambasted Android as a horrible OS suddenly going to embrace it because it has the BlackBerry name on the front? Are all the people that have avoided the BlackBerry brand suddenly going to jump on board?

Posted via Z30

[GadgetTravel]

But will an Android BlackBerry, given the fact the handsets won't change but will simply be running a different OS, sell in ebough numbers to make money? You know BlackBerry can't make them cheaper or better, so I simply don't see how Android is going to do anything for BlackBerry and improving the handset business. Are all the people on here that have lambasted Android as a horrible OS suddenly going to embrace it because it has the BlackBerry name on the front? Are all the people that have avoided the BlackBerry brand suddenly going to jump on board?

Posted via Z30

How could they do worse? The people on here don't matter. Who cares if they hate Android. The market is 85% Android and something like 0.3% - 0.5% BB. The growth is in Android and iOS. Has been for a long time. As the saying goes, "do the math". That is what matters. People avoid BB because they don't have a competitive product in my opinion because they don't have the software people want to use. Android fixes that.

[lnichols]

How could they do worse? The people on here don't matter. Who cares if they hate Android. The market is 85% Android and something like 0.3% - 0.5% BB. The growth is in Android and iOS. Has been for a long time. As the saying goes, "do the math". That is what matters. People avoid BB because they don't have a competitive product in my opinion because they don't have the software people want to use. Android fixes that.

How could they do worse? The only differentiator they have have going Android is PKB. Security if pure Android is not there, unless they throw the secusmart tech in that they charge $2600 a tablet. Rapid security certs are gone. Upgrades with FIPS approval guaranteed are gone. Only thing they gain with Android is apps, but lose a lot on the security advantages they got with QNX, and don't lose the Blackberry branding which is an albatross. I guess we'll see, but if I have to choose between a Blackberry Android and iOS, I'll go iOS because I think iOS is a better OS and platform as a total package. BB10 is the best, but a horrible company pushing it killing any chance of momentum.

Posted via Z30

[GadgetTravel]

How could they do worse? The only differentiator they have have going Android is PKB. Security if pure Android is not there, unless they throw the secusmart tech in that they charge $2600 a tablet. Rapid security certs are gone. Upgrades with FIPS approval guaranteed are gone. Only thing they gain with Android is apps, but lose a lot on the security advantages they got with QNX, and don't lose the Blackberry branding which is an albatross. I guess we'll see, but if I have to choose between a Blackberry Android and iOS, I'll go iOS because I think iOS is a better OS and platform as a total package. BB10 is the best, but a horrible company pushing it killing any chance of momentum.

Posted via Z30

There isn't room for four operating systems. Probably not three. If they had a small fraction of the Android market they would be way ahead of where they are now. And they are dropping. If they had cloned the Bold mail client on top of Android and a few other Bold features they would have vastly ahead of where they are now I think.

[mcstravi]

The differentiator will be a business Android phone...more security and probably PKB only phones.
For those that want a straight touchscreen, there is already too much competition, so BlackBerry will exit that market and instead offer their new bread and butter which is software, selling "the BlackBerry experience suite" as an app for iOS and Android (hub, keyboard, travel, contacts, etc. )

Posted via CB10

[skibnik]

How could they do worse? The only differentiator they have have going Android is PKB. Security if pure Android is not there, unless they throw the secusmart tech in that they charge $2600 a tablet. Rapid security certs are gone. Upgrades with FIPS approval guaranteed are gone. Only thing they gain with Android is apps, but lose a lot on the security advantages they got with QNX, and don't lose the Blackberry branding which is an albatross. I guess we'll see, but if I have to choose between a Blackberry Android and iOS, I'll go iOS because I think iOS is a better OS and platform as a total package. BB10 is the best, but a horrible company pushing it killing any chance of momentum.

Posted via Z30

Your assuming that BlackBerry would switch over completely to Android. More than likely they would still release BB10 devices for enterprise and government use and have Android devices for the regular every day consumer who doesn't care about security.

Loving my Passport!

[skibnik]

The differentiator will be a business Android phone...more security and probably PKB only phones.
For those that want a straight touchscreen, there is already too much competition, so BlackBerry will exit that market and instead offer their new bread and butter which is software, selling "the BlackBerry experience suite" as an app for iOS and Android (hub, keyboard, travel, contacts, etc. )

Posted via CB10

They would still sell BB10 devices for enterprise and government, so they don't lose their security certifications. As for the regular consumer security is a secondary thought so there is no need for BlackBerry to spend unnecessary resources trying to harden or secure Android more than it is already.

Loving my Passport!