[GeekOnTheHill]

In the past two years, a tiny search engine named DuckDuckGo has increased its search volume by more than 600 percent based on consumers' growing dislike for being tracked, use as fodder for dossiers, and sold to the highest bidder. The company's slogan is, "The Search Engine that Doesn't Track You," but it might as well be, "We Ain't Google."

I read posts from users here about how they lust for full Android and Google Play compatibility. The long-time IT security guy in me is tempted to think that they're crazy. But I also know that they don't have the advantages I have in having literally taken Android apart and analyzed the packet traffic from Android devices, so they don't know the extent of Google's disdain for user privacy.

Or maybe they just don't care, in which case I fall back to the other assumption.

Whatever the case, it seems to me that BBRY has a gold mine that they refuse to work. Moreover, it's one that could be exploited pretty easily if they had the will. Rather than whoring after Google and Amazon, how 'bout creating an optional, alternate BB10 track for users like myself who are primarily concerned with privacy and who don't give a **** about Android apps?

This could be done pretty easily by making a forked version of BB10 available for existing and future phones that doesn't offer the Android runtime at all. Yes, that would mean abandoning any hope of OHA compliance; but seriously, does anyone think that would have a prayer's chance in hell of being commercially successful, anyway? I mean, truly, does the world need yet another Android manufacturer?

So I suggest offering the opposite track: Create a version of BB10 that does not include the Android runtime at all, has a reasonable support lifetime commitment, and eschews any tracking by BBRY itself (such as targeted ads on BBM); and then offer it as a separate BB10 fork that can be loaded on to existing or new devices for people like myself who don't need Android and don't want Google, Amazon, or anyone else tracking them.

I'm not talking about something with DOD encryption, nor something like Silent Circle's BlackPhone. I don't need that level of security any more; and if I ever do need it again, Uncle will provide me with a suitable device. I'm just tired of being surveilled and my life being archived by Google (and others) so I can be sold like a meth ***** to the highest bidder. I'm looking for simple privacy, not MIL-SPEC encryption; but simple privacy has become something that's hard to find in a phone now that data-mining has become all the rage.

BlackBerry is in a unique position to provide that the privacy. Moreover, the beauty of their position is that it wouldn't require very much investment. It's all software work and it consists mainly of removing code, not adding it. It could also be reversible if the user later decides that they do want Android after all. They'd just have to switch back to that fork and re-load the current spyware-laded version of BB10.

I'd even pay a reasonable amount of money for an Android-free BB10. How much would depend on exactly how it's implemented and how long they guaranteed that they'd support it; but I would easily fork over $25.00 or $50.00 if they did nothing other than get rid of the runtime, Amazon, and anything else that tracks me; and promise to support it for at least five years. Or they could do it as a $1.00 or $2.00 a month subscription via BB World.

No, that's not a lot of money. But let's be real: There's a limit to how much you can charge people to remove features.

I even have a slogan for the alternate fork: "The Phone that Doesn't Track You." DuckDuckGo probably would be okay with that if BBRY made DDG the default search provider. Otherwise, the slogan could be something like "Your Life, Your Phone, Your Privacy."

I admit that something like this would appeal to a limited number of users who care mainly about privacy and don't give a rat's *** about apps, but who don't need MIL-SPEC encryption. So we're talking people who just want simple privacy, not paranoids who want every text messaged scrambled. But considering that it would cost very little to implement this option (and that it could even be an alternate revenue stream if reasonably priced), it's worth thinking about.

[tollfeeder]

Afaik you can get a BES12 subscription and disable the ART.

Via Pasta CB10

[Witmen]

I'd even pay a reasonable amount of money for an Android-free BB10. How much would depend on exactly how it's implemented and how long they guaranteed that they'd support it; but I would easily fork over $25.00 or $50.00 if they did nothing other than get rid of the runtime, Amazon, and anything else that tracks me; and promise to support it for at least five years. Or they could do it as a $1.00 or $2.00 a month subscription via BB World.

I don't think BlackBerry would be willing to remove BBM. They need that money from the targeted ads (yep, BBM tracks users and uses their data to serve up relevant ads) and sticker packs.

[GeekOnTheHill]

Tollfeeder:

Thanks, and that's what I plan on doing since the forced Amazon app. I just haven't had the time.

But I was actually thinking of something more geared toward ordinary consumers, not IT geeks. But you have a good point: BES could be repackaged for non-geeks and sold as a service.

[GeekOnTheHill]

I don't think BlackBerry would be willing to remove BBM. They need that money from the targeted ads (yep, BBM tracks users and uses their data to serve up relevant ads) and sticker packs.

They would just have to stop the tracking, not BBM (nor even the ads as long as they weren't targeted other than geo without logging).

Besides, whatever they got for a subscription would be more than they get from any ads served to me. I know only one other person who uses BBM, and we talk maybe once a month, if that much.

[Prem WatsApp]

More privacy: I wouldn't mind. Plus some more privacy features in the native browser... :-)

�   www. CrackDroidChentral .com --- (BB10 NOT dead!)   �

[nhanken]

You have great ideas but I'm afraid the majority of the average Joes don't agree with you. It's always easy to come up with a fantastic plan but it's not that easy to implement it. BlackBerry cannot afford to pour money and resources into these kinds of things until they're back on track with some solid quarterly profits.

The most important Mr. Chen needs to do right now is to axe the head of hardware because he honestly hasn't done a good thing for the company. He's the reason that has dragged the company down with poor BB10 hardware sales during the past few quarters. That's just my two cents.

To BB or not to BBBBBB...?

[GeekOnTheHill]

Thanks. And honestly, the runtime doesn't even bother me all that much as long as it's not Google's version of Android. If you don't use any Android apps, it doesn't do anything.

I'm really just tired of being spied on. As experienced and meticulous as I am about data security, my PII is now potentially on the street for the eighth time in my life (the recent O.P.M. hack, mainly because of my security clearances and other information I've provided to Uncle for various work-related reasons). The first time my PII was potentially exposed was the V.A. laptop theft. Then there were the various retail hacks, the Adobe hack. and the Anthem insurance hack, and now the O.P.M. hack. Eight times in all, and it's getting really effing tiresome.

So yeah, I'm sick of people compiling information about me; and I long for a phone that simply does what I want it to do and doesn't report to anyone except me. I'm tired of companies tracking my movements, reading my messages, and documenting my life. I want a phone that keeps its mouth shut and takes its orders only from me. Is that really too much to ask?

BlackBerry is in a unique position to create such a phone because BB10's datamining is bush league compared to Google's, or even Amazon's. So just disable the datamining in BBM (and whatever else they may be mining), provide an option to ****can the Amazon Store, and come up with a fair price to replace whatever revenue they're losing. Then come up with a brilliant slogan like one of the ones I suggested, and see if it flies.

What do they have to lose? We're talking about disabling some features and charging people for it, for Pete's sake, not re-designing the whole OS.

Richard

[Zirak]

I have said this before: I do not understand the average person. Between Google, Visa and (insert carrier name here) they can track and predict where you will be and what you will purchase before you even arrive. And people put up with, actually embrace this hence the world where we value things at .99 with ads vs paying what something is worth. What really baffles me though is the same people abhor TV commercials?

Sent while driving from my Crackberry.

[Prem WatsApp]

I have said this before: I do not understand the average person. Between Google, Visa and (insert carrier name here) they can track and predict where you will be and what you will purchase before you even arrive. And people put up with, actually embrace this hence the world where we value things at .99 with ads vs paying what something is worth. What really baffles me though is the same people abhor TV commercials?

Sent while driving from my Crackberry.

TV commercials take away from the time and viewing pleasure...

On the phone, everything happens in the background. Out out sight, of out... ;-)

Users are generally only concerned with what they see or get on the screen, background workings are a mystery and they don't worry too much about it. How could they know? Ignorance seems bliss....


�   "BB Android Armageddon: Chenisys is uploading in 5,4,3..."   �

[Prem WatsApp]

I have said this before: I do not understand the average person. Between Google, Visa and (insert carrier name here) they can track and predict where you will be and what you will purchase before you even arrive. And people put up with, actually embrace this hence the world where we value things at .99 with ads vs paying what something is worth. What really baffles me though is the same people abhor TV commercials?

Sent while driving from my Crackberry.

Or when your (teenage?) daughter or wife will be giving birth... 8-o

�   "BB Android Armageddon: Chenisys is uploading in 5,4,3..."   �

[aldrich9tesla9qiang]

If John chen can see my suggestion, I will be very happy as I am BlackBerry fans.And I am using Z10 write now.
For the market of BlackBerry, I have a plan is that blackberry company should cooperate with linkedin. As per the information, the user in linkedin is over 300 millions around the world. You can negotiate with linkedin, all the users in linkedin can get a BBM pin , and relevent QR Code for other people scan and add. When the pin owner scan QR Code of himself , He / she will download BBM and have the account.

Kevin.Qiang
BBM:2ABBF953

Posted via CB10

[tinochiko]

People put up with it in theory because when it's done right, privacy can still be maintained but their experience of services improves.

E.g. Netflix recording that user a watches this this and that at such and such a time, then using it to suggest this and this and such and such a time. Privacy can be maintained through encryption so that the company knows that 'a' user has these attributes, but doesn't know exactly which user that is, of course this fails when some companies want to make money from it, or don't put proper security in place to manage it.

Yes it's still something companies are learning to do well, but another reason people seem so eager is that the first step for these companies is making tools that people WANT to use, and in many cases letting them use it for free (at least at first) and again the information can be used to improve the service based on how users are using it.

I think it would be more useful for Chen to try what he has said and 'make android secure' Inc. Permissions etc. But appreciate the need and would love to have BlackBerry10 on its own with a vast array of native apps.

Check Out TechCraze

[Prem WatsApp]

People put up with it in theory because when it's done right, privacy can still be maintained but their experience of services improves.

E.g. Netflix recording that user a watches this this and that at such and such a time, then using it to suggest this and this and such and such a time. Privacy can be maintained through encryption so that the company knows that 'a' user has these attributes, but doesn't know exactly which user that is, of course this fails when some companies want to make money from it, or don't put proper security in place to manage it.

Yes it's still something companies are learning to do well, but another reason people seem so eager is that the first step for these companies is making tools that people WANT to use, and in many cases letting them use it for free (at least at first) and again the information can be used to improve the service based on how users are using it.

I think it would be more useful for Chen to try what he has said and 'make android secure' Inc. Permissions etc. But appreciate the need and would love to have BlackBerry10 on its own with a vast array of native apps.

Check Out TechCraze

Thanks. Some good thoughts here... :-)

�   "BB Android Armageddon: Chenisys is uploading in 5,4,3..."   �

[sarcazmo]

I've always thought this should be the direction BlackBerry takes its consumer handset business.

I understand Chens enterprise focused approach. I'm sure all his research and data supports that as being the most financially stable option to keep BlackBerry relevant and viable.

All this talk about being a software company really got me wondering though. Why hasn't BlackBerry dumped some more resources into consumer type software?

Do you know how amazing it would be if BlackBerry maps was at least close to Google maps? Why not develop a more secure version of Google docs? How about an alternative to Google voice? An alternative to Gmail would be so amazing! Wishful thinking but a music service like Google or secure integration would also be welcomed. The main features of course being the fact they don't track or store any of your data and you can rest assured BlackBerry security will keep it safe.

I'd be very willing to pay a monthly fee for all of this, and I know a lot of people that would. Instead of piggy backing on Android I really wish they'd create viable alternatives for services that people consider "integral."

As for the app situation, I don't care about many of the popular apps. I would like to see a greater emphasis is in courting developers. Grow your brand, incentivize development and grow your user base.

As a lowly regular non enterprise consumer the lack of progress in this area really saddens me. BlackBerry 10 is the most efficient os I've used and it wouldn't take much to take it to the next level imo.

Your search engine comparison was an apt one. I've always thought if BlackBerry actually decided to market itself their platform has been in the open. They're not apple, not Google, they're BlackBerry. Your info isn't tracked or stored, and you'll never have to worry about the security. You don't need a new device every year etc...

All this is Wishful thinking I know.

Posted via CB10

[GeekOnTheHill]

I've always thought this should be the direction BlackBerry takes its consumer handset business.

I understand Chens enterprise focused approach. I'm sure all his research and data supports that as being the most financially stable option to keep BlackBerry relevant and viable.

All this talk about being a software company really got me wondering though. Why hasn't BlackBerry dumped some more resources into consumer type software?

Do you know how amazing it would be if BlackBerry maps was at least close to Google maps? Why not develop a more secure version of Google docs? How about an alternative to Google voice? An alternative to Gmail would be so amazing! Wishful thinking but a music service like Google or secure integration would also be welcomed. The main features of course being the fact they don't track or store any of your data and you can rest assured BlackBerry security will keep it safe.

I'd be very willing to pay a monthly fee for all of this, and I know a lot of people that would. Instead of piggy backing on Android I really wish they'd create viable alternatives for services that people consider "integral."

As for the app situation, I don't care about many of the popular apps. I would like to see a greater emphasis is in courting developers. Grow your brand, incentivize development and grow your user base.

As a lowly regular non enterprise consumer the lack of progress in this area really saddens me. BlackBerry 10 is the most efficient os I've used and it wouldn't take much to take it to the next level imo.

Your search engine comparison was an apt one. I've always thought if BlackBerry actually decided to market itself their platform has been in the open. They're not apple, not Google, they're BlackBerry. Your info isn't tracked or stored, and you'll never have to worry about the security. You don't need a new device every year etc...

All this is Wishful thinking I know.

Posted via CB10

I agree. BlackBerry is so close to meeting a demand that can only grow as dataminers like Google intensify their privacy violations.

I'm not sure BBRY understands how many people there are who just want the details of our daily lives to remain our own, but who don't need to go as far as something along the lines of Black Phone. But out of my five closest associates, three have gotten rid of their Android phones specifically because they were sick of Google's snooping.

Granted, most of my friends have computer security backgrounds, so we're a bit out of the mainstream in that regard. But with a little marketing, privacy could be a big seller. I'm convinced that a motto like "The Phone that Doesn't Spy On You" would sell devices.

As for the specific apps you mentioned:

I have never used Google Apps, so I have no idea how that works.

I have in the past used Google Voice, but only as a forwarding number. I have no idea what else it offers. I do know that there are other companies that offer forwarding numbers, but I don't know what else they include.

I stopped using Google Maps years ago when I realized that they knew more about my movements than I did. I used to have it installed on an old BB, and Google knew every place I'd traveled. I haven't used it since. So I really can't say how it compares to BlackBerry Maps. That being said, the few times I have used BlackBerry maps recently, I haven't found it to be that bad. It's a bit plain, but the functionality seemed okay to me.

Android mail absolutely sucks, even privacy aside. So does whatever Apple calls its mail client. I can't tell you how many times I've had to walk clients through deleting and re-creating their mail accounts on Android and Apple devices because they just stopped working for unknown reasons. BlackBerry mail, in my opinion, is and has always been the best mobile mail client out there -- especially if the mail provider has BB FastMail enabled on their server.

I have not used an online music service in so long that I forget which one it was that I used. I think it was the legal version of Napster, but I wouldn't swear to it. I like oldies, and once you've accumulated enough of them... well, they're not making oldies anymore, so there's no need to download more. But a Sirius client for BB would be a nice thing and not at all hard to code.

Richard

[baarn]

Personally, Google/Android lost me as a potential customer (I've never owned an Android device) when they started storing people's saved WiFi passwords in their DB. Sure is nice though to have a backdoor into everyone's home or business network. It only takes one Android device on that network to compromise it for all.

In a similar vein, although I largely agree with the OP's sentiments, you can choose to protect your privacy by choosing a particular device, but you can't make that choice for others. If other people are using Android to, let's say, view your medical records or process your online purchases, then your privacy had been compromised anyway.

[nt300]

What we need is more Native BB10 Development and enough of the Amazon App Store that doesn't allow you do download and install the apps most people want anyway. They seem to be all blocked when you connect with a BB10 phone. Absolute Nonsense actually.
If people want Android, go buy one. BBRY thinking of going Android will only kill the company further. Chen trashed the BB10 App development, the BB10 marketing and to date has not released a (Z30 upgrade) BB10 full touch device, as people have been asking for for months upon months now.
Blaming BB10 for poor sales is dishonest at best. Blame the CEO's complete lack in releasing a high end BB10 full touch and complete lack in proper marketing. When people in the Enterprise are given a choice between BlackBerry, Android and iOS, the majority tell there IT they want nothing to do with BB7 BOLDS. What they don't know is they were offering Classic's, Passports and Z30's. Garbage Marketing Killed BB10's true potential. And even when its not too late, this CEO continues with this Incompetent approach of once again Garbage BB10 Marketing.

My work they got a few of us Androids without asking for our preference. Only because they thought we didn't want to go back to using a old BOLD BB7 phone. When I myself seen the list of device options, they were Samsung Galaxy S4, Note 2, iPhone 5 and Passport, Classic, Q10 and Z30's. Go Figure. Ridiculous.

[Tre Lawrence]

In the end, the ultimate decider is what the shareholders want.

BBRY exists to make money, which runs contrary to some concepts.

[Prem WatsApp]

In the end, the ultimate decider is what the shareholders want.

BBRY exists to make money, which runs contrary to some concepts.

The shareholder only goes so far...

Quoting myself, posted in another thread:

Customers are not shareholders, but stakeholders in the company, too, and ultimately those who pay the bills and make a profit possible...

It IS important to keep them happy and paying. Lack of confidence in the survivability of BlackBerry destroyed a lot of business, and still does. That's why customers ARE and need to be seen as stakeholders, because... they really are!

:-D

(what happens to your BES installation if BlackBerry disappears? Where do you get support? Will you still be able to use BBM and download apps? ... etc.)

�   "BBAndr10d Armageddon: Chenisys is uploading in 5,4,3..."   �

�   "BBAndr10d Armageddon: Chenisys is uploading in 5,4,3..."   �

[Tre Lawrence]

The shareholder only goes so far...

Quoting myself, posted in another thread:





�   "BBAndr10d Armageddon: Chenisys is uploading in 5,4,3..."   �

Agreed. But the customer isn't paying.

In this case, one person probably has the key: your namesake.

[GadgetTravel]

Google's business model. which is quite open, was that they would give people free stuff in exchange for some information from people which they would use to sell targeted advertising for more money than they could sell general ads. They now have a market cap of about 450 billion dollars. BB has been selling privacy. Do the math.

[GeekOnTheHill]

Right. And had I joined the Mafia when I graduated from high school, rather than serving my country, earning three degrees, and becoming an I.T. professional, I would have made a lot more money.

[GadgetTravel]

Right. And had I joined the Mafia when I graduated from high school, rather than serving my country, earning three degrees, and becoming an I.T. professional, I would have made a lot more money.

I'm sure there is a point there.

[ubizmo]

Blaming BB10 for poor sales is dishonest at best.

What is it at worst?