-
- 108
-
- 30,559
01-23-11 03:48 AMLike 0 -
- 108
01-23-11 10:36 AMLike 0 -
- 108
^Because I'm happy with my phone, just wanted to try out another OS? Maybe dual boot would be possible? It's just to mix things up. It's not that I hate the BlackBerry OS or anything, I just wanted to know what else was in store for a BlackBerry user.01-25-11 07:48 PMLike 0 -
- 748
-
- 108
Exactly. If HTC got it, why not us?
Can you direct me to this project?
Yeah, I hope this could happen.
Wish I had some developing knowledge, I would totally try to start.01-25-11 10:01 PMLike 0 -
- 1,987
is it more complicated then what you guys think, to make it clear is like trying to mix water and oil.....it is just a no go, been trying to do so for awhile with and a good amount of peeps have too, with no luck....goes more then just hacking a device....you got to do not just a software mod.....goes beyond that.....
this is a quote from another forum of someone you all may know or heard of that really knows what is he taking about
RIM production devices only run operating systems that have been digitally signed by RIM. The OS actually is all Java, and the firmware serves as a thin layer over the CPU to provide a low level JVM. The OS digital signature is enforced by the firmware, which isn't user alterable without some very serious hacking. For all intents and purposes, it is a "hardware" Java platform.
Certainly, any such firmware signature restrictions could be bypassed by modifying the firmware. However, I don't think this can be accomplished on production devices without dismantling the hardware, and extracting data from the chips containing the firmware.
Something tells me that won't be easy to accomplish. Nobody has succeeded at this before, and I'm sure the bounty on the potential BlackBerry malware would make it very worthwhile to blackhat developers. This alone makes me think it isn't going to be practical, if possible without destroying the hardware.and this still stands true this days.....Android isn't made in Java. Application development for Android is in Java (or C/C++ and ARM Assembly if using the Native Development Kit). However, the userspace and Dalvik virtual machine for Android are written in C (linked to the Bionic libc which is lighter weight than glibc or others used for heavier devices), as is the Linux kernel.
Given that BlackBerry development is limited to executing in the BlackBerry Java VM, Linux won't happen. Admittedly, some of my earlier statements in this topic are not entirely true (namely there is a non-insignificant native OS of sorts above the JVM, rather than a thin layer), as I've learned more from reverse engineering parts of the BlackBerry OS -- but the statement that Linux won't happen on BlackBerry hardware still stands.
sourcelikuidkewl likes this.01-25-11 10:21 PMLike 1 -
- 1,943
Maybe because of the class leading security on blackberries? Its trying escape out of guantanamo (or however its spelt) not gonna happen that easily.
Posted from my CrackBerry at wapforums.crackberry.com01-25-11 11:42 PMLike 0 -
- 1,170
is it more complicated then what you guys think, to make it clear is like trying to mix water and oil.....it is just a no go, been trying to do so for awhile with and a good amount of peeps have too, with no luck....goes more then just hacking a device....you got to do not just a software mod.....goes beyond that.....
this is a quote from another forum of someone you all may know or heard of that really knows what is he taking about
and this still stands true this days.....
source
Yep, this is pretty much the reason why.
In addition to bypassing/disabling the signature check, someone would have to develop/reverse engineer drivers for all of the Torch's components and somehow make it all work...a daunting task lol.01-26-11 12:02 AMLike 0 -
- 53
If you have the knowledge to do so, it could be done. But, you would A) have to have a deep working knowledge of BB OS and hardware, and B) have the coding knowledge for Android to write all the necessary drivers and such.
Honestly, I don't see why everyone is so bloody hooked on Android. It's buggy as ****, a resource hog, and once the phone manufacturers touch it, a mess in code.
Let a BB be a BB. There are many reasons these phones are what they are. Industry leading security, excellent stability, easy to use, what would be the point of changing that?
Seriously, if you want an Android device to play with the ecosystem, just buy one.There's only about a million or so to choose from, since they basically release a new one what, hourly now?01-26-11 05:56 AMLike 0 -
- 1,170
Tell that to the people at xda developers who managed to port Android onto Windows Mobile 6 devices.If you have the knowledge to do so, it could be done. But, you would A) have to have a deep working knowledge of BB OS and hardware, and B) have the coding knowledge for Android to write all the necessary drivers and such.
Honestly, I don't see why everyone is so bloody hooked on Android. It's buggy as ****, a resource hog, and once the phone manufacturers touch it, a mess in code.
Let a BB be a BB. There are many reasons these phones are what they are. Industry leading security, excellent stability, easy to use, what would be the point of changing that?
Seriously, if you want an Android device to play with the ecosystem, just buy one.There's only about a million or so to choose from, since they basically release a new one what, hourly now?
I think it's not so much about "wanting an Android device to play with the ecosystem" but rather the thrill of hacking/reverse engineering an existing phone to do something it wasn't meant to do not unlike people who hot rod their cars.01-26-11 09:02 AMLike 0 -
- 30
Even if you did get android OS running on a Blackberry, I would say it'd be very unstable, and not only that, pretty slow. With my Torch on OS 6, it's running okay, but not the best, probably because of the lack of processing power (628 MHz...)
And because Android relies so much on good hardware specs now, the torch isn't exactly a good option.
I would say get an android device and keep the blackberry. But hey, the Torch 2 seems to have promising specs, so maybe that would be a more suitable device to work with.
Nevertheless, it's a neat idea. I'd love to see it come to life. Hopefully XDA can do something like that, but I'm using my blackberry for what it's meant to be used for.
Oh, and I'm not very familiar with dual boot. But wouldn't that eat up quite a bit of the internal memory for the Torch? Or is it stored on a memory card?01-26-11 09:36 AMLike 0 -
- 304
Kellmike: dualboot (at least my limited experience with windows/android) boots android from the SD card and runs from there.
And yeah. Blackberries won't run Android, nor would the BIS let a non-authorized (android OS) phone through their servers. Even if you DID somehow get the OS running, you'd have to find drivers for Wifi, Bluetooth, Camera, Sound card/chip, and the cell phone radio itself. But I doubt you'd ever be able to use it to surf or anything because RIM's servers wouldn't authorize it.01-26-11 09:53 AMLike 0 -
- 82
Somebody said my name, so I'll put in my two cents directly on this topic.
ealvnv has quoted two of my posts from about a year and a half ago. There are things that I have learned in the meantime which don't make the outlook quite as pessimistic. It's true that system API's in the Java portion of the RIM operating system (at least for OS versions 5.0 and before, but likely for 6.0 as well) are restricted to packages that are digitally signed by a RIM key that is not made available to third party developers (I've referred to this key as "3" in the past).
While there are a couple of vulnerabilities in the signature enforcement and API restriction verification code that I haven't publicized, which can be used to gain access the systems API, I don't think you really need to go there if you're interested in alternative operating systems on the device.
I would instead look at the SFI files that are loaded as part of OS updates, and if necessary, the MFI files loaded during device provisioning. It is my understanding that these are native code images that are device specific and comprise the low level portions of the device hardware operating system. I don't know what the acronyms define, but I would intuit that they are something along the lines of "shipping firmware image" and "manufacturer/master firmware image" respectively.
If there is any signature verification code on loaded SFI's, I imagine it will be handled by code within the MFI, which can be modified and loaded with the RIM internal tools that have leaked. If there is only signature verification on the Java portions of the operating system, modifications to the SFI could be applied directly as part of the ordinary operating system loading procedure. However, significant work will be required to understand the format of these files before any more interesting work could be done. Once you manage to load and run your own native code on a device, you're a large part of the way there.
Drivers may or may not be much of an issue. I understand that RIM uses fairly standardized components for their hardware (ARM CPU, flash memory, microSD, LCD). On many smartphones, the cellular radio is managed by a separate baseband processor for which a fairly standard and well documented thin interface exists (ostensibly to protect the cellular network against maliciously reprogrammed hardware). Dumbphone/featurephone hardware tend to run their primitive OS software along with cellular functions on a single processor. The BlackBerry devices could go either way, since the third party software is normally kept isolated by the JVM sandbox in the OS. In any case, if you've managed to get as far as running your own code, you've likely reverse engineered most of the native OS code that manages the hardware, and can reuse it to build drivers of your own.
The comment about BIS allowing or not allowing an unauthorized device is meaningless. Third party applications on the BlackBerry typically access the Internet over the cellular connection in the same way that all other makes of smartphones access the Internet over the cellular connection -- that is to say via the APN IP gateway. Proxying data over the BlackBerry infrastructure connection makes sense if you're using the push protocol for mail, you want the horrific compression proxy on the browser, or you're using one of the other BlackBerry specific protocols (Messenger is pretty much it). Android does all IP communication either through the carrier APN (when using cellular data), or directly if on WiFi.
In any case, if you're interested in pursuing this sort of device hacking, I would recommend being cautious about what and how you publish your results. One of RIM's berserk buttons seems to be publication of any low level device details or algorithms, and they will send their lawyers after you. Presumably because they don't want the perception of BlackBerry legendary security to be challenged. This is why I haven't (publicly) published anything of interest on the platform since I was compelled to take down my eScreen generator.
If you're within the United States, the new DMCA "jailbreaking" exemption granted in July 2010 could shield you from RIM's wrath; I still think it's prudent to get bulletproof hosting somewhere and work semi-anonymously.
I've personally made the jump to Android almost two years ago and I haven't looked to switch back. Google maintains excellent developer relations and encourages this sort of system level hacking. The BlackBerry platform has stayed quite underwhelming since then. I'm watching the QNX based OS with a little bit of interest and I might buy a new device to hack at if the specs and SDK are enough to make it seem worthwhile. Beyond that, I wish anyone pursuing BlackBerry hacks the best of luck.Culex316 likes this.01-29-11 05:46 PMLike 1
- Forum
- Other Platforms
- Android
How come you can't install Android OS onto a Blackberry?
« VVM Issue and losing 3G
|
I think I figured out how 4G is going to work on Verizon, unfortunately »
LINK TO POST COPIED TO CLIPBOARD